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[Despera]

We were discussing this in one of the other threads about how Konami's statements apparently were deliberately vague up until release. They made it seem like you could earn those coins through online play, when in reality you have to purchase them.

The way they orchestrated the whole thing is just astonishingly sleazy. From how they handled review events to this FOB bullshit... just wow

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Maybe it's because I play a lot of Warframe so I understand that the mere pressence of this stuff doesn't mean a game is full on cash-grab pay2win, but I don't know where you all get the energy to hate it this much. I highly doubt the game is ruined because of it.

 

[Kamina777]

You are still giving Konami money and thus to them you are indirectly supporting this.



See above. I mean do not buy the game.

I see, so its:
"I'm furious so I'm not going to buy a game I was never going to buy in the first place to teach Konami a lesson about fuck all"

Since not buying the game at all doesn't make a statement whatsoever where their bottom line is concerned; outside of not being interested in the game.

 

[plasmawave]

Would just like to clarify this is for the Online FOBS and not your own Single Player Motherbase Upgrades.

I'd say this is a silver lining.

 

[Coffee Dog]

Here's something for you guys to think about.

The way the numbers for these work, some percentage of players (that I'm sure Konami has an estimate for) will participate in the microtransactions.

In fact, I guarantee that a non-zero percentage of people on GAF will do so.

I'd be willing to bet at least one person who says they won't do it, maybe even in this thread, will in fact end up doing it. The justification will change from, "well I'll just not participate in the microtransactions" to "it's only a couple bucks, who cares."

Furthermore, each sale, beyond supporting Konami directly, also supports EVERY company making the decision to do something like this. Because the bitching means nothing when you're all buying it anyway, and you're all potential participants in the microtransaction scheme. You're saying in the loudest way possible (for those looking at the money) that this is okay.

Plenty of you guys are telling yourselves whatever you need to in order to help you sleep at night and buy this game without feeling bad about it. I understand. But you're also hypocrites, and it's okay to accept that. Everyone is at one time or another. But let's not pretend you're making some sort of stand by "only" buying this game. That's a joke.

If someone doesn't buy the microtransactions, how are they hypocrites? You're clearly reaching. Of course if someone speaks out against microtransactions and then buys them, they are a hypocrite. But if you don't buy them, and instead pay $60 for a single player video game, how is that contributing any more than buying any other $60 video game with microtransactions in the multiplayer?

 

[Nameless]

Why would you need more than one?

You don't, they just accelerate the speed at which you're able to progress -- so hopefully GAF forgives me for not getting my speedo in a bunch over something that's been prevalent in gaming for nearly a decade. It does feel good to say 'Fuck Konami', though.

 

[iNvid02]

Shitty but I was never gonna touch the online portion of this game anyway

 

[soultron]

Here's something for you guys to think about.

The way the numbers for these work, some percentage of players (that I'm sure Konami has an estimate for) will participate in the microtransactions.

In fact, I guarantee that a non-zero percentage of people on GAF will do so.

I'd be willing to bet at least one person who says they won't do it, maybe even in this thread, will in fact end up doing it. The justification will change from, "well I'll just not participate in the microtransactions" to "it's only a couple bucks, who cares."

Furthermore, each sale, beyond supporting Konami directly, also supports EVERY company making the decision to do something like this. Because the bitching means nothing when you're all buying it anyway, and you're all potential participants in the microtransaction scheme. You're saying in the loudest way possible (for those looking at the money) that this is okay.

Plenty of you guys are telling yourselves whatever you need to in order to help you sleep at night and buy this game without feeling bad about it. I understand. But you're also hypocrites, and it's okay to accept that. Everyone is at one time or another. But let's not pretend you're making some sort of stand by "only" buying this game. That's a joke.

Journalists were able to finish it without the FOB stuff. (At the fun review event, sure.)

You're not going to make me feel bad about buying the game, playing it, enjoying it, and not buying any of the MTs.

I'm saying it here and now. If the MTs are set up in such a way that it ruins enjoyment I'll get a Steam refund and drop the game cold.

There are people in the OT who have sunk tens of hours into this game already and haven't made a peep about FOBs being an issue.

 

[Zombie James]

Source?

https://mobile.twitter.com/AshleyGrindley/status/637436300795232256
http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=177092420

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

Here's something for you guys to think about.

The way the numbers for these work, some percentage of players (that I'm sure Konami has an estimate for) will participate in the microtransactions.

In fact, I guarantee that a non-zero percentage of people on GAF will do so.

I'd be willing to bet at least one person who says they won't do it, maybe even in this thread, will in fact end up doing it. The justification will change from, "well I'll just not participate in the microtransactions" to "it's only a couple bucks, who cares."

Furthermore, each sale, beyond supporting Konami directly, also supports EVERY company making the decision to do something like this. Because the bitching means nothing when you're all buying it anyway, and you're all potential participants in the microtransaction scheme. You're saying in the loudest way possible (for those looking at the money) that this is okay.

Plenty of you guys are telling yourselves whatever you need to in order to help you sleep at night and buy this game without feeling bad about it. I understand. But you're also hypocrites, and it's okay to accept that. Everyone is at one time or another. But let's not pretend you're making some sort of stand by "only" buying this game. That's a joke.

Who is making a stand? I bought a game I wanted to play with money I earned. What do I gain from not letting myself play a game I wanted to play?

I don't feel bad about enjoying the game and I'll sleep fantastically well and then get up tomorrow and play the game some more.

All while not buying any of the microtransactions.

I have more important things to be on moral crusades about without missing out on entertainment products I want to buy.

 

[semiconscious]

you are not gonna buy another game for the rest of your life?

not gonna buy another mgs game. or konami game. you suggesting everyone's gonna do this if i buy a copy of mgs v? & that, if i don't, they won't? ...

 

[Majukun]

If someone doesn't buy the microtransactions, how are they hypocrites? You're clearly reaching.

not really difficult to understand

if konami puts microtransaction and doesn't lose money,they have no reason NOT TO put them again in their next game
and other publishers have no reason NOT TO follow themselves

saying you are not gonna buy those coins means zero in preventing this to be the norm,you are still screwing all us over

 

[RandomSeed]

I'd say this is a silver lining.

 

[Red Blaster]

Here's something for you guys to think about.

The way the numbers for these work, some percentage of players (that I'm sure Konami has an estimate for) will participate in the microtransactions.

In fact, I guarantee that a non-zero percentage of people on GAF will do so.

I'd be willing to bet at least one person who says they won't do it, maybe even in this thread, will in fact end up doing it. The justification will change from, "well I'll just not participate in the microtransactions" to "it's only a couple bucks, who cares."

Furthermore, each sale, beyond supporting Konami directly, also supports EVERY company making the decision to do something like this. Because the bitching means nothing when you're all buying it anyway, and you're all potential participants in the microtransaction scheme. You're saying in the loudest way possible (for those looking at the money) that this is okay.

Plenty of you guys are telling yourselves whatever you need to in order to help you sleep at night and buy this game without feeling bad about it. I understand. But you're also hypocrites, and it's okay to accept that. Everyone is at one time or another. But let's not pretend you're making some sort of stand by "only" buying this game. That's a joke.

this is hilariously dumb logic

it's like saying anyone who buys a 3ds ostensibly supports nintendo's decision to region lock their handhelds

 

[A-V-B]

this is hilariously dumb logic

it's like saying anyone who buys a 3ds ostensibly supports nintendo's decision to region lock their handhelds

...I guess it does?

Since all that matters to a company of that size is the bottom line, right?

Lots of money: let's do it, it works

No money: that's bad, let's do something else

 

[Kamina777]

not really difficult to understand

if konami puts microtransaction and doesn't lose money,they have no reason NOT TO put them again in their next game
and other publishers have no reason NOT TO follow themselves

saying you are not gonna buy those coins means zero in preventing this to be the norm,you are still screwing all us over

Buy spending my own money on a game I want to play; I'm screwing YOU and millions of people I don't know over? Listen to yourself duder. It's almost like there's a subset of gamers who want to see this game fail so bad, Konami isn't helping either.

 

[Majukun]

not gonna buy another mgs game. or konami game. you suggesting everyone's gonna do this if i buy a copy of mgs v? & that, if i don't, they won't? ...

yes,every publisher will do this
just like every publisher now does dlc,even though people "didn't buy them" back in the day

again,not very difficult to understand..so problem you and other simply don't want to

 

[hwy_61]

this is hilariously dumb logic

it's like saying anyone who buys a 3ds ostensibly supports nintendo's decision to region lock their handhelds

I bet there are a number of people who feel that it is actually.

 

[Majukun]

Buy spending my own money on a game I'm screwing you over? Listen to yourself duder.

yes,by supporting such practice,you are screwing all us gamers over

you are expressing a vote,a vote that will matter for us all in the future

 

[Coffee Dog]

not really difficult to understand

if konami puts microtransaction and doesn't lose money,they have no reason NOT TO put them again in their next game
and other publishers have no reason NOT TO follow themselves

saying you are not gonna buy those coins means zero in preventing this to be the norm,you are still screwing all us over

Nobody has any reason not to put microtransactions in their games anymore. They're in uncharted 4's multiplayer. They're in TLOU's multiplayer. They're in ME3's multiplayer. And now they're just in MGSV's multiplayer.

The ship sailed years ago. It's been "the norm" for a long time and it's continued success means it's going to stay.

 

[Trey]

People are buying MGSV for the story, cutscenes etc directed and written by Kojima. Paying for additional FOBs isn't going to change shit for most fans of the series. Believe it or not, most people play through games once and don't aim for 100%&achievemnts etc.
MGO and possible microtransactions aren't really the reason people are pre ordering since MGO doesn't come out till over a month later. Seriously, how many calls for stop pre ordering are you all going to make. Reddit, GAF, Tumblr etc have all attempted this shit and failed... and you're trying to start some shit over the online components of a game series renowned for its single player.
Konami *might* change this if people complain loud enough but criticising people for buying MGSV due to this is foolishness.

It's not criticism. There's stuff we don't like in a lot of things we buy. But the benefit of the purchase is greater than the downsides, so we buy. That's basic consumerism, weighing the pros and cons, and coming to a decision. But understand, you are complicit with Konami employing the FOB macrotransactions scheme by buying the base game. You are looking at the product, which includes this FOB situation, and deciding the enterprise is worth it on the whole. Your money goes in to Konami's wallet. That's how it goes. We all do it to some degree, and owning up to it is healthy.

I would go so far as to say you can complain about the FOB pay2win system, even if you purchased the game. It's still feedback, even if it's not heard as loudly as a lost purchase.

 

[Majukun]

this is hilariously dumb logic

it's like saying anyone who buys a 3ds ostensibly supports nintendo's decision to region lock their handhelds

that's exactly what happened

 

[Roni]

Feel like putting the money down just to mislead management into thinking this was a great idea and force their hand into introducing this mechanic in another expensive title. The fire will be glorious to watch when the next non-Kojima game hits.

 

[CDV13]

yes,by supporting such practice,you are screwing all us gamers over

you are expressing a vote,a vote that will matter for us all in the future

My god. This is so dramatic.

 

[soultron]

yes,every publisher will do this
just like every publisher now does dlc,even though people "didn't buy them" back in the day

again,not very difficult to understand..so problem you and other simply don't want to

Konami is a company transitioning away from the AAA space. This is the last time many of us will be buying one of their products. Don't act like they're the norm.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

thank you
every copy sold of this game is a "yes" to microtransaction in the future

Shrug. I'm ok with that.

 

[LilJoka]

People buy the game = people don't care
Matters more to a publisher than
People buy the game and don't use microtranactions

 

[Kamina777]

yes,by supporting such practice,you are screwing all us gamers over

you are expressing a vote,a vote that will matter for us all in the future

I don't think you get how business works. Vote with your wallet is a misnomer that you are taking way too seriously.

 

[Quick Mustard]

Journalists were able to finish it without the FOB stuff. (At the fun review event, sure.)

You're not going to make me feel bad about buying the game, playing it, enjoying it, and not buying any of the MTs.

I'm saying it here and now. If the MTs are set up in such a way that it ruins enjoyment I'll get a Steam refund and drop the game cold.

There are people in the OT who have sunk tens of hours into this game already and haven't made a peep about FOBs being an issue.

They won't have had an issue yet since this is for the online section which isn't activated.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I think what gets me is that despite forcing KojiPro to monetize MGSV to the extreme with:

- Paid Prologue (Ground Zeroes)
- All that MGSV merch.
- FOB microtransactions (MB Coins)
& whatever the hell is going on with MGO3

Konami still fucks Kojima and his staff under some "NOT GOOD ENOUGH" firestorm. Like... what WOULD have been good enough? Releasing each Chapter as Episodic so the full game costed like $120+?

 

[Akainu]

So you can't get the coins without paying for them?

 

[BruceCLea]

Not gonna buy any.

 

[Ralemont]

yes,by supporting such practice,you are screwing all us gamers over

you are expressing a vote,a vote that will matter for us all in the future

You are expressing no vote on microtransactions by buying the game.

The FOB mode takes resources to develop for Konami. If zero people buy MTs while playing the FOB, then their next game simply won't have an FOB mode.

You are misallocating the blame since any scenario where people get screwed over supposes a certain population buying enough MTs to make the development of an FOB mode worthwhile for Konami. Therefore, place blame on those buying MTs instead of desperately trying to shame people who are at worst a neutral factor for Konami.

 

[Majukun]

Nobody has any reason not to put microtransactions in their games anymore. They're in uncharted 4's multiplayer. They're in TLOU's multiplayer. They're in ME3's multiplayer. And now they're just in MGSV's multiplayer.

The ship sailed years ago. It's been "the norm" for a long time and it's continued success means it's going to stay.

just like nobody had a reason to not go onine only with their next console, right?

damn how fast gamer have forgotten what little victory we achieved and how we did it.

 

[Emperor_Uriel]

As a PC gamer, I have confidence that we will find salvation from Konami's devilry through Cheat Engine.

 

[Chirotera]

f2p stays from FREE TO PLAY

putting microtransaction in a free game is acceptable

putting them in a SIXTY BUCKS game is not,it never has and it never will be,put people continuing buying those games because they "can't stay without mgs" will contribute to making this the norm.

i wanted dragon age inquisition,i didn't bought it because it had microtransaction

Not disagreeing with you, but if there's one company that has done microtransactions (god I hate using this word) right, it's BioWare. The ones in question, like Mass Effect 3, really aren't all that necessary for leveling up. You still get decent gear by just playing the game. They also introduce free multiplayer DLC that expands what's already there.

It's still shitty, but it's not the levels of Konami shitty we're seeing here as none of what I just talked about at all affected the single player experience. It really was a matter of helping people out that have money, but not time. Even then, the time to upgrade stuff was reasonable, especially when the gameplay (at least in ME3) was a lot of fun.

 

[A-V-B]

I think what gets me is that despite forcing KojiPro to monetize MGSV to the extreme with:

- Paid Prologue (Ground Zeroes)
- All that MGSV merch.
- FOB microtransactions (MB Coins)
& whatever the hell is going on with MGO3

Konami still fucks Kojima and his staff under some "NOT GOOD ENOUGH" firestorm. Like... what WOULD have been good enough? Releasing each Chapter as Episodic so the full game costed like $120+?

If only you'd been on Konami's team in time!

 

[Boke1879]

yes,by supporting such practice,you are screwing all us gamers over

you are expressing a vote,a vote that will matter for us all in the future

Man you aint stopping me from buying this game and playing the single player campaign.

People have already beaten this game and haven't said a WORD about FOB's or anything of the sort diminishing their experience.

Konami won't get a single cent from me regarding this shit. That's where I take my stand.

I buy this game to support Kojima and his final chapters in a series that I've grown up with and that has changed my life.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

just like nobody had a reason to not go onine only with their next console, right?

damn how fast gamer have forgotten what little victory we achieved and how we did it.

lol
What are you talking about?

 

[semiconscious]

yes,every publisher will do this
just like every publisher now does dlc,even though people "didn't buy them" back in the day

again,not very difficult to understand..so problem you and other simply don't want to

we've all got blood on our hands, son. & we all pick'n'choose our battles. in this case, i choose not to battle konami over a hideo kojima game. i know i'm 'part of the problem', in this instance. just like we're all part of all kinds of problem...

you pick'n'choose your battles, & i'll pick'n'choose mine ...

 

[Coffee Dog]

People buy the game = people don't care
Matters more to a publisher than
People buy the game and don't use microtranactions

Sure, let's run with this. Boycott enabled, MGSV will underperform, and that will somehow convince the publishers of the world that the wildly successful microtransaction business model is at fault?

 

[Aces&Eights]

thank you
every copy sold of this game is a "yes" to microtransaction in the future

That's not true. I will buy the game but I won't spend one penny on micros. If everybody does the same, the micros will generate zero revenue. That means the cost and time they spent making them yielded them no returns. It wouldn't take long for developers to stop putting them into games.

What will encourage them to keep putting them in games is people spending money on the micros. That is where the problem lies. If no one ever bought hats for their in game characters, developers would stop making hats available. Supply and Demand 101.

 

[biteren]

Shrug. I'm ok with that.

 

[TheSpoiler]

How would Konami know you are taking a stand against MTs by not buying their game? It could be a whole host of reasons why someone wouldn't buy MGSV. Maybe they don't like the story, the open world gameplay, the graphics, whatever. It's just an empty shot in the dark, far from tangibly related in their eyes.

Since that long winded post of nothing was obviously confused, I'll break it down.

Buy the game = Konami gets your money and knows you like said game.
Buy the game and use MT = Konami gets your money and knows you like said game and MTs.
Don't buy the game = Konami has no idea why they didn't get your money.
Buy the game but don't use MT = Konami sees how ineffective MTs with players.

The last point COULD lead to a deeper inclusion, as some companies take that as a sign to up the MTs, but not always. And while talking about it here doesn't help all that much in the grand scheme attention wise, going on Twitter, Facebook, or any public space and airing your complaints does. It happened with Ass Creed's terrible launch, Batman's horrible port, and Capcom's general stance on MTs, and it can happen again.

What I'm saying is, you don't have to buy the game to let them know you hate this practice, but you can still buy it and not engage in the shitty part of it and not feel bad, if you so chose.

 

[hwy_61]

lol
What are you talking about?

He's talking about Xbox one.

 

[A-V-B]

just like nobody had a reason to not go onine only with their next console, right?

damn how fast gamer have forgotten what little victory we achieved and how we did it.

To be fair, that was Sony's victory first, ours second.

 

[Foffy]

More resources = you can take on more missions at the same time, if I understand what dawg said anyway.

Isn't it Outer Ops, though? Missions where you send your staff out to do.

Unless I am wrong about that, I thought those returned.

 

[Scrooged]

no,everyone is screwing us
just like with dlc,,if people don't STOP BUYING THE GAMES,the publishers will continue to put them until every game will have them,doesn't matter if multiplayer or single player focused

you know why?because if they are not losing money,they have no reason not to.

they will stop only when money is going out eir pocket (see xbone),if it doesn't they will continue,and do it worse next time.

No, if nobody buys their games they will just...stop making games. You're being a bit naive to think that they'll look at their bottom line, see that the games just aren't selling, and go "we should just remove the DLC and microtransactions, yeah!", and then continue to make more AAA games.

 

[soultron]

They won't have had an issue yet since this is for the online section which isn't activated.

And it doesn't stop you from completing the SP campaign and having a good time doing so, which is how many people in the OT currently playing the game seem to be experiencing it -- all without any FOB enhancement.

 

[Coffee Dog]

just like nobody had a reason to not go onine only with their next console, right?

damn how fast gamer have forgotten what little victory we achieved and how we did it.

MS had the only reason that mattered: when they presented their ideas to the masses, they found that it would cost them money.

Microtransactions work. They are tested. They are proven.