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[Atrophis]

Not sure if your being sarcastic, glib or poignant but this comment cuts to the point swiftly and deeply.

Silly study. You can feel regret at any time in your life. Ask those same women on their deathbed. Or maybe if they're in their 50s and childless. I'm not commenting on their decisions but the stupidity of this study.

This may shock you to your core but not every woman wants children and won't change their mind even if they are 50 or on their death bed.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Not sure if your being sarcastic, glib or poignant but this comment cuts to the point swiftly and deeply.

Silly study. You can feel regret at any time in your life. Ask those same women on their deathbed. Or maybe if they're in their 50s and childless. I'm not commenting on their decisions but the stupidity of this study.

Abortion isn't murder sooooo

And women who already have children make up a huge number of women who have abortions (they might even be the largest percentage)

 

[Dirtyshubb]

The arguments against abortion are always full of bias, ignorance and just plain stupidity that it really is hard to read through the responses.

Firstly - not everyone who gets pregnant did so because of being reckless and having sex without a condom. Some contraceptives fail without you being aware they have until you are pregnant, it’s not always as simple as “Condom broke so I better get the morning after pill”. Stop assuming its reckless children who get abortions.

Secondly – Pregnancy is a huge strain on women’s bodies and can also be life threatening or at least cause permanent changes so the argument of ‘Just give it up for adoption’ is terribly misguided since you are asking the person to go through a lot of strain and potential danger.

Thirdly – Not everyone is able to give a child an acceptable life, be it financially or emotionally and either forcing the child to grow up in that environment or putting it up for adoption which anyone who has read reports on how that can severely mess up a child even more due to a number of factors, really isn’t a great option.

Lastly – a foetus isnt a human being, no matter how much some want to argue this fact. It is simply the start of a potential life but it is in no way at any point a fully developed person who will be aware of their situation on any conscious level.

It always feels like the people who argue against abortions either – Cant have children themselves, have a child/sibling that was born prematurely, had a child die or are religious which are in no way a valid argument against abortions. They are arguments of why YOU might not want one or feel they are right for you, but they are in NO WAY a reason why other people who will live their life with the outcome should be forced to live with something because you don’t like it, and if you think it is than that shows how selfish and ignorant you truly are.

As for the topic – Im glad to see studies like this come out, its time we end the ongoing narrative that abortions are life changing, emotionally damaging acts that you will regret because as this states, this is simply not true and can save people’s lives – both literally and figuratively.

 

[Prime crotch]

Is it me or is there some meanness on this thread directed at people who regret having had an abortion?

 

[TatteredHat]

I am not surprised, though minimizing unwanted pregnancies with proper sex-ed is a much better solution.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Is it me or is there some meanness on this thread directed at people who regret having had an abortion?

Uh just you.

 

[farmerboy]

About 1% of American women get an abortion per year. It comes out to about 1 in every 3 women by the age of 45. 33% of the women you know very likely have had at least one abortion.

Also, we all do things we regret. In a case like abortion, it's easy to say "well you'll regret it," because there's only two choices. Abort, or don't abort. You'll NEVER know what it would have been like if you made the other choice, as either one makes a substantial impact in life. It's easy to look back on a choice like this, that is so binary and yet defining, and think about the "whatifs."

Similarly, we could ask the women that did have kids, hey, do you regret this? Do you regret dropping out of college or high school? Do you regret how much time and energy you had to put into your kid rather into yourself? Do you regret giving up a potentially fulfilling and meaningful career? Do you regret being shamed and ostracized by your family and community? etc (By the way, these are horrible and unfair questions to ask someone, and I do not mean to imply that any of these questions are universally true. I use these to demonstrate the opposite side of the same technique, rhetoric questions used for shame and guilt.)

The point is that women can be sad about a heartbreaking choice, and yet not regret it because they feel it is the right one for them. If they choose to do so, they shouldn't be shamed by others for making their own choice.

Women that choose NOT to abort should also not be shamed.



But everyone knows women can't be trusted to make their own decisions or have their own feelings about those decisions....

This study is flawed, wrong, bias, etc, anyway.

(/s)

This may shock you to your core but not every woman wants children and won't change their mind even if they are 50 or on their death bed.

Abortion isn't murder sooooo

And women who already have children make up a huge number of women who have abortions (they might even be the largest percentage)

You've got me all wrong, maybe i chose the wrong examples. I'm not getting into the abortion debate because there are so many grey areas and it is an emotionally charged topic. Suffice to say that I've been fortunate enough not to have to make that decision and hope to never have to.
I just think its a bullshit survey. The only thing i take out of it is that 95% don't feel regret AT THE TIME OF THE SURVEY.
Lives change. Perspectives change. The 5% that felt regret, may not sometime in the future. The 95% that did not feel regret, may feel it sometime in the future.

 

[SmokyDave]

It's not a decision that is made lightly, so I'm not surprised that people tend to make the right decision. I'm kinda surprised at the 5%. I wonder if it's a deep regret or just a wistful 'what might have been'.

 

[InfiniteBento]

I had an abortion when I was 15. I was in an abusive relationship and a frequent drinker/drug user.

Its been almost 7 years since and I don't regret it in the slightest. My life is going in such a positive direction and none of this would've been possible if I had kept both that kid and my abusive ex in the picture.

It was a difficult decision to make, I did it behind my mothers back. I went through the legal system and was represented by a free lawyer so I could petition to a judge how I was making the right decision at my age and get a signed off consent form for the procedure. It was tough and I will never forget what happened but I am far stronger now than I ever thought I would be.

There has not been a single day that has gone by where I regret it.

 

[Neidii]

Once someone has the will to kill their own child then there really isn't anything that could surprise me so how shocking could it be that there isn't regret?
Most people who would feel regret wouldn't have had the abortion in the first place.

Wtf. TIL women are crazy psychopaths and cant be trusted to make their own decisions.

Women should never feel ashamed of making a choice like this, it's so old fashioned to go around saying that abortion is such a terrible thing and women should feel really bad. Maybe they're not ready for a kid, maybe they're too young, maybe they just don't want it. It doesn't matter. I'm not gonna let someone tell me what I can and cant do with my body and I'm sure not gonna feel regret.

EDIT:

Thread needs a "Am I out of touch? No, it's the women who are wrong." shop.

Yeah haha

 

[WedgeX]

Thread needs a "Am I out of touch? No, it's the women who are wrong." shop.

Seriously.

 

[farmerboy]

I agree with you about how people's feelings change.

I do not think it contributes to anything good at "remind" women that they might feel regret about an abortion some time down the road. Chances are, if a woman is seriously considering abortion, she's probably very upset already. We might as well remind a women at a doctor's exam during pregnancy that she "might regret" having the child. It just doesn't make a lot of sense, and can come off as a little patronizing despite intent.

Once again I'm only commenting on what I think is a shitty survey and agree with what you've said as well.

You wouldn't want to be making these big decisions without some serious support (sans the judgement).

 

[USC-fan]

Well, considering nearly half the respondents already had a previous abortion, they likely would have already been through all of that.

Thats the most shocking thing for me. We need more free birth control.

 

[Platy]

I agree a fetus isn't a "baby", but I mean look at the research: "53 percent found it very or somewhat difficult", even if we don't see fetus' as a "baby" clearly the decision still hurts/weighs on women a lot, so I hate when people make silly strawmen arguments that women are 'thrilled' to go through it or use it as a 'form of birth control'.

Dificult even if only because it is a medical procedure... people talk about things like breast implants but it is a fucking surgery so it is nothing like pressing a button and suddenly big boobs

 

[FuuRe]

People don't regret being responsible and choosing what they do with their bodies and lives?

I'm fucking shocked.

The unborn baby is also another life, left without the right to choose.

Talk about shock

 

[Guileless]

People don't regret being responsible and choosing what they do with their bodies and lives?

I'm fucking shocked.

Consumerism. It's fantastic.

 

[excelsiorlef]

The unborn baby is also another life, left without the right to choose.

Talk about shock

This is why abortion debates are so annoying one side wants to condemn and judge all as murderers. The other side wants to have the right to make a personal choice.

Abortion is not murder and an unborn baby is not "alive"

 

[Dude Abides]

This is why abortion debates are so annoying one side wants to condemn and judge all as murderers. The other side wants to have the right to make a personal choice.

Abortion is not murder and an unborn baby is not "alive"

The fetus is alive. This focus is misplaced IMO. The problem with the "pro-life" position is that it advocates that person A should be forced against their will to grant person B the use of their body. Arguing about the status of the fetus is a bit of a red herring both substantively and strategically.

 

[Krauser Kat]

It's too bad they can't do a similar study with the unborn human infants.

... WTF is this shit.

I am going to assume you eat meat.

You are fine with trying to ask for consent by something that can barely even think, yet are completely okay with causing the death without consent of cows, who have been shown to have life long friends and cans show more emotions than 6-18 month old baby.

 

[FuuRe]

This is why abortion debates are so annoying one side wants to condemn and judge all as murderers. The other side wants to have the right to make a personal choice.

Abortion is not murder and an unborn baby is not "alive"

Are you for real? so being out of the womb is now the chemical process that grants you life or something?

 

[metalslimer]

Fetuses are alive. Doesn't make them any more of an aware organism than the millions of cattle we slaughter every year and eat. Hell a cockroach is more cognizant than early fetuses.

 

[FuuRe]

... WTF is this shit.

I am going to assume you eat meat.

You are fine with trying to ask for consent by something that can barely even think, yet are completely okay with causing the death without consent of cows, who have been shown to have life long friends and cans show more emotions than 6-18 month old baby.

How can anyone be more wrong? i assume you don't have kids.

And what the hell with that logic, a lioness would care for their cubs but not for the gazelles, it's animal nature.

Everyone should stop trying to cover the sun with one finger, if you are pro abortion, at least have the guts to assume you are okay with killing someone else without trying to sugar-coat the reality.

 

[metalslimer]

How can anyone be more wrong? i assume you don't have kids.

And what the hell with that logic, a lioness would care for their cubs but not for the gazelles, it's animal nature.

Everyone should stop trying to cover the sun with one finger, if you are pro abortion, at least have the guts to assume you are okay with killing someone else without trying to sugar-coat the reality.

So your argument as to why you are pro eating meat is that in the animal kingdom animals should protect their own and fuck everything else?

 

[FuuRe]

So your argument as to why you are pro eating meat is that in the animal kingdom animals should protect their own and fuck everything else?

It's not as extreme as fuck everyone else, if you need to eat an apple you don't get every apple and then burn the tree lol.

It's about needs mostly, and that i couldn't kill my kids.

You are trying to pin me to conclude only vegans can be pro-life?

 

[professor_t]

These were the study requirements, right above the line you found weird:

Further above that they talked about the differences between the groups they tested and whatnot, but I think it's safe to say "eligible if they were English- or Spanish-speaking, ≥15 years old, and had a pregnancy with no known fetal anomalies" is fairly broad.

It's also a three year study, so it's not like everyone might be jumping at the chance to commit (however minimal the effort) to the study.

I can't say that his criticism is valid without really digging into the study, but I can say for certain that you're not addressing his criticism.

However, the fact that he's wondering about it actually is encouraging. It's always discouraging to see presumably bright, left-minded people rush to endorse a study that confirms their beliefs without truly cross-examining it.

 

[RM8]

Forcing a kid into an unfit family is so much more humane than interrupting pregnancy before the product has any consciousness, yeah. For being "pro-life", some people don't care one bit about the quality of life. On that note, the term pro-life bothers me because people who are not against abortion are not anti-life, lol. It's like when a particular kind of people hijacks the word "family".

 

[excelsiorlef]

Are you for real? so being out of the womb is now the chemical process that grants you life or something?

In that sense that they are no longer living off the body of another yes.

It's not as extreme as fuck everyone else, if you need to eat an apple you don't get every apple and then burn the tree lol.

It's about needs mostly, and that i couldn't kill my kids.

You are trying to pin me to conclude only vegans can be pro-life?

Then don't have an abortion. That's the beauty of it all. You can choose not to.

 

[tcrunch]

A 1st-2nd trimester fetus has the exact same cognitive and emotional capacity as literally any stage of life after that, and if women were really "responsible" they would never have sex with men ever, and the only women who get abortions are childless harpies and definitely not mostly women who already have kids. Abortions are only done because the woman is selfish and never a family planning decision, assuming it's even a "decision" at all and she isn't just being psychotic/hysterical/womanly or was coerced by Big Abortion into getting one. In general women just aren't fully human, with fully realized emotions or thought processes, and they can't be trusted to make effective decisions or to have genuine feelings that they made the right decision later. It only makes sense to equate their right to their bodies with a fetus's right to their bodies in that light.

 

[Krauser Kat]

Fetuses are alive. Doesn't make them any more of an aware organism than the millions of cattle we slaughter every year and eat. Hell a cockroach is more cognizant than early fetuses.

This was the argument i was trying to make. thank you for making it more succinctly. Consent is not where one should be looking as a defense of keeping a baby until birth.

Also i dont think anyone is pro-abortion. We are for the choice a women should have regarding her body.

 

[hey_it's_that_dog]

Abortion is sad, and gross, and troubling, and nobody should want more abortions to occur, but a woman's right to choose absolutely and completely trumps all of those concerns.

Opponents of abortion feel these things very acutely and have a difficult time reasoning without heavy input from their gut feelings. Having a child (with my wife) recently myself made it easy to understand why people oppose it; it brought into stark relief the emotions surrounding pregnancy and childbirth and having a baby. It did not, however, change my views about what other people should have the right to do and the choices they have the right to make for themselves.

 

[Zoe]

In that sense that they are no longer living off the body of another yes.

Parasitic organisms, no matter their purpose, are generally treated as alive. I don't see why fetuses are treated any differently.

 

[metalslimer]

This was the argument i was trying to make. thank you for making it more succinctly. Consent is not where one should be looking as a defense of keeping a baby alive until birth.

Also i dont think anyone is pro-abortion. We are for the choice a women should have regarding her body.

I'm pro abortion in the sense that the benefits to our society of terminating pregnancies where the mother cannot provide for the child are vast.

Can we get off this alive argument. Scientifically it is a fact that a fetus is alive.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Parasitic organisms, no matter their purpose, are generally treated as alive. I don't see why fetuses are treated any differently.

Sorry I was trying to talk about it as in human life.

Forget it poor choice of words and semantics on my part.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

I had an abortion when I was 15. I was in an abusive relationship and a frequent drinker/drug user.

Its been almost 7 years since and I don't regret it in the slightest. My life is going in such a positive direction and none of this would've been possible if I had kept both that kid and my abusive ex in the picture.

It was a difficult decision to make, I did it behind my mothers back. I went through the legal system and was represented by a free lawyer so I could petition to a judge how I was making the right decision at my age and get a signed off consent form for the procedure. It was tough and I will never forget what happened but I am far stronger now than I ever thought I would be.

There has not been a single day that has gone by where I regret it.

Holy shit, this is incredible. I honestly don't know if I could have thought that clearly and that far ahead to do something like that. That's extremely impressive and I'm glad everything worked out for you. Hope college is going well.

 

[hey_it's_that_dog]

Instead of talking about "humanity," which a fetus indisputably has, the fetus-centered debate has to be about "personhood." A fetus does not have personhood, so any rights conferred by personhood are absent. Then you can debate the concept of personhood, where do you draw the line, yadda yadda yadda.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Instead of talking about "humanity," which a fetus indisputably has, the fetus-centered debate has to be about "personhood." A fetus does not have personhood, so any rights conferred by personhood are absent. Then you can debate the concept of personhood, where do you draw the line, yadda yadda yadda.

Yeah that was what I was trying to get at with "alive" but personhood is hella a better concept

 

[metalslimer]

Instead of talking about "humanity," which a fetus indisputably has, the fetus-centered debate has to be about "personhood." A fetus does not have personhood, so any rights conferred by personhood are absent. Then you can debate the concept of personhood, where do you draw the line, yadda yadda yadda.

Of course but most people don't want to talk about what personhood entails because they realize that would be hypocritical to argue for personhood for a fetus and not for the animals we eat everyday. The only argument for slaughtering animals Seems to be that they are not our own species.

 

[Crazyorloco]

Obviously the men's feelings are more important in this matter, clearly.

ha! One of the first things I thought about here. As the father, I would be devastated.

 

[Deleted member 20920]

Hey, getting pregnant is normally something you can choose. I don't think abortion is ever the right course of action. My heart goes out to the women who had no choice, I'm not saying it's up to them to raise the child when they can't later. An acquaintance I knew had that situation where it wasn't her choice, she had the baby still. I don't know if she chose to raise it herself or not, she moved on so I wasn't able to keep up. Either way I don't think killing someone else is ever right. The line of logic where we go "it's her or my body" is understandable in of itself, but a baby also happens to have it's own body. Just because it requires the mother to sustain it... just like we still require outside means to sustain our bodies after birth... doesn't make it ok to axe a baby.

Do I think all people who abort are irresponsible or immoral RM8? Their lifestyle very well could be amazing and far surpass mine, but I do think they made at least one irresponsible or immoral decision.

It is responsible of a woman to abort a baby when she doesn't want the baby, can't raise it or have any other reasons that she deems as more important. It is not murder. It is not a person until it is born.

The irresponsibility thing to do is to go through a pregnancy and give birth to a baby just because of some stupid moral issues.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Hey, getting pregnant is normally something you can choose. I don't think abortion is ever the right course of action. My heart goes out to the women who had no choice, I'm not saying it's up to them to raise the child when they can't later. An acquaintance I knew had that situation where it wasn't her choice, she had the baby still. I don't know if she chose to raise it herself or not, she moved on so I wasn't able to keep up. Either way I don't think killing someone else is ever right. The line of logic where we go "it's her or my body" is understandable in of itself, but a baby also happens to have it's own body. Just because it requires the mother to sustain it... just like we still require outside means to sustain our bodies after birth... doesn't make it ok to axe a baby.

Do I think all people who abort are irresponsible or immoral RM8? Their lifestyle very well could be amazing and far surpass mine, but I do think they made at least one irresponsible or immoral decision.

Congratulations you just compared/equated women to food.

 

[Champagne]

I thought the public consciousness in regards to abortion had begun to significantly shift in the past 5 years in a positive manner.....

Then I came in this thread and read some of the replies.

There's some shameful ass shit in here.

 

[FuuRe]

But what about adoptions? there are a lot of couples unable to have kids, why can't they take care of the unwanted babies? i don't conceive why abortion seems to be the only viable choice.

If anything, i would feel less regrets if i gave my baby in adoption rather than killing him.

And guys, honestly, i think you need to have a kid to understand that personhood is invalid in this argument, as then it would make sense to kill babies, people in vegetative state, or with alzheimer's, etc.

There's no magic switch or binary value about life and the right to it, personhood is out of this argument.

The only scenario where i could find abortion reasonable is in fetus inhability, in case of risk of death of the mother i have mixed feelings since i as a father (and my wife thinks the same too) would try everything before the abortion, how would we feel about killing our baby before feeling totally secure there was no other way?. And about rape i really dunno, i'm honest, i would be pro abortion, but my wife says the baby isn't the culprit in that case, and she's right.

Adoption guys, there's huge barriers for parents wanting to adopt, some are ok but some are excessive, who would be more fit to take care of the child than a couple willing to take care of one?

There should be a raise on adoptions now that same sex couples are able to marry, so it's all for the better.

 

[Champagne]

But what about adoptions? there are a lot of couples unable to have kids, why can't they take care of the unwanted babies? i don't conceive why abortion seems to be the only viable choice.

If anything, i would feel less regrets if i gave my baby in adoption rather than killing him.

And guys, honestly, i think you need to have a kid to understand that personhood is invalid in this argument, as then it would make sense to kill babies, paraplegic people, people with alzheimer's, etc.

There's no magic switch or binary value about life and the right to it, personhood is out of this argument.

How delusional and selfish do you have to be to want everyone else in the world to dictate their lives around your personal beliefs?

It literally boggles my mind to think that someone could be this self-centered.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

95% is an extremely high percentage of people to agree on anything. I definitely believe that the percentage is a high number but that is a pretty damn shocking amount.

 

[riotous]

Fetuses are alive. Doesn't make them any more of an aware organism than the millions of cattle we slaughter every year and eat. Hell a cockroach is more cognizant than early fetuses.

Yeah the "it's not a life" argument is really flawed.

A fetus is objectively a human life form; at one of its stages of development.

I'm pro choice and have no issue with abortion but wish people would speak factually about life and life forms.

 

[Battersea Power Station]

How delusional and selfish do you have to be to want everyone else in the world to dictate their lives around your personal beliefs?

It literally boggles my mind to think that someone could be this self-centered.

I'm not anti-abortion rights but I'm not sure what you mean. Can you clarify how he's being self-centered?

 

[CrunchyFrog]

It doesnt matter what they think. It only matters what people who dont know them think about it.

Thats what a woman's decision should be guided by. People who have nothing to do with her life.

Spoiler

The whole abortion "controversy" is silly to me. Its none of your business people.

I'm gonna get flack for this but whatever.

The pro life argument isn't that the woman has no say about her body DE facto or that her opinion doesn't matter or that her life should be entirely dictated by others, it's that the life conceived has just as much a right to live as she does and it is unfair to deny that right simply because that life cannot currently respond. It would be far more productive for you and others to interface without being so incredibly reductive.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

How delusional and selfish do you have to be to want everyone else in the world to dictate their lives around your personal beliefs?

It literally boggles my mind to think that someone could be this self-centered.

If you think abortion is wrong from a moral perspective I don't find this a particularly shocking or even illogical opinion.

I mean me personally, I am not really interested in making other peoples choices for them so I do not give a shit whether someone does or doesn't get one "but" with any debate where there is the possibility to bring morality or ethics into it, its not surprising people straight up do not want certain things to ever be done. One offing it as delusional or self centered doesn't really add anything of worth to the discusion

 

[Champagne]

I'm not anti-abortion rights but I'm not sure what you mean. Can you clarify how he's being self-centered?

Read his post.

He wants to deny others the right to an abortion because, and I quote:

"If anything, i would feel less regrets if i gave my baby in adoption rather than killing him."

Yes, that's right. Other people, with their own stories, beliefs, cultures, religions, situations, standards, codes of morality, etc. etc. should be denied certain rights because he (or she? I dunno) personally finds more comfort in delivering the baby and then giving it away to an adoption agency.

Then he proceeds to entirely dismiss the concept of person-hood (and the lack of it in regards to a fetus) being a relevant factor in the discussion because, again, he personally disagrees with it.

So once again he wants to deny millions of others the right to abort because of his personal beliefs.

If thinking that your personal opinions are so important that they should supersede the rights of 7 billion other people on this planet isn't self-centered, then good luck ever finding anything that is.

 

[FuuRe]

How delusional and selfish do you have to be to want everyone else in the world to dictate their lives around your personal beliefs?

It literally boggles my mind to think that someone could be this self-centered.

How? i'm presenting my stance and there are only two states about abortion, i'm not allowed to express my way of thinking without people feeling offended by it because it doesn't fit them?