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[orioto]

Not sure. Pulled it from an article on how to get DOOM to run on a i7+Nvidia GPU Surface Book.


Getting to a playable 60fps at 720p/Low Settings required a 950m which has 640 shader cores, 914MHz(1124MHz boost) core, and 4GB 128-bit memory @ 1800MHz.

DOOM on a handheld @ 60fps would be godly even at low settings. I'd love if you're right and I'm just being pessimistic.

From that pic you can literally count pixels it's like 3ds resolution lol

 

[big_erk]

What other major gaming handheld device even has TV Out let alone alters the resolution of games on the fly when hooked up to a TV?

As well as featuring removable controllers and compatibility with external controllers.

 

[Skittzo0413]

Not sure. Pulled it from an article on how to get DOOM to run on a i7+Nvidia GPU Surface Book.

I'm assuming that's the 940M version, not the i7 Surface sporting the 965M.

Getting to a playable 60fps at 720p/Low Settings required a 950m which has 640 shader cores, 914MHz(1124MHz boost) core, and 4GB 128-bit memory @ 1800MHz.

DOOM on a handheld @ 60fps would be godly even at low settings. I'd love if you're right and I'm just being pessimistic.

I'm running it with a GTX 860m (640 cores at 1029MHz) and getting a consistent ~45fps at medium settings and 1080p... Even though everything is saying I'm below the minimum specifications. With proper optimizations on Switch I'm sure they can get it running decently at medium-low settings.

 

[lwilliams3]

Who would actually like to play a multiplatform game on the switch, when it looks and runs way better on the other consoles.

To be able to play your game anyplace, anytime, and get to play an enhanced version docked sounds like a good double-pack to me.

 

[CrustyBritches]

I'm running it with a GTX 860m (640 cores at 1029MHz) and getting a consistent ~45fps at medium settings and 1080p... Even though everything is saying I'm below the minimum specifications. With proper optimizations on Switch I'm sure they can get it running decently at medium-low settings.

Your 860M is rated for ~1.3TFLOPS and has up to 4GB 128-bit GDDR5. It can score 215k Ice Storm Unlimited graphics score. The 840M hits 119k graphics score. The Shield TV pulls in at 61k graphics score(Note: This is most likely lower than it should be due to Android optimization. Should be around 75k).

DOOM notebook benchmark:

 

[saskuatch]

unless the switch has some sort of secret sauce. At 400 TF, only 4gb ram, low clocked cpu, very low memory bandwidth it is not getting any modern games from this console generation unless they look like dog turds. There will probably be a lot of last gen ports

 

[EloquentM]

I skipped 7 pages because...well you know... any new developments?

 

[antonz]

unless the switch has some sort of secret sauce. At 400 TF, only 4gb ram, low clocked cpu, very low memory bandwidth it is not getting any modern games from this console generation unless they look like dog turds. There will probably be a lot of last gen ports

Its not about selling Current Gen Games at Max. Yeah ports of Current Gen games will likely look decidedly closer to last gen but they are not trying to sell you the game if you already have a PS4 or PC or XBO. They are selling it to people who want it on the switch and know what they are getting.

Its like people whining Witcher 3 didn't get a PS4 Pro patch. If you want the best version then buy a PC otherwise enjoy the version you have. Switch owners will know going in most multiplatform games will be developed as not lead platform and have sacrifices. For some games that may be deal breaker for others the idea of playing on the go etc. may be too much to pass up.

 

[n0razi]

Its not about selling Current Gen Games at Max. Yeah ports of Current Gen games will likely look decidedly closer to last gen but they are not trying to sell you the game if you already have a PS4 or PC or XBO. They are selling it to people who want it on the switch and know what they are getting.

Its like people whining Witcher 3 didn't get a PS4 Pro patch. If you want the best version then buy a PC otherwise enjoy the version you have. Switch owners will know going in most multiplatform games will be developed as not lead platform and have sacrifices. For some games that may be deal breaker for others the idea of playing on the go etc. may be too much to pass up.

Playing demanding games Xenoblade 3DS and MGS 3DS made me realize that I would rather not play a game than on insufficient hardware

 

[nubbe]

I skipped 7 pages because...well you know... any new developments?

just talk how much Switch will flop

 

[saskuatch]

Its not about selling Current Gen Games at Max. Yeah ports of Current Gen games will likely look decidedly closer to last gen but they are not trying to sell you the game if you already have a PS4 or PC or XBO. They are selling it to people who want it on the switch and know what they are getting.

Its like people whining Witcher 3 didn't get a PS4 Pro patch. If you want the best version then buy a PC otherwise enjoy the version you have. Switch owners will know going in most multiplatform games will be developed as not lead platform and have sacrifices. For some games that may be deal breaker for others the idea of playing on the go etc. may be too much to pass up.

unless the switch gets a huge install base within a year most companies will not take that risk/effort. The thing we should be looking for is them making games specifically for the switches audience should it gain ground.

 

[Doctre81]

Who would actually like to play a multiplatform game on the switch, when it looks and runs way better on the other consoles.

Same can be said about pc.

Anyway the answer is the option to play on the go and some people might not own those other systems. And also maybe lack of load times or installs.

 

[saskuatch]

if the switch could have decent ports of current gen games that would be amazing. I would love to play mass effect andromeda in bed.

 

[ggx2ac]

I skipped 7 pages because...well you know... any new developments?

We're exactly three weeks away from the January presentation.

 

[Skittzo0413]

if the switch could have decent ports of current gen games that would be amazing. I would love to play mass effect andromeda in bed.

Yep this is the dream. Hopefully that has big mass market appeal too.

 

[lwilliams3]

Playing demanding games Xenoblade 3DS and MGS 3DS made me realize that I would rather not play a game than on insufficient hardware

The 3DS has a 240p screen and nearly 40-50x weaker than the undocked Switch. I don't think the experience should be comparable.

 

[EloquentM]

just talk how much Switch will flop

thats why I skipped 7 pages 😩😩😩

We're exactly three weeks away from the January presentation.

Best news yet

 

[Smurfman256]

unless the switch has some sort of secret sauce. At 400 TF, only 4gb ram, low clocked cpu, very low memory bandwidth it is not getting any modern games from this console generation unless they look like dog turds. There will probably be a lot of last gen ports

might wanna check yer abbreviations, m8.

 

[saskuatch]

might wanna check yer abbreviations, m8.

sorry not used to referring graphical power in GF

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Guys who just want the switch but want games from other platforms.
Which achieves nothing for Nintendo.

Third party game sales seem like something for them.

 

[Anarky]

Who would actually like to play a multiplatform game on the switch, when it looks and runs way better on the other consoles.

You saying you wouldn't want to play Overwatch on the shitter?

 

[z0m3le]

Comparing switch to 3ds in terms of inferior ports just is a nonstarter, the biggest issue with 3ds besides the ancient hardware is 240p resolution and 4inch screen, we know what xenoblade x looked like on a 6.2 inch 480p screen that was streamed. Running natively on the portable @720p with 69% more gflop performance than Wii U is a very different situation.

Really while it might be a good deal weaker than current consoles, it is far more current architecture than said consoles, that would reflect in any ports that switch does receive.

 

[lwilliams3]

Except someone did his homework and it is competitive.

A customized ARM CPU not on windows which reserves power could easily pull that, regardless of console/pc would allow for that number.. However that won't be happening and it's downclocked. I've already stated I didn't expect downclocks. Yet be like others and forget I did nail what type of CPU it was going to end up with, though to be fair thraktor/blu were on the money once hints came out.

It's not just Thraktor/blu - sane gaffers have been saying ARMv8 made the most sense for NX way before there were any actual hints of what its CPU architecture was - we've been going over potential ARMv8 configurations in speculation threads for .. I dunno, since there were rumors of NX?

Re the Switch/ps4 juxtaposition, here's a very rudimentary one: https://browser.primatelabs.com/v4/cpu/compare/1398129?baseline=1396658

To see the DF picture, divide the left-side scores by 1.55. Let me help - first column is A57 @ 1.55GHz, second column - Jaguar @1.6GHz, third colum - first column / 1.55:

Single-Core Score       1304        967         841
AES                     945         916         610
LZMA                    1221        1191        788
JPEG                    1561        1177        1007
Canny                   1659        988         1070
Lua                     1173        799         757
Dijkstra                1416        1366        914
SQLite                  1206        751         778
HTML5 Parse             1381        902         891
HTML5 DOM               1259        819         812
Histogram Equalization  1697        1022        1095
PDF Rendering           1631        926         1052
LLVM                    1562        825         1008
Camera                  1700        1003        1097
SGEMM                   472         300         305
SFFT                    977         472         630
N-Body Physics          778         650         502
Ray Tracing             892         744         575
Rigid Body Physics      1424        977         919
HDR                     1743        1333        1125
Gaussian Blur           1284        813         828
Speech Recognition      964         1012        622
Face Detection          1355        861         874
Memory Copy             1399        1056        903
Memory Latency          1821        3459        1175
Memory Bandwidth        1312        647         846

Wow, no wonder there have no leaks of Switch dev being upset about the Switch's CPU. Even if they are clocked down, they are probably close to 60% of 6x Jaguars' performance that are used for gaming in the PS4. That is assuming that the Switch uses A57s with only minor customization.

 

[TunaLover]

What's the reason Wii U had a disabled core? If I recall correctly the chip had 4 cores configuration, could be the same happen with NS, if there's any reason to Nintendo disabling cores.

 

[z0m3le]

What's the reason Wii U had a disabled core? If I recall correctly the chip had 4 cores configuration, could be the same happen with NS, if there's any reason to Nintendo disabling cores.

No, wii u had a "ring" arrangement for the cpu, only 3 cores in expresso, disabled or not.

Edit: I don't think Nintendo has ever disabled cores, not even on their GPUs.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

It's not just Thraktor/blu - sane gaffers have been saying ARMv8 made the most sense for NX way before there were any actual hints of what its CPU architecture was - we've been going over potential ARMv8 configurations in speculation threads for .. I dunno, since there were rumors of NX?

Shit. I was rooting for ARM for the WiiU.

 

[antonz]

I guess the thing that comes to question now is it Jetson TX1 based or the normal X1. The Jetson TX1 cut the 4 A53 cpus etc.
Could see Nintendo taking advantage of the 4 A53 for OS and other operations and then when going into a game using the more powerful A57. That way all non gaming operations could be more power efficient etc. Though so far it seems like it may have gone the Jetson route

 

[z0m3le]

Shit. I was rooting for ARM for the WiiU.

A57 did release in 2012. If they had went with 4 A57 cores then, it would have been much easier to get ports. Who knows what the Wii U would have looked like if the team had just used co-processors for bc. Heck we know that A57 can emulate GameCube and Wii, so it might have just been VC for these platforms on Wii U.

There is always what ifs with these devices though, what if dreamcast released in 1998 (same year as oot) world wide instead of just in Japan and a year later in the West? What if N64 had a disc drive? Or GameCube had 32MB of 1tsram instead of 24MB, a left shoulder button and DVD support... What if Wii had a multicore processor and programmable shaders, even pulling 80gflops? That last one would have made a monster difference to the industry, if developers could have doubled their market size by downscaling to a modern yet weaker box? I think they absolutely would have done so.

Switch is the least offensive Nintendo device to come out since the Snes. That is pretty exciting imo.

 

[Hermii]

I guess the thing that comes to question now is it Jetson TX1 based or the normal X1. The Jetson TX1 cut the 4 A53 cpus etc.
Could see Nintendo taking advantage of the 4 A53 for OS and other operations and then when going into a game using the more powerful A57. That way all non gaming operations could be more power efficient etc. Though so far it seems like it may have gone the Jetson route

What about neither? After all its a custom chip.

 

[antonz]

What about neither? After all its a custom chip.

The data sheet given to developers apparently shows a pretty standard Jetson X1 so far that is significantly under clocked.

The Jetson X1 is after all a custom X1.

 

[Donnie]

Its not going to be just a downclocked jetson board, anyone who thinks it is must never have seen a single Nintendo console. At the absolute minimum it'll have CPU/GPU customisations in memory and feature set, Nintendo consoles always do.

 

[AzaK]

Who would actually like to play a multiplatform game on the switch, when it looks and runs way better on the other consoles.

Me, I don't really care about graphical fidelity so long as it's not garbage. The only first party games I really care about are from Nintendo as well. So for me a Nintendo machine that got all the third parties, even though it wasn't up to par with the others would be perfect.

 

[LCGeek]

unless the switch has some sort of secret sauce. At 400 TF, only 4gb ram, low clocked cpu, very low memory bandwidth it is not getting any modern games from this console generation unless they look like dog turds. There will probably be a lot of last gen ports

This isn't true, low spec gamer uses utterly ancient stuff and look at the results.

Notice what vulkan does?

If you don't like dog turds fine, but millions of consumers aren't really as picky as certain console gamers would like to argue. When something like minecraft or event GTA5 can dominate vs the current exceptional climate of heavy hitting graphical titles this argument needs to stop.

The priority will be what will nintendo realistically do to get 3rd parties involved. No point in putting this in a PM, but if Nvidia/AMd works with developers on games on PC I see no reason why nintendo as a platform holder can't grow up in this area when those two companies along with sony and ms do a pretty fucking bang up job. They should be getting ports up and running and if they don't have people who do better than some dude doing youtube videos or tweakers like myself they should be fired promptly. Shogmaster is right to ask for nintendo balls up and just say this is the ultimate portable.

You don't need magic sauce you just need to use vulkan and do a solid job on optimizing. Doom be it low spec machines or not using vulkan has some serious gains if we are talking performance.

 

[Oregano]

This is probably the level of port we can expect:

Spoiler

The Modern Warfare port was actually really well done. If everyone was on the level of Treyarch we'd have nothing to worry about for Switch.

 

[Roo]

This is probably the level of port we can expect:

Spoiler

The Modern Warfare port was actually really well done. If everyone was on the level of Treyarch we'd have nothing to worry about for Switch.

The power disparity between Switch and Xbox One isn't as big as the one between Wii and PS360 so.. no.

 

[Philippo]

3rd party games made specifically for the Switch >>> 3rd party multiplatform ports

i think the majority of those who own both a Nintendo console and at least one more play all their 3rd party games on that one, and this won't change with the Switch.

Let's only hope it sells well enough that it can play on its own strenghts and push devs to develop games specifically tailored for it.

 

[z0m3le]

The data sheet given to developers apparently shows a pretty standard Jetson X1 so far that is significantly under clocked.

The Jetson X1 is after all a custom X1.

Well technically the data sheet given to developers had significantly higher clocks. 2GHz for 4 A57 cores and a "MAX clock 1Ghz" for Switch.

 

[Oregano]

The power disparity between Switch and Xbox One isn't as big as the one between Wii and PS360 so.. no.

Pssstt check the spoiler. That's an infamously bad screenshot. The game looks good on the Wii.

 

[ShadowFox08]

This is probably the level of port we can expect:

Spoiler

The Modern Warfare port was actually really well done. If everyone was on the level of Treyarch we'd have nothing to worry about for Switch.

Wii was like 20x weaker than than 360/ps3. If eurogamer is right with two gpu cores, its going to be 40% of xbone1 in power.

The closet power analogies we can get imo is Wii U vs ps4 is analogous to Switch vs Scorpio. Which is roughly a 10x power disparity(counting switch architecture diff)

 

[Roo]

Pssstt check the spoiler. That's an infamously bad screenshot. The game looks good on the Wii.

I honestly can't tell who's being sarcastic and who is not in those threads but as you can already tell, the joke might fly over people's head.

 

[Oregano]

Wii was like 20x weaker than than 360/ps3. If eurogamer is right with two gpu cores, its going to be 40% of xbone1 in power.

That's true when docked but games have to take into account unlocked play where Switch will be like 15% of XBO's power.

We could compare Vita ports of PS3/360 games but that would be rough too.

 

[Oregano]

I honestly can't tell who's being sarcastic and who is not in those threads but as you can already tell, the joke might fly over people's head.

Yeah this is a more accurate portrayal

EDIT: blergh double post, sorry!

 

[Hermii]

Wii was like 20x weaker than than 360/ps3. If eurogamer is right with two gpu cores, its going to be 40% of xbone1 in power.

The closet power analogies we can get imo is Wii U vs ps4 is analogous to Switch vs Scorpio. Which is roughly a 10x power disparity(counting switch architecture diff)

Not just power, but gpu featureset will be equal or better on the switch and that was miles behind 360 ps3 on Wii and closer but still miles behind ps4 and xbox one on Wii U.

 

[z0m3le]

This is probably the level of port we can expect:

Spoiler

The Modern Warfare port was actually really well done. If everyone was on the level of Treyarch we'd have nothing to worry about for Switch.

It would be FAR more accurate to take a 360 vs XB1 comparison of the 2 or 3 CoD titles that came to both, then realize that even as a handheld, the Switch is about twice as powerful, with over 6x the available ram for better textures, along with the modern architecture's better effects.

This should be what the handheld is capable of, with room for much better textures and lighting:

The docked mode in UE4 seems to also increase settings from low to medium, so keep that in mind, that docked, the game is going to look better than the above.

 

[Rodin]

Are we really comparing the Switch-Xbone gap to the Wii-360 one? Ooohhh boy.

The comparison with Scorpio is useless as well. That's not the base for ports, it's a premium 4K machine that will use most of its power for the higher resolution with the vast majority of games.

The difference in multiplatform games should be less than Chaos Theory Xbox vs PS2. The difference in power is similar, but API/architecture are actually in favor of the Switch.

It would be FAR more accurate to take a 360 vs XB1 comparison of the 2 or 3 CoD titles that came to both, then release that even as a handheld, the Switch is about twice as powerful, with over 6x the available ram for better textures, along with the modern architecture's better effects.

It wouldn't be accurate either for the reasons you stated yourself. 360 is less powerful than Switch and has a huge disadvantage in terms of architecture and libraries compared to the One.

 

[z0m3le]

Are we really comparing the Switch-Xbone gap to the Wii-360 one? Ooohhh boy.

The comparison with Scorpio is useless as well. That's not the base for ports, it's a premium 4K machine that will use most of its power for the higher resolution with the vast majority of games.

The difference in multiplatform games should be less than Chaos Theory Xbox vs PS2. The difference in power is similar, but API/architecture are actually in favor of the Switch.


It wouldn't be accurate either for the reasons you stated yourself. 360 is less powerful than Switch and has a huge disadvantage in terms of architecture and libraries compared to the One.

I agree that it isn't accurate, as I said it would be far closer than Wii to 360, I'm only talking about the handheld version of Switch, docked it would be closer to PS4 vs PS4 Pro in terms of performance difference from Switch docked to XB1, there is no great analog, the closest I've found is HD 7650K, but this lacks VRAM so textures are too low from what we should expect.

 

[Oregano]

The original post was in jest but when you're talking about the cross gen CODs are you using the two which were made with last gen in mind or the one that cut the campaign altogether?

Developers aren't going to be taking Switch into consideration when designing games for XBO/PS4.

Vita to PS3/360 is the actual closest comparison anyway. Both are on paper around a tenth of the power of their respective console gen but have the benefit of being more modern.

 

[Rodin]

The original post was in jest but when you're talking about the cross gen CODs are you using the two which were made with last gen in mind or the one that cut the campaign altogether?

Developers aren't going to be taking Switch into consideration when designing games for XBO/PS4.

Vita to PS3/360 is the actual closest comparison anyway. Both are on paper around a tenth of the power of their respective console gen but have the benefit of being more modern.

Switch isn't 1/10 of Xbox One, it's 1/3, Maxwell isn't the same as PowerVR series 5 and the gap in CPU power is nowhere near as large. Again, PS2 vs Xbox if PS2 had comparable APIs and a better architecture is the closest comparison.

 

[Mr Swine]

I agree that it isn't accurate, as I said it would be far closer than Wii to 360, I'm only talking about the handheld version of Switch, docked it would be closer to PS4 vs PS4 Pro in terms of performance difference from Switch docked to XB1, there is no great analog, the closest I've found is HD 7650K, but this lacks VRAM so textures are too low from what we should expect.

Actually I don't think textures will be that much of a problem if developers use ASTC. They can manage to cram in more textures or higher resolution ones than with the over decade old S3TC.

 

[z0m3le]

The original post was in jest but when you're talking about the cross gen CODs are you using the two which were made with last gen in mind or the one that cut the campaign altogether?

Developers aren't going to be taking Switch into consideration when designing games for XBO/PS4.

Vita to PS3/360 is the actual closest comparison anyway. Both are on paper around a tenth of the power of their respective console gen but have the benefit of being more modern.

I think the CPU problem is not comparable at all. Also I'm not sure what last gen and current gen stuff has to do with anything. Witcher 3 is one of the best looking games you can find and was cross gen.

Actually I don't think textures will be that much of a problem if developers use ASTC. They can manage to cram in more textures or higher resolution ones than with the over decade old S3TC.

The RAM allocated for HD 7650K is only 1GB on the videos I found on youtube, Switch should be looking at up to ~2GB for the graphics card.