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[Liberty4all]

Posting as somebody mentioned this deserved is own thread. 14 injured, 2 dead one 10 year, old one 18 year old. 3 dead of we include the gunman.

I should add where it happened it would be like a shooting in NYC Greektown.

Actually the Toronto incident -- that guy would have been put down quickly if it happened in an open carry state.

I should add they found explosives at Chester subway Station nearby (this has been practically reported nowhere) -

Is very likely this incident is terrorism related (IMHO). Time will tell I guess. The gunman was Faisal Hussein

 

[Gander]

I'm beyond angry that this disease continues to grow and the right wing is convinced do nothing or solve it all for us right now this minute is the answer.

 

[Zog]

I'm beyond angry that this disease continues to grow and right wing is convinced do nothing or solve it all for us right now this minute is the answer.

Did you proofread this? I can't make heads or tails of what you are trying to say here.

 

[Liberty4all]

I'm beyond angry that this disease continues to grow and right wing is convinced do nothing or solve it all for us right now this minute is the answer.

Open carry and the gunmsn would have been put down quickly. It's a shame so many people were hurt because they could not defend themselves. Thankfully in America the 2nd amendment is in place to allow citizens the ability to put down madmen.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'm beyond angry that this disease continues to grow and the right wing is convinced do nothing or solve it all for us right now this minute is the answer.

This happened in a place that has far stricter gun laws, than other places where the same thing happens.

So this is not a left vs. right issue, this is a violent human issue that is probably lead buy an ideology. Not to mention Toronto is extremely liberal compared to most places as well.

 

[Gander]

Did you proofread this? I can't make heads or tails of what you are trying to say here.

Open carry and the gunmsn would have been put down quickly. It's a shame so many people were hurt because they could not defend themselves. Thankfully in America the 2nd amendment is in place to allow citizens the ability to put down madmen.

That has nothing to do with it, there were open carry people there in Vegas when 800 people got shot.

 

[Liberty4all]

That has nothing to do with it, there were open carry people there in Vegas when 800 people got shot.

Huge difference between maniac with a handgun vs a maniac in a sniper spot with fully automatics

 

[Gander]

This happened in a place that has far stricter gun laws, than other places where the same thing happens.

So this is not a left vs. right issue, this is a violent human issue that is probably lead buy an ideology. Not to mention Toronto is extremely liberal compared to most places as well.

It is because any attempt to discuss strategy on how to tackle this issue. One side consistently shuts down all discuss.

 

[Liberty4all]

It is because any attempt to discuss strategy on how to tackle this issue. One side consistently shuts down all discuss.

Obviously Canada's strict gun control did no good. Bad guy had gun and shot innocents with impunity as law abiding citizens could not defend themselves.

 

[Alfadawg]

Canadians are so lucky over their gun laws.

Hopefully this remains just an isolated incident for Canadians.

 

[DeepEnigma]

It is because any attempt to discuss strategy on how to tackle this issue. One side consistently shuts down all discuss.

This is Canada, not the United States. They already have extremely strict gun laws in place, way more strict than the United States.

So again, it's not the simple conservative versus liberal issue like the United States picture you are presenting as an argument.

And there is no coincidence that the crime rate is steadily rising in Toronto, a heavy liberal city just as some liberal cities all around the western world (London is another one) and the United States.

Why is that?

 

[Liberty4all]

Canadians are so lucky over their gun laws.

Hopefully this remains just an isolated incident for Canadians.

It's not. Gun crimes are out of control in Toronto. Perhaps not at the same level as say Chicago, but by Canadian standards it's bad and getting worse.

 

[Gander]

Obviously Canada's strict gun control did no good. Bad guy had gun and shot innocents with impunity as law abiding citizens could not defend themselves.

That is like saying seat belts weren't enough to save a life in a car crash so lets not even discuss airbags or any other options.

 

[Gander]

This is Canada, not the United States. They already have extremely strict gun laws in place, way more strict than the United States.

So again, it's not the simple conservative versus liberal issue like the United States picture you are presenting as an argument.

And there is no coincidence that the crime rate is steadily rising in Toronto, a heavy liberal city just as some liberal cities all around the western world (London is another one) and the United States.

Why is that?

Open your goddamn mind, it's not about being more strict it's about discussing to find out what works.

 

[Liberty4all]

That is like saying seat belts weren't enough to save a life in a car crash so lets not even discuss airbags or any other options.

Bad guys will get guns illegally. Law abiding citizens cannot.

So let's discuss allowing law abiding citizens to carry so they can protect themselves.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Open your goddamn mind, it's not about being more strict it's about discussing to find out what works.

We both know the real answer to that.

You're never going to be able to 100% curb human violence, so the tools would have to not exist in the first place and that goes for everyone not just civilians.

Unfortunately that's not realistic due to that Pandora's Box being well opened.

I do think it starts at the political level and works its way down. When the governments are too busy fighting each other, how does one expect them to formulate plans to help their citizens work in more harmonic ways of tolerance. It is pretty much gang warfare whether it's with words or with weapons.

 

[TheShadowLord]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...er-suspect-kills-two-injures-13-idUSKBN1KD1KF

Less than a day after two young women, ages 10 and 18, were killed and 13 other people were wounded by a gunman, the suspect was identified by the independent Special Investigations Unit (SIU) as Faisal Hussain, a 29-year-old Toronto resident. He was found dead shortly after the shooting, authorities said.

 

[Sakura Doritos]

Open your goddamn mind, it's not about being more strict it's about discussing to find out what works.

Unfortunately most of these people are mentally ill or mentally impaired by mind altering substances. Good luck solving that problem. It takes a village.

 

[gioGAF]

It is because any attempt to discuss strategy on how to tackle this issue. One side consistently shuts down all discuss.

Okay, what is the strategy (or even a strategy) we can use to tackle this issue? I would like to hear it.

Do you know anything about who this guy was and how he got the firearm(s)? Is there a proposed law that would have prevented this?

The problem with the "shuts down all discussions" complaint is that most suggestions being put forth are stupid (assault weapon ban is ridiculous, do you even know what is being labelled an "assault weapon" and why?).

I agree that there are things to be done, but I certainly don't agree with many of the "ideas" being kicked around by politicians. I am very reluctant to give up a right based on knee-jerk suggestions by emotional politicians or mobs.

 

[Gander]

Okay, what is the strategy (or even a strategy) we can use to tackle this issue? I would like to hear it.

Do you know anything about who this guy was and how he got the firearm(s)? Is there a proposed law that would have prevented this?

The problem with the "shuts down all discussions" complaint is that most suggestions being put forth are stupid (assault weapon ban is ridiculous, do you even know what is being labelled an "assault weapon" and why?).

I agree that there are things to be done, but I certainly don't agree with many of the "ideas" being kicked around by politicians. I am very reluctant to give up a right based on knee-jerk suggestions by emotional politicians or mobs.

Ok I'll throw silliness right back at you. Solve Cancer now...can't do it? Well since you can't give me an answer to solve Cancer right now let's not try to solve it at all.

 

[TrainedRage]

How did he get a gun with those strict laws? I'm going to go out on a limb and say its a religiously motivated terrorist attack.

 

[gioGAF]

Ok I'll throw silliness right back at you. Solve Cancer now...can't do it? Well since you can't give me an answer to solve Cancer right now let's not try to solve it at all.

No, not even remotely the same thing. I am not getting outraged because cancer hasn't been solved. I don't know much about the inner workings of the disease. I know it is a complex issue.

Should I attack the people working on solving cancer because it hasn't been done yet? I guess all those researchers are just refusing to tackle the issue. Lazy scientists? Or maybe they are just okay with all of the people who are dying?

 

[Spheyr]

was identified by the independent Special Investigations Unit (SIU) as Faisal Hussain,

 

[12Goblins]

Obviously Canada's strict gun control did no good. Bad guy had gun and shot innocents with impunity as law abiding citizens could not defend themselves.

Yeah let's just arm everyone with a gun then, if that's the only way to keep people safe. What could go wrong

 

[Atrus]

Bad guys will get guns illegally. Law abiding citizens cannot.

So let's discuss allowing law abiding citizens to carry so they can protect themselves.

The accuracy rate of people with guns is extremely low. We see this with the incredibly poor kill ratios for the amount of ammunition expended by rampaging shooters and that is with the advantage of surprise, preparation and possible training.

Once people get into a panic it all goes south. We also see the same poor ratios by fully trained soldiers as well.

The solution to a madmen with guns isn’t a bunch of strangers with guns filling the air with more bullets all in the hope that one side kills the other first.

Given this is Canada, we can rest assured that arming people for self-defence will never come to fruition.

 

[Spheyr]

Yeah let's just arm everyone with a gun then, if that's the only way to keep people safe. What could go wrong

Hundreds of millions of guns in America and not that much crime happens here with them relative to the hundreds of millions of guns in circulation.

 

[appaws]

Well, the news was saying the guy was pretty well secularized, not the Islamist type. But he had a history of dealing with mental illness and depression.

I don't know if that is true, but that is what Lester Holt said.

 

[Chairman Tickles]

Canada is supposed to have strict gun sale controls, i.e those with a history of mental illness can't buy gun legally. That doesn't mean he didn't get it legally, his parents might be exaggerating, covering for their disgraced late son.

 

[King of Foxes]

But WHAT is the motive? Incel, alt right, Trump supporter or the Russian hacker known as 4chan?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...er-suspect-kills-two-injures-13-idUSKBN1KD1KF

Less than a day after two young women, ages 10 and 18, were killed and 13 other people were wounded by a gunman, the suspect was identified by the independent Special Investigations Unit (SIU) as Faisal Hussain, a 29-year-old Toronto resident. He was found dead shortly after the shooting, authorities said.

Oh, well uh

Something about bigots using this to further their own agenda

 

[luigimario]

But WHAT is the motive? Incel, alt right, Trump supporter or the Russian hacker known as 4chan?



Oh, well uh

Something about bigots using this to further their own agenda

Mental Illness? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...story-of-psychosis-and-depression-family-says

But, erm, nice try I guess?

 

[Nobody_Important]

I'm beyond angry that this disease continues to grow and the right wing is convinced do nothing or solve it all for us right now this minute is the answer.

Right there with you man. Its disgusting.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

Mental Illness? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...story-of-psychosis-and-depression-family-says

But, erm, nice try I guess?

Mental health is only an excuse when we’re trying to deflect attention away from gun control. We don’t need to talk about that when we can just blame a Muslim.

Phew, that saves us all a lot of trouble.

 

[Teletraan1]

The government could ban all firearms and we would still have gun violence. There will always be a black market. If guns are somehow prevented from entering the country (good luck with that) there are plenty of unregistered guns in circulation. Technology is far enough that people can 3D print guns on demand.

Trying to identify and help all people who are mentally ill/depressed/likely to commit these crimes is probably just as futile as trying to rid the world of guns but I would rather start there. If it isn't guns it will be homemade explosives or whatever means so I think the root problem should be addressed.

Knowing how our healthcare works here I sincerely doubt the shooter received all the help they could. I know a man who went blind in one eye with a degenerative eye issue because he was waiting for a specialist and I also had a friend die a few days after surgery because he was rushed out of the hospital.

 

[Corderlain]

Mental Illness? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...story-of-psychosis-and-depression-family-says

But, erm, nice try I guess?

Mental illness my ass. Read his name. All the dems are crying about gun control in Canada lmfao

Everyone knows why he did it and no one wants to say it.

 

[Spheyr]

The government could ban all firearms and we would still have gun violence. There will always be a black market. If guns are somehow prevented from entering the country (good luck with that) there are plenty of unregistered guns in circulation. Technology is far enough that people can 3D print guns on demand.

Trying to identify and help all people who are mentally ill/depressed/likely to commit these crimes is probably just as futile as trying to rid the world of guns but I would rather start there. If it isn't guns it will be homemade explosives or whatever means so I think the root problem should be addressed.

Knowing how our healthcare works here I sincerely doubt the shooter received all the help they could. I know a man who went blind in one eye with a degenerative eye issue because he was waiting for a specialist and I also had a friend die a few days after surgery because he was rushed out of the hospital.

3D printer? Hell, go to the hardware store and read a paperback https://www.amazon.com/dp/0873649834/?tag=neogaf0e-20

(I actually have a copy of that, it's p. cool)

 

[Teletraan1]

3D printer? Hell, go to the hardware store and read a paperback https://www.amazon.com/dp/0873649834/?tag=neogaf0e-20

(I actually have a copy of that, it's p. cool)

Exactly what I mean. You can never take the tools people use to commit crimes away from them at this point, there are just too many options available. If you stick your finger in one leak 3 more leaks sprout up from places you wouldn't even suspect there is water. Imo it is a better use of time trying to figure out a solution to why it happened rather than how it happened.

 

[Airola]

The government could ban all firearms and we would still have gun violence. There will always be a black market. If guns are somehow prevented from entering the country (good luck with that) there are plenty of unregistered guns in circulation. Technology is far enough that people can 3D print guns on demand.

Science was an unavoidable mistake.

 

[VAL0R]

But he was always such a nice Muslim boy...

 

[TheShadowLord]

Mental illness my ass. Read his name. All the dems are crying about gun control in Canada lmfao

Everyone knows why he did it and no one wants to say it.

yeah it's not like there's a chance that Muslim who commits shooting could also be suffering from mental illness and didn't pledge to ISIS/terrorism. that only implies to white mass shooters /s

 

[Azurro]

Open carry and the gunmsn would have been put down quickly. It's a shame so many people were hurt because they could not defend themselves. Thankfully in America the 2nd amendment is in place to allow citizens the ability to put down madmen.

This is a ridiculous response. Not to minimize the horrible event, but this is the only one of such kind with actual guns in Canada in the entire year, the other one involved a van. In the US, you can set your clock to mass shootings, as they happen all the time, and no "good guy" puts down the madman in time. In fact, you guys have had children in grade school, and I think even in kindergarten and you guys are happy to not do shit, because you love shooting guns.

Don't export the shit American gun culture to other places, let's keep the disease contained, please.

 

[livestOne]

so this is treated differently to america where they would report about it nonstop 24/7 and drum up fear vs canadian news just doesn't talk about it at all to keep people complacent.

i see the argument but i don't really like either stance to be honest

 

[Spheyr]

This is a ridiculous response. Not to minimize the horrible event, but this is the only one of such kind with actual guns in Canada in the entire year, the other one involved a van. In the US, you can set your clock to mass shootings, as they happen all the time, and no "good guy" puts down the madman in time. In fact, you guys have had children in grade school, and I think even in kindergarten and you guys are happy to not do shit, because you love shooting guns.

Don't export the shit American gun culture to other places, let's keep the disease contained, please.

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

 

[Marshmallow]

So... gun control works in Canada? Because they only get like what, one of these once a year as opposed to every day of the week? OP doesn't seem to understand you can't stop crime.

But he was always such a nice Muslim boy...

 

[Azurro]

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

Yeah, I am a proponent of practicality and rationality. It's best to keep guns away from as many people as possible, especially from people that fetishize them. They are tools to kill, it is weird how people give them to kids in the US to try out.

I don't think most people are mature enough to carry a gun, and the staggering amount of shootings in the US proves that point.

 

[Spheyr]

Yeah, I am a proponent of practicality and rationality. It's best to keep guns away from as many people as possible, especially from people that fetishize them. They are tools to kill, it is weird how people give them to kids in the US to try out.

I don't think most people are mature enough to carry a gun, and the staggering amount of shootings in the US proves that point.

Good thing nearly all of those shootings are done by people who weren't legally carrying those guns in the first place, proving that gun control doesn't do a whole lotta anything.

 

[Marshmallow]

Good thing nearly all of those shootings are done by people who weren't legally carrying those guns in the first place, proving that gun control doesn't do a whole lotta anything.

Kinda weird how other countries don't have school shooting every day of the week too! I wonder what most of Europe, Japan and Canada is doing right?

 

[Azurro]

Good thing nearly all of those shootings are done by people who weren't legally carrying those guns in the first place, proving that gun control doesn't do a whole lotta anything.

Can you please find and post how many mass shootings happen in Canada per year? Once you have that number, then you'll see how wrong you are.

Meanwhile, when I see a shooting at a school in the US, I just think: "oh, it is Thursday".

I mean, I have no hope of convincing you, I know you guys are insane when it comes to guns, it's like a sexual object to you. Just, please don't export it, keep it contained. You guys have been trying to export identity politics for a while, we don't need anymore "presents". :/

 

[Spheyr]

Kinda weird how other countries don't have school shooting every day of the week too! I wonder what most of Europe, Japan and Canada is doing right?

Weird, neither do we!


Man, Europe sure does have plenty of acid attacks, trucks of peace, and various other types of violence and murder, it's almost as if crime and violence happen regardless of what tools are at hand

 

[Azurro]

Weird, neither do we!


Man, Europe sure does have plenty of acid attacks, trucks of peace, and various other types of violence and murder, it's almost as if crime and violence happen regardless of what tools are at hand

False equivalence, but if we are going to go there, then look up how many murders and violent crime happens in the US and compare it with the rest of the developed world. You guys are very, very violent people, uniquely perturbed for a developed world.

You know? You might even be right. Finland for example has a shitload of guns and yet there's barely any murders. Maybe it's a combination of poverty, lack of education, lack of a social safety net and availability of guns that created that powder keg. Regardless, the US is the most violent developed country, and the gun fetishism is so deep rooted that that no amount of shootings will ever change that country.

 

[Spheyr]

False equivalence, but if we are going to go there, then look up how many murders and violent crime happens in the US and compare it with the rest of the developed world. You guys are very, very violent people, uniquely perturbed for a developed world.

You know? You might even be right. Finland for example has a shitload of guns and yet there's barely any murders. Maybe it's a combination of poverty, lack of education, lack of a social safety net and availability of guns that created that powder keg. Regardless, the US is the most violent developed country, and the gun fetishism is so deep rooted that that no amount of shootings will ever change that country.

It's not the "gun fetishists" behind the majority of the violence in our country. Most of us "gun fetishists" will never commit a violent crime in our lives.