Imo the people who value FR over everything else is a small Minority. Great graphics have sold a lot more games than Framerates ever have or will.
I don't see how that's a relevant response to his comment.
Imo the people who value FR over everything else is a small Minority. Great graphics have sold a lot more games than Framerates ever have or will.
it feels incredibly better but if the cost of IQ is too big i rather have a locked 30 with better visuals, a line has to be drawn when IQ sacrifices are being made, of course you want the game to run at 60 but you also want the game to look great and on consoles is sometimes difficult to achieve both things, no point on having a 60 fps game when you're aiming down the scope of a sniper and all you see is a jaggfest due the low resolutionI don't know what your issue is, then. 60fps feels better than 30fps. I dearly hope you're not about to try and claim otherwise.
Call of Duty.Imo the people who value FR over everything else is a small Minority. Great graphics have sold a lot more games than Framerates ever have or will.
Kudos for them trying 60fps and even putting resolution second (that's how I'd prefer too) but I think the majority of the market doesn't care about 60fps.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't framerate dips and resolution some of the last things worked on during a game's development?
The look of the game and its effects are probably close to final, but judging the performance and resolution of the final game based on pre-release code stinks of concern mongering.
it feels incredibly better but if the cost of IQ is too big i rather have a locked 30 with better visuals, a line has to be drawn when IQ sacrifices are being made, of course you want the game to run at 60 but you also want the game to look great and on consoles is sometimes difficult to achieve both things, no point on having a 60 fps game when you're aiming down the scope of a sniper and all you see is a jaggfest due the low resolution
Call of Duty.
.......and here I was thinking it looked ok *shrugs*
Indeed
Some very, very depressing comments here.
LoolUncharted has good graphics and bad gameplay. Halo has bad graphics and good gameplay.
Cross gen game running at 30fpsThe most surprising thing is that Bungie of all people managed to squeeze 1080p out of X1.
I don't see how that's a relevant response to his comment.
DF needs to stop pre-release analyses IMO. Almost totally worthless, especially because optimization happens so late in the development process.
But if they want more clicks then I guess it works for them.
It's just the reverse claim. And in his case, consumers do gravitate more towards immersive graphics, improved physics, AI, NPC counts etc at the expense of framerate in closed systems - it's as it were, a known quantity in the console space. I don't even think that's debatable.
I don't see how that's a relevant response to his comment.
DF needs to stop pre-release analyses IMO. Almost totally worthless, especially because optimization happens so late in the development process.
But if they want more clicks then I guess it works for them.
It doesn't invalidate the claim that 60fps feels better than 30, however.
I don't think that's quite fair. What's wrong with looking at games in development?DF needs to stop pre-release analyses IMO. Almost totally worthless, especially because optimization happens so late in the development process.
But if they want more clicks then I guess it works for them.
DF needs to stop pre-release analyses IMO. Almost totally worthless, especially because optimization happens so late in the development process.
But if they want more clicks then I guess it works for them.
It is pretty sad that in 2015 a company with the resources available to them has to play the majority/vocal minority game on their flagship title. This isn't some indie dev here. This is THE title that made XBOX what it is today and local co-op was a huge draw for a non-trivial amount of people. Frankly this excuse does not stand.
Only 42% of players finished Mass Effect 3. They should cut having an end to the next game. Only 18% used a FemShep, they should just cut out the choice of male vs female because majority rules. I just love arguing for less options in games. It is so fun.
It's relevant to the Discussion Of Compromises To hit 60fps. When it's simple not a huge factor in the console world. People on this forum will say this game feels amazing. While millions of other will say damn this looks close to a 360 game.
One day I should complete my thesis on the average post and console ownership history in negative Gaf threads. This should be cross referenced with a graph showing the (apparent) relative importance of feature, tech or personnel being discussed and divided by the difference in conversation momentum versus "positive" threads.
Count the low-res alpha pixels.
Don't forget to include number of positive/negative posts pre/post release, as well as time spent playing/#of posts!One day I should complete my thesis on the average post and console ownership history in negative Gaf threads. This should be cross referenced with a graph showing the (apparent) relative importance of feature, tech or personnel being discussed and divided by the difference in conversation momentum versus "positive" threads.
One day I should complete my thesis on the average post and console ownership history in negative Gaf threads. This should be cross referenced with a graph showing the (apparent) relative importance of feature, tech or personnel being discussed and divided by the difference in conversation momentum versus "positive" threads.
There's nothing wrong with DF stories as long as they caveat them and don't make assumptions about the final product. I would say the real issue is what folks with zero legitimate interest in the game then do with the information or more accurately, ammunition they glean.
One day I should complete my thesis on the average post and console ownership history in negative Gaf threads. This should be cross referenced with a graph showing the (apparent) relative importance of feature, tech or personnel being discussed and divided by the difference in conversation momentum versus "positive" threads.
There's nothing wrong with DF stories as long as they caveat them and don't make assumptions about the final product. I would say the real issue is what folks with zero legitimate interest in the game then do with the information or more accurately, ammunition they glean.
Huh? I dont get it. Every thread on NeoGAF has negativity, positivity, fan"atics", resolution matters, framerate matters, etc, etc, etc. If you are saying that some people switch what matters to them the most, depending on how positive and negative a thread is, then that is probably right. Its called console wars.
Maybe, but not relevant to that string of conversation, not really. GwantyDog took issue with Seanspeed saying that 60fps makes a game more satisfying to play. All this talk about compromises and the decision between a 30fps/60fps game don't really directly apply to that particular thread.
I don't think Seanspeed was making any particular arguments about the trade-offs or decisions behind 60/30fps games.
Don't let them get to ya! People just love to jump on things even when unfinished. Game will be judged when its released.
Just give us a great Halo 5 which I know you will. )
I have no idea why you took issue with my comment unless you disagreed with it.And you think I will claim so why? The question is rather how 60fps makes Halo a MORE fun game? The value proposition is interesting given Halo's history of being a 30fps game. How much less fun will Halo 5 be if it were to release at 1080p 30fps, vs. variable res 900p, 60fps...
Huh? I dont get it. Every thread on NeoGAF has negativity, positivity, fanatics, resolution matters, framerate matters, etc, etc, etc. If you are saying that some people switch what matters to them the most, depending on how positive and negative a thread is, then that is probably right. Its called console wars.
Uncharted has good graphics and bad gameplay. Halo has bad graphics and good gameplay.
Maybe, but not relevant to that string of conversation, not really. GwantyDog took issue with Seanspeed saying that 60fps makes a game more satisfying to play. All this talk about compromises and the decision between a 30fps/60fps game don't really directly apply to that particular thread.
I don't think Seanspeed was making any particular arguments about the trade-offs or decisions behind 60/30fps games.
I'm actually not talking about Halo at all
Uh huh.
You sure he didn't make an argument? The simple fact of suggesting the game will be better off with a certain direction versus a potential trade-off alternative = the argument.
Anyway, satisfying is a very loose word. Fun - now everyone knows fun.
So your original response boils down to semantic argument. sighYou sure he didn't make an argument? The simple fact of suggesting the game will be better off with a certain direction versus a potential trade-off alternative = the argument.
Anyway, satisfying is a very loose word. Fun - now everyone knows fun.
I don't think that's quite fair. What's wrong with looking at games in development?
The thing is, games are shipping with pretty serious problems these days more often than not. Highlighting the state of a game prior to release puts it in the spotlight and gets people talking. If the developer can turn around and solve these issues before release they'll look like heroes. Either way, it gives a snapshot of how the game is coming along.
We looked at MGSV well before its release and it was already delivering a stable 60fps. Knowing this ahead of time puts a lot of people at ease, I think, since it basically demonstrates that the game is in good shape even prior to release.
It's not just about "the clicks". At least from my perspective. This is NOT passing final judgement. Would you just prefer glowing previews that ignore all in-development flaws then?
Also, hitting 60fps is hard. Sacrifices have to be made. People complaining about games not being 60fps need to think about this when a game attempts it.
Well, let's be real for a second. To be part of a "positive" discussion about Halo, you'd have to go into HaloGAF, which is in community right now. There's a lot of reasons why people might not want to do that. I can only speak for myself. I don't care for the current state of HaloGAF. I rarely visit community threads anyways. Thus, I'll be in gaming threads, positive or negative.
There can be plenty of positivity towards Halo. IIRC, the beta convinced quite a few people that the MP was going to be great this time around and got quite a few people on board after Halo 4. However, 343 hasn't really shown why people should be excited for the SP outside of PR talk. On top of that, all the news regarding campaign is about cut-features without anything to show for it aside from "60 FPS is really important."
Is it really a surprise that it's met with negativity?
Hell, I'd be okay with some of the features being cut like split-screen if the E3 demo showed the scale and sandbox fit for a Halo title.
But what did we get? A scripted set-piece at 60 FPS with frame-rate dips.
Wow. Fantastic, simply amazing. Yea, no, that doesn't inspire any sort of confidence whatsoever. There would be more positivity if they showed worthwhile SP stuff, but they haven't.
And I'm not in the business of blindly believing what 343 says after Halo 4 either, which was awful.
He's saying that increasingly, negativity triumphs any positivity and we're all noticing it. Is it natural? Maybe. But you can have the world's best game made, but if so and so feature is cut or such and such issue arises, you're going to see that completely overwhelm the original topic or game. You've probably noticed it yourself. Additionally, you also notice how many people upset by this, are largely absent from discussion when it's positive or are even around when the game launches or are part of the game community here. It's not necessarily a requirement, but interesting how someone you've never once seen post in a community thread, or announce thread about how they're excited or are buying the game but are front and center in a negative thread about how they're no longer buying the game, how it's outrageous etc.
At least that's what I think. You can also take notice of certain users XBL gamertag, PSN ID, Nintendo ID and see sometimes how they're arguing against a certain game or system and yet they don't own it, have no intention of buying it, or buying the game and yet will concern troll about how devastated or disappointed they are.
I have no idea why you took issue with my comment unless you disagreed with it.
Anyways, a game that feels better to play is more fun/satisfying. 60fps enhances the existing gameplay. Dramatically in many cases.
Obviously we're not talking about quantifiable levels of 'fun' here, so I don't know what point you're trying to make. Like seriously, I don't get it. You said 'oh god' to my comment like it was ridiculous but thus far you're not necessarily saying you disagree with anything.