Rellik
Member
What Nintendo have done with the Switch is create the perfect emulation device, but we all know the official VC support will be crap. Let's crack this baby open just enough for that.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Switch hacked through old webkit exploit
- Thread starter MUnited83
- Start date
What Nintendo have done with the Switch is create the perfect emulation device, but we all know the official VC support will be crap. Let's crack this baby open just enough for that.
I'm currently interested in the new shield tablet with some bluetooth controllers (there's one that lets you put the shield inbetween it) because I have a good pc and library but I'm not in a rush and will have to decide between that and a switch (already have a wiiu though).
Maybe the next shield... or if Nintendo puts out some killer apps for the Switch, then maybe the shield/tablet with shield streaming app after that.
It doesn't look as good as the switch with the bluetooth controllers I saw though.
Wake me up when the economics of building a device as sleek and perfectly engineered as the Switch allow for people to just dump ROMs on it instead of purchasing the games.
Theoretically, they might have knowingly accepted the risk of shipping a version of WebKit with known vulnerabilities, if updating the version might have required adaptations in the customized parts of their port for which they would not have had time or resources.
Especially if vulnerabilities in WebKit are already mitigated by other counter-measures, like sandboxing the WebKit process. As others have said, being able to execute code with the privileges of a browser process might be worthless, if those privileges are sufficiently restricted; which should be an obvious thing to do.
Delusibeta
Banned
The web applet was introduced in the last Switch patch. So yeah, latest Switch update.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
In some gaffers' heads, perhaps.
Geno Breaker
Banned
Nice. The closer we get to homebrew emulators, the better.
I would agree if the damn VC wouldn't start from scratch every single time. All games previously released on VC should be available on new consoles. I suspect that once VS support becomes available, it will be the same release schedule as before, resulting in laughable library at the end of Switch life cycle. If that's what Nintendo is planning all over again than homebrew emulators can't come soon enough.
7DollarHagane
Banned
Hackers can make fancy looking web pages display with this but not much else yet.
Hopefully the web applet is sufficiently sandboxed and can't touch the main system functions.
Either way the cat and mouse game will continue.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Thanks for answering.
Not yet, as they've likely got a backlog of indies still looking for dev kits, but I'd imagine it shouldn't be too difficult to get hold of one by the end of the year (if you're at least somewhat qualified to put together a game, which I'm sure blu is).
Chronospherics
Member
In South America you can buy PS4s with 500GB of digital games for $100.
The exploits definitely led to some fairly considerable piracy at least on PS4. The methods are a little too inaccessible for most of the Western world to care, but you can play the majority of the PS4 library at very low cost.
Permanently A
Junior Member
Sounds like something hackers would easily remove.
Memorabilia
Member
Condescending nonsense post assumes unproven and refuted link between piracy and "unhealthy marketplace" = nonsense post.
SinCityAssassin
Member
It's gonna close that exploit in the next firmware for sure.
test_account
XP-39C²
That should be another method than the webkit/kernel exploit that the PS4 saw. That method is something like cloning a chip (NOR) inside the PS4 and transfering this to another PS4, tricking it to think that its the same PS4 as it was copied from. From what i know, you cant connect online with this method.
They included an old ass version of webkit, don't feel sorry.
Those have nothing to do with these kinds of exploits. That one is rather a cloning thing done with hardware afaik.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I feared this would happen the minute I connected to my work's Wi-Fi network and the browser popped up to handle its login portal.
Lmaooo, that's some hard logic man.
Nah, what was done day one was just people spoofing DNS to access whatever website they wanted. This is the first actual legit webkit exploit for the Switch.
I thought it just wasnt ready for launch?
Real_Madrid
Member
It's their own fault if it is imo. I hate piracy and exploits as much as the next guy, but Nintendo should do their homework and R&D before a console releases. In these digital times it shouldn't be that difficult to make a console piracy free.
balgajo
Member
Everything I've done until now, it was all for nothing.
Honestly they would have to be absolutely stupid to not sandbox the WebKit process in 2017, especially after the Wii & WiiU were compromised through their web browsers
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
The eShop is also browser-based.
That's not perfect though. It's not a magic wand, sandoxed browsers have been exploited before.
No, it's an evolution of the 3ds firmware.
jts
...hate me...
Surely you mean $100 on top of the normal PS4 price, right?
Not even Apple can completely fight off exploits. Although there exists a semi-professional iOS hacking scene and tons of interest, tbf.
I honestly don't see a big relation between us being in the digital age and making a console free of piracy. Barring always-online DRM that we are not ready to accept, digital age only makes everyone having the tools and the knowledge to attack a device. It's an order of magnitude harder to patch and block every hole constantly.
Chronospherics
Member
Yes, it's very different and it just exploits a very particular part of the system, but the point is that you can't simply ignore these and say 'nothing will come from it' because nothing happened with the PS4.
The PS4 was exploited, in one way or another, to a point where piracy was achievable, so of course, every exploit like this, has potential to lead to something more significant. No one would have thought that cloning the bios and harddrive on a PS4 would enable you to activate your account on an infinite number of primary PS4s, in the same way no one knows what an exploit via the web app, would lead to.
As a disclaimer though, I don't advocate piracy and neither would I describe to anyone how to do it. The above description is a vague approximation of the PS4 exploit.
Well I believe you can either bring in your own PS4, or buy one at one of the stores. So it's $100 for the exploit but only assuming you own a PS4, otherwise it's whatever the system cost, plus the value of the exploit. I would not be surprised if some of these retailers install hacks as a means of selling units. Sounds more appealing if a pre-owned PS4 comes stacked with games.
Different stores would have different prices. I mean, it's an illegal market, it's not like the prices are regulated. Those are just the prices I've heard people speaking about. I've also heard people talking about $100 for 10 triple A games, and things like that. The people that vend this stuff can charge whatever they link, inventing their own deals as they please.
Ahh you're right. I guess I assumed this was going to follow in short order when the browser was used to 'browse'.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Sometimes I don't know why Nintendo even bothers. Even Sony eventually just gave stopping PSP hacks.
They also didn't seem to do much with the VIta, mostly cause no one really bought the Vita...
Wasn't the Vita hacked on the first day through the PSP emulator?
Elfforkusu
Member
Homebrew will get youtube and twitch working on the Switch before Nintendo does.
Actually doing some further reading on other forums, sounds like the webkit is indeed sandboxed and has other security on top of very tightly defined and restricted permissions profile.
So I'd hazard a guess Nintendo expected this and layered barriers to keep it as abstracted as possible.
So I'd hazard a guess Nintendo expected this and layered barriers to keep it as abstracted as possible.
NoFaceNico
Member
I'd install AM2R just to give them a big middle finger.
Rellik
Member
Hopefully there is a way through.
I don't have any clue about hacking but I guess they can just firmware update the vulnerability and require newer games to run the higher firmware as well as ship new consoles with the new firmware.
Nothing the less, it's a bit funny that the security allegedly wasn't as tight as you would have expected.
Nothing the less, it's a bit funny that the security allegedly wasn't as tight as you would have expected.
test_account
XP-39C²
No. The PSP emulator might have been, but not the Vita itself. The Vita is one of the most secure gaming system ever according to Yifan (one of the Vita hackers). Sony was even confident enough to let people run their own code through the PS Mobile program on Vita, and that didnt really lead to much on itself.
Xbox One might take the crown though. I havnt really heard any hacks about that, except that cloning thing that the PS4 also has (lets you run pirated games through hardware hack, but not connect online).
tearsintherain
Member
Not really, most jail broken custom firmwares (CFWs) spoof current firmware versions so games think everything is just fine and dandy on an older firmware. Then you can start making calls that only new firmware has, but usually the CFW will start implementing those functions so it just becomes a mini arms race on who is better and smarter. Historically Nintendo has fared extremely poorly when trying to keep hackers out of their systems, with every one of their consoles broken wide open and to the point where they completely lose control of it.
It usually takes a few years though and is usually 1-2 years before console retirement time, it would be a bit sad if the switch is broken a week after release. Once its completely opened up it can be extraordinarily difficult to undo it, PS4 really got mostly lucky because it was 1.76 and below that had a few exploits and they haven't shipped consoles with that version of the firmware for years now.