Casualized doesn't mean bad, it just means casualized.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Gotdatmoney
Member
Casualized doesn't mean anything. You need a better description than that.
And yet we talk about it every week :/
Skullwaker
Member
It's hard to give a sales estimate for a hypothetical game that has zero details whatsoever.
In Japan?
I mean I guess Umbrella Chronicles didn't underperform but I don't exactly recall it doing particularly well either.
I asked you for evidence to support your claim. The tastes are different in Japan, so they don't think Mario, et al. are "kiddy, uncool, not manly" enough. Surveys/studies done by breaking showing who bought the systems and what age they were is how to do it, not "name a wii game aimed at dude bros in Japan that didn't underperform".
As for MonHan, Tri for Wii sold 1077k, and 3rd HD for PS3 sold 441k. I'm sure there are a million reasons the PS3 version didn't sell as well as the Wii version.
Simplified, streamlined, made more approachable, more accessible, easier. It's not difficult to understand the meaning there. And it isn't "bad".
There's one obvious one too. The Wii version was the next game in the franchise, and exclusive, whereas the PS3 version was a cheap up port of the last release. MHXX Switch won't sell that well either.
Gotdatmoney
Member
Those are all improvments MH games have already been making game by game. You literally aren't saying anything with those descriptions. Do you play MH? Things have been and will continue to need streamlining and more accessibility and simplification. The games have been getting easier.
Saying a westernized (more action really) open world (means nothing), casualised (means nothing) version of MH will underperform tells us nothing. I'm not being obtuse here. I really dunno what people are getting at.
If the PS4 MH is a full production effort I don't see why it wouldn't sell well in Japan.
I do play Monster Hunter but no, the games aren't getting more consistently streamlined or simplified and if anything the trend seems to be more a kitchen sink approach in recent entries after the Tri reset. 4U had a very good tutorial/curve for beginners but Generations just sort of throws you into the deep end so even accessibility isn't improving. Difficulty does vary by installment, Generations being particularly easy but then it came from the Portable team (whose games were usually easier) and a lot of the ease came from the new arts/styles experiments. I'm not seeing continual improvements in any of those respects really though from F2/FU to Tri/3G to 4U to Gen?
I also wouldn't say under 1m in Japan for a western targeted PS4/XB1 MH spinoff is necessarily underperforming.
So 54% is too far off for a spin off? In the context of being a spin off it seems fine to me.
For what they were, Umbrella Chronicles and RE4 both did well
Principate
Saint Titanfall
That's terrible logic. Final fantasy struggles to reach 1 million on the ps4 and MH on ports on the ps3 sold poorly. These predictive estimations based on the minimal details we have are Lala land.
Gotdatmoney
Member
They are most definitely becoming more streamlined and simplified. Generations is a clusterfuck mess though but it is extremely easy because of all the additions and abilities they have given you while not scaling the monsters at all.
Streamlining includes QOL improvements. Better mapping. Simplifying includes reduce grinding, easier requirements, less set up time. You can't seriously tell me the early games are less obtuse than playing 4U.
I would but pointless discussuion.
Capcom already won E3
says you.
MH World is gonna blow Splatoon 2 out of the water. Or be the next W101.
speaking of E3 bets, over/uinder on number of bans in the annoucement thread if the game exists? Nintendo fans gonna lose it, Sony fans gonna gloat, Xbox fans gonna
Scorpio
what about Monster Hunter fans?
what about Media Creates fans?
what about Ouya fans?
Gotdatmoney
Member
I know, I was highlighting how stupid "the Wii held back MH" was :/
That said, the plain HD port of MHP3 sold over 400k. That's not a bad result for what it was.
1. So such thing. Choose a console and stick with it
2. There are fans of chaos and disorder?
3. Thank you for remembering us
Some entries do improve but it's not consistent. Most QOL control improvements (monster cam, touchscreen mapping) were a conciet to moving to 3DS with one analog and missing triggers. And with XX Switch we're even losing some of that, again there's not a consistent improvement. I'd agree the series is now less generally grindy than the PSP games, but complexity hasn't scaled back at all. There's still heavy emphasis on resource gathering, material grinding, build out and prep time, to a degree that's functionally unchanged from a casual perspective. 4U was less obtuse largely because of the softer learning curve and emphasis on explanation in the early game, Generations by comparison would be much more complex for a new player. Again not a consistent series improvement in one direction here. Monster Hunter in many respects will take two steps forward and one step back in these areas.
I thought that was sort the larger point of the discussion actually? How well should a PS4 MH sell?
Gotdatmoney
Member
If we disgaree on the core of the games and series our expectations wont match for obvious reasons. That's why I don't want to drag this back and forth. We can return to it after E3
That could follow shortly after. Or it will be an alternate title for an existing game. Or it will be exclusive to the West. Or something else. Take your pick.
MHW isn't going to sell a million on PS4 unless they overship that much and crawl to a million like tri did. Brand is fine, but you need to consider where the ceiling on software has been on PS4 for it's entire lifetime. Pulling magical numbers out of your ass without basis is meaningless.
The lol is because, unless it's a 3DS game, is not going to sell in the million+ rang, so regardless of what it is it's not going to change the forecast vs. reality.
The lol is because, unless it's a 3DS game, is not going to sell in the million+ rang, so regardless of what it is it's not going to change the forecast vs. reality.
The Gyakuten Kenji were much higher than that, GK2 (260k) was also a notable drop from GK1 (310k) and DGS managed to drop even more.
The Ace Attorney series overall is in decline, but there's just a ceiling in sales where Capcom will have to wonder if it's even worth it to keep releasing these games, the very low effort approach they took for DGS2 doesn't inspire any confidence and it wouldn't be surprising if it only ends up around 150k.
If I remember correctly, those spin-offs, along with recent mainline entries, are not particularly well received by fans.
personally I don't like recent games either, the plots of those games are just plain stupid
I dont't remember any problem for the Gyakuten Kenji, being a sequel and late into the console lifecycle (just like DGS2) the drop was expected.
DGS though I read that it was litteraly unfinished and a big sequel bait, for thèse games whosé sales are heavily frontloaded it doesn't affect the game that much but tarnish the IP and the following games sales.
The big question is where do Capcom go afterwards, AA7 is pretty much a given, but DGS was supposed to be a series running alongside the main one and with the underwhelming sales it seems pretty safe to say that the likelihood of DGS3 existing is very low, so in that regard it pretty much failed as a soft reboot.
Maybe they'll try something else with the IP, maybe they will just pull the plug, maybe the team will work on another entirely different project altogether (on console and/or on mobile)
Gyakuten Kenji 2 is widely considered to be one of the best games, if not the best, game in the franchise, main games included. Dai Gyakuten Saiban was recieved well except for the ending, which left a ton of unresolved plot holes (which has been promised to be filled in this game). Professor Layton vs Ace Attorney is pretty split on opinion I feel, while Gyakuten Kenji is the only one that isn't very popular. That's my take at least.
Edit: of course this is a sales thread and I'm aware of that, just painting a bigger picture. I'm personally afraid that DGS2 will bomb to such an extent we'll never get any more spin-offs released.
Edit: of course this is a sales thread and I'm aware of that, just painting a bigger picture. I'm personally afraid that DGS2 will bomb to such an extent we'll never get any more spin-offs released.
Well you can release a game and sell some hundred thousand copies or don't release a game and sell 0. The criterium for not making another one would depend on budget required to make them (unless you know those you don't know what the ceiling is). And since DGS2 reuses so many assets the budget should be low.
Kenji also reused assets from the main series and with polygonal models reusing assets has actually gotten easier.　Releasing a spin off is definitely better than to milk the mainline games and cause franchise fatigue by doing yearly releases fans feel obliged to buy (and at some point stop doing so). Spin offs will be bought by fans who want more, others can ignore them.
The original game on GBA only sold a bit more than 200k, including the best price edition. That was enough to continue the series until now. It might have declined but it still is higher than it started.
Any chance that it's called MonHun world in the west and just MonHun 5 in Japan?
I didn't think of that but I covered it by "something else". My intention was to list by decreasing likelihood. Your guess is more likely than a Western exclusive I think.
I don't think they would want to savotage mainline MH sales so I would say no. If Capcom is just filing the name for U.S, I think there might be a chance that this is just western name for Frontier.
this could also cause a big meltdown actually
The budget they're using now, spin off included, is also nowhere near the budget they used when they started the series, Ace Attorney started as a hidden project within Capcom lead by Takumi and done in one year with a few guys.
The criterium for not making another game is rather the cost/opportunity one we talked about time and time again in these threads.
Monster Hunter World's performance in Japan depends on how its received by fans from announcement to release, guessing now its pointless.
Just having the Monster Hunter name attach to it doesn't mean it'll sell well though, if it doesn't appeal to the Japanese audience that's it, people don't buy these games blindly, else stuff like Dragon Quest X, Final Fantasy XIV or even Monster Hunter Stories would've been million sellers.
Having the name doesn't equal success, but a more western focus doesn't equal failure either.
Just having the Monster Hunter name attach to it doesn't mean it'll sell well though, if it doesn't appeal to the Japanese audience that's it, people don't buy these games blindly, else stuff like Dragon Quest X, Final Fantasy XIV or even Monster Hunter Stories would've been million sellers.
Having the name doesn't equal success, but a more western focus doesn't equal failure either.
Jon Carter
Member
I can't believe this is final. It's lazier than the Final Fantasy Explorers box art.
Skullwaker
Member
Woah, let's not get hasty here.
Eolz
Member
Need a "Konami best of DS" version: MonHun Switch for Nintendo Switch, best of Nintendo Switch, only on Nintendo Switch.
Why not just go with Occam's Razor that, maybe, Capcom's expectations are detached from reality?
Here, let me contextualize what it currently looks like for this FY for Capcom (and I was being very generous with sales on the titles that have effectively sold nothing by rounding up for weeks where they weren't even in the recorded top 50).
I welcome any comments with regards to my numbers/estimates but, well, the numbers speak for themselves, and I over-shot multiple upcoming entries rather self-evidently.
My only answer to their numbers is: No.
I welcome any comments with regards to my numbers/estimates but, well, the numbers speak for themselves, and I over-shot multiple upcoming entries rather self-evidently.
My only answer to their numbers is: No.
Jon Carter
Member
It's because they have yet to announce Gaist Crusher God: Nintendo Switch Ver.
There are some games missing (announced and unannounced). I think they can match the 2.75 million number but we'll see.
That's fair, but I am basing this on their own report where they had only MvCI and (now) MHW as up coming titles that they had planned for the FY with MHW being the "unannounced" title for the FY.
If plans have changed, then yes there will be more sales coming in from somewhere but I have no source of information on that at current. I suppose, I could have floated the rumor of a SSFV but, frankly, I consider that game beyond redemption given Capcom's rather capable effort in dismantling its own competitive scene.
Also if I forgot something already announced, please remind me so that I can add it!
Dragons Dogma remaster. Original game was really popular.
.....in what world?