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[Salsa]

Im expecting history to repeat itself, only with Sony being a bit more competent considering they had time to learn the handheld business some more.

By history i mean, everyone surprised with the Sony handheld, saying that by being more powerful and all that is going to crush the 3DS, that the 3DS is a kiddie's machine etc etc, and then the 3DS being the more succesfull one due to better, more handheld-suited software.

It'll be interesting though since now the PSVita also has an interesting new feature (the back touch-pad) that could result in some never before seen gameplay experience, we'll need to see if they put it to good use or if it becomes just a gimmick.

 

[Chuck Norris]

Like I said, Uncharted Vita does look lifeless, and pales in comparison to Uncharted 3 which will be out around the same time.

It would be amazing if Vita's Uncharted had as much polish, cinematography, humor, and production values comparable to Uncharted 3.

It is written by Amy Henig and has the same use of motion capture, I don't think humour and polish will be lacking

 

[kuroshiki]

No, it is a matter of 45nm vs 22nm. When you shrink the die, you improve battery life, reduce size and decrease production cost. Those are all key factors into whether it's worth it to make it into a smartphone or not.

The Xperia play has space for dual analog pads. No reason the Vita phone cant use the same design, but possibly make the pads into nubs.

AT&T pays Apple $400 for every iPhone they sell, due to the 2 year contract people sign.

Sony could sell the Vita phone for $99 and get $499 for each Vita phone they sell. They could make a very substantial profit on hardware, at the same time getting the device into more households, and selling more software.

They would be stupid not to do it at that point.

No one wants to buy a phone these days that does not have app market.

VITA and its software library will never merge with android market, because android OS is basically means opening its gate for piracy.

The only reason why Sony wants to do make PSVITA as a phone is when PSVITA utterly failed and there is no way to recuperate its initial investment.

PSVITA has been created with gamers in mind from the ground up. It sacrificed portability for gaming. Phone on the other hand is gearing toward exactly opposite direction. It also features lower API access to developers for full hardware capability access which android OS never will be able to do so because it uses virtual system.

Not to mention Xperia play's dual nub is a joke. It's never meant to be a proper control input for serious games.

 

[kuroshiki]

Im expecting history to repeat itself, only with Sony being a bit more competent considering they had time to learn the handheld business some more.

By history i mean, everyone surprised with the Sony handheld, saying that by being more powerful and all that is going to crush the 3DS, that the 3DS is a kiddie's machine etc etc, and then the 3DS being the more succesfull one due to better, more handheld-suited software.

It'll be interesting though since now the PSVita also has an interesting new feature (the back touch-pad) that could result in some never before seen gameplay experience, we'll need to see if they put it to good use or if it becomes just a gimmick.

If sony can copy 70million unit sold achievement this gen, they will be EXTREMELY happy. I don't think 3DS will be that stellar seller this time.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

Ack, well I think you're wrong back.

Imagine if the PS3 had one analog stick, will you?

The software was bad because the developers had no solution.

Exactly. The lack of second analog nub was a huge crippling flaw for the types of games the PSP was centered around, console style games.

People simply didn't want to play console style shooters and action games using one nub.

 

[Sianos]

Anyone have some good DS vs. PSP threads of yore? I've found a couple but nothing good.

It'd be interesting to see the intial predictions and compare them to now.

 

[MrMephistoX]

3DS and Vita compared to Wii and 360 seems perfectly apt to me.

Same here but Uncharted vs Twilight Princess ( just go with the massive dungeon and traversal theme) is a more apt comparison.

 

[Apath]

Anyone have some good DS vs. PSP threads of yore? I've found a couple but nothing good.

It'd be interesting to see the intial predictions and compare them to now.

I think it would be mostly novel, since it's pretty obvious that the PSP was a tech-lovers wet dream. I find it much more interesting to compare and contrast the advantages/disadvantages the DS and PSP had in relation to one another, and how both companies have learned/ignored those mistakes/advantages, as well as the effects of these.

 

[Your Excellency]

You cannot beat Mario, Luigi's Mansion, Kid Icarus, and Mario Kart.

So a shitload of ports?


Honestly, I've played all of those games about 30 times over. Enough.

 

[distrbnce]

Anyone have some good DS vs. PSP threads of yore? I've found a couple but nothing good.

It'd be interesting to see the intial predictions and compare them to now.

I don't think it'll be that directly comparable.

Consider that during that time, both handhelds were launching less than 2 weeks apart. It was complete speculation as to how they would tear out of the gates.

At this point though, 3DS is already out, and 'performing', and we have well over 6 months before the new, graphically (big deal on store shelves) superior toy will be launching.

 

[60_gig_PS3]

I think people who like the DS will go 3DS people who like PSP will go Vita. Nothing really changed.

The 3D gimmick might bring some more people over to Nintendo's side.

 

[Apath]

I don't think it'll be that directly comparable.

Consider that during that time, both handhelds were launching less than 2 weeks apart. It was complete speculation as to how they would tear out of the gates.

At this point though, 3DS is already out, and 'performing', and we have well over 6 months before the new, graphically (big deal on store shelves) superior toy will be launching.

I'd say the difference, graphics wise, between the 3DS and the Vita is insignificant when you compare the two console's control methods and feature sets. Having two analogue sticks is huge.

I think people who like the DS will go 3DS people who like PSP will go Vita. Nothing really changed.

The 3D gimmick might bring some more people over to Nintendo's side.

Except now the PSP is the one with all the advantages? Before the DS had its touch screen. Now the Vita has it and then some. The DS has gained an analogue nub, but that wasn't exactly great on the PSP. Now the PSP has two sticks.

We're also talking same price, no UMD drive, and a full fledged online system (speculating) for the PSP.

 

[corporate cheerleader]

Ps2 had wipeout and Gc had pokemon.

N64 had both Wipeout AND Pokémon.

 

[Snuggles]

Hmm. I plan on getting one or the other within the next year, but I'm still undecided. Clearly the Vita has the tech advantage. There is no question about it. Price seems pretty equal between the two, although the 3DS will probably be a notch cheaper once I'm ready to buy it.

The big decider will be the software library, and what it adds to what I already have. Maybe this is a misconception, since I've never owned a PSP, but I've always got the impression that it's like a tiny, portable console. I can already play LBP2, Uncharted, Wipeout and so on. I like those series but I already get my fill of them on PS3. On the other hand, I won't own a Nintendo console until the U is out and so the 3DS library seems to add more to what I already have (PC, PS3). Plus, I like both of their games but I probably lean a bit more towards Nintendo's first party franchises.

Tough choice but I guess I have a while to stink it over.

 

[Freezie KO]

So a shitload of ports?

I thought they did a really good job porting Kid Icarus though.

 

[StuBurns]

Those GC pokemon games were crap. If Nintendo ever releases a real pokemon game on a home system, we'll know the end is near.

 

[SmokedMeat]

The notion that the DS and 3DS is designed for children is complete bullshit. I heard the same thing about the Wii. Just like wii and ds, the 3ds is marketed to EVERYONE. It's always been that way.

I don't know of a single kid that doesn't own a DS. I also don't know a single adult that owns a DS, nor have I ever spotted an adult playing one in public.
Face it, some adults enjoy products that are designed for kids. I'm sure adult Hot Wheels collectors claim "they're for everyone" as well.

 

[syoaran]

I skipped the 3DS launch and am so glad I did so. Now that Vita has been shown, and the price has been announced I no longer care to own a 3DS.
Unless the Vita turns into pirate heaven the way PSP has been, Sony should really give Nintendo a run for their money.
Shit, a far more impressive system, for the same amount of money? Sony deserves to take a bigger hunk out of Nintendo's pie.

These types of post I don't understand. So an equal price point means that the software exclusive to the 3DS no longer matters to you? If that software wasn't interesting, then why even consider buying a 3DS in the first place?

 

[Father_Brain]

So a shitload of ports?


Honestly, I've played all of those games about 30 times over. Enough.

...not one of those four games is a port.

 

[tzare]

Im expecting history to repeat itself, only with Sony being a bit more competent considering they had time to learn the handheld business some more.

By history i mean, everyone surprised with the Sony handheld, saying that by being more powerful and all that is going to crush the 3DS, that the 3DS is a kiddie's machine etc etc, and then the 3DS being the more succesfull one due to better, more handheld-suited software.

It'll be interesting though since now the PSVita also has an interesting new feature (the back touch-pad) that could result in some never before seen gameplay experience, we'll need to see if they put it to good use or if it becomes just a gimmick.

until sony put a price to vita, showed its features and real games on it and 3ds was launched, it was 3ds(and apple) that was going to crush whatever sony delivered. Now things look better for sony as they seem to learn from mistakes and give what many people asked for. of course nintendo still has the edge , mario, pokemon give them some million sales almost for granted. Sony has to work hard for every unit they want to sell.

 

[Chuck Norris]

The fantastic sales of GTA, MGS, GT, God of War etc. were assumed for PSP. I don't think we can assume anything, a lot of these Nintendo franchises have done well on systems that haven't sold amazingly (Gamecube). I think DS's popularity and its games increased popularity were a reciprocal relationship, but the kick off point was caused by new experiences with Nintendogs and Brain Training. I just don't see that equivelant on 3DS (or Vita for that matter)

 

[Pirabear]

N64 had both Wipeout AND Pokémon.

N64 is going to win the handheld wars confirmed.

 

[f@luS]

i don't think the gap is that big,when you compare stuff like SSF4 vs SFVSTekken and resident evil R vs uncharted ga.

i think it closer to ps2 to xbox gap but bigger.

lol people saying gamecube to xbox, barely even had gap between them

it is
vita is as less powerfull to x360 than 3DS is at WII.. easily

Street 4 as 2D background.... but god uncharted stomp on Resident evil night and day dude

 

[Codeblue]

I thought they did a really good job porting Kid Icarus though.

Yeah but the Uncharted port for Vita is looking pretty good too.

 

[Alrus]

So a shitload of ports?


Honestly, I've played all of those games about 30 times over. Enough.

So you played Kid Icarus and Luigi Mansion 30 times over? Get out.

 

[btkadams]

N64 is going to win the handheld wars confirmed.

i've been saying this for months! yessss

 

[Codeblue]

So a shitload of ports?


Honestly, I've played all of those games about 30 times over. Enough.

Ok, either you mind sequels or you don't.

You are either saying one of the following:

A. You think those are all literally ports, meaning you are misinformed.

B. You think those games are rehashes, to which I respond that we have seen:

Three Kid Icarus Games in 24 years.
Two Luigi's Mansion games in 10 years.
Seven Mario Kart games (Nine if you count arcade) in 19 years.
Five 3D Mario platformers in 15 years.

Now we've seen 4 Uncharted games in 4 years.

You can't discredit the 3DS lineup without simultaneously discrediting everyone else.

 

[Akainu]

My theory is that Sony still hasn't designed a portable that parents would generally feel comfortable getting for a kid - like the 3DS, it's still a lot of money, only with the Vita the platform screams delicate. And unlike, say, an iPhone or something it doesn't have the vast applications outside of gaming that might allow a kid to persuade a parent that it's an investment worth their time.

My theory is parent say to themselves, "Hey isn't that the thing with mario and pokeman on it? That seems to be popular these days." These are probably the same people that buy they kids iphones.

 

[Special J]

vita's design is too refined, just like the DS it wasnt till the DS lite redesign when the system really took off.

3DS is kinda a shitty looking device even the colors are kinda silly, i can see them inevitably releasing a redesigned 3DS with better lines and lower cost and that second wind will make them uncatchable. i feel like vita will only be bought by psp or ps3 loyalists because honestly those console experiences arent that much fun on a handheld. and its why peacewalker was completely redesigned so it worked for short session gaming.

 

[Chuck Norris]

vita's design is too refined, just like the DS it wasnt till the DS lite redesign when the system really took off.

3DS is kinda a shitty looking device even the colors are kinda silly, i can see them inevitably releasing a redesigned 3DS with better lines and lower cost and that second wind will make them uncatchable. i feel like vita will only be bought by psp or ps3 loyalists because honestly those console experiences arent that much fun on a handheld. and its why peacewalker was completely redesigned so it worked for short session gaming.

3DS looks better than DS Lite

What exactly are they supposed to change?

 

[btkadams]

vita's design is too refined, just like the DS it wasnt till the DS lite redesign when the system really took off.

3DS is kinda a shitty looking device even the colors are kinda silly, i can see them inevitably releasing a redesigned 3DS with better lines and lower cost and that second wind will make them uncatchable. i feel like vita will only be bought by psp or ps3 loyalists because honestly those console experiences arent that much fun on a handheld. and its why peacewalker was completely redesigned so it worked for short session gaming.

what do you mean by "too refined?"

 

[Apath]

3DS looks better than DS Lite

What exactly are they supposed to change?

When I look at the 3DS, it just screams inevitable Lite version.

what do you mean by "too refined?"

Maybe he means it's as elegant as the design can get? Like how the Nintendo DS looked much better through its Lite and i variants. The PSP just got thinner. That's what I assume he means at least.

 

[Special J]

^i dont know why that was so hard to understand for some :/

the 3DS actually has alot of things it can improve on, one flaw which scratches the top screen, the bottom screen protrudes out too much, odd choice of buttons under the screen, quite thick for a portable which doesnt fit well into pockets and edges are angled which make it look like a cheap toy (lines should be more flush not to accentuate weird shapes), and the battery life is subpar

heres a profile view to show kinda how ugly the 3ds is
http://sickr.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/3ds_red_side.jpg

theres alot of room for improvement, and even tho i really wanna buy the 3DS now i know that the redesign is going to significant

 

[Chuck Norris]

When I look at the 3DS, it just screams inevitable Lite version.

Maybe he means it's as elegant as the design can get? Like how the Nintendo DS looked much better through its Lite and i variants. The PSP just got thinner. That's what I assume he means at least.

There is nothing particularly bulky about it though? What are they supposed to change

 

[TheDrowningMan]

Well, at the moment there's no question that the 3DS has the fresher, more substantial software en route, but it remains to be seen if that continues into the future. I can't say that Uncharted strikes me as something I would really care to play on a handheld, yet my head has been turned by the new Sony handheld (forgive me if it takes a little bit longer to call it by its dire name), just as it was with PSP, in spite of that system ending up barely played next to the relatively dated looking DS.

 

[Apath]

There is nothing particularly bulky about it though? What are they supposed to change

To me it looks like a three layered sandwich. I say meld the bottom two layers and even out the top layer so it becomes one smooth box.

 

[Vanillalite]

Well, at the moment there's no question that the 3DS has the fresher, more substantial software en route, but it remains to be seen if that continues into the future. I can't say that Uncharted strikes me as something I would really care to play on a handheld, yet my head has been turned by the new Sony handheld (forgive me if it takes a little bit longer to call it by its dire name), just as it was with PSP, in spite of that system ending up barely played next to the relatively dated looking DS.

If you read through this thread it seems there IS a question on just that very thing.

 

[Chuck Norris]

To me it looks like a three layered sandwich. I say meld the bottom two layers and even out the top layer so it becomes one smooth box.

That's the big change to win the market?

eh

 

[Apath]

That's the big change to win the market?

eh

I never said that. I just agree that the design isn't as elegant as it can get.

 

[Chuck Norris]

I never said that. I just agree that the design isn't as elegant as it can get.

DS Phat was ugly as sin, the change was substantial. I can't see Nintendo deviating heavily from what they have now, besides maybe little tweaks as you mentioned

 

[KaYotiX]

Still all about the games.

Oh and if SONY makes the storage overpriced for the PSV, ill say "fuck off" and not bother.

 

[TheDrowningMan]

If you read through this thread it seems there IS a question on just that very thing.

There's not really though. Most of the PlayStation games have been far more 'done' with machine-gun speed in recent years. People confuse the cross-pollonation of Nintendo characters with quick fire sequels of every game, when in reality they arrive at a much more conservative rate than most. Something like Mario Kart isn't really a constant rehash in the grand scheme of things. It's not a Little Big Planet or God Of War, something they churn out almost every single year in one form or another.

I think, obviously, that some people won't care for Nintendo games while loving as much as they can get of Sony's offerings and vice versa, which is entirely valid and not really something which can be argued. I like both, my only trepidation lies with the fact that I ended up not really getting into the PSP's place as a cut-down PS2.

 

[Special J]

That's the big change to win the market?

eh

ya it would be part of the scheme if 3DS wants a big second wind like it got with the DSlite, and i can see that happening.

hell its worked twice already with the ps3 slim redesign which practically saved the console and 360 slim also saw big growth with very strong sales in america.

Still all about the games.

Oh and if SONY makes the storage overpriced for the PSV, ill say "fuck off" and not bother.

proprietary memory cards, get raped.

 

[Xilium]

Ok, either you mind sequels or you don't.

You are either saying one of the following:

A. You think those are all literally ports, meaning you are misinformed.

B. You think those games are rehashes, to which I respond that we have seen:

Three Kid Icarus Games in 24 years.
Two Luigi's Mansion games in 10 years.
Seven Mario Kart games (Nine if you count arcade) in 19 years.
Five 3D Mario platformers in 15 years.

Now we've seen 4 Uncharted games in 4 years.

You can't discredit the 3DS lineup without simultaneously discrediting everyone else.

He's probably like me and just doesn't like Nintendo first-party franchises (though he should have just said that).

Outside of those first-party franchises I would assume that the Vita will be getting the bulk majority of 3rd-party games that I would actually care about in some form. The 3D is already optional and if the DS was any indication, the second screen will just be used as a menu/map/stat/inventory screen. So those games can just as easily be made for the Vita and will most likely look and play better on it.

That said, the 3DS will obviously win out simply due to parents buying it for their kids over the Vita for Mario Kart and other kid friendly titles. There's no way Sony was every going to pull in that demographic anyway so I'm happy with the direction that they took the Vita.

 

[StuBurns]

There's not really though. Most of the PlayStation games have been far more 'done' with machine-gun speed in recent years. People confuse the cross-pollonation of Nintendo characters with quick fire sequels of every game, when in reality they arrive at a much more conservative rate than most. Something like Mario Kart isn't really a constant rehash in the grand scheme of things. It's not a Little Big Planet or God Of War, something they churn out almost every single year in one form or another.

That does nothing to prove the 3DS has "fresher, more substantial software en route".

 

[Apath]

There's not really though. Most of the PlayStation games have been far more 'done' with machine-gun speed in recent years. People confuse the cross-pollonation of Nintendo characters with quick fire sequels of every game, when in reality they arrive at a much more conservative rate than most. Something like Mario Kart isn't really a constant rehash in the grand scheme of things. It's not a Little Big Planet or God Of War, something they churn out almost every single year in one form or another.

What these games lack in quick fire sequels, they make up for in their age.

That does nothing to prove the 3DS has "fresher, more substantial software en route".

That too.

 

[Chuck Norris]

ya it would be part of the scheme if 3DS wants a big second wind like it got with the DSlite, and i can see that happening.

hell its worked twice already with the ps3 slim redesign which practically saved the console and 360 slim also saw big growth with very strong sales in america.

.

I just don't see the need for it. The system's design, aside from looking very much like a regular DS, isn't the problem

 

[TheDrowningMan]

That does nothing to prove the 3DS has "fresher, more substantial software en route".

Well it looks that way at the moment. It's receiving a lot of software that isn't done to death every year, which the PlayStation isn't as yet. However, there's plenty of time for that to change.

 

[Mista Koo]

It'll be interesting though since now the PSVita also has an interesting new feature (the back touch-pad) that could result in some never before seen gameplay experience, we'll need to see if they put it to good use or if it becomes just a gimmick.

Is there a thread for touchpad ideas? We need one.

 

[Special J]

i dont see third party investing in vita either, unless they're console ports and at that point why even bother.

heres the thing vita is powerful but that just means longer and more expensive development, if its rendering between a ps2 and ps3, the cost of development is simply too risky for a platform which wont hit 1-2 million for quite a while. and even then most third party get what maybe 1-5% attach rate and thats IF they're amazing.

isnt it a quad core arm? mulithreaded development for handheld is kinda nuts and these games are going to sell for $40? how would a publisher even break even.

I just don't see the need for it. The system's design, aside from looking very much like a regular DS, isn't the problem

its not really whether you see a need or not, its about if theres a market and there is, most people are holding off on 3DS because the price. redesign also examines the components, focuses the manufacturing and design which reduces the cost and you get a better product.

Is there a thread for touchpad ideas? We need one.

the problem with the back touch screen is that you're unable to see your fingers prior to touching it so the place you initially touch wont be precise also trying to hold the handheld while using the rear pad would seem like a chore. reason sony probably included it is because touch pads are relatively inexpensive to add in. and yes developers are creative but i feel like its going to be the sixaxis of the vita an optional input which is rarely used and when it is used seems pointless.