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The Order: 1886 |OT| Gears of Yore
- Thread starter Skux
- Start date
Say what now?
deltacanuckian
Member
Precisely why I think I'm going to hang onto this. The world is so interesting, the gunplay so fantastic, and the game short enough that this is the kind of game I'll pop in and replay very year or so just because.
Idris Elba for everything.
And Charles Dance for everything. I just enjoy watching that man on screen.
I'm in agreement with you here, for the most part. Everything in that 6-7 range makes perfect sense to me, but I feel some of the really low scores are undeserved. I understand that they made be written by people with a "gameplay first" mindset, but there is so much The Order gets right. Weapon feedback is phenomenal. Graphics are mindblowing. The soundtrack and sound design are top notch. The game is absolutely polished to a tee, something that's seemingly eluded a lot of AAA developers in the last two years. Whether the like the game or not, it's completely competent. I think the game deserves credit for these things alone.
TheWorthyEdge
Member
Bradley cooper as Lucan.
Just curious, what is it then? And what is up with that hilarious link to your tag?
theignoramus
Member
Theres an element of games journalism that thrives on hyperbole and tantrums when something doesnt live up to expectations. See:Heavenly Sword, a decent game unfairly maligned. Though this behaviour and "line in the sand" posturing is usually reserved for new IP. Cherished franchises that put out mediocre or just plain bad titles are consistently treated with kids gloves, so you have a jarring inconsistency that develops.
Steverulez
Member
The scale is 0-10 and people are finally using it. The Order is an above average game, but imo it has a lot of issues that affect the experience for me, I have no issues with 6/10 tbh.
First half of the game is good, second half isn't nearly so.
deltacanuckian
Member
Oh absolutely. It's a big part of the rise in YouTube that was getting touched on in the review thread. That's why I'm so happy that it's being mostly well-received by people who have played it, and hopefully RaD does get the chance to continue with this IP. There's just so much they could do with it and I'd hate for it to go to waste.
theignoramus
Member
I would have more respect for the publications scoring like that if they did it with mega franchises as well. Imagine if gaming media had a shred of integrity with some of the blockbuster shooter franchises, like CoD and Halo. Even Metal Gear Solid gets quite a bit of leeway with reviewers.
The journalist who gave The Order a 1/5 even admitted this earlier in this very thread. That he has greater expectations/standards for new IP than he does established franchises or sequels, and as such doesn't expect as much innovation from them. Kind of an unfair way of treating new IP's if you ask me, and probably one more reason we're likely to get less of them, and instead more churned out sequels. Certain journalists are essentially indirectly saying, nope this genre and type of game has already been done and now belongs to x, y or z franchise and therefore if you do a similar thing you're going to get shat on for it, unless you really stand out and do something different. This explains the mass hypocrisy and inconsistency of the rating and review scale system, and why games like Call of Duty or Fifa can get away with the same sort of shit over and over, whilst games like The Order 1886 are torn apart for being 'derivative' or 'unambitious'.
Schrade
Member
shinobi602
Member
Interestingly enough I felt the game picked up steam in the second half lol. In the end it's all subjective anyway. This thread is a poster child in that regard. I don't think I've seen a game ranging from 2 to a 9.5 on Metacritic quite like this.
I thought it was a solid experience that excelled in many regards but fell flat in others. If I was forced to give it a number it'd be an 8/10, ultimately every person in here will feel differently about something. I'm just enjoying the different viewpoints.
Not to derail but the TV I have bought states it has HDMI version 2. Or is that false?
http://www.appliancesonline.com.au/sony-kd70x8500b-70inch-177cm-4k-ultra-hd-smart-3d-led-lcd-tv/
Personally chapters 9 and 11 are the best by far (most shooting etc.) so yeah the second half was much better I think. 8.5/10 for me probably. The more I think back on it the more I like it.
Coma Ecliptic
Member
I really feel they marketed this wrong and had chance to take a different approach to it.
They marketed it as a classic "Video Game" and focused on the "Cinematic feel" yadda yadda.
I wonder if they explored marketing this as a interactive movie. I feel this may have been poorly received thinking they were getting a full-on video game, but the entire game felt like an interactive story thus far. Makes sense why when people played different pieces in chunks why it felt disjointed.
I'm not thrilled that a lot of what we've come to expect in games is completely omitted, but I really think that first and foremost their focus was on the story/characters/atmosphere/graphics and left mechanics/gameplay in the generic 3rd person shooter bin.
I just hit Chapter 12 and it feels like things are about to hit the fan. I'm enjoying this, rented it, and it was definitely worth renting.
**EDIT**
I really thing people shouldn't get so hung up on reviewers for the game. I can only speak for myself, but when I see movies that are critically panned I generally enjoy them for bits and pieces. I understand that games are "More expensive", but think about it this way going to a movie with your significant other can be around $50 after popcorn etc. I wish people would stop relying on others to tell them what they will like in any medium and just go experience it for yourself. Also, if anyone gets excited just because a game that was hyped gets a bad review they're just an asshole and should be treated that way.
They marketed it as a classic "Video Game" and focused on the "Cinematic feel" yadda yadda.
I wonder if they explored marketing this as a interactive movie. I feel this may have been poorly received thinking they were getting a full-on video game, but the entire game felt like an interactive story thus far. Makes sense why when people played different pieces in chunks why it felt disjointed.
I'm not thrilled that a lot of what we've come to expect in games is completely omitted, but I really think that first and foremost their focus was on the story/characters/atmosphere/graphics and left mechanics/gameplay in the generic 3rd person shooter bin.
I just hit Chapter 12 and it feels like things are about to hit the fan. I'm enjoying this, rented it, and it was definitely worth renting.
**EDIT**
I really thing people shouldn't get so hung up on reviewers for the game. I can only speak for myself, but when I see movies that are critically panned I generally enjoy them for bits and pieces. I understand that games are "More expensive", but think about it this way going to a movie with your significant other can be around $50 after popcorn etc. I wish people would stop relying on others to tell them what they will like in any medium and just go experience it for yourself. Also, if anyone gets excited just because a game that was hyped gets a bad review they're just an asshole and should be treated that way.
Why can't we just enjoy the game and not worry about the opinions of a group of reviewers? It's what they thought based on the values they weighed their game experience with. They don't need to validate your opinions.
Net_Wrecker
Member
Two titles I feel completely let down their great mechanics by the way the games are designed and how their stories are told (or not told in Destiny's case)
I'll just link to one of my recent posts which outlines how I feel about "cinematic" games pretty succinctly. To be fair to The Order, the game seems to do a lot in core gameplay presentation to establish itself as a cinematic title (aspect ratio, camera behavior, lighting, post-processing, music, etc.) but the reliance on totally passive cutscenes takes it too often from "cinematic" to simply "cinema" and is a style of storytelling I've grown to dislike more and more. Even beyond the narrative, I just don't like what the constant breaks and restrictions in total player control do to pacing.
As for the tag, it's become a mix of 2 different tags from completely different situations. The video is in reference to something I said or did in a wrestling thread in Off Topic a few years back (and was attached to a different term), while "Cinematically Cinematic" comes from me jokingly defending Tomb Raider 2013 in the face of Dark Souls selling 2 million.
Same score as I'd give it at the moment, but I've been wanting to hold off on sharing my full impressions, or giving it a score till I've completed my second play through. Mind you I have quite a long list of complaints, most are nitpicking or minor, but a few are more glaring, but the positives still far outweigh the negatives.
Got it earlier and and up to chapter 5 so far.
Hooo boy. I feel all over the place with it so far. The latest stuff on this ship was a pretty nice summation of it--starts with slowly moving around not doing much at all, works up to a QTE fight in the cockpit(where you die instantly upon missing a prompt and restart), then a stealth section where you instantly die if you get seen, or if you mistime the takedown prompt.
But then there was a fight right after where I got the three crown shotgun and holy shit that thing is amazing.
Seeing some of the above discussion, I agree that the feedback and general shooting is fine--but it needs more than just that. So far, I haven't seen anything that stood out. The thermite rifle shootout was the coolest thing so far, but that felt like more of a tutorial and the gun has since been yanked from my hands and I'm not sure how much it will show up. I was also expecting more of a prevalance of actual lycan fights, but given they literally seem to have one attack and are horribly uninteresting to fight, I guess I should be thankful.
There are also constant on screen tutorial prompts even to this point that I can click in the stick to move faster, which funnily enough seems necessary as the game basically needs to give you permission to allow you to do this, as it is outright disabled in a lot of segments, which is something that bugs the shit out of me in a game.
Hooo boy. I feel all over the place with it so far. The latest stuff on this ship was a pretty nice summation of it--starts with slowly moving around not doing much at all, works up to a QTE fight in the cockpit(where you die instantly upon missing a prompt and restart), then a stealth section where you instantly die if you get seen, or if you mistime the takedown prompt.
But then there was a fight right after where I got the three crown shotgun and holy shit that thing is amazing.
Seeing some of the above discussion, I agree that the feedback and general shooting is fine--but it needs more than just that. So far, I haven't seen anything that stood out. The thermite rifle shootout was the coolest thing so far, but that felt like more of a tutorial and the gun has since been yanked from my hands and I'm not sure how much it will show up. I was also expecting more of a prevalance of actual lycan fights, but given they literally seem to have one attack and are horribly uninteresting to fight, I guess I should be thankful.
There are also constant on screen tutorial prompts even to this point that I can click in the stick to move faster, which funnily enough seems necessary as the game basically needs to give you permission to allow you to do this, as it is outright disabled in a lot of segments, which is something that bugs the shit out of me in a game.
Based on how much the graphics are touted.
Sure, part of that is the fact that the graphics are amazing.
In some cases it also comes across as an attempt to discredit low review scores, as though amazing graphics make up for some serious flaws.
I would truly love this game if there was more to it. I think it was Tom Sawyer who made a post with some good suggestions.
Levelling up weapons, choosing sidekicks, hubworld, etc. Fleshing this game out (I'm not suggesting turning it into some sort of Ubi cut and paste fest BTW) would have made it something truly special for me.
reptilescorpio
Member
Ha, I felt the opposite! Enjoyed the second half a hell of a lot more than the first. The story really got up and running with some interesting twists and the level design improved a lot.
The Xtortionist
Member
Encounter design, AI, and enemy design should be RAD's top priorities for a sequel (along with cutscene-gameplay pacing). Still, the shooting is good enough to me that, paired with the production values, gets the game up to something like a 7/10. Just wait until you get the repeating shotgun and late game revolver ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I hope an Arcade or Horde mode is in consideration for post-release content. I'm still baffled that gunplay and aiming controls are so good, yet the overall game design downplays them. RAD clearly put a ton of work into them.
Interestingly, I was looking back at some old Order threads and found this:
Now I'm not sure a "supernatural thriller" was the right track, but it definitely shows that the way they've sold the game changed over the course of development. The January trailer turned the game into a pure action blockbuster and got a lot of GAF on board.
In that thread I think I also cast my Lafayette haha
And my Isabeau! (maybe not, this pic is from Gladiator and she's a fair bit older now)
It is weird. To nail the feel so well and then fall flat on encounter design, level design, etc.
ricardo_sousa11
Member
Just finished the game, what an incredible experience ! Loved every single second of it, even the ending so many people are talking about. Although I would have loved + 1/2 hours, and see an end to
, I think all of this could and should be answered with DLC, and not wait for a sequel !
I will begin my 2nd playthrough tomorrow to get the platinum.
Lord Hastings, and know a bit more about the vampires, blackwater, and galahad itself
I will begin my 2nd playthrough tomorrow to get the platinum.
shinobi602
Member
pharmboy044
Member
Currently on chapter 4 but just wanted to say that the arc gun and the thermal rifle are fuckin badass. I love how the enemies react to getting burned with the rifle.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Why not? That stuff could be fun. Obviously, if executed poorly, it wouldn't be much fun, but as everyone is saying, the feel of the shooting is great. I'd love for some more open-ended options when it came to the combat scenarios. Allowing you to kind of go out on excursions based on your own weapon and team loadout could have added a lot of replay value.
Do it in a subtle way. Especially seeing as the trade off seems to be a bunch of QTE stuff, small and very linear levels with pretty much pointless jumping and very simplistic encounter design.
I'd even take a game with more of the great shooting so that I could get a better feel for it and feel like it was a bigger part of the game rather than a whole bunch of looking at stuff (what is the point of that in the grand scheme of things?), connect the dots jumping, overly long story exposition, etc.
Oh, forgot the lousy stealth stuff. Didn't do themselves any favors by having you dispatch every single guy with a brutally and seemingly noisy flurry of strikes. Why even bother if all the dead bodies don't trigger any reaction. They could have at least not have had it so that getting discovered was instant death. Have the character take a hit, then put all the guards on alert and force a firefight.
That would be cool, but it'd basically become Mass Effect: 1886 and a completely different game. There's plenty of scope for RAD to improve the core formula of "cinematic TPS with amazing presentation" without having to branch out into other genres.
Monkey_Plunkett
Member
Im on chapter 11 now having played around 10 hours. Im really enjoying it so far. I know this game is divisive, and not without issues that will grate with some players but to get so many reviews below a 7 and not much more above is bullshit imo. For me its a solid 8/10 game.
RetrospectiveLamb
Member
Using the laser gun in chapter 8 on the bridge was so bad ass. I'm currently on Ch 9 and so far I dig it. Only gripes I may share is I wish there was more interaction with the world rather than just picking up stuff and staring at it mindlessly and less QTE
shinobi602
Member
Why? That's not what Ready at Dawn is aiming for in this IP. RPG elements like leveling up weapons, "picking squads" and running around in hubworlds are the antithesis of the experience they're trying to pull off. This is a very focused IP with very focused characters/weapons, etc that are grounded somewhat in reality.
Throwing in things like that muddies the whole thing. Other games implement those design choices, there are plenty of them out there. All of that is unnecessary fluff honestly. Let Ready at Dawn craft their baby like they intended to and double down on their ideas, but I'm all for things like improving combat encounters and level design.
That's why we both suggested something subtle.
Have some sort of currency or XP accumulating in the background and then between chapters have Tesla upgrade a weapon of your choice, at least. They even have your upgrade guy built into the game already.
If they want to avoid numbers you could just choose "increase accuracy" or "increase damage", etc.
Though imo not at all necessary, I'm cool with weapon upgrades and scavenging for items and parts (two of my fave TPS, RE4 and LoU have this), but not keen on the other ideas. Though I suppose Tesla's new lab could act as a sort of hub, Eg The Order 1887's version of the Merchant from RE4. It'd make more sense in a sequel as Tesla will no longer have an unlimited budget, supplies or a full on sophisticated high end lab the way he did in this game, so stuff you collect could prove more valuable.
Fair enough. I think they muddied their own waters by trying to make an interactive movie and then putting a half assed TPS in there.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
It's not fluff if it's implemented in a meaningful way. They were just ideas, anyway, not demands. RAD appears to be in sore need of ideas, because their idea of gameplay scenarios is pitiful based on what they gave us in the game. No one would be in here suggesting such things if what we got was very good in the first place.
Luckily you seem to have a source that says they'll be able to focus more on the gameplay in the sequel. Hopefully they double down on more of the fun stuff and less of the cart pushing.
I'd be fine if they double down on the "watch a movie and press buttons sometimes" aspect and just got rid of the shooting, too, honestly. If they're going to half-ass it again, I'd rather they just not do it at all and focus on what they're good at instead.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
A hubworld and levelling weapons would be cool if we could really investigate monster attacks and follow them. Doubt that's what RAD would want, though.
Probably because they have swaying power over lots of people who might choose not to buy a certain game, killing the studio and IP. Not to mention all those people here that love to say the game is bad without even playing the game who feel supported in their statement by dozens of reviews.
I wish it weren't like that though. I already outgrew reviewers.
Man... I really wanted a supernatural thriller. It seems like the thriller was only present in Chapter 3. Really sad how it change during development.
I really thought at first that we were going to fight more monsters than humans, because after all, The Order cannot be bothered to get into petty political problems, and focus only on the fight against half breeds. Then we got 95% human enemies.
Probably because they have swaying power over lots of people who might choose not to buy a certain game, killing the studio and IP. Not to mention all those people here that love to say the game is bad without even playing the game who feel supported in their statement by dozens of reviews.
I wish it weren't like that though. I already outgrew reviewers.
Interestingly, I was looking back at some old Order threads and found this:
Now I'm not sure a "supernatural thriller" was the right track, but it definitely shows that the way they've sold the game changed over the course of development. The January trailer turned the game into a pure action blockbuster and got a lot of GAF on board.
Man... I really wanted a supernatural thriller. It seems like the thriller was only present in Chapter 3. Really sad how it change during development.
I really thought at first that we were going to fight more monsters than humans, because after all, The Order cannot be bothered to get into petty political problems, and focus only on the fight against half breeds. Then we got 95% human enemies.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
People rinse this game for being exactly what's wrong with AAA games, then suggest things to improve it like tacked on XP, Crafting and Skill Upgrades which are 3 elements that are contributing heavily to what is making so many western AAA games so derivative these days. Far Cry, Tomb Raider, Batman, Shadow of Mordor, Assassin's Creed...I could go on all freakin' day.
What the game needs is better level design as well as slightly more open areas and in general higher emphasis on player agency.
I'd also note that the Hospital segments were imo the best in the game, primarily for atmosphere and they reminded me a lot of Resident Evil etc. More of that please RAD. They absolute nailed that Chapter.
What the game needs is better level design as well as slightly more open areas and in general higher emphasis on player agency.
I'd also note that the Hospital segments were imo the best in the game, primarily for atmosphere and they reminded me a lot of Resident Evil etc. More of that please RAD. They absolute nailed that Chapter.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
Ready At Dawn needs to aim at creating a cinematic adventure game that also has expanded gameplay systems.
RPG elements add greatly to games and it's understandable why they should be included. They don't need to make a bloated game like Assassin's Creed, but if they can offer more gameplay / exploration to the tune of something like Arkham Asylum, that would go a long way towards resolving many issues people had with how bare bones the experience felt.
Having a hub area would be pretty nice, and would certainly make the title more engrossing from an atmosphere perspective. The game can still retain it's linear narrative structure while having these open areas that offer unique distractions from the typical gameplay foundations.
badnewsbeers
Member
I'm just in chapter one but has anyone else found the start to be fairly slow? It's a bit tedious, but I've just reached the first shooting section and that feels great.
shinobi602
Member
Well, everyone has their opinion, though I disagree with that assessment
I wasn't saying not to bring up ideas, I just personally feel things like that aren't in the best interest of improving the game they set out to make. I'm thinking things like expanding on the level design, implementing more dynamic enemy encounters, enemy variety, AI and slightly less cutscenes vs gameplay would drastically improve the IP, to me at least.
Ryouji Gunblade
Member
I think the game had just enough mechanics to do what it needed to do, and that is good design. Now we just need more chapters and fewer black bars.
Schrade
Member
The beginning is very tedious. After the first several chapters things start to get more interesting and fun.
theignoramus
Member
I dont know about "levelling up" but I really wish the boss encounter in that hospital was more "Evil Within" or "Siren:Blood Curse" where the boss hunts you and you have a series of evasive or combat oriented exchanges with it. Fucking Siren man, that game has appalling, wonky controls, bad graphics, and a poor framerate, but it still managed to make some of the best horror themed bosses ever. More developers should strive to imitate how they gave an element of depth and complexity to their bosses.
Absolutely. It's 15 minutes of QTEs, then 10 minutes of walking before you even get to shoot something. The game should have started with a bang but the slow start probably turned off a lot of people.