What I disagree with is that there isn't quality content in HR and (based on the demo) Beyond. What Cage does do extremely well in my opinion is emotion. In fact, I can't really think of any games that do it better.
I think true healthy discussion about a game, film, TV show, book etc. is when people consume said thing in question and discuss what they took away from it. Getting in a discussion or debate about something you have no investment in or haven't experienced yet seems pointless to me. We're all guilty, including myself, of this a majority of the time.
I know enough about the game to know that I will thoroughly enjoy it. I also want to support developers that try to create something different.
this is so true.I think true healthy discussion about a game, film, TV show, book etc. is when people consume said thing in question and discuss what they took away from it. Getting in a discussion or debate about something you have no investment in or haven't experienced yet seems pointless to me. We're all guilty, including myself, of this a majority of the time.
You can't think of a game better than David Cage's games? Emotion isn't restricted to a template of shaped by hallmark cards and movie genres. Every single thing you've ever felt about a videogame was an emotional response. The most emotional game, or at least the game that "does emotion best", is no doubt the game that gave you the most pleasure.
You can't think of a game better than David Cage's games? Emotion isn't restricted to a template of shaped by hallmark cards and movie genres. Every single thing you've ever felt about a videogame was an emotional response. The most emotional game, or at least the game that "does emotion best", is no doubt the game that gave you the most pleasure.
The problem with a lot of Cage haters is that it has become their personal mission to invalidate his games. Some won't even call them games, which is especially stupid when they somehow give The Walking Dead a pass. I'm a fan of TWD, btw.I'm so tired of the strawman that Cage and his supporters so often trot out, that the people that voice complaints about Heavy Rain or whatever are, in essence, "haters" that just want to play Madden and Call of Duty. It's such a disgusting, lazy argument that relies on putting people into two implied groups: the "accepting, worldly group that can enjoy games of all types" and the "dudebro frat group that probably just likes guns and big tits and fucking sports games."
You can't think of a game better than David Cage's games? Emotion isn't restricted to a template of shaped by hallmark cards and movie genres. Every single thing you've ever felt about a videogame was an emotional response. The most emotional game, or at least the game that "does emotion best", is no doubt the game that gave you the most pleasure.
I've been playing the game for a few hours and I think it's absolutely great and yeah, I loved Heavy Rain.
So I think that the issue with mixed (high variance) review scores is clearly due to the fact that some people simply don't like the genre and what this kind of game is trying to accomplish and they want to be vocal about it.
That's absolutely natural, different people have different tastes, but it's not really fair, it's as if I reviewed Call of Duty telling how the developers are in creativity bankruptcy, they could not bother with the single player campaign at all considering how short, cliched and useless it is, that they do it every year just for the money, with a 4/10 score as the icing on the cake. These points are true and yet every year we see the gaming press giving out the political 8s and 9s and 10s. BUT it's also true that millions of people like to play that game every year, there must be a reason for that and I respect them.
These reviews (not necessarily all the negative ones) saying that Beyond is not a game and so it automatically sucks, that David Cage is a failed movie director and so on are just disrespectful.
I hope that David Cage continues to explore this genre finding new ways to innovate it.
Not exactly.What do you mean'stacks up'? Like... one event by itself is not major, but that one event might lead to a slight alteration of another scene, and then that scene might lead to a bigger alteration of another scene, until eventually you arrive at a totally new ending?
Am I interpreting this right?
Amirox, i'm sure you've typed at least double the amount of text, and spent double the amount of time on this subject than any of QD's fans on this forum. Doesn't it get tiring talking about a certain director's games that obviously don't appeal to you? A lot of people like Cage's stuff and respect what he's bringing to the scene, get over it.
dragonbane said:Not exactly.Just the things you do with Aiden are stacking up. So for example if you play nice, mixed or evil. The thing that is cool about this is that it's not like Mass Effect 3 "choose option 1,2,3" it happens more organically. You just do what you feel is appropriate and the game will remember it. In the end it's probably some kind of ratio how you did in different situations and depending on that you unlock a different ending branch. The game has just released, so people are still experimenting with it.
From the reviews I've read, it appears that critics have no issues with the genre, but rather Quantic Dream's execution of the genre.
I mean just read the IGN review:
"Look, don't touch. If there was ever a game that suggested that Cage is a frustrated film director at heart, it’s this one. ".
That's false because the game offers a lot of interaction and disrespectful towards a creator at an almost personal level.
Ah, that actually is an interesting system for gauging moral decisions. I wonder exactly how they weigh different things.
This is actually a really good idea....I am playing through it now and unlike heavy rain I feel I am expressing more of my morals through the choices I make with Aiden. Unlike heavy rain where I just pressed x to be good.
Colin Moriarty trashes this game in the new Podcast Beyond, and he loved Heavy Rain
Colin Moriarty trashes this game in the new Podcast Beyond, and he loved Heavy Rain
one of the things that make me curious now, and maybe I'll try it out when Beyond is like $9.99 or something, is if it would lead to difficulty in my finding the 'optimal' ending.
In Heavy Rain, like you said, I felt like it was extremely obvious what your choices would lead to. I aimed for the happiest ending and on my first try I got the happiest ending available.
If Beyond could change that binary type of morality weighing, it may almost be worth trying out at $9.99 to see how it works in practice.
When is a spoiler thread going to go up? I just watched a guy play through the whole thing on twitch, need to read some reactions.
Just watched the whole thing played by dansgaming. Just judging on it's story alone... it's bad. I can see where any reviewer giving it bad scores would be coming from.
Ah, but the level of investment varies. For example, someone who is heavily invested in the industry might still want to discuss HR and Beyond for their good or bad qualities because of the implications it has, or because you hope future products are improved so that they can impact gamers and the industry more positively. I agree with your overarching point here, but just want to clarify that 'investment' does not solely mean playing the game start to finish. There are other forms of investment.
for God's sake shut up already, you sound like buying and enjoying this game is a sin and the industry is in danger so you, of all people, are needed to save everything... look go get the game, play it and come here to post your walls of text, until then please stay quiet and don't call others' opinions "silly" or start ranking posters "this guy is cool while this poster is not", please, don't make this any more toxic, we get you, you hate the game, can you leave and come back when you play the damn game since your main point is the story and gameplay and you haven't tried it yourself ? if you're bored just go and edit something you wrote in the past.
You didnt address his point at all, and only succeeded at making yourself look impossible to engage in reasonable discourse with. Hell, you even ended your post with a personal attack for no reason. Good job, ya dingus.
Amir0x said:I'm just going to repost this response I made to the last person who said such a silly thing. It answers specifically why it's wrong and unfair to even suggest it.
Amir0x said:If you respond to criticisms being made and explain why they're wrong or right, we can have a discussion. If you choose to attack an individual for being negative, then you are the problem, not the individual. It's why I don't have a single problem with dragonbane, despite him being one of the biggest QD fans on neoGAF. He articulates his points extremely well, states his case with some genuine resolve and support, and always does it in a matter which respects his fellow posters right to think otherwise. dragonbane doesn't invent fake reasons why people don't like Heavy Rain, he accepts what people say at face value and merely disagrees.
Dragonbane is a model poster.
73 average is not a bad score. Reminds me of this.
Atilac said:When is a spoiler thread going to go up? I just watched a guy play through the whole thing on twitch, need to read some reactions.
True, but I think the problem is that Heavy Rain was VERY polarizing after the fact (I bought it, and regretted it) and it had an 87 on Metacritic. People who were on the fence about giving a Cage game another chance are probably going to be scared away by a lot of game reviewers thinking Beyond is much worse than Heavy Rain.
73 average is not a bad score. Reminds me of this.
I'm glad that experiences like this exist. It's not as if the entire industry has shifted towards making interactive drama like this and, in reality, this concept has existed for decades (think of graphic novel games back on NES and SNES, for instance).I watched almost all of his playthrough today too. Must say I was compelled by the story, graphics, and acting. Plus Dan was his usual entertaining self. Many laughs were had.
This has probably been said many times already in this thread, but my beef with this game is it's much more of a movie or simulator than a video game. It's something that I would much rather watch on the internet than buy and play through it myself. The gameplay was interesting at the beginning, but they didn't really add much to it throughout the game. It got pretty boring quickly and like Dan said it felt very tacked on.
So for me, it's in the very same boat as games such as the walking dead and the last of us. They're games that I would much rather watch for free than pay $60 to play.
Why do people keep saying this, you guys do know this is the 3rd game of its kind by the same guy and two so far have been successful right?I know enough about the game to know that I will thoroughly enjoy it. I also want to support developers that try to create something different.
I agree, that does sound a little disrespectful.
To me, it sounds like less of a critique of his writing or ideas, and more of a personal insult.
This was clearly not IGN's intention, but it definitely could have been worded better.
I know enough about the game to know that I will thoroughly enjoy it. I also want to support developers that try to create something different.
Sticky, sticky, sticky.I think true healthy discussion about a game, film, TV show, book etc. is when people consume said thing in question and discuss what they took away from it. Getting in a discussion or debate about something you have no investment in or haven't experienced yet seems pointless to me. We're all guilty, including myself, of this a majority of the time.
I wonder how many reviewers do actually play games thoroughly and at least twice before making a proper review. FPS fans and Titanfall preachers as well as Cage haters just won't play past 3 hours of Beyond, and they have a score ready beforehand anyway. I played this and it's my favorite game this year along with Bioshock Infinite and The Last of Us, the less people buying it the more special it's to me. An absolute gem in my opinion. The walls of text certain guy is posting here are hilarious, like seriously, why do you need to hate every single bit of the game ? you don't like it we get it, no need to write a novel about it, don't worry, it won't sell better than Mass Effect 2.
It's incredibly sad to see a creative chance with a large financial backing behind it like this fail in one of its most important and crucial aspects, namely its writing.
The developers are given the extremely lucky and almost unattainable privilege to develop a game that emphasizes its narrative along with high production values and marketing, yet the developers in question *once again* fumble with the opportunity because of a lack of talent and critical approach to their work.
It's very sad to see (not that I didn't expect it).
It's incredibly sad to see a creative chance with a large financial backing behind it like this fail in one of its most important and crucial aspects, namely its writing.
The developers are given the extremely lucky and almost unattainable privilege to develop a game that emphasizes its narrative along with high production values and marketing, yet the developers in question *once again* fumble with the opportunity because of a lack of talent and critical approach to their work.
It's very sad to see (not that I didn't expect it).