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[Lifeline]

Obviously no one knows why Sony did it unless all the terms and negotiations behind this leak. But i'm gonna bet it's a little more complicated that Sony just being arrogant dicks.

So did Sony pull all rival video apps on the PS4 when vue launched? Hell they should pull the game then and refund everyone who bought it.

Sony published Minecraft on PS4, why would they remove it?

Spoitfy only became available on PSN after Sony's Music Unlimited was killed off. They've definitely done this before.

Sony makes Windows PCs. It's not like the two don't do business.

They're completely different departments. For example: Sony Movie tie in games appear on all console/PC.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

A Microsoft published game using a Microsoft service in Xbox Live asking for the support from a platform they have worked with on Minecraft so they can bring them a bigger, better experience is strong arming?

They're trying to get away from the 100 or so versions of Minecraft they have floating around and bring them all together under one umbrella. A requirement of that is crossplay.

Ok for some reason I read it more as a policy of how they want cross play in general to work rather than in this sole instance. That does make a lot more sense.

 

[boiled goose]

Finally a proper online account system on Nintendo hardware.

(This is weird)

 

[Mohasus]

Aww boy gotta get those Live MAU numbers up.

 

[quest]

Microsoft bought Mincecraft, right? Yup, Xbox login. Switch install base is smaller than Xbox install base, it benefits Nintendo. MS wants Sony to do it, since it benefits them seeing as the Xbox install base is half the size of Sony's.

Sony ain't taking that bait. Ain't nobody got time for that.

The combination of mobile w10 alone dwarfs the PS4 base for mine craft. Sony benefits big time from such a large community. They sell more dlc and copies if the game. Hell they might of been able to get a PSVR option with the new bedrock engine.

 

[Woo-Fu]

Sony already does by having Minecraft on playstation. It's a mS owned license available on their hardware.

They don't have a choice there, though, do they? If they want Minecraft they have to. Pretty sure the timing on that was a bit different too.

 

[The Pet of the Month]

But it says in the OP that Xbox Live is the network they're tying it together with. Would that not provide an artificial boost to their statistics having other systems rely on them?

If it opens cross platform DLC does that not push the sales through their network instead? Honestly it's very confusing without some actual explanation of how this would work

Technically it's Azure here, and uses a Microsoft Account to authorize access to the service.

DLC behaves the same way. Minecraft coins are purchased through the console's storefront, in which case can be used anywhere you go. Your money follows you.

Sony still makes money if a user purchases Minecraft coins from the PS4 storefront, and that money will follow them because it is attached to the Microsoft account, as well as any DLC in supported Bedrock Engine Minecraft titles.

 

[Jmille99]

We're talking about a Microsoft Account here. A generic account used for over a dozen common services that doesn't sell Xboxes on its own.

But does that count towards their MAU? The same numbers that MS uses to impress people since according to Phil the actual number of consoles sold is irrelevant.

If Microsoft is using MAU to boast their successes and use it as a talking point about why X1 is so great over PS, why would Sony as a company want to help boost those numbers?

I dont know if these logins actually do count. Let me get that out there for clarification. Its me playing Devils Advocate.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

But it says in the OP that Xbox Live is the network they're tying it together with. Would that not provide an artificial boost to their statistics having other systems rely on them?

I'm not sure what statistics making a Microsoft account provides an artificial boost to. It's not gonna affect XBL usage, because you're not signing into XBL to play on XBL, you're signing into your Microsoft account to authenticate entry into Minecraft servers. If those servers were running on an Xbox Live network, I still don't see how Microsoft leverages that statistical boost outside of Minecraft discussion.


I'll defer to you guys, though, because I don't know shit about how Microsoft uses their MAU data. Is MS's gaming-centric MAU data influenced by all Microsoft accounts across all services, or just the ones used on Xbox and Windows 10?

 

[Keinning]

Aww boy gotta get those Live MAU numbers up.

You tell them
I bet my kid would never want to be part of this shady corporate scheme to boost numbers even if it meant playing with his sister on her switch

Oh wait he doesnt give a shit

 

[Bsigg12]

Ok for some reason I read it more as a policy of how they want cross play in general to work rather than in this sole instance. That does make a lot more sense.

Oh ok. For Minecraft specifically they are using Live as the backbone because it's already in place between the mobile and PC versions and they're adding the Switch and Xbox to that.

The question about what is going on with crossplay falls into why they won't allow it with Rocket League since that is entirely handled by Psyonix.

 

[Trogdor1123]

This is absolutely not the reason, or if it is, it is not a better reason. If it were, then Sony would have said, "We don't want xbox branding on playstation". they instead went with the children excuse.

The only reason people think this is more reasonable is because their view of playing games has become irreparably twisted by a fictional blood feud that mainly exists in their heads. Consumers should not care.

Consumers do care and they should care. I have a significant amount of money invested in gaming and I want the system I chose to continue to be succesful so that money isn't wasted in the long term.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Technically it's Azure here, and uses a Microsoft Account to authorize access to the service.

DLC behaves the same way. Minecraft coins are purchased through the console's storefront, in which case can be used anywhere you go. Your money follows you.

Sony still makes money if a user purchases Minecraft coins from the PS4 storefront, and that money will follow them because it is attached to the Microsoft account, as well as any DLC in supported Bedrock Engine Minecraft titles.

Yeah that makes sense. I dunno why but I misinterpreted the first half of the OP as more of a general stance rather than in this instance alone. Makes perfect sense for Minecraft to work the way they plan to.

 

[m00h]

You want to play with your friends in other consoles/mobile? You can't with a PS4. You want to have the latest version of Minecraft with all the shiny new additions and updates? you can't with a PS4

Good job!

Who cares about the userbase of Xbox One or Nintendo Switch? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every console gamer nowdays owns a PS4. No one has friends on other consoles they want to play with

 

[Moneal]

why does everyone say "its not an XboX Live account its a Microsoft Account". In the Interview he says specifically that you sign into Xbox Live.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Oh ok. For Minecraft specifically they are using Live as the backbone because it's already in place between the mobile and PC versions and they're adding the Switch and Xbox to that.

The question about what is going on with crossplay falls into why they won't allow it with Rocket League since that is entirely handled by Psyonix.

Yeah there's definitely going to be heat on that issue. It's been in limbo for a long ass time on RL and the recent events are shining a spotlight on it. Sooner or later Sony will have to cave and either do it or at least give us some real reasons why they won't. IMO both scenarios end in them eventually caving anyway.

This issue certainly ain't gonna go back in the box.

 

[Bsigg12]

Who cares about the userbase of Xbox One or Nintendo Switch? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every console gamer nowdays owns a PS4.

Mobile and PC also fall into this. The Pocket edition has a huge amount of players that this update makes available to Switch and Xbox players and allows say a friend on their phone to hop into a game with a friend on one of those consoles.

why does everyone say "its not an XboX Live account its a Microsoft Account". In the Interview he says specifically that you sign into Xbox Live.

It's all the same. A Microsoft Account includes, Live, all the Office apps, and Groove.

 

[Trup1aya]

Wake me when MS allows PSN logins on Xbox

We would need a multiplat game from Sony in order for that to even be considered.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

Who cares about the userbase of Xbox One or Nintendo Switch? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every console gamer nowdays owns a PS4.

Minecraft is available on a shitload of platforms besides the Xbox One and Nintendo Switch. The PS4 was not Minecraft's leading platform to begin with, and with this update, MC's userbase on PS4 becomes the smallest contemporary Minecraft userbase, limited to playing PS4-sized worlds with up to 7 other PS4 owners, with the rest being combined into one large community that enjoys the benefits of cross-play dedicated servers that can play host to a thousand people.

Also, I know I'm just splitting hairs here, but PS4 is at what, 60 mil? 80 mil? Not quite every console gamer owns a PS4 yet, although its success cannot be understated.

 

[watdaeff4]

But does that count towards their MAU? The same numbers that MS uses to impress people since according to Phil the actual number of consoles sold is irrelevant.

If Microsoft is using MAU to boast their successes and use it as a talking point about why X1 is so great over PS, why would Sony as a company want to help boost those numbers?

I dont know if these logins actually do count. Let me get that out there for clarification. Its me playing Devils Advocate.

I'm going to guess they count because one of my friends plays FFXIV a LOT and on my friend list it always shows him doing so. He must be logged into his Live account for one reason or another while playing the game and I would be shocked if MS isn't counting this as MAU/playtime/etc

 

[Keinning]

Mobile and PC also fall into this. The Pocket edition has a huge amount of players that this update makes available to Switch and Xbox players and allows say a friend on their phone to hop into a game with a friend on one of those consoles.

Who cares about the userbase of mobile? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every person wanting to communicate with others use voice chat on PS4.

 

[The Artisan]

No offense but what you'd do is irrelevant to Sony. They care about your money like all businesses. Clearly, they've weighed their options and decided that this is the best course of action for their business. Again, unfortunately, you're not the primary focus. In fact, you aren't even in focus.

I am their consumer though...if they don't care about the people who give them money then who the fuck are they after?

They don't have a choice there, though, do they? If they want Minecraft they have to. Pretty sure the timing on that was a bit different too.

As someone pointed out, they had a choice with Minecraft Vita & Telltale Minecraft.

 

[zenspider]

Obviously. Aren't they using MS servers Azure?

Probably, but that's not why.

 

[The Pet of the Month]

Who cares about the userbase of Xbox One or Nintendo Switch? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every console gamer nowdays owns a PS4.

In 2015, Minecraft pocket edition surpassed 30 million units alone. The game wasn't free at the time, either. You can bet that number has grown.

Compared to that, the PS4, XOne, and Switch install bases for Minecraft might as well be a blimp in the breeze. I mean, since we care about big, tremendous numbers so much, right?

Get off your high horse.

https://mspoweruser.com/minecraft-pocket-edition-tops-30-million-paid-downloads/

 

[Purest 78]

So MS really though Sony would allow having to long into live from a ps4 Gtfo.

 

[Loonz]

Who cares about the userbase of Xbox One or Nintendo Switch? They are irrelevant compared to the PS4 userbase. Almost every console gamer nowdays owns a PS4.

Wow.

Sony, by not allowing crossplay with players from other platforms, even for games as important to the whole community as Minecraft, what's achieving is making it's own platform a bit less interesting and relevant. Needlessly so.

Who the hell wants to play in a walled community? I want to be able to play with as many people as possible. If my lifestyle meshes better with a mobile platform like the Switch or an iPad, why not allowing me to play with gamers using an Xbox or a PC that they prefer, if the game allows this? Or, God forbids, a PS4?

I just can't understand this stupidity and short-sightedness.

Shame for all of you defending this absolute bullshit. Sony needs to feel some fire lit under them to make them change their stance on this issue, the sooner the better.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

So MS really though Sony would allow having to long into live from a ps4 Gtfo.

Every other platform holder involved did, presumably because they see little to no issues in allowing people to log into a third party service inside of a video game once to enable supplementary platform-agnostic features, because it's not uncommon.

 

[m00h]

Minecraft is available on a shitload of platforms besides the Xbox One and Nintendo Switch. The PS4 was not Minecraft's leading platform to begin with, and with this update, MC's userbase on PS4 becomes the smallest contemporary Minecraft userbase, limited to playing PS4-sized worlds with up to 7 other PS4 owners, with the rest being combined into one large community that enjoys the benefits of cross-play dedicated servers that can play host to a thousand people.

Also, I know I'm just splitting hairs here, but PS4 is at what, 60 mil? 80 mil? Not quite every console gamer owns a PS4 yet, although its success cannot be understated.

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.
Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

Minecraft is from MS, I don't see the issue since it's using MS's online infrascturue. And of course you don't need to pay Live for this, you don't need it either for any Play-Anywhere title on PC.

 

[sonto340]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.
Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

They're isolated fixed communities because they have to have been until now.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.
Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

Explain to me how Sony enabling cross-play with Minecraft alone endangers their efforts to sell the PS4, keeping in mind that we're discussing just one game, one of the biggest out there.
Why aren't people going to buy a PS4 when Minecraft boasts cross-play?
Because they now don't have to buy what's still the most attractive platform on the market specifically to play one game with their friends and relatives? That's not real-world logic. I'd get it if we were talking right now about moving all games over to a cross play model, but we're not.
Conversely, without cross-play and the features it enables, very few people purchase Minecraft on PS4 moving forward. Every single version including mobile will be a much stronger value proposition than the PS4 version.
And so while Sony loses little besides a bit of goodwill and the future viability of their Minecraft version, they certainly don't gain anything from this decision.

And boy, does that bolded sentence miss the freakin' forest for the trees.

Minecraft players will care, because this move will unify formerly disparate communities (As well as allow communities to grow from the previously limited console versions to begin with) and that will grow Minecraft like never before. This move means that PC or Android or Xbox or whatever Minecraft player can play with whoever the hell they please on massive online servers backed by a web presence. This move means family and friends can play with one another without restrictions.

They're isolated fixed communities because they have to have been until now.

Seriously, that shit made me do a double-take. In a few months, those isolated fixed communities won't be so isolated and fixed.

 

[The Artisan]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.
Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

That's not entirely true; Sony would have the most up to date version of the game available by extension their user base would have it. And right now thats what they're losing. They wouldn't be losing potential customers in a any other scenario that they aren't already.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

Wake me when MS allows PSN logins on Xbox

If it's a Sony game using Sony's infrastrucutre, why not??

That... is actually a pretty legit reason why Sony wouldn't want cross play at least with Minecraft.

And no. It's not.

 

[The Pet of the Month]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.

I hear this parroted a lot, but there doesn't seem to be much merit to this belief. And unless your a heavy shareholder I don't see why you'd care.

Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

Java players are in their own walled gardens, yes, but their version is a very different code base and changing that would be suicidal.

There are thousands of players on the Windows Store version alone, and that version can be played on any device running Windows 10. It also supports cross play already. I think it's a big deal.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But again, Sony would gain nothing from taking part, they would only lose potential ps4 buyers. Sony not being a part of that big cross-play agglomeration won't push anyone getting an Xbox One instead of a PS4.
Also, I don't think that the majority of PC Minecraft player care too much about being able to play with someone on Xbox Live or on Android. Those are isolated, fixed communities, so it really isn't a big deal.

You're full of assumptions there. Very, very incorrect assumptions.

 

[m00h]

They're isolated fixed communities because they have to have been until now.

That's not the main reason obviously. Cross-platform multiplayer isn't a new idea invented by Microsoft or Psyonix. Yet there is not a single case where it actually had any significant imapct on the communities merging together.

You're full of assumptions there. Very, very incorrect assumptions.

This thread is based on assumptions only. And you can only decide for yourself if they sound either right or incorrect to you.

 

[The Artisan]

That's not the main reason obviously. Cross-platform multiplayer isn't a new idea invented by Microsoft or Psyonix. Yet there is not a single case where it actually had any significant imapct on the communities merging together.

if sony does cave and say yes, uniting Minecraft and Rocket League then it's going to be a really big deal.

 

[TheSpecialOne]

You're full of assumptions there. Very, very incorrect assumptions.

Please share the data you've obtained through research to refute his claims. You accuse others of making assumptions while your post is an assumption.

 

[tiredheadcrab]

I feel like the same points are being argued for cross play in every thread. I mean if everyone didnt know about this big update they sure as hell will in a few months when it releases.

Either way i see sony caving soon after E3. Perhaps just on Minecraft. Its too big for them to ignore.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

That's not the main reason obviously. Cross-platform multiplayer isn't a new idea invented by Microsoft or Psyonix. Yet there is not a single case where it actually had any significant imapct on the communities merging together.

Do yourself a favor and look into the Minecraft 'Better Together' update. It's going to have a massive impact moving forward on what Minecraft is and how it is played. To infer otherwise is tantamount to ignorance, to me.

Cross-play is less relevant where Rocket League is concerned. Pure crossplay across all platforms isn't going to change that game much, except matchmaking will always be solid, lol.

Minecraft on the other hand is a different situation entirely. Every platform besides PC is moving out of the 'lesser Minecraft' ghetto and receiving near total feature parity with the PC version. Mojang is providing four massive infinite-world persistent dedicated servers right out of the gate that will host players from every platform. If you don't think the ability to join huge MMO-like servers and take advantage of their full-fat online communities and web presence regardless of platform will change how Minecraft communities form and grow, then it makes me question how aware you are of Minecraft.

 

[The Artisan]

I feel like the same points are being argued for cross play in every thread. I mean if everyone didnt know about this big update they sure as hell will in a few months when it releases.

Either way i see sony caving soon after E3. Perhaps just on Minecraft. Its too big for them to ignore.

if they would cave for Minecraft then why not Rocket League / any other 3rd party software going forward?

 

[Oersted]

Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to be able to crossplay with every platform out there. But

Why are the sensible sentences always followed by a but. Just why.

 

[Panajev2001a]

My niece plays mine craft on her iPhone. She needed an Xbox login as well to access some features.

She didn't know what to do so I put her email address in and set it up for her. It's a simple system.

You see why Sony does not like to help MS acquire users and in a month or so facilitate MS sending Xbox promotional material to those same e-mail accounts, don’t you?

 

[The Artisan]

You see why Sony does not like to help MS acquire users and in a month or so facilitate MS sending Xbox promotional material to those same e-mail accounts, don’t you?

we are all on the consumer end of the video game market, why should we care?

 

[quest]

if they would cave for Minecraft then why not Rocket League / any other 3rd party software going forward?

Because mine craft is the biggest game out there. They will eventually cave or no PS5 version. Because MS is not making a special version for Sony going forward. Funny thing is they made other platforms more attractive to anyone who has mine craft as one of their favorite games.

 

[leeh]

You see why Sony does not like to help MS acquire users and in a month or so facilitate MS sending Xbox promotional material to those same e-mail accounts, don’t you?

Microsoft sending emails to their own accounts with promotional material, genius.

 

[Purest 78]

Every other platform holder involved did, presumably because they see little to no issues in allowing people to log into a third party service inside of a video game once to enable supplementary platform-agnostic features, because it's not uncommon.

Every Other console maker is trying to catch Sony and Ps4. The rules change when you're at the top as it should.

If roles were reversed You really think MS would be Pushing Crossplay? Absolutely not In fact the were heavily against Crossplay with 360 and the beginning of this gen. They didn't allow it with Final Fantasy Reborn which is why it was ps4 exclusive.

 

[m00h]

Why are the sensible sentences always followed by a but. Just why.

Because one may be wishful thinking, and the other may be the uncomfortable reality.

Microsoft sending emails to their own accounts with promotional material, genius.

Microsoft sending promotional emails to the email-adresses of PS4 owners. Probably to the same emails where their PSN accounts are registered to.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

Every Other console maker is trying to catch Sony and Ps4.

Yeah, Google and Apple sure are feeling Sony's burn, that's why they agreed to this.

 

[The Artisan]

Because mine craft is the biggest game out there. They will eventually cave or no PS5 version. Because MS is not making a special version for Sony going forward. Funny thing is they made other platforms more attractive to anyone who has mine craft as one of their favorite games.

Rocket League is one of the most popular indie games. While I cannot confirm this, I believe it is the most popular, at least this gen. If Sony caves for the biggest game, why not allow it for all the other games?