Dictator93
Member
Download the less compromised version elsewhere (gamersyde with corrected black levels for example).
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DF: Is Uncharted 4 the generational leap we were hoping for?
- Thread starter valkyre
- Start date
Download the less compromised version elsewhere (gamersyde with corrected black levels for example).
The gun he picked carried over with him in the cutscene. And they've already said they're dropping the pre-rendered stuff. But I believe they are using better character models during cutscenes.
This flick happens right after the first scene. You can clearly see the subtle changes.
Apart from the holster changing slightly position I see zero difference in textures, polycount etc in either the hairline or the holster itself.
Sure the hair looks like it has magically changed position, but the texture quality still remains the same. Looks like a small glitch to me. Or if not, the most amazing LOD transition I have ever witnessed because I simply cant see the texture or polycount/asset difference at all.
GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
You can always sniff out Digital Foundry bias when they start editorializing well beyond the scope of technical analysis. If a game performs well but doesn't fit their taste you'll get a dryly written article without much fluff, but when they get a chubby for a title you can expect some irrelevant car waxing to creep into the writing, and in some cases even an apologist tone for instances of uneven underperformance. I'm sure Uncharted 4 will be visually stellar, but it's hard to take DF articles as a source of genuinely objective analysis (which the tend to present themselves as) when they often frame the information they give in a subjective manner. In regular preview/review terms that would be fine and dandy, but if that's the editorial direction they want to go they should drop the pretense and own up to it.
Always-honest
Banned
In this closeup i can see the detail getting slightly less but i don't really think you'll see it from normal distance and i'm confident that they are insane perfectionsts at ND so it will all okay in the final game. Who knows in how much time they had to make this playthrough.
Beside the obvious hair, neck, the gun holster, there are changes in his watch, a button on his jeans, his skin though not clear due to compression but you can still see a scar on his right elbow disappearing.
It's subtle, but it's there.
Dictator93
Member
Pointing out objective differences (which in themselves require a certain subjectivity of empiricism / epistemoligcal definitions) and then subjectively valuing them is pretty much standard.
Not sure why it is a problem for them to weigth the values and come to conclusions.
Indeed I can see it now that I know were to look at. But seriously I was trying to find the difference and couldnt. I guess I kinda suck at find the difference situations lol.
Really though, I doubt that from a normal distance ou can perceive such subtle changes.
If this is indeed an intended LOD transition and not some glitch , I am fine with it. It is almost perfect to be honest. Especially compared to other games like you know which...
Primethius
Banned
Yatōkiri_Kilgharrah;142487827 said:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=946678
Enjoy.
And please do post your detailed impressions sometime.
So paranoid.
Coriolanus
Banned
Why are people saying pre-alpha? Pre-alpha is concept, ffs.
If they got a model running around and shooting stuff, that thing is well into alpha.
If they got a model running around and shooting stuff, that thing is well into alpha.
nullpoynter
Member
Because Naughty Dog themselves said it was pre-alpha.
Yeah there was a lot of content in this article that was beyond the scope of a DF technical analysis. I was really hoping Richard would be on this but I guess not. His opinion on things just carries more weight for me.
But this is my first time watching it and, although the game looks superb especially the foliage, I lost focus on the graphics and was checking out that sweet Uncharted gameplay. It looks awesome. And the mercs are South African which is even better
. I can't wait for this.GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
What exactly is paranoid about it? As I said, they can editorialize all they want, but they can't simultaneously paint themselves as the gold standard of technical objectivity. Their Sunset Overdrive analysis and this Uncharted one stand out for having selective and blatantly subjective overtones compared to the typically flatter analysis of less hyped games. They don't treat all games equally on a purely technical basis, at all imo.
Any way to download that 3.something GB corrected version of the video? I wanted to download it yesterday but the link's dead
This is only 2.3GB : http://www.gamersyde.com/telecharge...end_psx_demo_fixed_black_levels-33753_fr.html
VFX_Veteran
Banned
It's just the different art direction for the leaves. The trees are not tessellated but you can't see any trees in UC4 to compare. Also, while UC4 has specular layer on the leaves, there is no light propagation through the leaves (which is much more complex) like in the AC:U shots.
I believe that's a background layer of geo+textures. I would be surprised if you could actually GO where he's looking.
-M
sobaka770
Banned
UC4 will be a beast for sure.
First-of-all, I've just come out of a long open-world rambling, but in this case, comparing AC:U to UC4 is not correct if it's PC vs PS4 (AC:U runs at 900p at 20 FPS on console, come on!) and it's open-world vs linear game. Naughty Dog will come out on top in comparisons when the game is done, end of story.
What is obvious is that, as is known, they use the same engine for UC4 as for previous-gen. There's this core which is visible under all the polish and smoothness which is still old-gen (like grenade not causing and ground deformation or lasting impact).
Now it's important to also understand that this time we get a real run-of-the-mill UC gameplay for a demo and not a staged scene, like for UC2. This is what this game should look like at it's "worst" in my opinion: pre-alpha, not set-piece, no gimmicks. Just a jungle, couple of soldiers and platforming. So far: must have. Maybe won't beat the Order, but that game is all set-piece and is cropped on both sides.
2015 will be great for PS4.
First-of-all, I've just come out of a long open-world rambling, but in this case, comparing AC:U to UC4 is not correct if it's PC vs PS4 (AC:U runs at 900p at 20 FPS on console, come on!) and it's open-world vs linear game. Naughty Dog will come out on top in comparisons when the game is done, end of story.
What is obvious is that, as is known, they use the same engine for UC4 as for previous-gen. There's this core which is visible under all the polish and smoothness which is still old-gen (like grenade not causing and ground deformation or lasting impact).
Now it's important to also understand that this time we get a real run-of-the-mill UC gameplay for a demo and not a staged scene, like for UC2. This is what this game should look like at it's "worst" in my opinion: pre-alpha, not set-piece, no gimmicks. Just a jungle, couple of soldiers and platforming. So far: must have. Maybe won't beat the Order, but that game is all set-piece and is cropped on both sides.
2015 will be great for PS4.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
Not true. Everything in AC:U is using a physically-based shading model, which is quite complex (and more than likely the cause of the console's low framerates). However, I have yet to see anything in that UC4 demo that's technically superior to games that are out now.
Saberus
Member
It wasn't, they said a few times, it was real time on the ps4.. but you have to understand.. there wasn't a lot going on in that scene for animation around him.. so they were using a lot of the processing for Drakes render.
But those tweets have since been deleted. Don't get me wrong, Naughty dog is one if not the best developer today. However, I'm really disappointed in their lack of clarity on this.
I guess we'll really have to comment when the final game is out on this. If it was pre-alpha like they reckon, then we should still have something great.
Did did the last of us gameplay look back in 2012?
Several people write for Digital Foundry, its not one entity. They never were 100% objective about every tech feature. They judge differently final code and vertical slices.
And they look at many factors, like You know amount of characters on screen or particles on screen too, which many people completely forget in this 'tech' discussions.
MidgarBlowedUp
Member
Depending on how many people are working on the game, and how much stuff they have outsourced, I expect a pretty huge upgrade from what we are seeing now.
Yea, bigger games probably do get a bit more personal thoughts thrown in. That makes sense, though.
I also don't remember them painting themselves as the gold standard of technical objectivity. They state all their finds and their thoughts on it, which I welcome. Like their opinion on HRAA in the Far Cry 4 analysis. If they just said 'game uses HRAA', it wouldn't mean much to a lot of people, so they go into what they think about it. Personally, I disagree with their conclusion that its a great AA solution. But I don't begrudge them talking about it. It was still informative and I don't mind hearing what knowledgeable people think about something.
Bottom line is that they've never said that they were only going to be strict, cold analysis and nothing but. You are accusing them of doing something wrong when its just your expectations and fears that are the source of your grievances.
OsirisBlack
Banned
Yatōkiri_Kilgharrah;142487827 said:
If you did not play the PSX demo then your opinion is a bit out of date. I never played the first demo (probably best that I didn't) but I did get to play the longer version of the new demo. Beginning to end fap material.
On topic, Assassins Creed Unity looks amazing on powerful PC's not so much on Console so comparing the console version to UC4 is really going to make ACU look horrid.
TetraGenesis
Member
The Gamersyde gamma corrected version is so incredible. The amount of detail is staggering.
ND doesn't outsource tech and the assets in the demo look very much like pre-polish pass assets. They will definitely go through balancing (colors, texture size for better and for worse and placement in the least), but I certainly don't expect a huge difference in those areas. Animations maybe, but those look really good and have certainly been polished pretty well already. So expect what you want to, but I certainly would advice to control your expectations even though I do believe that overall it will develop for the better, but not dramatically.
DirgeExtinction
Member
The fact that UC4 looks as good as most finished PS4 games, while in a pre-alpha state, is a testament to ND's technical capabilities.
You're being jumped on but i agree. Sometimes it's like they are trying to obfuscate or redirect attention from anything that doesn't match their own personal opinions so hard. Depends on the writers though.
But this is 30. Maybe you'll have a toggle to drop various details to get it closer to 60 like TLOU?
Naughty dog says a lot of things
gundamkyoukai
Member
How much better looking UC4 going to get depends on thing the frame rate.
Is ND still going to push for 60 or stick with 30fps and add more stuff as they go.
Is ND still going to push for 60 or stick with 30fps and add more stuff as they go.
VisceralBowl
Member
Good to know you can view the wireframe/polycount with just your eyes.
Maninthemirror
Banned
thats basically it. in its current state it would labelled as very good graphically and a 8/10 game
1 year from release we have THIS level of graphics
at 1080p
at 30fps
it will only get better now
people comparing Unity being on par to this forget Unity is 900p and a stuttering frame rate ON RELEASE. this is 1080p and 30 fps LOCKED 1 year from release
If anything, UC4 as a PS4 game will be running for best graphics against current PC games with ultra settings. just think about that for a second, you are comparing Unity which has been released which is 900p and a stuttering frame rate with UC4 which is 1080p and 30fps already 1 year from release.....
put it in perspective and minds will be blown
in 99% of games 1 year from release we are usually saying 'hope they add AA' or 'hope they lock the frame rate' or 'hope they fix the animation' or 'hope they fix the AI'
It's because the distance from the camera is enough to hide, it's how good LOD is supposed to work and Naughty Dog have the luxury of controlling the changes really well. It's also a testament to how good their lowpoly model and bake is and that the shaders might not even change at all.
So I take it you notice a difference in geometry from that gif?
Because if you dont, then I guess my main point stands and all you want to achieve with your post is come out as the smart fella...
agreed. Like I said in one of my later posts, whatever differences there are, they are so well hidden, that it really does not matter at all. If this is LOD change and not an omission, then by all means, more of that kind of LOD, rather than the one we are used to.
Personally I had to been told the differences to spot them. And that is by looking at a zoomed in , cropped section of the gameplay. In a pure gameplay session from a normal distance this LOD transition is almost invisible. At least to most people.
This is just an opinion piece and first impressions of the game. It's not a final analysis or anything.
gundamkyoukai
Member
And they back it up , it's not like they have history of downgrading there games or saying stupid stuff.
Boombloxer
Member
First post.
VisceralBowl
Member
The straps look a little thicker, but I think it's because it was hovering above a little his shoulder, so I just saw the bottom. The watch and top of the shirt are also a tad different.
What I meant was that, if done well enough, you wouldn't really notice a difference in geometry between the two close LODs (unless of course you knew what exactly was changed). I don't think you would be able to tell what they removed in that GIF, because if this is indeed a transition and not just some glitch, it's a good one.
martino
Member
imo most change are front side detail to go gameplay model.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Yep the majority of the difference in models will be in his face, and that's going to be obscured a lot of the time they do that "cutscene into gameplay" transition where the camera rolls to his back. It's a good way to hide the change.
FormerShirts
Member
Pre-Alpha means different things at different studios.
marketing buzz the game is far from alpha lets be honest, alpha's don't look like that, let alone pre-alpha
I'm sure it will look better in the year leading to its release, but i won't act like this is far from final art
looks good though, not quite what i expected, but it's definitely a higher resolution and poly count uncharted
I'm sure it will look better in the year leading to its release, but i won't act like this is far from final art
looks good though, not quite what i expected, but it's definitely a higher resolution and poly count uncharted
It's not safe at all to assume that what you saw is true for the rest of the existing game. They crunched over this particular segment for the past few weeks to pretty it up enough to show to the public. Pre-alpha means they are still in testing, which I can believe.
Scott Rohde:
Well, I'm sorry that ACU doesn't have any tropical rain forest environments to compare to UC4's.
Curiously that doesn't stop some from saying UC4 looks better than any other game. It also doesn't stop others from saying The Order 1886 looks better than UC4. If there is a problem with comparing the graphical quality between widely different kinds of environments then people need to at least be a little consistent about it.
Because the game doesn't have stutters or performance issues for me. It's perfectly smooth at around 50 to 70fps on my Gsync monitor. But even before when I capped it at 30fps on my previous monitor the framerate was still solid and free of stutters.
The LOD complaint is way overblown. The LOD is actually quite impressive at the ultra texture settings. The vast majority of the time I am blown away by how much stuff is being rendered on screen and the quality levels it's doing it at.
The pop-in is a real thing, but it's mostly confined to the NPC's LOD levels. It's a bit distracting at times, but doesn't come close to destroying the visuals. All open world games I have played have pop-in.
As I said, all of these games have their strengths and weaknesses. I could easily point out a half dozen things that I find weak in UC4's visuals. All games are going to have weaknesses, but that doesn't mean that they can't still be visually impressive overall.
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