-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Games Industry Reacts to Tango Gameworks Closure: "Why?"
clarky
Banned
What are you going on about? Tango was a solid studio putting out solid titles. MS didnt over hire they bought this studio. MS are just retarded. Not enough ROI on HIFI? Well don't give it away you stupid fucks.
Gamepass and the quality of titles MS is putting out is the issue. Massive executive mismanagement from the top down.
Can't wait to see them completely fuck COD.
Last edited:
i don't know what their other games were, but personally did not find hi fi rush fun at all, dropped it after 10 minutes or so.
Punished Miku
Member
Evil Within 1, 2, Ghostwire Tokyo, Hi Fi Rush.
Salaries in Japan aren’t crazy high, and Tango had not much over 100 employees. At average salaries of $100k per year (and that’s a generous estimate), that’s about $10.5m a year. Worst case, triple that to $32m.
Is that truly worth closing a very well regarded studio over, enmeshing yourself in extremely negative PR and scuppering your relationship with smaller developers?
Absolutely mismanaged.
Is that truly worth closing a very well regarded studio over, enmeshing yourself in extremely negative PR and scuppering your relationship with smaller developers?
Absolutely mismanaged.
gotcha. i'm sure people enjoyed those games but they were all limp dick for me.
Punished Miku
Member
Its literally the worst thing they've done. Cant get over it.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
So glad MBAs started running gaming companies
Thank you Matt Booty for being a worse stereotype than a Marvel villain
Thank you Matt Booty for being a worse stereotype than a Marvel villain
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
Yep a needless culling that doesn’t move the needle and just sets a really terrible precedent and mark against MS management
Ashamam
Member
One aspect of this that annoys me is that they try and make out they are doing the right thing by employees.
What this really means is they are doing the minimum legally required. They aren't doing any favours, they aren't going above and beyond. Some local laws are terrible and give stuff all protection to employees laid off. Not to mention you just know the headcount will end up replaced by contractors with 18 month limits on the titles they want to accelerate. Recipe for mediocrity. Meanwhile great creatives get the shaft.
What this really means is they are doing the minimum legally required. They aren't doing any favours, they aren't going above and beyond. Some local laws are terrible and give stuff all protection to employees laid off. Not to mention you just know the headcount will end up replaced by contractors with 18 month limits on the titles they want to accelerate. Recipe for mediocrity. Meanwhile great creatives get the shaft.
eerik9000
Member
Look, it's simple. Microsoft bought Activision so they could have Call of Duty. If their studios can't make Call of Duty, they are useless. Hi-Fi RUSH might be cool and all that, but it is not Call of Duty.
These studios did not get shut down because of what they made previously, but because of what they would need to make in the future.
These studios did not get shut down because of what they made previously, but because of what they would need to make in the future.
StereoVsn
Member
Yep, they killed off a productive and good studio while MS profit was cool $29BILLION this quarter.
StereoVsn
Member
Ooh, that could have worked out pretty well come to think of it.
MS couldn’t even bother to try to sell the studio. Complete and utter lack of care for anything while making huge profit is astounding.
Kagoshima_Luke
Gold Member
MSFT truly are trash. What’s appalling is they still have the audacity to stay in the industry when they should’ve gotten out about a generation and a half ago.
KXVXII9X
Member
This is honestly the most depressing and disappointing console generation in my lifetime. While it did have some big wins, there was a ton of loses like this. I thought Tango Works knocked it out of the park with Hi Fi Rush. I guess I'm a hypocrite since I only have the GamePass version. Ghostwire Tokyo isn't that bad either from what I played of it. I'm still bummed with the closing of Japan Studios and Edios Montreal with Deus Ex.
I'm not a big fan of companies constantly needing constant growth and excessive amounts of sales for a game/studio to be worth keeping. No one has a chance to improve or grow. All the studio acquisitions this generation felt too hasty and I kind of had a feeling it would end up like this.
I'm not a big fan of companies constantly needing constant growth and excessive amounts of sales for a game/studio to be worth keeping. No one has a chance to improve or grow. All the studio acquisitions this generation felt too hasty and I kind of had a feeling it would end up like this.
balls of snow
Member
That obsidian dev tweet.
Do a Bungie and
Do a Bungie and
Gambit2483
Member
WTF?? Tango Gameworks didn't deserve this.
DeepSpace5D
Member
This is one closure that really bothers me. Tango have, for the most part, a great track record. Even if the games don’t sell gangbusters, you need highly acclaimed games in your portfolio.
I fucking love The Evil Within, have probably played it way more than the average person, beat it like 4-5 times at least. I was really hoping for an eventual new entry in that series. Shit sucks.
I fucking love The Evil Within, have probably played it way more than the average person, beat it like 4-5 times at least. I was really hoping for an eventual new entry in that series. Shit sucks.
butane bob
Member
I don't understand why Japanese studios keep getting in bed with Microsoft, after all the shit they've pulled going right back to the 360 era.
bender
What time is it?
Kind of feels like they are going to let teams finish projects that are mostly done and then shutter any studios that don't contribute to the big hitters (Minecraft, COD, Halo, Gears, Fallout, TES, DOOM, Diablo, Warcraft, etc.).
Last edited:
Null Persp
Member
I fear for Obsidian and ninja Theory
FeralEcho
Member
Yup,I feel like it's the tipping point.
Honestly,Microsoft closing Tango is like if Sony were to close Insomniac.
Tango literally released 2 great,well recieved games this gen while other Microsoft studios haven't put out a single one.
Ninja Theory is on suicide watch at this point.
This industry is more profitable than ever yet all we see are closures and downsizing teams. Something is putrid in this industry and I blame the greed of the people in charge.
Fuck all these greedy CEOS.Hope they are comfortable knowing there's a special place waiting for them in Hell.
Fox Mulder
Member
Some people thought MS buying up so many studios could end up with soulless corporate mismanagement.
Last edited:
Not_A-Cop_Maybe
Member
but hey- at least its single player tho.I'm expecting Avowed to be next Redfall actually
Buggy Loop
Member
I'm expecting Avowed to be next Redfall actually
Huge blockbuster, probably not. 3D pillars of eternity? Most likely. Which is fine.
It looks like the PoE CGI backgrounds to 3D
Adra
Xaurip from PoE:
Looks so good sometimes. Like if peoples are fine with isometric cRPGs, it's a huge step-up
If this looks bad for any RPG fans... LOL
Portugeezer
Member
I assume some multi millionaires looked at some spreadsheet, don't give a shit about creativity, and decided they could use a couple more million in the bank.
Last edited:
Plague Doctor
Member
Cause Phil has the reverse Midas Touch. Whatever he touches turns into shit. A talented studio that developed a highly acclaimed game and gave much needed variety to our library?! Close them! I mean I think it's too late for Xbox but... if there is anything that could help/work, they need a new head and they needed it 2 years ago. If not way earlier.
Last edited:
FalsettoVibe
Member
Huge blockbuster, probably not. 3D pillars of eternity? Most likely. Which is fine.
It looks like the PoE CGI backgrounds to 3D
Adra
Xaurip from PoE:
Looks so good sometimes. Like if peoples are fine with isometric cRPGs, it's a huge step-up
If this looks bad for any RPG fans... LOL
Doesn't look bad per say, but the combat in the latest direct looked terrible.
Not_A-Cop_Maybe
Member
Yeah, there was quite a few people on the reveal threads that complained about how the enemy types and characters didnt look "good" or "interesting" enough, but since its literally a FPRPG game in an established universe with existing character/race from previous games. I agree that it looks like a isometric crpg game brought to life based on what i remember playing from PoE.
Huge blockbuster, probably not. 3D pillars of eternity? Most likely. Which is fine.
It looks like the PoE CGI backgrounds to 3D
Adra
Xaurip from PoE:
Looks so good sometimes. Like if peoples are fine with isometric cRPGs, it's a huge step-up
If this looks bad for any RPG fans... LOL
Graphics is debatable, im just happy there seems to be a lot of vibrant colorful areas in a game. Too many games these days imo have some super muted color pallet or weird filter added for visual aesthetics.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
I said it in one of the other threads, but gaming is an odd industry. Not only are the people often weird to begin with, but the way studios are amped up like gods or suddenly shut down isnt the kind of thing you get in other industries.
If a car company releases some meh models, I dont think the R&D team who worked on that car all get the axe. And then the company rehires a new R&D team for the next car.
How many industries are there where if a group/dept release meh products (sales, quality or both), the bosses nuke the whole building and rehire from scratch 100+ people?
Last edited:
ProtoByte
Member
Why? Because their games weren't selling before Microsoft bought Bethesda, and they still weren't compelling enough to buy into Gamepass after.
Look, I called stuff like this coming down the pipeline because of Microsoft's nutty business model, but let's not pretend to mourn every single studio that gets closed as if we liked their games, much less bought them.
Look, I called stuff like this coming down the pipeline because of Microsoft's nutty business model, but let's not pretend to mourn every single studio that gets closed as if we liked their games, much less bought them.
kungfuian
Member
Any company that changes direction this often is very risky to be a part of! If your a Double Fine or Compulsion or anyone not working on big IP, I'd be worried.
Rewind only a few years back and Game Pass was the big push and buying all those teams made sense. Get lots of teams making diverse games and let them go wild. Now that Game Pass seems to have plateaued, Microsoft has once again shifted strategies, and all of these smaller studios and teams are only a spread sheet away from the chopping block.
What's crazy to me is that, after so long in the business, Microsoft don't seem to understand the value of talented developers. Letting go of a team as great as Tango clearly shows just how blind they are to the reality that these types of people make the whole thing work. I don't care what your strategy is or how many great IP you own. All the IP in the world mean jack shit if you don't invest in your people!
Microsoft just seem incapable of this from a structural level. Look no further than Halo Infinite and how their focus on cheap contract labor helped ruined that game and significantly damage the value of that IP.
It's clear the suits making decisions at X-box are unable to see what is so very obvious to us all! They are what we call penny wise and pound foolish, and very short sighted in their perspective on the industry. Their lack of vision is why X-box is where it is today and why Sony and Nintendo remain the top dogs.
Only positive out of all of this is these devs are now free. Hope they get snatched up by companies that will actually appreciate them!
Rewind only a few years back and Game Pass was the big push and buying all those teams made sense. Get lots of teams making diverse games and let them go wild. Now that Game Pass seems to have plateaued, Microsoft has once again shifted strategies, and all of these smaller studios and teams are only a spread sheet away from the chopping block.
What's crazy to me is that, after so long in the business, Microsoft don't seem to understand the value of talented developers. Letting go of a team as great as Tango clearly shows just how blind they are to the reality that these types of people make the whole thing work. I don't care what your strategy is or how many great IP you own. All the IP in the world mean jack shit if you don't invest in your people!
Microsoft just seem incapable of this from a structural level. Look no further than Halo Infinite and how their focus on cheap contract labor helped ruined that game and significantly damage the value of that IP.
It's clear the suits making decisions at X-box are unable to see what is so very obvious to us all! They are what we call penny wise and pound foolish, and very short sighted in their perspective on the industry. Their lack of vision is why X-box is where it is today and why Sony and Nintendo remain the top dogs.
Only positive out of all of this is these devs are now free. Hope they get snatched up by companies that will actually appreciate them!
Bernardougf
Gold Member
Thats what happenas when you sell just ONE copy...
MasterDerico
Member
Shame.
They did awesome games!
They did awesome games!
Hero_Select
Member
Ninja Theory is next.
Hellblade II is going to bomb sales-wise
Hellblade II is going to bomb sales-wise
RyanEvans21
Member
Might be next? It depends on hellblade 2 sales.
N30RYU
Member
You should close your mouth as fast as ms closes their studios
Paltheos
Member
There's some unfair extrapolating going on here - Suggesting that MS' overall profitability makes their segment decision-making appear ridiculous is not fair (Tango is small potatoes in the grand scheme of things for a megacorp like MS). I don't know the company's overall strategy or what the segment performance looks like.
But without more information, yeah, this looks totally ridiculous from the outside. Hi-Fi Rush is a game that's a darling critically and otherwise and it's a game that management has publicly defended as being a success by every key metric. Why shutter Tango? Is it really because Mikami left? The public statement leaves much wanting. Where are these Japanese developers being reallocated, if they're not just losing their jobs outright? Might Tango have been better to sell, or was the studio really in such dire straits that the public just didn't see?
But without more information, yeah, this looks totally ridiculous from the outside. Hi-Fi Rush is a game that's a darling critically and otherwise and it's a game that management has publicly defended as being a success by every key metric. Why shutter Tango? Is it really because Mikami left? The public statement leaves much wanting. Where are these Japanese developers being reallocated, if they're not just losing their jobs outright? Might Tango have been better to sell, or was the studio really in such dire straits that the public just didn't see?
Clintizzle
Lord of Edge.
MS really spent billions on clown make up.
Also, in what universe does Tango and Arkane Austin go before 343i? Microsoft is targeting the wrong people. They have plenty of artists but no leadership to guide the artists to success. Funny that it can be said for pretty much all of Microsoft's products and services. Very sad.
Congrats shareholders, I guess...
Also, in what universe does Tango and Arkane Austin go before 343i? Microsoft is targeting the wrong people. They have plenty of artists but no leadership to guide the artists to success. Funny that it can be said for pretty much all of Microsoft's products and services. Very sad.
Congrats shareholders, I guess...
Last edited:
Paltheos
Member
Bernardougf
Gold Member
Ita a meme from the other topic my friend ...
Paltheos
Member
Ita a meme from the other topic my friend ...
Oh whoops. Sorry, B.