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[vcc]

That's a real stretch IMO. Even if little Jimmy is this clever, Little Jimmy still wants to play with all his friends

Will be monitoring the lil Jimmy situation closely...

Stretch? This is a huge factor in PC sales. Back to school sales are a enormous percentage of computer hardware sales.

PS. QB min req at dell is $1050 CAD (~$782 USD) or $600 CAD (~$447 USD) at newegg. Sporadic deals may make PCs of this spec cheaper and time will eventually make it cheaper than a XB1.

 

[Helznicht]

True, but I could see any PC Manufacture seeing this announcement trying to figure out how to drive their price down to Console levels to attempt to take some of this market away from Microsoft. Even if they could get within $50-$100 of Xbox One's price they might be able to market this and make a killing.

They have to pay MS for the OS. MS gets it for free. Where they gonna make up ~$100, that is IF MS doesn't subsidize them at all.

Steam machines are here, slap win10 on and go today if you want. They will never be cheaper than a MS branded xbox at similar power levels.

But if your willing to spend a couple hundred bucks more, you open yourself up to all Xbox/PC gaming has to offer in the future..

 

[Trup1aya]

Stretch? This is a huge factor in PC sales. Back to school sales are a enormous percentage of computer hardware sales.

But do back to school sales concert significant numbers of console gamers into PC gamers?

Maybe they will now, but I doubt it.

 

[Sydle]

Your trying to strawman again. The reality is the value to a potential customer is now different; some choices will change.

Folk rarely buy a system for just 1 game. It's often a handful of games and the potential for more. Each system may have some interest to them and now one of the system is less unqiue.

It's not like this is really novel thinking. Folks in all those companies get paid to look at things like this. I am nearly reading a marketing text book to you.

Or more unique if you're into their value props of UWA and whatever they're going to do on the hardware side with more frequent refreshes.

 

[gamz]

But do back to school sales concert significant numbers of console gamers into PC gamers?

Maybe they will now, but I doubt it.

LOL! The day back to school day means back to school day for gamers....We really have re-think our education system.

 

[vcc]

But do back to school sales concert significant numbers of console gamers into PC gamers?

Maybe they will now, but I doubt it.

It's more that many young XB gamers already have both. Their PC may not run QB but they likely have a laptop or PC for school. The consideration may not be even a whole system but just a video card upgrade. It's $150 to get one as good as the min or better.

Fact remains; both this announcement and the w10 store getting XB1 exclusives causes problems for the XB1.

 

[vcc]

Or more unique if you're into their value props of UWA and whatever they're going to do on the hardware side with more frequent refreshes.

Depends; for right now the implication reduces sales until they allow pre-orders of the 'refresh'.

 

[gamz]

It's more that many young XB gamers already have both. Their PC may not run QB but they likely have a laptop or PC for school. The consideration may not be even a whole system but just a video card upgrade. It's $150 to get one as good as the min or better.

Fact remains; both this announcement and the w10 store getting XB1 exclusives causes problems for the XB1.

You think their school laptop can run QB?

What if timmy is running ChromeOS? Tho?

 

[RedSwirl]

So, unless the console's APU & OS is identical to the weaker Xbox,

I think this is exactly how an incrementally upgraded console would work, and even potentially the leap to the next entire console generation, just significantly upclocked, or a new version of that APU and OS (like the jump from Apple's A7 to A8 processors or something). Thus, the phone upgrade comparison.

I will admit however that getting developers to actually support UWA is a whole other issue for Microsoft.

 

[slavesnyder]

Did you notice that UWA and MAU are nearly an anagram?

 

[vcc]

You think their school laptop can run QB?

What if timmy is running ChromeOS? Tho?

You were never a gamer kid? Never begged for a bit too much hardware for a 'school' computer? A laptop that can run is is ~$1000 USD.

 

[Zedox]

You were never a gamer kid? Never begged for a bit too much hardware for a 'school' computer? A laptop that can run is is ~$1000 USD.

This is just me (and I'm not even in the discussion yall having) but we had 1 desktop computer in the house and I always had to beg for gaming consoles (we were poor). The only thing that was personal about that personal computer was that I realized how many people called the house and kicked me off of AOL.

 

[vcc]

This is just me (and I'm not even in the discussion yall having) but we had 1 desktop computer in the house and I always had to beg for gaming consoles (we were poor). The only thing that was personal about that personal computer was that I realized how many people called the house and kicked me off of AOL.

Ditto poor. We had that 1 PC for a while. We were too poor for call waiting so it was only the fury of parents impatient for the phone which kicked me off BBS's.

Waiting 14h for a download then having someone pick up the phone and having to start over is awful too.

I got 2 computers and 1 NES from my parents. Back in the 80's and 90's when the $200 NES was almost a full weeks work for my dad and the computers were $2500 or around 3 months pay.

 

[Trup1aya]

It's more that many young XB gamers already have both. Their PC may not run QB but they likely have a laptop or PC for school. The consideration may not be even a whole system but just a video card upgrade. It's $150 to get one as good as the min or better.

Fact remains; both this announcement and the w10 store getting XB1 exclusives causes problems for the XB1.

The availability of Xbox exclusives isn't simply not going to cause significant numbers of people who prefer consoles to invest in gaming rigs. Nor is it going to encourage people to choose systems that don't have the games they want to play. Even if they did, they aren't going to let that stop them from getting the console they need to play the games they want.


You are overestimating effect of this announcement on people interest in Converting to PC and on people's interest in the xb1 console. People who prefer console don't care what's available on PC.

Perhaps this overestimation is based on your frequency of this forum, which is filled with enthusiasts who are more likely to consider changing their mode of play or already have gaming rigs. But Gaf if isn't reflective of the general population.

 

[vcc]

The availability of Xbox exclusives isn't simply not going to cause significant numbers of people who prefer consoles to invest in gaming rigs. Nor is it going to encourage people to choose systems that don't have the games they want to play.

You are overestimating effect of this announcement on people interest in Converting to PC and on people's interest in the xb1 console. People who prefer console don't care what's available on PC.

Perhaps this overestimation is based on your frequency of this forum, which is filled with enthusiasts who are more likely to consider changing their mode of play or already have gaming rigs. But Gaf if isn't reflective of the general population.

You realize I never attached a magnitude to anything. Just saying it will have a measurable effect. We will see in the NPD if we get numbers what the magnitude it. But both the w10 versions and the implication of upgrades will have some effect.

 

[Trup1aya]

You realize I never attached a magnitude to anything. Just saying it will have a measurable effect. We will see in the NPD if we get numbers what the magnitude it. But both the w10 versions and the implication of upgrades will have some effect.

It will have an effect. But it will be negligable.

Interested in the effects seeing the implication of impending upgrades though. It doesn't seem to affect any other consumer products. The fact that there has been no marketing campaign yet, no mention of pricing makes me think that people will keep buying. I think consumer reaction will be similar to when new SKUs are rumored, then announced.

 

[vcc]

It will have an effect. But it will be negligable.

Interested in the effects seeing the implication of impending upgrades though. It doesn't seem to affect any other consumer products. The fact that there has been no marketing campaign yet, no mention of pricing makes me think that people will keep buying. I think consumer reaction will be similar to when new SKUs are rumored, then announced.

It depends on how 'aware' the customers are. In markets where enthusiasts exist it tends to decimate sales unless it's very regular and the timing is not known. Lots of case studies exist of where a exec mentions a new version and the current ones sales tank. The more interested the customer base the greater the effect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect

 

[jtb]

makes sense

the playstation model is dead, gotta chase that Apple iterative money instead (which, tbh, has actually turned out shockingly well for gaming)

 

[Trup1aya]

It depends on how 'aware' the customers are. In markets where enthusiasts exist it tends to decimate sales unless it's very regular and the timing is not known. Lots of case studies exist of where a exec mentions a new version and the current ones sales tank. The more interested the customer base the greater the effect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect

Console gamers are used to getting multiple sku's throughout a console generation. Prior to an actual marketing campaign with pricing and more concrete information, I can't see these rumors having much more impact than rumors of an Xbox slim or an Xbox elite.

 

[Ushay]

Console gamers are used to getting multiple sku's throughout a console generation. Prior to an actual marketing campaign with pricing and more concrete information, I can't see these rumors having much more impact than rumors of an Xbox slim or an Xbox elite.

Those SKUs have primarily been lateral upgrades such as HD space, if word gets out I can see sales being affected employees particularly after E3. We have literally no idea what kind of timescale MS is looking at for release/announcement.

 

[Trup1aya]

Those SKUs have primarily been lateral upgrades such as HD space, if word gets out I can see sales being affected employees particularly after E3. We have literally no idea what kind of timescale MS is looking at for release/announcement.

Oh I'm absolutely aware that an upgrade of this nature is unprecedented. I just don't the think effects on the market will differ much from when people are expecting lateral upgrades.

Will the casual, price conscious gamer who has yet to join the current gen be interested in holding out for the SKU that is likely to be sold at a premium, Especially if the only benefit is prettier graphics?

Or will they want to be able to finally play the hottest games, right away.

I'm very interested to see how it plays out, though.

PS, what did you mean in place of the word "employees"

 

[Zedox]

Ditto poor. We had that 1 PC for a while. We were too poor for call waiting so it was only the fury of parents impatient for the phone which kicked me off BBS's.

Waiting 14h for a download then having someone pick up the phone and having to start over is awful too.

I got 2 computers and 1 NES from my parents. Back in the 80's and 90's when the $200 NES was almost a full weeks work for my dad and the computers were $2500 or around 3 months pay.

That's why Download Accelerator was so clutch, it saved your progress in a download. Man, those days. *sigh* Crazy world we live now. Lol

 

[vcc]

That's why Download Accelerator was so clutch, it saved your progress in a download. Man, those days. *sigh* Crazy world we live now. Lol

Back then it was zmodem vs xmodem or ymodem protocols. Getting a telnet (Telix was it I think) like client that could use zmodem was great. Saving for and getting a 28.8k then a 56k modem.

Even ran a bbs with a friend which taught me a ton of the skills I use now for work.

 

[SneakersSO]

Well, I guess we'll see. I think the man-hours required for something like that are miniscule, and would probably mostly blend in with the general testing of multiple PC configurations.

Testing multiple PC configs is such a monumental task most triple-A publishers have had several examples of failing to do it properly or to a level of consumer satisfaction for a long, long time now. In most cases, they were shipping games on engines that had already had a retail release, meaning some sort of code precedent was available to them. There have been significant examples of these failures in the last year alone.

Do not underestimate the amount of money & effort it will take to add another development pipeline to a project. A separate code-base would require just as much QA as any other build of the game. In the case of another closed box console game, your title has to undergo another certification process. And this applies to all content I create for my title, not just the initial release.

 

[MilkyJoe]

Super PC--check. Wheel--check. Rift preorder--check. Missing my ex-gf, no check.

Living my dream, sir

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

I think people are vastly misinterpreting what Phil said and mean't.

He was just using PR fluff speak to basically say one thing > They are cutting the Xbox One gen short and starting again with a new console, in a similar fashion as Xbox > Xbox 360.

Only this time it's fully compatible with the old model and games.

Seems obvious to me. A new, vastly upgraded Xbox will soon be on the market. Holiday 2017 at the latest is my guess.

 

[Clear]

Seems obvious to me. A new, vastly upgraded Xbox will soon be on the market. Holiday 2017 at the latest is my guess.

Very probably. Unfortunately that value proposition will be somewhat diminished by all its key exclusives being also available on PC and putting it in direct competition with that platform.

Meanwhile PS4 will be sitting on a huge and mature install-base making it the de-facto base specification for most AAA titles and ensuring that owners of that system will not feel like they are "losing out".

 

[Synth]

Testing multiple PC configs is such a monumental task most triple-A publishers have had several examples of failing to do it properly or to a level of consumer satisfaction for a long, long time now. In most cases, they were shipping games on engines that had already had a retail release, meaning some sort of code precedent was available to them. There have been significant examples of these failures in the last year alone.

Do not underestimate the amount of money & effort it will take to add another development pipeline to a project. A separate code-base would require just as much QA as any other build of the game. In the case of another closed box console game, your title has to undergo another certification process. And this applies to all content I create for my title, not just the initial release.

Yea, because there are so many different potential PC configurations, so establishing a range and testing across them is messy. This would be a single extra fixed configuration that won't be a constantly moving target. You say that developers that work with commonly established engines have the a precedent to them.. well this would be true for any game shipping for an upgraded Xbox One, there will always be the precedent of what the performance delta between it and the standard consoles tends to represent.

Also, this entire discussion is based on the premise that XB1 will run every game an XB1.5 does, and an XB1.5 runs every game an XB1 does.. this includes all games going back to launch (so you could play Ryse and Forza 5 on an XB1.5). You can use whatever assumptions you feel necessary to make this work, such as your previous "same architecture, but better" scenario... but we're not having a discussion of two entire unique codebases for each console, so I'm not interested in returning to that side-convo here.

I think people are vastly misinterpreting what Phil said and mean't.

He was just using PR fluff speak to basically say one thing > They are cutting the Xbox One gen short and starting again with a new console, in a similar fashion as Xbox > Xbox 360.

Only this time it's fully compatible with the old model and games.

Seems obvious to me. A new, vastly upgraded Xbox will soon be on the market. Holiday 2017 at the latest is my guess.

It seems you're misinterpreting it even more tbh. He states both backwards and forwards compatibility for the new hardware... so not only can the new Xbox play Xbox One games... but the Xbox One would continue to play the new games being released. So it's nothing like an OG Xbox to Xbox 360 transition at all.

 

[Fafalada]

They really can't avoid competing with steam as they're both stores with many of the same clients and customers.

That isn't the point - it's about messaging and differentiating value proposition to distance themselves from store-fronts like Steam. Perceived value is the only thing that really matters (and dominant players continually demonstrate that).

There is a question of leverage on the business side too. On the XB1, they hold the keys and they can say "if you want access to our 21m install base, you need ot pay use $7 per unit off the top." For the w10 store the sell is harder, the system is open and they need to offer some upside to selling it stand alone or paying steam for the exposure.

Microsoft's system isn't open. If XB1 actually becomes part of UWP(not just a PR message), you've just allowed developer to sell the same XB title on the store for all Windows devices instead of just console. The whole point is that incentive-ising from PC side is a lost cause, whereas XB1 support is still a "given" at this point.

How's any of that feedback to XB1? more 'apps'. What type for what purpose? Doesn't it still make it a worse deal?

Not in any measurable way - XB gets the same software support, until it doesn't anymore, which is the case with every fixed-box in history. The purpose is simply to grow that software support into a larger marketplace, which may or may not have dedicated devices for it in the future (it really becomes arbitrary if they want to ever make another fixed box).

Mind you I'm not arguing whether this is a viable approach or not - but it's one where centralization actually serves a purpose.

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

It seems you're misinterpreting it even more tbh. He states both backwards and forwards compatibility for the new hardware... so not only can the new Xbox play Xbox One games... but the Xbox One would continue to play the new games being released. So it's nothing like an OG Xbox to Xbox 360 transition at all.

Sure, new games will still work on the Xbox One (until they phase it out), and all current XB1 games play on the new machine.

I think that's the most likely scenario, rather than all this speculation about new hardware every 1-2 years. Or upgradable hardware.

Microsoft made big mistakes with the Xbox One and are getting trounced by Sony
They have pretty much done it before with the original Xbox
Nintendo are effectively doing the same thing
They don't want to miss out on the VR train

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

Very probably. Unfortunately that value proposition will be somewhat diminished by all its key exclusives being also available on PC and putting it in direct competition with that platform.

Meanwhile PS4 will be sitting on a huge and mature install-base making it the de-facto base specification for most AAA titles and ensuring that owners of that system will not feel like they are "losing out".

Not really, the majority of console buyers dont really care. If the game is still exclusive on console that's the main thing. Most console gamers dont own a capable PC.

They would be looking to sell to -

Current XB1 owners
People who are yet to buy a next gen console
Getting some PS4 owners to switch

A better specced Xbox would get AAA games developed to it's specifications, just as the PS4 does now. Multi plat games are already much higher specced for the PC releases so it's not like they would be having to do any real extra work.

Edit - oops 2 posts

 

[Ushay]

Oh I'm absolutely aware that an upgrade of this nature is unprecedented. I just don't the think effects on the market will differ much from when people are expecting lateral upgrades.

Will the casual, price conscious gamer who has yet to join the current gen be interested in holding out for the SKU that is likely to be sold at a premium, Especially if the only benefit is prettier graphics?

Or will they want to be able to finally play the hottest games, right away.

I'm very interested to see how it plays out, though.

PS, what did you mean in place of the word "employees"

Sorry dude, damn auto correct on my phone!

Back to what you just said, graphics have been the loudest drum to bang this gen ie resolutiongate. I get the impression power users/gamers like ourselves will at the very least be inquisitive as to what the performance gains are on the new SKUs. Especially if the price is right. Then again I'm just being optimistic here.

Back then it was zmodem vs xmodem or ymodem protocols. Getting a telnet (Telix was it I think) like client that could use zmodem was great. Saving for and getting a 28.8k then a 56k modem.

Even ran a bbs with a friend which taught me a ton of the skills I use now for work.

You work fixed line networks? That's what I do!

 

[tayls129]

If we could just get Sunset Overdrive on PC, I'd be happy.

 

[Abinash117]

Console gamers are used to getting multiple sku's throughout a console generation. Prior to an actual marketing campaign with pricing and more concrete information, I can't see these rumors having much more impact than rumors of an Xbox slim or an Xbox elite.

I think that doesn't change his argument, like in previous generations I'm sure when the newer versions was announced like slim the sales of the previous version dropped I guess the same can be said for the Nintendo handhelds too.I could be wrong since I don't have the information.

 

[rokkerkory]

If windows10 games can run on all platforms (incl xbox and PC) for one price of admission, I am so there

 

[Art Vandilay]

If we could just get Sunset Overdrive on PC, I'd be happy.

This should happen. SO was a lot of fun, it would be nice to see it become available to a larger audience.

 

[Complicated]

I'm coming around to the idea of Holiday 2016 being new console time. A new hardware revision every three years seems like the sweet spot in terms of getting better internals without leaving a huge gap between the hardware revisions. They could then either have 6 or 9 years of support for the current XB1. So when the second hardware revision comes in 2019 they could drop game support for XB1 (2013) going forward and then the 2016 model becomes the new low end for developer support. That way they only have two hardware platforms with ongoing development at any one time just like the Sith.

Of course, since they're updating hardware and staying more up to date graphically they might want to support things longer and phase out the current XB1 in 2022. This would mean having three hardware models (2013, 2016, and 2019 models) supported at any given time. I think either one is reasonable, but the current Xbox being the low end for that long combined with the need for developer to configure their games for three different Xbox's makes it less likely.

 

[HAWDOKEN]

The conversation in here seems all over the place so I'll just throw in my two cents.

I posted this to the xbox feedback site back in September which is basically the same concept Phil Spencer was outlining in his speech. I think this is the next logical move for MS to make and I think it could be very popular with enthusiasts, but it really depends on how they sell it.

I think it would be wise for them to sell the baseline hardware in retail stores, but offer the "elite" SKUs online. Provide an interface for people to order the hardware with the various pre-fab specs similarly to how they currently sell surface tablets. The SKUs don't have to look different from each other either. That should hammer home that an xbox is an xbox, regardless of SKU, but performance may vary depending on the one chosen.

 

[MilkyJoe]

The conversation in here seems all over the place so I'll just throw in my two cents.

I posted this to the xbox feedback site back in September which is basically the same concept Phil Spencer was outlining in his speech. I think this is the next logical move for MS to make and I think it could be very popular with enthusiasts, but it really depends on how they sell it.

I think it would be wise for them to sell the baseline hardware in retail stores, but offer the "elite" SKUs online. Provide an interface for people to order the hardware with the various pre-fab specs similarly to how they currently sell surface tablets. The SKUs don't have to look different from each other either. That should hammer home that an xbox is an xbox, regardless of SKU, but performance may vary depending on the one chosen.

Jeepers....

There's calling it and there's crystal balling it.

 

[EvB]

I think it would be wise for them to sell the baseline hardware in retail stores, but offer the "elite" SKUs online.

Nope.

It'll be sold in at retail, like most consoles are.
This serves 3 purposes

It creates a larger scale used hardware market for Games retail, as the used software side of business declines throwing retail a bone that benefits both parties is going to help to keep them on-side as consumers gradually move away from physical software.
,
If a new model becomes a regular occurrence ( e.g. every 2-3 years) then a portion of people are going to want to trade in their old machine towards a new one.

For Microsoft this means that there are more lower cost old units available in circulation, which in itself provides a lower price point (without having to reduce the price of the new hardware) which in turn creates more users, which then contributes towards generating live subscriptions and brings in revenue from digital/new game purchases also.

 

[Trup1aya]

I think that doesn't change his argument, like in previous generations I'm sure when the newer versions was announced like slim the sales of the previous version dropped I guess the same can be said for the Nintendo handhelds too.I could be wrong since I don't have the information.

Yeah, there is a drop, but there isn't the decimation... These types of drops are offset by renewed interest in the new hardware and better margins.

So sales of the existing hardware is typically replaced and/or exceeded by pre sales of the new hardware.

The Osborn effect usually doesn't come into play in markets like this, where consumers expect hardware revisions mid cycle.

The only X factor is that revisions to this hardware are more extreme. I'm willing to bet the market won't react too much differently.

 

[Frustrated_me]

The conversation in here seems all over the place so I'll just throw in my two cents.

I posted this to the xbox feedback site back in September which is basically the same concept Phil Spencer was outlining in his speech. I think this is the next logical move for MS to make and I think it could be very popular with enthusiasts, but it really depends on how they sell it.

I think it would be wise for them to sell the baseline hardware in retail stores, but offer the "elite" SKUs online. Provide an interface for people to order the hardware with the various pre-fab specs similarly to how they currently sell surface tablets. The SKUs don't have to look different from each other either. That should hammer home that an xbox is an xbox, regardless of SKU, but performance may vary depending on the one chosen.

Man.. Well done calling (suggesting) it.

 

[vcc]

You work fixed line networks? That's what I do!

I do a bunch of stuff. Server admin side, network admin, business management side, web dev, SEO, cable drops, etc... working for a small company.

 

[tinfoilhatman]

Direct3D 12 certainly doesn't.

Remember when all the "experts" on here(and Beyond 3D) said XB1 BC would NEVER EVER EVER EVER happen...........I said it would and got banned(I was being an asshole, but still I was right)

This is infinitely easier to accomplish(for Microsoft), Config 1 for OG XB1, Config 2 for New XB1.5.....developers still code for the lowest common denominator but the new version plays at 1080p at a higher frame rate and more detailed textures and FX.

Not rocket science not even close more like no brainer, haters are just in denial

 

[Malcolm9]

Remember when all the "experts" on here(and Beyond 3D) said XB1 BC would NEVER EVER EVER EVER happen...........I said it would and got banned(I was being an asshole, but still I was right)

This is infinitely easier to accomplish(for Microsoft), Config 1 for OG XB1, Config 2 for New XB1.5.....developers still code for the lowest common denominator but the new version plays at 1080p at a higher frame rate and more detailed textures and FX.

Not rocket science not even close more like no brainer, haters are just in denial

It's emulation rather than real BC.

I still can't see this being a good idea, in fact it will push more gamers towards the PS4, and possibly the NX.

 

[jbug617]

Phil is on the Major Nelson podcast. Starts around 35 minute mark. He specifically talks about the hardware question around the 50min mark.
https://soundcloud.com/xbox/mnr-564-phil-spencer-the-1

 

[Zedox]

It's emulation rather than real BC.

I still can't see this being a good idea, in fact it will push more gamers towards the PS4, and possibly the NX.

It's not emulation if it's running the same code on the same platform just on different hardware. Nothing to say to your second point as it is your opinion.

 

[JaggedSac]

Phil is on the Major Nelson podcast. Starts around 35 minute mark. He specifically talks about the hardware question around the 50min mark.
https://soundcloud.com/xbox/mnr-564-phil-spencer-the-1

Got a short and sweet version of what was said?

 

[jbug617]

Got a short and sweet version of what was said?

They are not going to have a console you have to open and put in new parts. He said what makes a console special is that you plug it in and it works. Mentions about how digital content works now where the music or books you have carry from the old device to the new device.He said that hardware innovations happen he wants them to come sooner instead of waiting 7-8yrs to release new hardware. Has nothing to announce

For me sounds sort something like what happens with iPads.

 

[gamz]

They are not going to have a console you have to open and put in new parts. He said what makes a console special is that you plug it in and it works. Mentions about how digital content works now where the music or books you have carry from the old device to the new device.He said that hardware innovations happen he wants them to come sooner instead of waiting 7-8yrs to release new hardware. Has nothing to announce

For me sounds sort something like what happens with iPads.

Pretty much what we thought. I can't Fucking wait!