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[DocSeuss]

That's a fantastic post!


Why would they do that? They had their design goals which I assume they met, they should design Xbox around their vision of gaming and would want the device to do, not around beating Sony in spec wars.

It's a mostly fantastic post. The suggestion that THQ died because of suffocation is wrong. THQ died because it tried to appeal to casuals with a modern military shooter and udraw.

I agree with the post's point (Try new things!), but not the THQ bit. Too bad I missed it when I was replying earlier.

 

[Swifty]

In Uncharted 2, this combat is almost entirely limited to "hide behind cover, pick any gun (doesn't matter what, aside from range), and shoot." It's all about shooting galleries. Max Payne 3 was like this a lot as well, which was a big part of its problem--Rockstar's never been good at shooter design, though.

You really played Uncharted this way? There are a lot of sections in Uncharted that aren't just corridors with chest high walls. I just played Uncharted 2 and 3 for the first time about two weeks ago. I noticed there are plenty of fights with large open areas with plenty of ledges and high ground to climb. A lot of those fights force you to move a lot and take advantage of the kinetic abilities Nate has.

 

[harSon]

MS presentation will be worse, but payed media will tell us it was amazing and brainwashed sheeppeople will accept it as such. repeat of last gen basically.

Do you truly believe this is the case?

 

[FordGTGuy]

what successful products has microsoft launched since the original 360?


edit: I'll give you windows 7, but what else

Windows 8?(has already gathered a larger marketshare than OSX and Linux put together in a few months.)

New versions of Office?

Kinect?

We're describing success as in ability to make profit or marketshare right?

 

[szaromir]

Do you truly believe this is the case?

It's easy to predict future when you're a hater (or a rabid fanboy).

It's a mostly fantastic post. The suggestion that THQ died because of suffocation is wrong. THQ died because it tried to appeal to casuals with a modern military shooter and udraw.

I agree with the post's point (Try new things!), but not the THQ bit. Too bad I missed it when I was replying earlier.

The market has shrunk a lot since 2008 though. Part of it is the economic crash, part of it is the stagnation in game design. There's only so many COD/Uncharted derivatives people want to play.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

Sony games are objectively worse, both from basic game design standpoints, and from the scores they receive. I mentioned my opinions lining up with metacritic mostly because I know there are idiots out there who have a propensity towards claiming that it's just because reviewers are bought off by Microsoft moneyhatting, and poor Sony is noble and doesn't buy people off, which is why their scores are entirely, 100% accurate. Nah. Microsoft just has a habit of picking up some of the best developers out there (Bungie, Epic, Turn 10, 343, Remedy, etc are all made up of some of the best devs in the industry, even before they were employed by Microsoft). Sony tends to release games that are mostly 7/10 range, and wouldn't do nearly as well if they were multiplatform titles.

well, if you say it's objectively better, i guess it's okay. and the developer talk...man, talk about arrogant posts.

 

[Doffen]

what successful products has microsoft launched since the original 360?


edit: I'll give you windows 7, but what else

SkyDrive, Windows Azure, Hyper-V, Kinect, SQL Server 08 R2, Visual Studios 08/10/12, Office 365, SCVMM, Virtual PC, Lync, Office 2010, Exchange Server and ­SharePoint.

I could go on, but I think you get it.

Edit: Microsoft also owns Skype, So.cl and Fast Search & Transfer.

 

[mujun]

So did my PC. Or does that still not count because it doesn't fit the narrative?

What does that even mean? Does the PC having the best list of games available for it mean that the 360 and to a lesser degree the PS3 (and to a greater degree some would say, the Wii) are pointless or platforms where their makers have abandoned their customers?

Did I miss part of the conversation? Seems that your PC argument would indicate almost as much abandonment by Sony and yet you don't say that.

 

[SmoothCB]

I just read this article about the cloud and game streaming.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/video-games/the-biggest-letdown-about-the-ps4-cloud-gaming-15127125?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=pulsenews

Perhaps this is part of microsoft's strategy? I know high speed, no data cap Internet, etc isn't available to everyone but as the generation goes on, it might be. The new Xbox specs might be good enough for now but in the future with potential cloud streaming, they would become irrelevant..

Just a thought.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Sony games are objectively worse, both from basic game design standpoints, and from the scores they receive. I mentioned my opinions lining up with metacritic mostly because I know there are idiots out there who have a propensity towards claiming that it's just because reviewers are bought off by Microsoft moneyhatting, and poor Sony is noble and doesn't buy people off, which is why their scores are entirely, 100% accurate. Nah. Microsoft just has a habit of picking up some of the best developers out there (Bungie, Epic, Turn 10, 343, Remedy, etc are all made up of some of the best devs in the industry, even before they were employed by Microsoft). Sony tends to release games that are mostly 7/10 range, and wouldn't do nearly as well if they were multiplatform titles.

You made it to page 5. I am impressed.

 

[DEADEVIL]

No need to re-write what has already been written by MS. It's clear as day their abandonment of gamers after Kinect came out and abandonment of everyone with the early demise of Xbox 1.

False.

 

[abadguy]

Do we have any information regarding the size of these studios? I'm willing to bet that the majority of them are working on Kinect titles or maybe even non-gaming/gaming related applications and services.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=511206

Just look at most of TheOddOne's posts in the thread.

MS presentation will be worse, but payed media will tell us it was amazing and brainwashed sheeppeople will accept it as such. repeat of last gen basically.

Lol wow. serious post?

 

[Amir0x]

Very well thought out post, and I hope you're right at least as far as the games are concerned.

But from the sounds of Durango, they sacrificed a lot of power to get Kinect packed in with every system, and the useless Kinect 2.0 will seemingly take up a lot of wasted conference and system time and resources, and if we add in the big negative rumour about no-used-games, the system has to REALLY surprise me to get out of my negative MS funk.

360 went from my favorite console to nearly forgotten by me in no time flat once Kinect came out and ruined everything.

 

[DEADEVIL]

The first two Fables were very solid games, to me at least. The 3rd was a big letdown but that doesn't mean they can't easily make the Fable series into something special on the next Xbox.

Never finished 3, but two is one of my fave RPGs gthis whole gen in fun factor alone. I played it 3 times for all the endings. Couldn't get into 3 because there were othere games pressing for my time, but plan on playing it in the near future.

 

[Izick]

I agree.

For me, Sony has sold me on a PS4 at this point. Basically if Microsoft fucks up, and Nintendo continues to do what they do, then I'm going with a PS4 for sure. With that said, I'm definitely still willing to see what Microsoft has planned out for the next-generation, and I'm expecting that they have a lot of interesting stuff because they know they can't win people over with the lackadaisical attitude they've recently had about trying to give me reasons to pick up a 360 over a PS3.

I'm guessing we see a lot of big hitters like Halo, Forza, Gears, and some big surprises like Alan Wake, some new Rare games, and some completely new IP's. Not to mention I think Micorosft is going to try and lock up some games as console exclusives, maybe something big like The Walking Dead Season 2, maybe an updated Minecraft game (kids love 360 Minecraft), and some other surprises like Bethesda or Bioware. I'm not saying those all will be console exclusives, but I think we'll see a lot of those companies debut games at Microsoft's event.

 

[LeBoef]

SkyDrive, Windows Azure, Hyper-V, Kinect, SQL Server 08 R2, Visual Studios 08/10/12, Office 365, SCVMM, Virtual PC, Lync, Office 2010, Exchange Server and ­SharePoint.

I could go on, but I think you get it.

Edit: Microsoft also owns Skype, So.cl and Fast Search & Transfer.

A bit of an understatement to say scvmm without sccm... that whole system center product line is mighty.
unbelievable that people think ms doesnt know what they do.

 

[Raven77]

I think if Microsoft releases the machine in 2013, it will concede the technical crown to Sony, but I honestly don't think Microsoft cares. Microsoft has the price advantage, and that is not something to fool around about. They will make heavy profits with their unit if GAF-Xbox fans, and the casuals are any indication. Sony will have a long and rough road ahead since GDDR5 is not something that can shrink on whim. This is going to be a battle of the technical enthusiast and the rest of the world.

The complete financial failure of the Wii begs to differ with your above opinions...

And please don't start posting stats. Consoles sales mean nothing when you don't sell games, that is where they make money.

The casual crowd has proven to be fickle at best, they did not support the Wii enough to make it successful financially and it's likely they wouldn't support the next casual-box either if that is the market they intend to target. Eventually when the market stops shifting so much companies will settle in and realize they can't keep chasing the money. If that were a good business strategy, movie studios would only make cheap horror films that make 4x their budget in their opening weekend...

 

[rudieboy77]

It seems like a lot of opinions on here hold a dim view of Xbox's prospects. I hypothesize that the Xbox will actually surprise people about what it can do and what is offered.

 

[Grecco]

Shoot nobody told me "gamers were abandoned by MS

I guess once i get the memo my copy of Halo 4 and Forza Horizon will dissapear?

 

[DocSeuss]

It's easy to predict future when you're a hater (or a rabid fanboy).

The market has shrunk a lot since 2008 though. Part of it is the economic crash, part of it is the stagnation in game design. There's only so many COD/Uncharted derivatives people want to play.

The market has shrunk? I was under the impression people were spending more money on gaming.

You made it to page 5. I am impressed.

I am not sure how to read this post.

The complete financial failure of the Wii begs to differ with your above opinions...

And please don't start posting stats. Consoles sales mean nothing when you don't sell games, that is where they make money.

The casual crowd has proven to be fickle at best, they did not support the Wii enough to make it successful financially and it's likely they wouldn't support the next casual-box either if that is the market they intend to target. Eventually when the market stops shifting so much companies will settle in and realize they can't keep chasing the money. If that were a good business strategy, movie studios would only make cheap horror films that make 4x their budget in their opening weekend...

You are correct. Attach rate is hugely important.

 

[abadguy]

Shoot nobody told me "gamers were abandoned by MS

I guess once i get the memo my copy of Halo 4 and Forza Horizon will dissapear?

I heard that Kinect when in close proximity to "core" games will render them non functional.

 

[gryz]

SkyDrive, Windows Azure, Hyper-V, Kinect, SQL Server 08 R2, Visual Studios 08/10/12, Office 365, SCVMM, Virtual PC, Lync, Office 2010, Exchange Server and ­SharePoint.

I could go on, but I think you get it.

Edit: Microsoft also owns Skype, So.cl and Fast Search & Transfer.

those are pretty much all business products, which is all they have left. all the consumer products like windows phone and surface are duds.

 

[DocSeuss]

those are pretty much all business products, which is all they have left.

"all they have left?"

That's 90% of what Microsoft has done since their inception.

 

[Maximus.]

Microsoft I feel will be using Xbox has an Apple TV, etc competitor in unison with competing with Sony. I feel this means it will not be as powerful as the ps4, which sucks because I want to see games using the system to its fully capability. Now that's not to say the ps4 won't be the system of choice for developers because we don't know how that will play out yet. Regardless, interested to see what happens!

 

[gryz]

"all they have left?"

That's 90% of what Microsoft has done since their inception.

and? why does that make you think this console would be successful? they seem to be pretty out of touch with consumers lately

 

[PhatSaqs]

those are pretty much all business products, which is all they have left. all the consumer products like windows phone and surface are duds.

Lmao... Goal posts and all...

 

[DocSeuss]

and? why does that make you think this console would be successful? they seem to be pretty out of touch with consumers lately

I think my OP expresses my thoughts quite nicely.

Microsoft sucks at consumer electronics, except the 360, which handily won this gen (because of that attach rate). Most of what they've done has just been late to the party. It's almost always better than the competition (Zune HD is the best MP3 player to have ever existed), but it never catches on because it still feels like it's imitating. The Xbox's success is that it doesn't feel like it's imitating. It defines itself.

 

[Derrick01]

Did I miss part of the conversation? Seems that your PC argument would indicate almost as much abandonment by Sony and yet you don't say that.

How do you figure? Most of the exclusives on PS3 actually live up to the word exclusive, meaning 1 platform.

 

[Raven77]

How do you figure? Most of the exclusives on PS3 actually live up to the word exclusive, meaning 1 platform.

Quote for truth.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I think my OP expresses my thoughts quite nicely.

Microsoft sucks at consumer electronics, except the 360, which handily won this gen (because of that attach rate). Most of what they've done has just been late to the party. It's almost always better than the competition (Zune HD is the best MP3 player to have ever existed), but it never catches on because it still feels like it's imitating. The Xbox's success is that it doesn't feel like it's imitating. It defines itself.

Good point. I just hope in their trek to a new frontier its not mostly mom and dad with their 3 kids that they are targeting.

 

[RadarScope1]

I like the way you think, OP. It's seemed logical to me that MS is reloading to really pour the software on thick as they launch a new box. This is what I thought in 2010, then 2011... But it's been a while now and we haven't seen much. I really hope they've just been keeping it all under wraps.

Where I really agree with you is on XBLA. It is THE reason to own a 360, and by far that is where I spend my time and money. Between indies, reboots, puzzlers, 2D games and really smart stuff like the Minecraft port - man, it's just been so good. If they can widen that scope and spirit, they will do quite well. What will kill me is the lack of BC for those digital games, which seems certain (sigh).

Where I disagree with you is the strength of first-party games (I think they're both pretty damn good), but hey, that's mostly subjective.

I'm all about new experiences and so I wouldn't mind something cool from Kinect 2.0. I personally just didn't see much that was appealing when it came to motion stuff in Wii, Move or Kinect these last few years.

I think we'll see it all from MS. Core stuff, expected sequels, new IP, innovative digital titles from smaller studios, Kinect, streaming services and more social stuff. Throw it all out there. They have the money, and new gen is the time to toss stuff against the wall.

Shadow Complex 2 won't hurt, either...

 

[Satchel]

Very well thought out post, and I hope you're right at least as far as the games are concerned.

But from the sounds of Durango, they sacrificed a lot of power to get Kinect packed in with every system, and the useless Kinect 2.0 will seemingly take up a lot of wasted conference and system time and resources, and if we add in the big negative rumour about no-used-games, the system has to REALLY surprise me to get out of my negative MS funk.

360 went from my favorite console to nearly forgotten by me in no time flat once Kinect came out and ruined everything.

But Sony didn't sacrifice anything for their camera.

 

[Amir0x]

But Sony didn't sacrifice anything for their camera.

i know Sony wants to trick people into thinking Eye is some Kinect approximation, but the only reason it really exists is so that they can do the whole facial recognition authorization thing and say "See, we can do the only important thing Kinect does just as well!" The tech is not going to touch what Kinect 2.0 does, and therefore naturally not touch the cost of its components.

We already know what PS4 did to sacrifice - 8GB DDR5 ram. Which is to say, Sony is certifiably insane.

 

[Kikarian]

I can see more Windows 8 apps intergrated in the Xbox OS/Store.
We already know there are going to be 4 new IP's.
Kinect will play a heavy part throughout the whole conference.

I think that there may be one surprise by Microsoft though.

 

[Satchel]

Shoot nobody told me "gamers were abandoned by MS

I guess once i get the memo my copy of Halo 4 and Forza Horizon will dissapear?

Yeah its a bummer. I got the memo and once I did, almost 50 games on my shelf disappeared except for Dance Central and Kinect Adventures.

All my XBLA library was wiped from my HDD, and then my Xbox transformed into a person, gave me the finger and walked out of the house.

I can see more Windows 8 apps intergrated in the Xbox OS/Store.
We already know there are going to be 4 new IP's.
Kinect will play a heavy part throughout the whole conference.

I think that there may be one surprise by Microsoft though.

So why was Kinect all but absent from E3 2012?

 

[Grecco]

i know Sony wants to trick people into thinking Eye is some Kinect approximation, but the only reason it really exists is so that they can do the whole facial recognition authorization thing and say "See, we can do the only important thing Kinect does just as well!" The tech is not going to touch what Kinect 2.0 does, and therefore naturally not touch the cost of its components.

We already know what PS4 did to sacrifice - 8GB DDR5 ram. Which is to say, Sony is certifiably insane.

We dont really know a whole lot about the New PS Eye saying it its just facial recognition is a bit early

 

[Grecco]

Yeah its a bummer. I got the memo and once I did, almost 50 games on my shelf disappeared except for Dance Central and Kinect Adventures.

All my XBLA library was wiped from my HDD, and then my Xbox transformed into a person, gave me the finger and walked out of the house.



So why was Kinect all but absent from E3 2012?

Shoot i better not get the memo before Gears of War Judgement comes out!

 

[DocSeuss]

Good point. I just hope in their trek to a new frontier its not mostly mom and dad with their 3 kids that they are targeting.

I hope so as well.

I'm a fan of the Microsoft that established Xbox Live Arcade (I cannot express how much I love the ability to download any game on the service, and, while playing, unlock the full version if I enjoy it that much), the Microsoft that pushed games like Otogi, Crimson Skies, Shadowrun, Viva Pinata, and, yeah, the Halo/Alan Wake/Forza/Fable/Gears stuff.

At this stage, I think that Microsoft exists. I think they resumed core development in 2010 and 2011, and decided not to announce anything new in 2012 because they weren't yet ready to announce their new console--which most of these games are being developed for.

I hate the "as a..." statements, but... As a core gamer, I have found that I actually like Kinect. I have also found that most of the people who complain about Kinect don't actually own one, and have, at best, tried it out at a friend's house. Kinect is something unlike anything out there (yes, even PSEye--and I say this as a guy who has spent a great deal of time working with both of these things for motion capture purposes).

If Microsoft is still doing Fortaleza (and I worry they aren't), which combines VR stuff with Kinect motion control, we've basically got the Holodeck 0.1, which, to me, is incredibly exciting.

Of course, I also find the WiiU pad and SmartGlass incredibly exiting, and am excited that the PS4+Vita is basically just WiiU + Kinect. I'm weird that way.

So why was Kinect all but absent from E3 2012?

I was always confused by peoples' reception to E3 2012. Everyone kept saying Sony "won," which confused me quite a bit.

My ideal E3 for a first-party dev means they show sequels to old games, they show new IPs, they show new technology, and they show new features.

Sony... they showed games we already knew about (The Last of Us, Sony Smash Bros, the seventh God of War retail release this generation, iirc), they announced a new David Cage game (I loathe this man's games), they spent like twenty minutes on Wonderbook. Most of these things are/were lackluster. They basically ignored the Vita and I can't recall any new features being added to PSN or anything (maybe they announced the store? I think reception to that has been pretty bad, though).

Microsoft, conversely? We got to see Halo 4, saw Gears Judgement announced, saw Dance Central 3, got three or four new IPs (can't remember if Wreckateer--which is surprisingly fun!--was a new IP), learned about SmartGlass functionality, and learned about additional XBL features. It ticked all the right boxes. Sure, they spent some time on Kinect, but why not? They had lots of stuff to show. Very diverse. It's not like they spent twenty minutes on Wonderbook and ten minutes on a subpar clone of a game from another company.

For an E3 at the end of a gen, I thought Microsoft's was pretty great.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

i know Sony wants to trick people into thinking Eye is some Kinect approximation, but the only reason it really exists is so that they can do the whole facial recognition authorization thing and say "See, we can do the only important thing Kinect does just as well!" The tech is not going to touch what Kinect 2.0 does, and therefore naturally not touch the cost of its components.

We already know what PS4 did to sacrifice - 8GB DDR5 ram. Which is to say, Sony is certifiably insane.

We all know Sony is a bullet point company. All they care about is showing on the back of the box that they can match the competition without putting any effort behind it. Thats how the Eyetoy will be marketed.

Now the 8GB of GDDR5...That is my kind of crazy.

I hope so as well.

I'm a fan of the Microsoft that established Xbox Live Arcade (I cannot express how much I love the ability to download any game on the service, and, while playing, unlock the full version if I enjoy it that much), the Microsoft that pushed games like Otogi, Crimson Skies, Shadowrun, Viva Pinata, and, yeah, the Halo/Alan Wake/Forza/Fable/Gears stuff.

At this stage, I think that Microsoft exists. I think they resumed core development in 2010 and 2011, and decided not to announce anything new in 2012 because they weren't yet ready to announce their new console--which most of these games are being developed for.

I hate the "as a..." statements, but... As a core gamer, I have found that I actually like Kinect. I have also found that most of the people who complain about Kinect don't actually own one, and have, at best, tried it out at a friend's house. Kinect is something unlike anything out there (yes, even PSEye--and I say this as a guy who has spent a great deal of time working with both of these things for motion capture purposes).

If Microsoft is still doing Fortaleza (and I worry they aren't), which combines VR stuff with Kinect motion control, we've basically got the Holodeck 0.1, which, to me, is incredibly exciting.

Of course, I also find the WiiU pad and SmartGlass incredibly exiting, and am excited that the PS4+Vita is basically just WiiU + Kinect. I'm weird that way.

Honestly after CES I am really excited about the next version of Kinect. There was some ridiculous stuff they were showing off in those kiosks. MS would be dumb not to continue to exploit that excitement the populace has for that device. Ami will disagree with me on this but Dance Central + Kinect + Alcohol is better than anything with a Wii mote

 

[JJD]

I think MS will surprise people mainly because they will actually care about core games this time contrary to past E3s were kinect and OS features were clearly the focus.

They will have some good software to show and considering the generational leap it's going to look good. They cannot afford to have few games on their E3 unveiling but it's mostly going to be third party stuff. They have a great relationship with most third parties so this is a certainty.

Are their games going to look better than PS4 games? I don't know, but if the specs aren't changed from the rumors this is not likely. Remember Edge nailed the PS4 specs including the possibility of the bump in RAM that a lot of developers didn't think was possible, so Edge rumors about Durango carries weight.

Regardless of graphical power if the games are there I think most people will be satisfied.

I still believe that the main focus is going to be media features aiming to capture the heart of the living room but they won't forget about gaming this time.

They will have Alan Wake 2, so I'll be there when the 720 releases.

Also, I'm sorry OP but I just can't take your opinion seriously when you argue that games like KZ and Uncharted are genuinely bad.

I don't want to derail the thread so I'll just say this.

I fucking hate Halo. Tried playing Halo 2, 3 and 4 and just couldn't get into it. I Never cared for the other games in the series so I didn't even try.

But I would never dare say that the series is genuinely bad despite hating it. I can easily understand why people like it. The games are technically competent (Halo 4 looks great), have great sound design, Halo Forge is just cool and finally the gameplay (even if it doesn't suits my tastes) is polished.

I'm glad that MS first party carter suits your tastes but if you're really going to argue with people about then holding up against Sony or specially Nintendo first party you'll find yourself in the minority pretty soon.

I sincerely cannot understand someone who cannot see a single redeeming quality in games like UC and KZ to the point to actually call then genuinely bad.

 

[RadioactiveLobster]

This prediction has no basis in reality or any sane human thought, but I post it here anyways in the off chance the planets align and reality warps and it happens.






Microsoft E3 Press Conference.

They show the console, they show the games, they get everyone excited.

They announce it launches the week after E3 ends.


worldexplodes.gif

 

[Amir0x]

We all know Sony is a bullet point company. All they care about is showing on the back of the box that they can match the competition without putting any effort behind it. Thats how the Eyetoy will be marketed.

Now the 8GB of GDDR5...That is my kind of crazy.

Bulletpoint Company. Haha, that is succinct and as perfectly accurate as possible about Sony.

And I'd go further and say that generations are starting to become Bulletpoint Gens - just unload a metric ton of features, at least 1/3rd of them half-assed, and that includes for most software development too. Tomb Raider is what I call a "Bulletpoint Game."

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Bulletpoint Company. Haha, that is succinct and as perfectly accurate as possible about Sony.

And I'd go further and say that generations are starting to become Bulletpoint Gens - just unload a metric ton of features, at least 1/3rd of them half-assed, and that includes for most software development too. Tomb Raider is what I call a "Bulletpoint Game."

Absolutely.

 

[Jadedx]

I think MS will surprise people mainly because they will actually care about core games this time contrary to past E3s were kinect and OS features were clearly the focus.

They will have some good software to show and considering the generational leap it's going to look good. They cannot afford to have few games on their E3 unveiling but it's mostly going to be third party stuff. They have a great relationship with most third parties so this is a certainty.

Are their games going to look better than PS4 games? I don't know, but if the specs aren't changed from the rumors this is not likely. Remember Edge nailed the PS4 specs including the possibility of the bump in RAM that a lot of developers didn't think was possible, so Edge rumors about Durango carries weight.

Regardless of graphical power if the games are there I think most people will be satisfied.

I still believe that the main focus is going to be media features aiming to capture the heart of the living room but they won't forget about gaming this time.

They will have Alan Wake 2, so I'll be there when the 720 releases.

Also, I'm sorry OP but I just can't take your opinion seriously when you argue that games like KZ and Uncharted are genuinely bad.

I don't want to derail the thread so I'll just say this.

I fucking hate Halo. Tried playing Halo 2, 3 and 4 and just couldn't get into it. I Never cared for the other games in the series so I didn't even try.

But I would never dare say that the series is genuinely bad despite hating it. I can easily understand why people like it. The games are technically competent (Halo 4 looks great), have great sound design, Halo Forge is just cool and finally the gameplay (even if it doesn't suits my tastes) is polished.

I'm glad that MS first party carter suits your tastes but if you're really going to argue with people about then holding up against Sony or specially Nintendo first party you'll find yourself in the minority pretty soon.

I sincerely cannot understand someone who cannot see a single redeeming quality in games like UC and KZ to the point to actually call then genuinely bad.

I cannot understand why people can't see any redeeming quality in Halo. It is all a matter of taste, I also can not understand why people like UC or KZ so much, both I think suck, especially KZ.

 

[Elixist]

Im not paying to play online anymore, if thats dropped im all ears. i love 360s controller and games. Ive played alot of Gears and Halo, im done being a dumbass that pays yearly for p2p networking.

 

[DocSeuss]

Honestly after CES I am really excited about the next version of Kinect. There was some ridiculous stuff they were showing off in those kiosks. MS would be dumb not to continue to exploit that excitement the populace has for that device. Ami will disagree with me on this but Dance Central + Kinect + Alcohol is better than anything with a Wii mote

After looking at the staff at Harmonix (I was trying to figure out where Eric Brosius went), a few weeks ago, I suddenly understand why they are one of the best developers in existence. Yeah, core gamers don't really think of them like that, but when you really get down to playing their games, they always feel like they're exactly what they want to be. Not the kind of games I'd design, given the chance, but excellent games nontheless.

Also, I'm sorry OP but I just can't take your opinion seriously when you argue that games like KZ and Uncharted are genuinely bad.

At some point, I'll probably do a thread on why I think they're as bad as they are. I've talked a bit about it here, but not in greater depth.

I fucking hate Halo. Tried playing Halo 2, 3 and 4 and just couldn't get into it. I Never cared for the other games in the series so I didn't even try.

I don't understand hating a game just because you can't get into it. I can't get into a lot of games. Don't hate them in the least.

But I would never dare say that the series is genuinely bad despite hating it. I can easily understand why people like it. The games are technically competent (Halo 4 looks great), have great sound design, Halo Forge is just cool and finally the gameplay (even if it doesn't suits my tastes) is polished.

Did you bother to read the one brief post I did where I explained Uncharted's failings from a shooter point of view? X-ray vision for AI is the mark of a bad game. Shooting galleries are the mark of a bad shooter. Weapons that don't help the player navigate/control the playspace are poorly designed. Etc etc.

I sincerely cannot understand someone who cannot see a single redeeming quality in games like UC and KZ to the point to actually call then genuinely bad.

I do see redeeming qualities in Uncharted and Killzone. The animations in both are phenomenal. The art design is top notch. The sound presentation is superb. Uncharted's facial capture is great. Both games do some graphical wizardry.

To me, however, these are secondary to gameplay and narrative. They drop the ball horribly in the gameplay departments.

This prediction has no basis in reality or any sane human thought, but I post it here anyways in the off chance the planets align and reality warps and it happens.

Microsoft E3 Press Conference.

They show the console, they show the games, they get everyone excited.

They announce it launches the week after E3 ends.


worldexplodes.gif

To be fair, the Xbox 360S was launched a week or so after E3 2010, wasn't it? PRECEDENCE

Bulletpoint Company. Haha, that is succinct and as perfectly accurate as possible about Sony.

And I'd go further and say that generations are starting to become Bulletpoint Gens - just unload a metric ton of features, at least 1/3rd of them half-assed, and that includes for most software development too. Tomb Raider is what I call a "Bulletpoint Game."

Assassin's Creed 3 is a game that seems like one team worked on each bullet point, and then some guy tried to sew it all together.

 

[mujun]

How do you figure? Most of the exclusives on PS3 actually live up to the word exclusive, meaning 1 platform.

So your initial argument which I took issue was that MS abandoned gamers (read had absolutely nothing for them) from the point they released the Kinect has now changed to "the 360 is pointless" because it has less exclusives than the PC or the PS3?

That is what you said, right? Why did you change your argument half way through?

 

[solarus]

People forget that microsoft really defined a lot of the features we expect from a modern gaming console with the 360. Background downloads, hard drive installs, low power mode downloads with automatic shutdown, no installs required for games that are downloaded unlike sony, cross game voice chat, the success of xbla and its resulting impact, party chat, the list just goes on... People here hate on microsoft for moving away from gaming as the focus, but their brilliance as a software company really set the bar this gen.

 

[Commanche Raisin Toast]

as a non-xbox-owning individual all i can really do is gauge what they might do based on all of their recent behavior. their comments, their services, their last few E3's, etc.

i don't really see them going anywhere else except full steam ahead with making xbox the "hub" of the living room, and being a jack of all trades and an ace of none. i foresee Windows 8 (in some form) on the new box, i foresee the windows marketplace kind of merging with the windows phone marketplace and xbox live.

it's a good strategy as a company that has their hands in a lot of different media services, but i really think they could miss out on gamers that want power if they can't deliver the performance PS4 can. im not saying they'll instantly lose a ton of existing 360 users to the PS4, but i think those that area easily swayed could easily jump ship, even if a small fraction. i also think they're going to have to be smarter about what they charge for and what is free. is it going to be all-inclusive? pay walls and tiers? i know several people that traded their 360's in for PS3's because they're tired of dealing with that.

i don't think they're going to take the gloves off, or even put up their dukes at all with Sony. i think they're going to act like PS4 doesn't exit and keep pushing ahead with kinect and DVR stuff and getting as many people as possible sucked into their microsoft/windows ecosystem that is almost certainly going to all merged together with 720. they're trying to pincer maneuver their customers like apple did. they don't care about Sony or Nintendo.

i don't think they're going to counter PS4's 8GB GDDR5 announcement. i think they may coincidentally have some similar features, but i think they're going for a broad weak stroke instead of a hard hit.

 

[Digital-Hero]

Sony was smart to come out swinging with one hand and having the other held back. For every Microsoft announcement at E3, I'm sure Sony has a counter waiting for it. This June is going to be very interesting.