Not entirely. You have listwar.com and check released exclusives. He undeniably underestimate PS4 exclusives.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Xbox One beats PS4 on Black Friday, according to market-research firm
- Thread starter fluffydelusions
- Start date
- Status
Not entirely. You have listwar.com and check released exclusives. He undeniably underestimate PS4 exclusives.
speculawyer
Member
WiiU got beat by 360? Ouch!
Uh, that's my quote. HIS quote is unchanged except a bolded sentence.
I read your quote just fine. You continue to say the XBO's exclusives are more compelling. That's fine. Your entitled to your opinion. My quote was meant to paraphrase a bit. Sorry if you took it the wrong way.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
360 being above WiiU is the bigger deal in my opinion
Yeah I imagine the rabbit hole went even deeper had sales still not stabilized. People aren't buy it? Throw in Master chief collection. Still not buying it? Throw in 1 year of Xbox Live. Still not buying it? Throw in even more games. The plan was to be as cut throat and possible. This is the beauty of consumerism.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
But they kinda coincide because the person in question was banned because he was so irate about November's outcome. Lol.
But I'll listen to you, begrudgingly. Hmph!
:-D
You ignored the actual points in that post instead getting caught up in pointless minutiae so I'm going to assume that means you don't have a counterpoint to my argument now. >
Triggerhappytel
Member
Infoscout last Black Friday:
http://blog.infoscout.co/black-friday-console-war/
Methodology last Black Friday:
"Of over 102k shopping receipts tracked by InfoScout on Black Friday, slightly over 1,500 included purchases of a gaming console or console game. The data includes purchases at all major retailers carrying electronics including Walmart, Target, Best Buy, GameStop, RadioShack, and others. For more information related to our data and panel representation, visit our data page."
Wonderful. So can we completely disregard anything this site has to say?!
not_so_special
Banned
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
That's not why it would be a pyrrhic victory. If it's not part of a sustainable pattern but rather just a fire sale effect that tapers off and only pulled sales forward then it will be a pyrrhic victory.
That's the major concern. PS4 won't be 399 forever and they are still being outsold for the month worldwide. What happens if PS4 is 349 by midway next year? Will they go to 299? What if PS4 matches that shortly thereafter. Their console is not much cheaper to produce so they can't maintain a price advantage for a great period of time without losing money.
El-Pistolero
Member
bigbaldwolf86
Banned
I don't know why people are taking this serioudly in the first place
It is all about enlarging your userbase, when you got that, it will generate more money because of game sale, and will generate word to mouth and that will lead to more sales.
As the PR for the one has been terrible... they don't even bother with Kinect anymore which is the differentiation if you have experienced it.
And it can sell you consoles.
I own both (and a WiiU) and ill take the XboxOne over the PS4 any time, it just offers more, fast app switching, instant resume after standby, kinect functions, tv functions, kinect fitness, to get me into shape. (or keep me in shape, I am pretty much in shape)
And for now better games.
It not that PS4 is bad, it's good if you are looking for a machine that does 1 thing right, gaming. But in the day and age that you want to do everything with your phone, and people are into this, it's a bit old fashioned.
So I am all for MS gaining more market.
As the PR for the one has been terrible... they don't even bother with Kinect anymore which is the differentiation if you have experienced it.
And it can sell you consoles.
I own both (and a WiiU) and ill take the XboxOne over the PS4 any time, it just offers more, fast app switching, instant resume after standby, kinect functions, tv functions, kinect fitness, to get me into shape. (or keep me in shape, I am pretty much in shape)
And for now better games.
It not that PS4 is bad, it's good if you are looking for a machine that does 1 thing right, gaming. But in the day and age that you want to do everything with your phone, and people are into this, it's a bit old fashioned.
So I am all for MS gaining more market.
Opus Angelorum
Member
Well the problem is some people will flatly refuse this, scoffing at the mere thought of it.
Others will say 'well Microsoft are in desperation mode' and that it should have outsold the PS4, despite the PS4 also having some great bundles.
A minority will actually give props to Microsoft for doing well, having an aggressive push for their system and offering good value.
He's just saying, since Microsoft is willing to do anything to save face, people might actually give their exclusive games the time of day as well. Their biggest (working) game is under $15
Im just surprised they got the ok to throw away so much money just to win November, it's not like outselling Sony one-two months will suddenly make them lead platform on multi plats
It's a matter of taste though.
PS4 bundles have been shit in comparison with what the Xbox One had to offer (price wise)
No but it will generate them more money
It's a marathon not a sprint. It's about enlarging their market and generating word to mouth and in the end sales.EmptySpace
Banned
unsurprising if true.
in a span of a year it went from 500 bucks to 329 plus bundled game plus free game of your own choice.
in a span of a year it went from 500 bucks to 329 plus bundled game plus free game of your own choice.
The notion that MS is losing a ton of money at 349 i think may be a bit of a stretch at this point. People forget that the Kinect pull wasnt a price drop. Also, kinect was being sold at 149 as a replacement. So to put things in perspective, its probably at the price it should have launched at initially.
I doubt its profitable for them but i dont think they are bleeding as so many others seem to think.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
Which has zero to do with a totally misleading and non representative survey fudging the results for the second year in a row.
But yeah. Let me applaud Microsoft, and also EA for having the Best selling game of black friday. /s
I mean there is no doubt this is Microsoft reacted with some extremeness. There is no comparison to the PS4 bundles. What Microsoft is doing is throwing everything and the kitchen sink at ensuring they win November. I don't know why it seemingly offends you to acknowledge that Microsoft is seriously going crazy with the deals this month. I don't know if I'd call it 'desperation', but it clearly would not be happening if they were in a different position.
This is the act of someone who is playing cutthroat hardcore hardball to win November because they clearly want the good PR from that after most of the year being dominated. They know the Holiday season is very important and that some genuinely good PR can be a huge boon.
But there's no minority giving props to Microsoft. Multiple topics are absolutely packed with people doing just that. This thread is slightly unique in that the methodology this company uses is very suspect, even to someone like me who thinks XBO is going to win by 200k-400k. Persecution complex stuff is not really becoming I don't think
Son of Sam
Banned
This isn't surprising at all. Xbox has the better games, the better controller, the better bundles, what else do you want?
Nightengale
Member
No but it will generate them more money
The fundamental idea that it'll generate more money is true, but it also needs to be weighed in from another perspective.
MS's approach of aggressive userbase expansion essentially implies that they're starting with a negative ARPPU, and growing it to a net positive eventually through game sales and subscriptions. Sony's approach presumably starts them at either flat/barely profitable ARPPU, and add it on top of them from their current base.
Whether or not it actually generates them more money in the long-run really depends on how they execute their overall business and monetisation-per-user.
I don't understand this defensive mechanism. I think, most rational GAFFers, have considered the Microsoft bundles as a net win for the consumer. At the end of the day- the strategy is clear. Microsoft cut price to gain marketshare and mindshare. Right now, the gamble has paid off with the anecdotal evidence- but time will tell just how far that gets them.
The more exciting thing is not what happens in the short terms- it's if the Xbox One can permanently supplant itself as formidable rival to the PS4 in North America.
Haha. It's the pricing. Games? That's preference. Controller? Preference. Better bundle? Preference.
It's the price. Overall, the PS4 is a better console, if it wasn't, it wouldn't be selling as well as it is, despite MS giving the house away. Let's not kid ourselves,
Nightengale
Member
Does it matter if some of us don't give MS the "props of a job well done (presumably)?"
Using myself as an example, I don't think I've said a word of praise to MS in this entire thread. However, at the same time, I don't think anything I've said is irrational, unreasonable or paints the sign of someone whose words aren't worth anyone's time.
I will be the first to admit that MS did a great job with their pricing, bundle strategy, etc in North America this holiday. But there was no need for me to vocalise that opinion.
Using myself as an example, I don't think I've said a word of praise to MS in this entire thread. However, at the same time, I don't think anything I've said is irrational, unreasonable or paints the sign of someone whose words aren't worth anyone's time.
I will be the first to admit that MS did a great job with their pricing, bundle strategy, etc in North America this holiday. But there was no need for me to vocalise that opinion.
I expected you to show up with a drive-by post sooner. I am disappoint.
It's not the end of story and there's never a black and white answer in business, just like most subjects.
There is certainly a perfectly plausible argument to be made that whereas XBO's lineup would not necessarily have impact by themselves, that when you add in insane bundle deals suddenly the fact that the system does in fact have those titles becomes an added incentive.
Nothing is so simple my friend, and there's no "end of story" to anything.
Green Yoshi
Member
I would rather forget about the One and keep on playing with my 360 until Microsoft announces a new console in 2017.
El-Pistolero
Member
I fail to see how points two and three could not be reconciled, as if they were at different ends of the spectrum. MS WAS -and is- in desperation mode, hence why they slashed their prices significantly, which obviously made the bundles irresistible. I can not remember more drastic measures within one year of a console launch...
AdventureRacing
Member
Was that true of the wii last gen? This seems only to apply when it is convenient. Quality is really subjective and there are many factors that influence sales. Thats why sales discussion always break down when the focus shifts to the respective quality of the consoles.
AdventureRacing
Member
Didn't we see very similar measures taken by Sony last gen? I'd imagine those ones were much more costly to their bottom line as well by a huge margin.
Can't remember if that was year one or not.
XBO is going to win November, but this is because the GTAV+TLOU bundle is sold out on Amazon and the only ones left are selling for $499.99
The AC bundle is back in stock on Amazon for $329.99.
Isn't the PS4 GTA V TLOU bundle sold out?
FinalStageBoss
Banned
StealthGoblin
Banned
It was always going to 'win' black Friday.
Microsoft drastically cut the price and included up to five games in their bundles. They've taken a massive, massive hit just to get the box into people's homes.
Whereas I think in Europe, the PS4 sales will grab back some of that total marketshare for Sony as the Xbox One is getting destroyed there.
Microsoft drastically cut the price and included up to five games in their bundles. They've taken a massive, massive hit just to get the box into people's homes.
Whereas I think in Europe, the PS4 sales will grab back some of that total marketshare for Sony as the Xbox One is getting destroyed there.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
Sony shot themselves in the foot with the GTAV bundle. It's sold out in a number of best buy stores near me and amazon.
Needed to stuff more channels.
Needed to stuff more channels.
Opus Angelorum
Member
Surely the point of any survey is to capture a general indication, I wouldn't ever claim they are to be taken as gospel.
This is Microsoft going crazy, and that isn't a problem as the consumer wins. I was suggesting some people like to use this as the sole reason Microsoft have been successful recently, ignoring the fact that the system and library has improved greatly over the last year.
Microsoft is absolutely doing this for good PR, no doubt.
Agree, I wasn't addressing the 'rational' ones though
If I knew you I'd be offended.
The measures were very necessary considering were Microsoft were before the Xbox One even launched. The turn around has been amazing.
Don't see how next year will be a train wreck. The game line-up for Fall 2015 seems like it will be even better than his year.
I mean I don't think anyone is suggesting it's a bad thing from a consumer's perspective. Just that it's illustrative of where the market must have been at for things to be the way they are with the Black Friday deals.
The system has an improved library and system elements (ID@Xbox parity clause fix and even I'm on board at these prices), but were it not for these deals, the Xbox One would still be getting dominated by PS4. Month after month has shown the games by themselves are not enough. When you use them as incentive on top of insane deals, however, then they might play a role.
Opus Angelorum
Member
I think it's a matter of momentum and consumer awareness. A successful holiday period for Microsoft will do wonders, word of mouth will help remove any existing pre-conceived ill-thought towards the platform. The price is there, the value is there and the initial launch stigma (disaster) is dissipating.
I hope it's true. MS deserves success considering how aggressive they've been both in terms of pricing and funding 3rd party console exclusives (Sunset, Dead Rising, Titanfall, RYse...).
Sony had a lousy end of the year, with one sub-par driving game and yet another LBP that doesn't bring much new to the table.
We need some good competition in this race to force both parties to bring their A game.
Sony had a lousy end of the year, with one sub-par driving game and yet another LBP that doesn't bring much new to the table.
We need some good competition in this race to force both parties to bring their A game.
not if things go back the way they were with price. Microsoft has to keep things this compelling price-wise, because it's clearly where the market is at. If it goes back up to $399.99 or even $349.99 w/out a pack-in, the problems come right back.
Jb said:
I'd rather them be tried in small claims court for this abomination. >
Jb said:
It has by far the most innovations yet in the series. Not that it will sell despite that, but this is inaccurate.
- Status