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Police kill unarmed black man in California.
- Thread starter Beefy
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Frozenprince
Banned
Depending on the pair I'm wearing I can probably fit one of my handguns in a cargo pocket. It'd stick out a little, I'm not exactly wide hipped or anything, but it'd fit.
finowns
Member
Loll. That video is crazy. I suppose I was thinking about bigger hand guns though.
Monster Zero
Junior Member
The worst part of this thread are the people who are OK with this man dying simply because there was a possibility that a cop could be harmed, it boggles the mind.
"God's Beard!"
Member
As it turns out, police are also people whose lives have value. It's unfortunate that this guy had a mental disability, but that doesn't mean what he did shouldn't have gotten him shot. Anybody who pulls a firing stance on a cop after ignoring their orders is gonna get shot. What boggles the mind is people acting like this dude wasn't clearly at fault in every conceivable way.
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";218436095]As it turns out, police are also people whose lives have value. It's unfortunate that this guy had a mental disability, but that doesn't mean what he did shouldn't have gotten him shot. Anybody who pulls a firing stance on a cop after ignoring their orders is gonna get shot. What boggles the mind is people acting like this dude wasn't clearly at fault in every conceivable way.
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, the cops were so far away, probably couldn't even see that it wasn't a gun. What are they, 4 feet away? It totally looks dark out. Can't be earlier than 3pm. I see one cloud.
You can't discount excessive force when 30-40 first world countries would pass this test easily.
Guy is less than 10 feet away and they can't tell what's in his hand? Maybe back away and deescalate?
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, the cops were so far away, probably couldn't even see that it wasn't a gun. What are they, 4 feet away? It totally looks dark out. Can't be earlier than 3pm. I see one cloud.
You can't discount excessive force when 30-40 first world countries would pass this test easily.
Guy is less than 10 feet away and they can't tell what's in his hand? Maybe back away and deescalate?
Monster Zero
Junior Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";218436095]As it turns out, police are also people whose lives have value. It's unfortunate that this guy had a mental disability, but that doesn't mean what he did shouldn't have gotten him shot. Anybody who pulls a firing stance on a cop after ignoring their orders is gonna get shot. What boggles the mind is people acting like this dude wasn't clearly at fault in every conceivable way.
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
The man died and you don't think that's excessive force?
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
The man died and you don't think that's excessive force?
"God's Beard!"
Member
Nope. If this was the exact same incident but he was holding a revolver nobody would have thought it was excessive force. But in reality the time they have to respond to someone holding a metal object with what appears to be a barrel pointed at them after behaving erratically and ignoring orders is so small that the difference is negligible.
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";218439545]Nope. If this was the exact same incident but he was holding a revolver nobody would have thought it was excessive force. But in reality the time they have to respond to someone holding a metal object with what appears to be a barrel pointed at them after behaving erratically and ignoring orders is so small that the difference is negligible.[/QUOTE]
http://abc7news.com/news/suspect-involved-in-civic-center-standoff-surrenders-to-sf-police-/1525268/
SFPD didn't kill the guy with the gun threatening people and himself. The gun he told them he had, and showed them.
El Cajon PD fucked up by approaching him if they feared for their lives or others.
http://abc7news.com/news/suspect-involved-in-civic-center-standoff-surrenders-to-sf-police-/1525268/
SFPD didn't kill the guy with the gun threatening people and himself. The gun he told them he had, and showed them.
El Cajon PD fucked up by approaching him if they feared for their lives or others.
https://twitter.com/AP/status/781242608010100737
BREAKING: Police in a San Diego suburb say an officer shot a mentally ill black man a minute after arriving at scene.
BREAKING: Police in a San Diego suburb say an officer shot a mentally ill black man a minute after arriving at scene.
Arms and legs are pretty small targets, even at a fairly close distance. Also, if the suspect is agitated, they'd be moving and waving their arms around, making them an even harder target. Officers are trained to shoot center mass, because that's the largest part of the target to hit. Unfortunately, that's also where all of our fragile internal organs are located, increasing the chances of dying if you're shot there.
I don't see why beanbag guns can't be deployed more often, and the officer resorting to his/her firearm being an absolute last resort. From what I've heard, beanbag rounds pack a punch.
David H Wong
Banned
He very much appeared to be armed. In the shoes of the police officers, I'm thinking you would have shot, too. Very easy to say otherwise from the safety of a keyboard.
Frozenprince
Banned
Here's a novel concept.
Don't just jump to lethal force as a response to perceived danger.
Thinking untrained civilians serves as a fair comparison to police officers is pretty telling how low expectations are for police competency. Also, the police are the ones who escalated the situation. Seems they didn't care too much about whether they killed the man or not.
They certainly didn't care enough to see if the man actually had a gun.
Frozenprince
Banned
Is it right to expect a peace officer to be a mental health expert? No. But given that "suicide by cop" has become such a societal staple in the US that we have a god damn name for it to immediately jump too? Beat cops should absolutely receive training to handle these situations and de-escalate, not kill the guy and scar his family, themselves, their reputation, and their department.
Yes, America needs better standards for mental health care, no, it's not the polices issue to fix.
But unfortunately, one is preventable more often than not, and the other isn't going to change for a long time.
Yes, America needs better standards for mental health care, no, it's not the polices issue to fix.
But unfortunately, one is preventable more often than not, and the other isn't going to change for a long time.
Thebeardofknowledge
Banned
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";218436095]As it turns out, police are also people whose lives have value. It's unfortunate that this guy had a mental disability, but that doesn't mean what he did shouldn't have gotten him shot. Anybody who pulls a firing stance on a cop after ignoring their orders is gonna get shot. What boggles the mind is people acting like this dude wasn't clearly at fault in every conceivable way.
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
They where close enough to know if he had a weapon or not
Get the fuck out of here with that bullshit
The fact that there is apparently a protest is shocking. This incident has nothing to do with racial bias or excessive force. It's just some dude that happened to die after threatening an officer.[/QUOTE]
They where close enough to know if he had a weapon or not
Get the fuck out of here with that bullshit
Danis Saur
Member
Ah fuck thats near me... Welp, it was bound to happen, I never thought it would happen near me.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Shooting to disarm isn't something that exists. Anywhere. Period.
Even if you do shoot someone in the arm, it's neither guaranteed to stop someone from shooting you OR be a non-lethal action.
Damerman
Member
This just keeps happening and happening... what the fuck?
Agent_ShortBus
Member
I live in El Cajon, I was wondering why it took a lot longer to get to work this afternoon. I really wanted to become a cop after highschool, even went as far as volunteering and going through the junior academy for three years. Unfortunately I had some financial and family issues so I had to drop it completely. Now I'm finally back on track and ready to try and apply for the local police department but all these stories have me thinking if it's something I still want to do. I originally wanted to become someone who gave back to the community I grew up in by helping keeping it safe but now a days most people see them as bad guys and it's been off putting. I still think I'm gonna at least try this coming year to apply. Sad stuff all around I guess.
Frozenprince
Banned
Apart from when they're slamming teenage girls on the ground do US cops ever actually try to physically restrain people? Do they even try? Seems like anyone not complying is simply shot. (EDIT: and shoot to kill rather than shoot to disable). Police forces in other countries would try to get physically involved but US cops are always too terrified of being shot that they shoot first. Seems pretty pathetic to me. Bizarre they have tasers as well and don't use them for their intended purpose.
And just a few weeks ago a fucking terrorist blew up multiple explosives, shot a cop at point blank range, and ran from the cops.
Captured alive.
Unarmed black man.
Killed.
Essentially an unarmed black man is more dangerous than an armed terrorist and an armed mass shooter.
Has anything changed here or did he in fact dig into his pocket and bring the motion like he had a firearm? If not this is 100% suicide by cop. He needed treatment before this happened, but nah. From my understanding as a white male, people of color are incapable of mental illness.
D1renegade
Member
We need snipers with tranquilizers or something
Good idea. Maybe that will finally stop the cops.
gamechanger87
Member
If you pull something out of you pants and point it at a cop, you will be shot. I know this is a video game forum, but I swear there are a lot of people who have played way too many video games or watched way too many movies to understand just how fast this tuff happens. By the time you process whether or not they have a gun you have already been shot.
Also, I can't believe people are actually saying that the officers should just let themselves get shot because the have a vest.
Whether it was intentional or not, this is suicide by cop. The taser cop was movIng in slowly to use the taser and when he got close the guy pulled his hand out and turned and aimed something.
I won't post any of the actual police shooting videos but here is a video of a BLM protester undergoing these unknown scenarios. Watch this and rethink how quickly you could react.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WRHCAUpdAc4
Yep, like a wallet you were told by the cops to take out.
Do you guys ever stop making excuses for the police? (lol no)
Danis Saur
Member
Sorry if this has been posted already, but this guy is doing a great coverage, livestream:
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/inlea...&utm_medium=social&utm_content=20160928205116
Says that protesters were ready to leave until more cops and people came, so it will continue tonight. Very full of people and police.
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/inlea...&utm_medium=social&utm_content=20160928205116
Says that protesters were ready to leave until more cops and people came, so it will continue tonight. Very full of people and police.
AlteredBeast
Fork 'em, Sparky!
Excellent video and the conclusions drawn by the guy are accurate. Total compliance is of utmost importance to your safety.
What shouldn't be an issue, however, is pokice shooting people with their hands in the air, or totally complying with their demands, or someone running, or etc.
That is where myself, and everyone else thinking rationally gets depressed abd pissed off.
gamechanger87
Member
If they ask you for your wallet, you are supposed to tell them you are getting it out of your pocket. Kind of common sense no?
So what would you have done in this exact situation if you were to police? He pulled something out and pointed it at you.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
Apparently they shot him and missed his torso. That guy just got lucky the cops couldn't aim.
That we constantly feel the need to compare untrained people to those who are is part of the problem, no?
If my answer as an untrained civilian is the same as a cop's, that says a whole lot to me.
gamechanger87
Member
I'm more speaking to the people who don't understand how fluid a situation may be and believe that humans have some supernatural power to slow down time and understand whether or not a gun is pointed at you. Or that a bullet proof vest is a viable reason to take a bullet because we all know how officers wear full body Kevlar.
gamechanger87
Member
Yeah they were trying to kill him and missed. They hit his shoulder and he went down. He had already shot two cops by that point.
out0v0rder
Member
Wow, shame on some of you.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
They're trained to quickly react to someone going into a shooting stance. This guy's chances were better with an armed untrained civilian.
Danis Saur
Member
The police were backing away right now and some dumbasses started to throw water bottles at them; thankfully the other protesters stopped them.
That "common sense" didn't save Philando Castile.
Probably use the taser instead of going right for the kill.
Leg shots can be just as lethal. Shooting to disarm or disable is Hollywood nonsense. It has only worked in a few situations. Your accuracy, even in a very well trained individual, goes out the window when your body responds to stress.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Shooting to disable aside warning shots actually do exist in multiple european countries.
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