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Half of Detroit’s Streetlights May Go Out as City Shrinks

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Ripclawe

Banned
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...-streetlights-may-go-out-as-city-shrinks.html

Detroit, whose 139 square miles contain 60 percent fewer residents than in 1950, will try to nudge them into a smaller living space by eliminating almost half its streetlights.

As it is, 40 percent of the 88,000 streetlights are broken and the city, whose finances are to be overseen by an appointed board, can’t afford to fix them. Mayor Dave Bing’s plan would create an authority to borrow $160 million to upgrade and reduce the number of streetlights to 46,000. Maintenance would be contracted out, saving the city $10 million a year.


Other U.S. cities have gone partially dark to save money, among them Colorado Springs; Santa Rosa, California; and Rockford, Illinois. Detroit’s plan goes further: It would leave sparsely populated swaths unlit in a community of 713,000 that covers more area than Boston, Buffalo and San Francisco combined. Vacant property and parks account for 37 square miles (96 square kilometers), according to city planners.

“You have to identify those neighborhoods where you want to concentrate your population,” said Chris Brown, Detroit’s chief operating officer. “We’re not going to light distressed areas like we light other areas.”

Detroit’s dwindling income and property-tax revenue have required residents to endure unreliable buses and strained police services throughout the city. Because streetlights are basic to urban life, deciding what areas to illuminate will reshape the city, said Kirk Cheyfitz, co-founder of a project called Detroit143 -- named for the 139 square miles of land, plus water -- that publicizes neighborhood issues.

Rethinking Detroit

“It touches kids going to school in the dark,” said Cheyfitz, chief executive of Story Worldwide Ltd., a New York marketing company. “It touches midnight Mass at a church. It touches businesses that want to stay open past 9 p.m.”

Bing in 2010 began an independent project called Detroit Works to sort ideas on how to reconfigure the city for residences, businesses, green space and even agriculture, a plan due in August.

Meantime, Brown said, the city will fix broken streetlights in certain places even as it discontinues such services as street and sidewalk repairs in “distressed” areas -- those with a high degree of blight and little or no commercial activity.

Bing’s plan requires state legislation to create the lighting authority. Governor Rick Snyder supports the plan, said his senior policy adviser, Valerie Brader.


Dark Portents

There’s already experience snuffing out streetlights within Detroit’s borders. Highland Park, a 3-square-mile city encircled by its larger neighbor, removed 1,100 of 1,600 streetlights last year, after piling up a $4 million debt to DTE Energy. The move saves $45,000 a month, said Alejandro Bodipo-Memba, a spokesman for the company.

Only major streets and intersections remain lit in the city of 12,000, once home to Chrysler Group LLC’s namesake car manufacturer and Henry Ford’s first moving assembly line. Mayor DeAndre Windom, 45, said residents at first complained, though few do now. He’s considering grants and private funding to relight darkened streets

Colorado Springs pulled the plug on 9,000 of its 25,600 lights in 2010 to save $1.3 million, said David Krauth, a city traffic engineer. Some were relit as revenue improved, though 3,500 remain dark, saving about $500,000 a year, he said.

In Detroit, some streets have no working lights. Many appear dim or are blocked by trees. And some areas with mostly vacant lots are well-lit.

Night Terrors

A single, broken streetlight on the northeast side brings fear to Cynthia Perry, 55. It hasn’t worked for six years, Perry said in an interview on the darkened sidewalk where she walks from her garage to her house entrance.

“I’m afraid coming in at night,” she said. “I’m not going to seclude myself in the house and never go anywhere.”

In southwest Detroit, businesses on West Vernor Highway, a main commercial thoroughfare, have sought $4 million in private grants to fix the situation themselves. The state would pay $2.5 million, said Kathy Wendler, president of the Southwest Detroit Business Association.

Jamahl Makled, 40, said he’s owned businesses in southwest Detroit for about two decades, most recently cell-phone stores. He said they’ve have been burglarized more than a dozen times.

“In the dark, criminals are comfortable,” Makled said. “It’s not good for the economy and the safety of the residents.”

Antique Lamps

North of there, on a stretch of West Grand Boulevard, the bases of light poles show where thieves tore out the wiring.

As many as 15,000 Detroit streetlights use 1920s technology, according to a 2010 study by McKinsey & Co. Upgrading the system would cost $140 million to $200 million, and $5 million more to operate than the $23 million now spent annually, the report said.

Besides streetlights, the Detroit lighting department provides electricity to 144 customers that include Detroit schools, Wayne State University and local government offices. Almost 22 percent of the city’s electric bills were unpaid, the McKinsey report said.

That’s just one reason Detroit is digging out of a $265 million deficit and saddled with more than $12 billion in long- term debt. To avoid a state takeover, Detroit agreed in April to have its finances overseen by a nine-member board appointed by the city and the state.

Civic Obligations

Delivering services to a thinly spread population is expensive. Some 20 neighborhoods, each a square mile or more, are only 10 to 15 percent occupied, said John Mogk, a law professor at Wayne State University who specializes in urban law and policy. He said the city can’t force residents to move, and it’s almost impossible under Michigan law for the city to seize properties for development.

Mogk said landowners can demand many times what property would fetch on the open market.

“There are tremendous political, administrative, financial and, to some degree, legal obstacles,” Mogk said. “Unless you phase out a neighborhood altogether, you still need lighting, and waste pickup and police and fire protection.”

As Detroit’s streets go dark, some of those neighborhoods may fade away with the dying light.
 

xbhaskarx

Member
Detroit is one of the most fascinating cities in the world, people throughout the rust belt and in countries with negative population growth like Japan and Italy should be paying attention.
 

xbhaskarx

Member
I can't think of an American city where losing streetlights would be nearly as terrifying.

Detroit actually has surprisingly low crime given what you would expect. As the mayor said, there is nobody left to kill. I'm not kidding, the mayor of Detroit actually said that about his own city.
 

wenis

Registered for GAF on September 11, 2001.
detroit might be the safest place to go for a zombie apocalypse at the end of the day.
 

frequency

Member
40% are already out/broken?

I don't even know what kind of city Detroit is, but that would be scary for ANYWHERE. How would you get anywhere at night if you don't have a car?

I didn't know stuff like this was happening in a country like the USA.
The population dropped in half in 60 years? That sounds unbelievable. Why does this happen? Does the city just have a bad reputation?
 
40% are already out/broken?

I don't even know what kind of city Detroit is, but that would be scary for ANYWHERE. How would you get anywhere at night if you don't have a car?

I didn't know stuff like this was happening in a country like the USA.
The population dropped in half in 60 years? That sounds unbelievable. Why does this happen? Does the city just have a bad reputation?

The industrial/manufacturing base dried up, unions were too strong/inflexible to attract new businesses to the area. Jobs dried up, and so did the tax base. The city was left with high demands for services, low tax revenue, and absurdly high legacy costs related to union benefits, health care, and pensions.

The city rotted from the inside.
 

frequency

Member
The industrial/manufacturing base dried up, unions were too strong/inflexible to attract new businesses to the area. Jobs dried up, and so did the tax base. The city was left with high demands for services, low tax revenue, and absurdly high legacy costs related to union benefits, health care, and pensions.

The city rotted from the inside.

Thank you for the explanation.
That is a little too technical for me but I think I get the general idea.

I think I will take some time to learn how cities actually work on my own.

I always thought Detroit was a big (and successful) city. It's one of the few USA cities I can recognize the name of.
 

t26

Member
Detroit is one of the most fascinating cities in the world, people throughout the rust belt and in countries with negative population growth like Japan and Italy should be paying attention.

Well in Detroit people just move to other cities. For countries like Japan and Western Europe people are moving from rural areas to the city.
 

Dude Abides

Banned
It's so dark
cold
in the D.

How are we supposed to make peace?

The industrial/manufacturing base dried up, unions were too strong/inflexible to attract new businesses to the area. Jobs dried up, and so did the tax base. The city was left with high demands for services, low tax revenue, and absurdly high legacy costs related to union benefits, health care, and pensions.

The city rotted from the inside.

Also the first clause of this makes sense. The rest doesn't.
 

pirata

Member
40% are already out/broken?

I don't even know what kind of city Detroit is, but that would be scary for ANYWHERE. How would you get anywhere at night if you don't have a car?

I didn't know stuff like this was happening in a country like the USA.
The population dropped in half in 60 years? That sounds unbelievable. Why does this happen? Does the city just have a bad reputation?

It's a long and complicated story that I don't entirely understand. Basically, the United States used to be the world's manufacturing powerhouse, since it had the most and most modern infrastructure and a huge supply of metal from American mines. However, in the sixties and seventies, most of the metal ran out, the infrastructure became old (compared to the newer infrastructure in Germany, Japan, etc.), and US manufacturing couldn't compete, and the entire industry collapsed, putting huge amounts of people out of jobs.

Some cities in the north, like Detroit and Cleveland, were mainly devoted to manufacturing, and when the jobs left, so did the people...at least, those who could leave. The cities began to decay. Detroit is probably the most severe case of this.
 

Patapwn

Member
The industrial/manufacturing base dried up, unions were too strong/inflexible to attract new businesses to the area. Jobs dried up, and so did the tax base. The city was left with high demands for services, low tax revenue, and absurdly high legacy costs related to union benefits, health care, and pensions.

The city rotted from the inside.

Not only this, but the entire political/management environment has been fucked up like forever.

If you want to have a fun read and learn about the last 10 years of detroit politics at the same time, see here
 

frequency

Member
It's a long and complicated story that I don't entirely understand. Basically, the United States used to be the world's manufacturing powerhouse, since it had the most and most modern infrastructure and a huge supply of metal from American mines. However, in the sixties and seventies, most of the metal ran out, the infrastructure became old (compared to the newer infrastructure in Germany, Japan, etc.), and US manufacturing couldn't compete, and the entire industry collapsed, putting huge amounts of people out of jobs.

Some cities in the north, like Detroit and Cleveland, were mainly devoted to manufacturing, and when the jobs left, so did the people...at least, those who could leave. The cities began to decay. Detroit is probably the most severe case of this.

Oh thank you!
That is easier to understand. It sounds kind of like the ghost towns, just on a larger scale and not completely deserted.
But I still appreciate the reply outunderthestars - you just didn't assume that I'm dumb.
 
Here is a great look at the city for those of you who aren't familiar with its current state.

Oh thank you!
That is easier to understand. It sounds kind of like the ghost towns, just on a larger scale and not completely deserted.
But I still appreciate the reply outunderthestars - you just didn't assume that I'm dumb.

No worries! I wish I could be more helpful, but it is an incredibly complicated situation that I don't fully understand.
 
Same thing happened to Rome after Alaric and his Visigoths sacked it. There were attempts to revive and rebuild, but the damage was done and the population dropped to a fraction of what it was.

The Vandal sack a generation later didn't help either.

Anyway, hundreds of years from now, people will look at the half buried ruins of GM and Ford factories and wonder at the times and people that built them.
 

frequency

Member
Here is a great look at the city for those of you who aren't familiar with its current state.

Oh wow.
That looks way worse than I imagined.


I think that man said the house was $50. And then at the end the abandoned buildings. I wonder why low prices aren't incentive enough to bring in new businesses and people. There have been things that happened in my town just because it was cheap. (edit: Oh, maybe the crime rate. I didn't know it was high, but it makes sense that it is)
 

TheSeks

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.
I can't think of an American city where losing streetlights would be nearly as terrifying.

Yep. If it was any other city with a very low crime-rate it wouldn't be bad. Since less street lamps = less "light pollution" = net benefit of being able to see the stars and relax/be calm "be one" with nature.

Except Detroit isn't a low crime-rate city, so this is just going to make that situation worse.
 
Oh wow.
That looks way worse than I imagined.


I think that man said the house was $50. And then at the end the abandoned buildings. I wonder why low prices aren't incentive enough to bring in new businesses and people. There have been things that happened in my town just because it was cheap.

Banks won't give you money to repair the homes, as they have no value. There are no jobs for people to need a home.

Just do a google image search for "abandoned Detroit" and look what you find.....

The abandoned schools are the most depressing.

This is oddly beautiful though

I want to start a Kickstarter campaign to raise the money to renovate this place. I sooooo want to live there!

04150404_16.jpg



I'd love to photograph the urban decay but I'd feel unsafe even if I had a group of friends with me

There are organized ruin porn tours of Detroit! I am going on one this September. :)
 

xbhaskarx

Member
Detroit actually has surprisingly low crime given what you would expect. As the mayor said, there is nobody left to kill. I'm not kidding, the mayor of Detroit actually said that about his own city.

source please?
That's not true. The person who made that remark was Stanley Christmas.

I did a Google search and found this article. Sorry, my ability to instantly recall three year old quotes about a city I have never been to with perfect accuracy isn't quite what I thought it was...
Detroit's outlook falls along with home prices
Motor City on the brink of bankruptcy, but still 15 people want to be mayor
January 29, 2009

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/..._1_home-prices-mayor-kwame-kilpatrick-outlook

On a positive note, Detroit's homicide rate dropped 14 percent last year. That prompted mayoral candidate Stanley Christmas to tell the Detroit News recently, "I don't mean to be sarcastic, but there just isn't anyone left to kill."

The whole article is worth reading, if you are interested in this sort of thing....
 

antonz

Member
Detroit could soon be the ultimate vacation for survivalist and end of the world nuts.

They could make a fortune cordoning off a section of the abandoned city and setup wargames and shit with paintball guns and stuff.
 

Wingfan19

Unconfirmed Member
Oh wow.
That looks way worse than I imagined.


I think that man said the house was $50. And then at the end the abandoned buildings. I wonder why low prices aren't incentive enough to bring in new businesses and people. There have been things that happened in my town just because it was cheap. (edit: Oh, maybe the crime rate. I didn't know it was high, but it makes sense that it is)
Yeah, you don't want to buy a house for 50 bucks in those neighborhoods. For one, a lot of them are crack houses and the crime in the those areas is very high. You'd have to literally have a thousand or so people move in at the exact same time to make a dent, but that's just not going to happen. There's also no infrastructure in those areas. All the business closed, so there's no where to get groceries, housing supplies, etc. Most of the corner stores are just liquor stores.

I used to go down there for the Red Wings games with my dad and we'd park in Brick Town to take the monorail to the Joe Louis Arena, but now if we go there for a game, we just park at the arena. I wouldn't trust walking in the dimly lit pay parking lots at 11:00pm anymore. They've tried to spruce up some areas by building casinos, which has really done nothing except to help those exclusive areas. All the shops/restaurants are literally on the same street as the casino or IN the casino itself.
 

Hunter S.

Member
Colorado Springs has been dark because the cheap ass Republican majority has voted down every tax in the history of the city. We were forced into it by cheap, rich White people not because it is a city that is turning to a ghost town.
Other results: Shitty bus service, shitty roads, unkempt parks. Thanks assholes.
 
Colorado Springs has been dark because the cheap ass Republican minority has voted down every tax in the history of the city. We were forced into it by cheap, rich White people not a city that is turning to a ghost town.

I heard about that on TAL. Rich people don't mind because they just pay out of pocket to keep the lights on.
 

frequency

Member
These pictures of abandoned places are starting to get scary. I shouldn't look at so many at once. Some of them look like stuff you would see in Chernobyl pictures.

This whole thing is pretty interesting though.

Yeah, you don't want to buy a house for 50 bucks in those neighborhoods. For one, a lot of them are crack houses and the crime in the those areas is very high. You'd have to literally have a thousand or so people move in at the exact same time to make a dent, but that's just not going to happen. There's also no infrastructure in those areas. All the business closed, so there's no where to get groceries, housing supplies, etc. Most of the corner stores are just liquor stores.

That makes sense. I didn't even think about stuff like grocery stores.
 

xbhaskarx

Member
There's also no infrastructure in those areas. All the business closed, so there's no where to get groceries, housing supplies, etc. Most of the corner stores are just liquor stores.

From the Chicago Tribune article I linked above:
Detroit, which has lost half its population in the past 50 years, is deceptively large, covering 139 square miles. Manhattan, San Francisco and Boston could, as a group, fit inside the city's boundaries. There is no major grocery chain in the city, and only two movie theaters. Much of the neighborhood economy revolves around rib joints, hot dog stands and liquor stores.
.
 

Hunter S.

Member
I heard about that on TAL. Rich people don't mind because they just pay out of pocket to keep the lights on.

I am not one to talk as a white dude who lives by the mountains, but yes rich communities by the mountains can pay for light service or donate, but they keep it dark often because it is very safe. No worries. Ugh.
 
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