• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Lizard Squad DDOS Brings Down multiple Daybreak Studios titles

If you block them, they go underground and agencies and police can't follow them. They're kids, they'll make mistakes eventually. Easier to catch them when agencies are working with Twitter to get their IPs and such.

These agencies must really suck at their jobs then if they can't catch a bunch of teenagers gloating on the internet for what, 9 months now?
 
These agencies must really suck at their jobs then if they can't catch a bunch of teenagers gloating on the internet for what, 9 months now?

They've already caought quite many. But they're like Anonymous, the more fame they get, the more kiddies they'll hire. Lulzsec fell this way. FBI got their boss who then turned into a rat and gave everyone up. FBI might already have their mole inside, so they just wait and get more evidence. We'll see.

They will get caught, but what kind of punishment they're getting is just a guess. At least they're considered as terrorists after that bomb threat so they might get what they deserve.
 
What many of you don't seem to understand is this: In the Scandinavian countries, which has the lowest reoffending rate in the world, a sentence isn't handed out for the sake of the victim. It's for the sake of the offender. The idea is that, if someone has done something bad, they need to be put on the right course as quickly as possible.

The absolute worst way to achieve this is locking them up with a bunch of other people who have done bad stuff, so it's seen as a last resort. Even when people are locked up, the prison should be made to resemble the outside world as much as possible. That means both responsibilities and freedoms, room for jobs and hobbies, and yes, a prison cell that, to many outsiders, looks way too much like a dorm room or small apartment.

You may want a hard sentence, but it has been proved time and time again that longer sentences increases reoffending rates, and do next to nothing to deter crime. It just doesn't work. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If a society wants to lessen crime, it needs to treat its criminals well, and not punish them so much as rehabilitate them. Part of that rehabilitation could be therapy, meeting the victims they've hurt, and living in a controlled environment(prison) for a while to get their life back on track.

I say this based on numerous studies. Just Google a bit before you post, and you will hopefully realise that, although not very satisfying for the victim, this system is the best solution we know of for society as a whole.
 

Tenzan

Banned
He should have served prison time in the country where the servers are placed. The hacker in Finland got off light.
 

demigod

Member
I was on EQ yesterday and was experiencing lag, gated to town and the game froze on me when zoning. Couldn't log back on at all. Just got on for an hour right now and its happening again. Fuck these guys.
 

MGrant

Member
Was just trying to play an hour or two of Planetside 2 (PC) before bed to welcome in the weekend. Servers went down. Fuck this shit; dumbass kids devoting their weekends to ruining others' worldwide.
 

213372bu

Banned
Literal terrorists are back at it.

I'll admit, I cracked a guilty smile when they first started DDoSing and the main man behind it was just sitting at a Starbucks the whole day tweeting openly with pictures of him eating food and coffee.

But causing people's life to be in danger is overboard. Not to mention all they are just fucking script kiddies who think what they're doing is cool or demonstrating their prowess.

Obnoxious losers.
 

Achire

Member
There are some major issues in the Finnish justice system. The most obvious is a near-complete lack of punishment for sexual offences including rape. The other is dependency on suspended sentences. A suspended sentence in the Finnish system is effectually a lesser punishment than a fine. So while locking up people is bad, there are other options than "nothing". The most obvious is community service, which would probably help this kid a lot.
 
I reckon what matters the most is the percentage of members who get caught.
If lulsec and lizard both were to get dismantled following legal actions, then that's probably somewhat deterring for other shitheads contemplating crime and terrorism groups.
So I hope this Julius asshole is helpful in creating further investigations into more members.
 

-tetsuo-

Unlimited Capacity
The world at large simply has no idea how to deal with the internet when it comes to crime. Piratebay guy got 10 months in for founding a torrent site and this kid basically gets nothing for the shit he has done. Great.
 

Briarios

Member
What many of you don't seem to understand is this: In the Scandinavian countries, which has the lowest reoffending rate in the world, a sentence isn't handed out for the sake of the victim. It's for the sake of the offender. The idea is that, if someone has done something bad, they need to be put on the right course as quickly as possible.

The absolute worst way to achieve this is locking them up with a bunch of other people who have done bad stuff, so it's seen as a last resort. Even when people are locked up, the prison should be made to resemble the outside world as much as possible. That means both responsibilities and freedoms, room for jobs and hobbies, and yes, a prison cell that, to many outsiders, looks way too much like a dorm room or small apartment.

You may want a hard sentence, but it has been proved time and time again that longer sentences increases reoffending rates, and do next to nothing to deter crime. It just doesn't work. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If a society wants to lessen crime, it needs to treat its criminals well, and not punish them so much as rehabilitate them. Part of that rehabilitation could be therapy, meeting the victims they've hurt, and living in a controlled environment(prison) for a while to get their life back on track.

I say this based on numerous studies. Just Google a bit before you post, and you will hopefully realise that, although not very satisfying for the victim, this system is the best solution we know of for society as a whole.

The problem is, you're comparing different types of crimes. You can't compare the recidivism rates of violent offenders or theives with that of hackers.

One group tends to do things due to environment, while the hackers do it because of some warped ideology. That's not something you can rehabilitate.

Thieves can be taught skills so they dont have to steal ... Most don't want to steal in the first place, that's why rehabilitation works.

These hackers WANT to do what they're doing. A light sentence only reonforces their beliefs.
 
Not this shit again.

maxresdefault.jpg

.
 

Ponn

Banned
What many of you don't seem to understand is this: In the Scandinavian countries, which has the lowest reoffending rate in the world, a sentence isn't handed out for the sake of the victim. It's for the sake of the offender. The idea is that, if someone has done something bad, they need to be put on the right course as quickly as possible.

The absolute worst way to achieve this is locking them up with a bunch of other people who have done bad stuff, so it's seen as a last resort. Even when people are locked up, the prison should be made to resemble the outside world as much as possible. That means both responsibilities and freedoms, room for jobs and hobbies, and yes, a prison cell that, to many outsiders, looks way too much like a dorm room or small apartment.

You may want a hard sentence, but it has been proved time and time again that longer sentences increases reoffending rates, and do next to nothing to deter crime. It just doesn't work. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If a society wants to lessen crime, it needs to treat its criminals well, and not punish them so much as rehabilitate them. Part of that rehabilitation could be therapy, meeting the victims they've hurt, and living in a controlled environment(prison) for a while to get their life back on track.

I say this based on numerous studies. Just Google a bit before you post, and you will hopefully realise that, although not very satisfying for the victim, this system is the best solution we know of for society as a whole.

Sounds like a place where someone with no moral compass could thrive.
 

drotahorror

Member
I'm not talking from perspective but what is proven to work and what is not.

Nothing works. People still murder others over a pair of shoes or getting cut off on the freeway. These people know the consequences but still go through with it. People are only asking for criminals to serve the time they deserve.
 

GraveHorizon

poop meter feature creep
I'm upset after seeing so many people denying any sort of real repercussions for a person that commits potentially life-ruining acts of CYBER TERRORISM. Grounding a plane with a bomb threat isn't a grade school prank. Messing with a person's financial information is very serious. This shit needs to be treated like it is: a real life crime of harassment against other human beings. At the very minimum, no computer access. And real jail time.

Where's the
suspected
pedophile hate squad/lynch mob? They should bring in their rash desire to dole out punishment to a situation in which the people involved are confirmed to have actually done something wrong and can with 100% certainty be assumed to commit the same acts in the future given the lack of existing tangible consequences.
 

SaganIsGOAT

Junior Member
He had his credit destroyed? Wtf... I can't even imagine after how I've struggled financially to keep my credit solid to have some cunt on the Internet flush it all down the drain.
 

Jomjom

Banned
Wtf defacing his father's grave. I don't get people who don't think these kind of people need punishment. Is this way of thinking some new age hippie shit?
 

Tenebrous

Member
the DDOS started 10 minutes after Smedley CEO of Daybreak took to reddit with his story of how lizard squad has effected his life .... Everything from credit identity theft, SWATTED multiple times, bogus income tax filing, defacing Smedley's fathers grave, to having Smedley's plane downed with a bomb threat:

Wow... Wow.
 

Doomshine

Member
Like the last thread, everyone is ignoring the guy with the actual court documents:

So few points about Kivimäki. He was facing a max sentence, which is extremely rare in Finland. He got off because he was 15 at the time, and under Finnish law a person under 18 years doesn't get a prison sentence unless there are heavy reasons. He was a first timer, so the court played it safe. Also in that case MIT nor others had any demands. The sentence had nothing to do with psn or swatting or doxxing, it was about vcrrdit cards and adobe cloudflare vulnerabilities with a .h file vulnerability.

Most likely prosecutor will appeal, so Kivimäki might face prison time for these crimes. Alas there are multiple ongoing investigations ongoing against him, so he will go to jail next time he's in court.

What artsi has said in this topic is true, apart from a minor court process mistake. As I said in other thread, I have the full sentence and I am a nearly graduated lawyer in Finland, so if you have questions, shoot away.

Seriously, Don't source stuff to Kotaku about nongaming stuff.
 

canedaddy

Member
You guys get real salty at non punishment based justice systems dont you?
It's not "punishment" to remove dangerous individuals from society. It's a means of protecting innocent people who might be harmed by those individuals in the future.
 

deadlast

Member
You guys get real salty at non punishment based justice systems dont you?

Normally I don't care whatever criminal justice system a country has, but this kid is a terrorist. He needs to be treated like one.

Also if someone gets in trouble for something and continues to do the same thing, what rehabilitation has been done?
 
What many of you don't seem to understand is this: In the Scandinavian countries, which has the lowest reoffending rate in the world, a sentence isn't handed out for the sake of the victim. It's for the sake of the offender. The idea is that, if someone has done something bad, they need to be put on the right course as quickly as possible.

The absolute worst way to achieve this is locking them up with a bunch of other people who have done bad stuff, so it's seen as a last resort. Even when people are locked up, the prison should be made to resemble the outside world as much as possible. That means both responsibilities and freedoms, room for jobs and hobbies, and yes, a prison cell that, to many outsiders, looks way too much like a dorm room or small apartment.

You may want a hard sentence, but it has been proved time and time again that longer sentences increases reoffending rates, and do next to nothing to deter crime. It just doesn't work. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a demonstrable fact. If a society wants to lessen crime, it needs to treat its criminals well, and not punish them so much as rehabilitate them. Part of that rehabilitation could be therapy, meeting the victims they've hurt, and living in a controlled environment(prison) for a while to get their life back on track.

I say this based on numerous studies. Just Google a bit before you post, and you will hopefully realise that, although not very satisfying for the victim, this system is the best solution we know of for society as a whole.
But, there is no rehabilitation here. The guy has literally no punishment or rehabilitation program whatsoever. He was given a suspended sentence, this means he goes home, gets on the computer, gets with his friends, and does more crimes, but this time trying harder not to get caught. And this for being a repeat offender convicted of thousands of crimes! The system can't work if it does nothing at all to criminals, nor does it show other potential criminals that they shouldn't do bad things.
 

Loakum

Banned
For every attack by these entitled little shits, Sony and Microsoft are strengthening their security online servers.
 
This will be the last time I post about LS, they don't deserve this attention. And that's what they seek, and we're giving it to them. The hell with these kids, they're terrorists and I hope they meet a very cruel end. And I don't give a shit who finds that shocking or vigilante justice-like, these people are terrorizing people. This is no longer about simple insignificant things like DDOSing game servers. Anyway, that's all the attention I'm willing to give these people, stop giving them what they want. It only spurs them on.
 

AYF 001

Member
Normally I don't care whatever criminal justice system a country has, but this kid is a terrorist. He needs to be treated like one.

Also if someone gets in trouble for something and continues to do the same thing, what rehabilitation has been done?
First off, if you read what other people had posted, he hasn't even had a trial for any of the threats yet, hence the light sentence. It's very possible he could face a harsher term if he's convicted on those counts as well. Second, even if that were to be the maximum sentence he receives, how do you know what the outcome will be before his sentence has even begun?
 
Second, even if that were to be the maximum sentence he receives, how do you know what the outcome will be before his sentence has even begun?
Maybe you missed the fact that there is no sentence at all to begin? How can there be an outcome to...nothing? His sentence was suspended. This means nothing happens to him unless he is caught doing another crime.
 

system11

Member
Community service. Lots and LOTS of community service. Helping the elderly, gardening on community projects, helping pick up litter, things like that. And you ban them from the internet until it's finished.
 

AYF 001

Member
Maybe you missed the fact that there is no sentence at all to begin? How can there be an outcome to...nothing? His sentence was suspended. This means nothing happens to him unless he is caught doing another crime.
Last time I checked my dictionary, suspended meant the same thing as postponed, as in, to be given at a later date. Again, he can still face trial for the other charges. And since he won't be considered a first-timer now, they're more likely to take action sooner.
 
Last time I checked my dictionary, suspended meant the same thing as postponed, as in, to be given at a later date. Again, he can still face trial for the other charges. And since he won't be considered a first-timer now, they're more likely to take action sooner.
You need a legal dictionary: Suspending a sentence prior to the execution means that a judge has decided on a sentence, but has refrained from actually carrying it out. And I was responding to your point that even if this is the maximum sentence given, how do we know the outcome before it is started? That point assumes he receives no more sentences.
 
They're not given free passes. They won't be saying that if they're caught and given probation. Their bravado is from being anonymous. They're still fearful of being caught. If they weren't fearful they would give their names.
 
Top Bottom