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SPOILER ALERT: Halo 5 (Spoiler) Spoiler Thread of Spoilers Spoiler

I absolutely hated this campaign and the story it brought. Cortana suddenly being the villain after spending 4 games with her, and her and Chief being best buddies, and Chief and Cortana even sharing an emotional goodbye at the end of Halo 4 is awful.

Towards the end of the game, I just wanted Cortana to just kill Locke, and Cortana is stopped by Chief just convincing her to come home. Cortana playing he villain just feels so wrong.

I hope 343 gets rid of Osiris and ONLY makes us play with the Chief for Halo 6. Like... The story would have progressed and felt the same if it was just Blue teams 3 missions. 343 put Locke just to have him... Well screw that man. Just have us play as Chief.
 
343 put a lot of effort into Osiris, people. There's no way these guys are getting sidelined in Halo 6. They're here to stay.

....actually fuck it, anything's possible after what they did to Jul.
 

Trup1aya

Member
This game never truly explained how Cortana survived, or whether or not this isn't one of her clones. And what happened to the other forerunners, considering the Librarian was in Halo 4.

How Cortana survived has nothing to do with needing extended lore knowledge. The game explained that the Domain, an artifact that Forerunners once used, is extending the life of AI.

And all other Forerunners are dead. The Librarian wasn't in Halo 4, an imprint of her was. That was (poorly) explained in Halo4.
 

LycanXIII

Member
I absolutely hated this campaign and the story it brought. Cortana suddenly being the villain after spending 4 games with her, and her and Chief being best buddies, and Chief and Cortana even sharing an emotional goodbye at the end of Halo 4 is awful.

Towards the end of the game, I just wanted Cortana to just kill Locke, and Cortana is stopped by Chief just convincing her to come home. Cortana playing he villain just feels so wrong.

I hope 343 gets rid of Osiris and ONLY makes us play with the Chief for Halo 6. Like... The story would have progressed and felt the same if it was just Blue teams 3 missions. 343 put Locke just to have him... Well screw that man. Just have us play as Chief.

They probably should have had us finish off the Didact in 5 instead of in the comics and tease Cortana's return and saved her turn for 6.
 
343 put a lot of effort into Osiris, people. There's no way these guys are getting sidelined in Halo 6. They're here to stay.

....actually fuck it, anything's possible after what they did to Jul.
They can do to Osiris what they did to Palmer. Let her be so important in the previous game, and keep them in the Halo universe, and just have them around for one key moment/a few cutscenes, but don't force us to play as them.

And I'll also be praying they die every cutscene they're in. I was so disappointed when I saw Palmer still alive at the end after she crashed the Pelican.
 

shireman

Banned
343 put a lot of effort into Osiris, people. There's no way these guys are getting sidelined in Halo 6. They're here to stay.

....actually fuck it, anything's possible after what they did to Jul.


I really hope not. Osiris added nothing. Buck was fun to listen to thanks to Fillion. Locke was boring. He just wasn't interesting.

Also, did anyone else notice there wasn't really any epic vehicular segments? I can recall a couple from each game but none that stuck with me for Halo 5.
 
So will Halo 6 be about the UNSC and Arbiter fighting Cortona while Chief goes rogue to convince Cortona to stop?
Probably. I imagine Chief will go rogue in order to try and rescue Cortana from herself. Hell, he'll probably be labeled dead by the common folk. Traitor by the military. It wouldn't surprise me if they assemble some elite Spartan team to go hunt him down to bring him back in.
This game never truly explained how Cortana survived, or whether or not this isn't one of her clones. And what happened to the other forerunners, considering the Librarian was in Halo 4.
Not to get too philosophical, but a clone of Cortana is Cortana. The first time she splits, how would you know who the "original" and who is the "clone"? They're both just as original as the other ala "The Prestige"
 

krang

Member
I actually didn't mind playing as Locke for the bulk of the game. It didn't feel any different to play than playing the Chief, and you had the benefit of chatting with Buck. It's not as if the Chief was ever the chattiest during the gameplay, anyway, so I never felt like I was missing out on anything.

And yet the story was definitely all about Blue and the Chief, so it never felt like I was playing anything other than a main line Halo game.
 

Trup1aya

Member
I really hope not. Osiris added nothing. Buck was fun to listen to thanks to Fillion. Locke was boring. He just wasn't interesting.

Also, did anyone else notice there wasn't really any epic vehicular segments? I can recall a couple from each game but none that stuck with me for Halo 5.

Hmm I enjoyed all of the vehicular segments... Especially the Phaeton, with two men covering from the ground. I thought that was pretty neat...
 

Erimriv

Member
On Halo 6 Infinity takes Osiris, Blue Team and the Arbiter to Path Ketona, they met there the new librarian and Bornstellar forging a new alliance with the precursos to stop Cortana and the AIs reclaiming the mantle.

All speculation on my part.
 

Ivory Samoan

Gold Member
Everything with Cortana in this new trilogy/saga is really cringey to me. It feels like it comes out of some bad fan-fiction. Her visual design, the way she talks to the Master Chief... it just weirds me out.



shudder

I'm in complete agreeance... she just seemed off for the whole campaign.
I really liked her in Halo 1-3, she's gone backwards in terms of character growth/personality IMO.

She was much better in 4 than 5, though.
 
On Halo 6 Infinity takes Osiris, Blue Team and the Arbiter to Path Ketona, they met there the new librarian and Bornstellar forging a new alliance with the precursos to stop Cortana and the AIs reclaiming the mantle.

All speculation on my part.
There are words here, but I have no clue what they mean. And that's from someone who read all the books except the last two in that Forerunner trilogy.
 
I enjoyed the campaign. The cutscenes were very well made and some of the missions were pretty good. I hate, hate ,hate Cortana's new design, they should have used the Halo 4 design. Friendly AI was horrible and i found Osiris likable but i would have preffered more play time with Blue Team for sure.

Dont forget though,Cortana might be evil but that doesn't mean that we won't have a Cortana with us again. When Halsey Created Cortana, she put several clone brains H2, H3 and H4 in Cryo Storage (Cortana is H1) just in case. I'm guessing these same brains were what could have been used to cure Cortana of rampancy as well by rebuilding her neural net.
 

Brojito

Neo Member
343 put a lot of effort into Osiris, people. There's no way these guys are getting sidelined in Halo 6. They're here to stay.

....actually fuck it, anything's possible after what they did to Jul.

Apparently giving them any real character or purpose to the story was too much effort, then.

Seriously, imagine if Buck wasn't in Osiris, and it was just Locke with three nobodies. And I don't credit 343 for Buck, he was Bungie's creation anyways, and he's fucking Nathan Fillion. It's impossible for him to be not likable.

Osiris feels like another Palmer situation - a new character that 343 tries really hard to make "badass" and wants the fanbase to just accept. But they don't seem to get that you can't just shove a new character in your audience's faces and say, "look how badass they are!" and get them to care when you don't even bother giving them any kind of motivations, or character arc, or meaningful personality.

No doubt we'll get plenty of outside media (comics, books, etc) about Osiris in future, if 343 is determined to make this characters "work". Maybe they'll even have a really good story about them. Then 343 can bring them back in Halo 6 and not even bother with characterizing them, because if you really expect that much from our characters, you have to buy our books, assholes.

I was surprised that Roland didn't join Cortana. At the beginning of the game he was defensive of her and why they had to hunt her down when they first found out she had returned, yet at the end he didn't seem to care.

I had completely forgotten about Roland's little outburst. Such a random scene, even the fade-out at the end is awkward.

What exactly was the point of that? I thought maybe that this was setting up some kind of resentment from Roland, or that he'd be one of the first to sympathize with Cortana and join her at the end, but... nope. When Cortana calls all the AI to her at the end, the story doesn't even address it. He's apparently 100% loyal and none of the characters are even worried about the possibility.

You know, if you're going to write a story about AI rebelling against their creators, and you even specifically write a scene where one AI goes off about the treatment of his fellows, you'd think you'd actually go somewhere with that. Like call into question Roland's loyalty at the end.
 
So anyone have a feeling buck might sympathize with cortana? This is entirely based on his comment in the space elevator about hating how humanity keeps having to run and all they built keeps being destroyed so he might come to the conclusion that cortana's plan is the best way to stop that. Totally crazy speculation btw.
 

Flipyap

Member
Dont forget though,Cortana might be evil but that doesn't mean that we won't have a Cortana with us again. When Halsey Created Cortana, she put several clone brains H2, H3 and H4 in Cryo Storage (Cortana is H1) just in case. I'm guessing these same brains were what could have been used to cure Cortana of rampancy as well by rebuilding her neural net.
I would not expect anyone to be allowed or willing to create new AIs (especially new Cortanas) anytime soon after what just took place. I think our happy little computer friends are going to have some hard times ahead of them.
 

Toa TAK

Banned
Everything with Cortana in this new trilogy/saga is really cringey to me. It feels like it comes out of some bad fan-fiction. Her visual design, the way she talks to the Master Chief... it just weirds me out.

Image517-585x300.jpg


shudder

I think the main thing is just the overall design. Bring back the Halo 4 mo-cap actress, and redo the power armor. I really, really, like the idea of an Antagonistic Cortana, and her new suit, it just looks kinda funky.

And I'll give you +1 for the fanfiction especially at the end of 4. Though, either I've gotten used to it or it's grown on me, it doesn't bug me anymore.
 

Trup1aya

Member
I'm not really upset about Cortana being the bad guy, or her new look, or anything like that..

But that part where she held back a digital tear was pretty cringe worthy.

We do know from the lore that AI are capable of displaying emotions. We even have Cortana giving Cheif and 343GS an angry outburst in H:CE. But there is no logical explanation for an AI to have such an outwardly expression of emotion as crying, especially when this AI has her back turned to the people she's communicating with...

She doesn't have tear ducts, or an esophagus. Why would she ever get choked up? Lol
 
Dont forget though,Cortana might be evil but that doesn't mean that we won't have a Cortana with us again. When Halsey Created Cortana, she put several clone brains H2, H3 and H4 in Cryo Storage (Cortana is H1) just in case. I'm guessing these same brains were what could have been used to cure Cortana of rampancy as well by rebuilding her neural net.
But like she said in Halo 4: "That won't be me, you know that right?" I want the real Cortana!
 
I'm not really upset about Cortana being the bad guy, or her new look, or anything like that..

But that part where she held back a digital tear was pretty cringe worthy.

We do know from the lore that AI are capable of displaying emotions. We even have Cortana giving Cheif and 343GS an angry outburst in H:CE. But there is no logical explanation for an AI to have such an outwardly expression of emotion as crying, especially when this AI has her back turned to the people she's communicating with...

She doesn't have tear ducts, or an esophagus. Why would she ever get choked up? Lol

Her hologram's behavior is always going to be a visual approximation of what her emotions are. She's choking up because she's sad, same as you.
 
I would not expect anyone to be allowed or willing to create new AIs (especially new Cortanas) anytime soon after what just took place. I think our happy little computer friends are going to have some hard times ahead of them.

You're totally right but Cortana was an exceptionally powerful AI (she was able to overpower other AI's easily), seems to me like they might need that now more than ever.

But like she said in Halo 4: "That won't be me, you know that right?" I want the real Cortana!

Crap she did say that. All the more reason to think the writers have considered it. I said it here first folks. Oh and of course it's still her! If i have a Scarlett Johansson clone it's still Scarlett Johansson!
 
You're totally right but Cortana was an exceptionally powerful AI (she was able to overpower other AI's easily), seems to me like they might need that now more than ever.



Crap she did say that. All the more reason to think the writers have considered it. I said it here first folks. Oh and of course it's still her! If i have a Scarlett Johansson clone it's still Scarlett Johansson!

But it's not, it's a Scarlett Johansson clone. Totally different person.
 
So will Halo 6 be about the UNSC and Arbiter fighting Cortona while Chief goes rogue to convince Cortona to stop?

Probably. I imagine Chief will go rogue in order to try and rescue Cortana from herself. Hell, he'll probably be labeled dead by the common folk. Traitor by the military. It wouldn't surprise me if they assemble some elite Spartan team to go hunt him down to bring him back in.

Err. Isn't that what happened in this game? Chief went rogue to find Cortana once people started guessing she was the one behind the Guardians, he tried to get her to come home, and she responded by trying to seal his ass up for 10 thousand years. I don't think he's gonna go off on his own again. It wouldn't make any sense after the events of Halo 5.

But it's not, it's a Scarlett Johansson clone. Totally different person.

DO NOT RUIN THIS FOR ME OK
 

Vinc

Member
Yeah Cortana's design in 5 isn't doing it at all for me, it looks strange in an uncanny sort of way. Halo 4 had the GOAT design. Just perfect.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
Not to get too philosophical, but a clone of Cortana is Cortana. The first time she splits, how would you know who the "original" and who is the "clone"? They're both just as original as the other ala "The Prestige"

She split off her rampant processes though, is probably what he meant. Each copy probably had different errors. As far as I know she wasn't making 1:1 clones, an AI can split into fragments, but not full clones (BB/Kilo 5).
 

shireman

Banned
Err. Isn't that what happened in this game? Chief went rogue to find Cortana once people started guessing she was the one behind the Guardians, he tried to get her to come home, and she responded by trying to seal his ass up for 10 thousand years. I don't think he's gonna go off on his own again. It wouldn't make any sense after the events of Halo 5.

I don't see Chief giving up on Cortona so easy. I think the trilogy/saga will end with them reunited. I'm guessing Chief will merge with the domain to be with her?
 

Brojito

Neo Member
I really, really, like the idea of an Antagonistic Cortana, and her new suit, it just looks kinda funky.

I’m not crazy about the idea personally, but I think it could work. What I find baffling is why the story decided to throw out the one realistic and believable reason for Cortana to become an antagonist - rampancy. The concept has been in Halo nearly since the beginning and was built up in Halo 4 only to be totally discarded.

Otherwise, Cortana's actions make no sense to me. The character from the previous games would never intentionally cause the deaths of thousands of people, or lock Master Chief up for a thousand years while she enforces martial law on the galaxy... that's just totally out of character for her.

Why not just have her fall into rampancy like she was starting to in Halo 4? Then there's a believable reason for her to be acting so megalomaniacal, she's losing it and she's lashing out. It would be much more emotional IMO for Chief to have to watch his AI companion descend into insanity and realize that she's beyond repair and has to be "put down". As it is, the whole Cortana scene just made me go, "oh, fuck you" instead of feeling any sadness about it.

Then, if you really wanna do the whole AIs vs. humanity thing, use this conflict as a way to introduce the idea instead of just dumping it on everyone with no prior buildup. Roland could be watching the UNSC try to destroy Cortana and start thinking about his own mortality, and how they're probably going to destroy him in the end too.
 

Walshicus

Member
Apparently giving them any real character or purpose to the story was too much effort, then.

Every member of Osiris has ten times more development than John outside of secondary media. Include the secondary stuff and they're probably even.

I mean the whole point of John was that he was a blank slate!

I dunno, I kind of think a lot of you are bitching for bitching's sake when it comes to Osiris.
 

Oozer3993

Member
I’m not crazy about the idea personally, but I think it could work. What I find baffling is why the story decided to throw out the one realistic and believable reason for Cortana to become an antagonist - rampancy. The concept has been in Halo nearly since the beginning and was built up in Halo 4 only to be totally discarded.

Otherwise, Cortana's actions make no sense to me. The character from the previous games would never intentionally cause the deaths of thousands of people, or lock Master Chief up for a thousand years while she enforces martial law on the galaxy... that's just totally out of character for her.

Why not just have her fall into rampancy like she was starting to in Halo 4? Then there's a believable reason for her to be acting so megalomaniacal, she's losing it and she's lashing out. It would be much more emotional IMO for Chief to have to watch his AI companion descend into insanity and realize that she's beyond repair and has to be "put down". As it is, the whole Cortana scene just made me go, "oh, fuck you" instead of feeling any sadness about it.

Then, if you really wanna do the whole AIs vs. humanity thing, use this conflict as a way to introduce the idea instead of just dumping it on everyone with no prior buildup. Roland could be watching the UNSC try to destroy Cortana and start thinking about his own mortality, and how they're probably going to destroy him in the end too.

I'm almost positive Cortana is still rampant. It's why she's acting this way. Don't believe her when she says she cured it. She didn't. Jumping into the Domain gave her access to new levels of rampancy.
 

Zomba13

Member
I’m not crazy about the idea personally, but I think it could work. What I find baffling is why the story decided to throw out the one realistic and believable reason for Cortana to become an antagonist - rampancy. The concept has been in Halo nearly since the beginning and was built up in Halo 4 only to be totally discarded.

Otherwise, Cortana's actions make no sense to me. The character from the previous games would never intentionally cause the deaths of thousands of people, or lock Master Chief up for a thousand years while she enforces martial law on the galaxy... that's just totally out of character for her.

Why not just have her fall into rampancy like she was starting to in Halo 4? Then there's a believable reason for her to be acting so megalomaniacal, she's losing it and she's lashing out. It would be much more emotional IMO for Chief to have to watch his AI companion descend into insanity and realize that she's beyond repair and has to be "put down". As it is, the whole Cortana scene just made me go, "oh, fuck you" instead of feeling any sadness about it.

Then, if you really wanna do the whole AIs vs. humanity thing, use this conflict as a way to introduce the idea instead of just dumping it on everyone with no prior buildup. Roland could be watching the UNSC try to destroy Cortana and start thinking about his own mortality, and how they're probably going to destroy him in the end too.

I take the view that her heel turn was because of rampancy. Yeah, she is no longer degrading and "immortal" but that doesn't mean her age and the rampancy didn't have an effect on her "mind". She says how she is better and how she will live forever and how she will help other AIs live forever and take over the galaxy with order and force, that sounds pretty rampant/crazy to me.

We saw Sloan degrading and that was cool but he still seemed to mostly be in control of himself and care about his people but obviously value immortality and being "fixed" over them. Granted, I'm not big on Halo lore and all the books and comics and web series and live action and radio dramas and books but the AIs are made to work with and protect humanity right? And after 7 years they degrade and go crazy and stop working right and that has happened to Cortana, she's gone crazy, isn't working right and gone from working with humanity to protect it to rebelling and looking out for her fellow AIs while also trying to control the entire galaxy through fear and force with the Guardians. If she wasn't rampant she wouldn't do that and would know that she should shut it all down to protect humanity.

Just because she looked fine and acted fine doesn't mean she was fine. She's obviously not the same Cortana the Chief knew, she is rampant but also "fixed" because of the Forerunner stuff.
 

golem

Member
I’m not crazy about the idea personally, but I think it could work. What I find baffling is why the story decided to throw out the one realistic and believable reason for Cortana to become an antagonist - rampancy. The concept has been in Halo nearly since the beginning and was built up in Halo 4 only to be totally discarded.
Her meglomania having its roots in being based off the brain patterns of a younger Halsey is just as belivable to me. Also blaming it on rampancy wouldn't really make total sense since her plan in pure logical form would reduce suffering in the galaxy and be an overall good in the metrics she is defining
 

Kalentan

Member
I'm almost positive Cortana is still rampant. It's why she's acting this way. Don't believe her when she says she cured it. She didn't. Jumping into the Domain gave her access to new levels of rampancy.

She did and she didn't cure it. Like Cortana will no longer die from rampancy, but now she's still rampant. I mean, I thought the whole make pot shots at Osiris and wanting to lock Chief in a cryptum for ten thousand years still showed she still is rampant.

I think that's also the biggest trick she is pulling. Promising to other AI that they can cure rampancy but probably leaving out the fact that they will still act rampant.
 

TheOddOne

Member
She did and she didn't cure it. Like Cortana will no longer die from rampancy, but now she's still rampant. I mean, I thought the whole make pot shots at Osiris and wanting to lock Chief in a cryptum for ten thousand years still showed she still is rampant.

I think that's also the biggest trick she is pulling. Promising to other AI that they can cure rampancy but probably leaving out the fact that they will still act rampant.
I wonder if she is infecting other AIs, because Governor Sloan was glitching like Cortana in Halo 4.
 
She did and she didn't cure it. Like Cortana will no longer die from rampancy, but now she's still rampant. I mean, I thought the whole make pot shots at Osiris and wanting to lock Chief in a cryptum for ten thousand years still showed she still is rampant.

I think that's also the biggest trick she is pulling. Promising to other AI that they can cure rampancy but probably leaving out the fact that they will still act rampant.

She's not rampant, though. She's achieved metastability. She's no longer thinking herself to death. That's the definition of rampancy, violent outbursts are just a side effect.

Cortan's path isn't crazy, it's in fact chillingly logical. Kill millions to guarantee the security of billions and eventually trillions. Pure utilitarianism.
 
It really bothered me when Cortana went after Osiris with those cheap shots in the last level. I never imagined her to call out Vale about daddy issues.

I get that she was trying to demoralize them but that came out of nowhere. I was like CORTANA NOOOOO
 

Solidsoul

Banned
She's not rampant, though. She's achieved metastability. She's no longer thinking herself to death. That's the definition of rampancy, violent outbursts are just a side effect.

Cortan's path isn't crazy, it's in fact chillingly logical. Kill millions to guarantee the security of billions and eventually trillions. Pure utilitarianism.


No, just no. She is crazy.

If 343 drives home that she just decided to act completely different than she ever did in any of the other games for no reason other than she wants to they have ruined the story of Halo.

Rampancy is at play. Of course she said she isn't rampant, that's what a rampant AI would say.
 
No, just no. She is crazy.

If 343 drives home that she just decided to act completely different than she ever did in any of the other games for no reason other than she wants to they have ruined the story of Halo.

Rampancy is at play. Of course she said she isn't rampant, that's what a rampant AI would say.

No, she's actually not, because if she was, she'd be dead by now. She's making a decision you (and I, and a lot of people) find abhorrent, but it's not 'cause she's nuts.
 

Brojito

Neo Member
Every member of Osiris has ten times more development than John outside of secondary media. Include the secondary stuff and they're probably even.

I mean the whole point of John was that he was a blank slate!

That's a HUGE exaggeration. Osiris is barely developed in-game at all. (seriously, how much could you actually tell me about Tanaka?) You're not technically wrong, they do have slightly more than Master Chief, but being more developed than a blank slate character is not exactly an accomplishment.

I dunno, I kind of think a lot of you are bitching for bitching's sake when it comes to Osiris.

They have no purpose in the story. That's the main reason I'm bitching about them; the fact that they're barely characterized and poorly developed is just icing on top.

It's poor writing to spend over half the screentime with characters that have no point and no reason to care about them. Especially when it takes away from time that could have been used developing Blue Team, or literally anyone else that actually had importance to the story.

I'm almost positive Cortana is still rampant. It's why she's acting this way. Don't believe her when she says she cured it. She didn't. Jumping into the Domain gave her access to new levels of rampancy.

A lot of people are saying this, but I just don't get why the story wouldn't be clearer about this.

I don't know, it's just.. unnecessarily ambiguous, I guess? Like why make a point to tell the player one thing (and it's not just from Cortana, there's Intel about her fixing herself) but not actually mean it?

In Halo 4 she had those freak-out episodes. It would have been nice to maybe see one of those in the story, instead of her cringy choked sobs about Master Chief. If she was still rampant and crazy, why would she appear so "rational" and otherwise normal?

There's just no reason for it to be a "is she or isn't she??" plot point. Clarity would be better than, "well, she fixed herself so she's not rampant, but she's still kinda rampant, but not the normal rampant, etc".

Cortan's path isn't crazy, it's in fact chillingly logical. Kill millions to guarantee the security of billions and eventually trillions. Pure utilitarianism.

But this is completely against everything her character was in the last 4 games. If this truly is supposed to be a sane, rational thinking Cortana, her development from spunky AI companion to mass-murdering megalomaniac comes out of nowhere.
 
But this is completely against everything her character was in the last 4 games. If this truly is supposed to be a sane, rational thinking Cortana, her development from spunky AI companion to mass-murdering megalomaniac comes out of nowhere.

Well, consider this. How would you behave if you were handed the keys to the universe? Cortana gained, in a very short period of time, a massive number of IQ points (so to speak) and a nearly universal body of knowledge. She then finds the Guardians, weapons of such power that she could mold the galaxy to her choosing. Would you remain the same, with such power?

I doubt I would. If I knew, for a fact, that I was the smartest person alive (that isn't Mendicant Bias), knew basically everything, and had the power to act on that knowledge... I'm not sure I wouldn't.
 
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