SneakyStephan
Banned
Dark souls 3 needs a 4ghz intel quad core to maintain 60 fps on pc , it uses the same engine.
Definitely cpu limited, so bloodborne probably was too.
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Digital Foundry: Neo GPU are point-for-point a match for RX 480
- Thread starter Shtof
- Start date
Dark souls 3 needs a 4ghz intel quad core to maintain 60 fps on pc , it uses the same engine.
Definitely cpu limited, so bloodborne probably was too.
Long Division
Banned
People make silly assumptions or reasoning and people correct them, nothing wrong with it.
nelsonroyale
Member
Fair enough. Personally that isn't particularly interesting since I can't play stuff the few PS exclusives. There are probably 2-3 games per hear that I am actually really anticipating, and the rest I buy because they look pretty good. If playstation became a software platform that launched across hardware, then sure I would go with a gaming PC.
Makes sense to me with new consoles on the way and AMD ramping up production on a new GPU. Good news all around for these new systems.
This leaves room for up-clocking to remain competitive with MS if Scorpio is as much a beast as the rumors.
This leaves room for up-clocking to remain competitive with MS if Scorpio is as much a beast as the rumors.
You can't just upclock willy-nilly.
It runs at the clock it does for thermal reasons most likely, this could be a cooling limitation on the design they are using.
If they are using the same GPU then we know that the power advantage is a direct performance advantage unlike if we were comparing different cards... that makes this interesting.
The day you will understand consoles are just dedicated gaming hardware, as PC can be too (but not only), and that the success of consoles/PCs benefits the whole range of gaming possibilities, maybe you will stop this shit?
Let them play on what they want. At the end of the day, we all just want devs to use our hardware like it should, with decent and playable products.
I think that's what I'm saying, never before has it made more sense to lock into one or the other. That makes me sad as someone who has enjoyed both the PC/consoles. I may eventually cave on the new iterations if the exclusives are there, but it's a lot harder to talk myself into it if I know this is the path they're taking.
Care to do an avatar bet?
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Plenty of PC gamers were gushing over this card. I guess it's junk now that it's appearing in a console huh?
There's nothing to correct though. Dude said he was waiting on the Neo and people come quoting him with "b-b-b-but PC has this and that". Who cares, just take your dick out of your preferred box and let people play what they want.
For the near future there won't be such a GPU.
Since when? I don't remember needing a 4ghz cpu.
Long Division
Banned
I was more referring to posts like this
Exclusives AND multiplats? only on Neo.
At this point, some PC gamers just sounds like SJW... "HOW DARE YOU SAYING YOU PREFER CONSOLES!?"
And for a few years, discussion here has been toxic because every post saying something good about consoles is downplayed and aggressively answered.
This wasn't like that before this gen. We were plagued by silly console wars and now we have this... humanity how does it works?
thelastword
Banned
Some persons just have to go on a campaign trail about the gospel of "building a gaming PC", as if console owners don't know that gaming PC's exist. They think that console users are only buying consoles because it's cheaper, so they feel inclined to tell you that you can obtain a GPU for $200, so why the heck are you buying consoles anyway.......SMH..
Caayn
Member
Why are a lot of people in this thread talking about increasing the clock speed as if it's an easy and cost free thing to do?
Besides if the rumours are indeed true the 480 is downclocked in the Neo severely impacting its performance.
Exactly "plenty" meaning not all.
Besides if the rumours are indeed true the 480 is downclocked in the Neo severely impacting its performance.
If the 480 indeed performs as promised. I'm calling it a good card.
Memorabilia
Member
Dammit. Just when I thought I was out, they pull be back in.
I don't think I'll be able to resist pulling the trigger if there's a good trade-in offer. *sigh*
I don't think I'll be able to resist pulling the trigger if there's a good trade-in offer. *sigh*
...Clearly that person was saying he prefers the PS4's combination of exclusives and multiplats versus the PC's combination.
This is surprisingly poor reporting from Eurogamer:
Neo having the same number of CUs as the RX 480 has absolutely no bearing on whether it's using Polaris or 14nm or not. Neo is a custom chip which could (were Sony to desire it) have pretty much any number of CUs they like, regardless of whether it's GCN 1.0 or Polaris or anything in between. The fact that it has 36 is much more likely due to the fact that it's a neat double the number in the PS4, and the RX 480 having the same number is nothing more than coincidence. Trying to infer that they both use 36 CUs, and hence they must be identical in every other way, is a pretty big stretch.
Neo having the same number of CUs as the RX 480 has absolutely no bearing on whether it's using Polaris or 14nm or not. Neo is a custom chip which could (were Sony to desire it) have pretty much any number of CUs they like, regardless of whether it's GCN 1.0 or Polaris or anything in between. The fact that it has 36 is much more likely due to the fact that it's a neat double the number in the PS4, and the RX 480 having the same number is nothing more than coincidence. Trying to infer that they both use 36 CUs, and hence they must be identical in every other way, is a pretty big stretch.
And this doesn't happen in reverse? it also happens a lot to Xbox gamers for not choosing the PS4. Fanboys exist for all platforms, I'd say on here the majority of those type of posts come from PS4 owners but that's just due to how many own the PS4.
OsirisBlack
Banned
No it is not which leads me to believe the XB1 is done.
"The current devkit is not a final representation of the PS4 Neo it is a baseline. Sony is well aware of what Microsoft is doing. They are still weighing the pros and cons of the final retail units specifications."
There was something else in that message that I omitted (for reasons) but it basically stated that the OG PS4 ram situation and the Neo cpu situation could be very similar.
GameAddict411
Member
I said the same in the RX 480 thread. I think the reason why it's running at a much slower clock speed is because of the CPU. It's not able to keep up with the current PS4 GPU. The newer GPU will demand even more processing power which hints at a huge bottleneck; bottlenecks we witnessed with a few games like AC Unity, and the newly released Homefront. Running the GPU at 911 HZ will insure lower TDP and thermals. Having a higher clock speed won't make a difference.
JumPeRJumPzZ
Banned
Sadly there is still that weak CPU :/
There is a difference in putting more ram in a box or to change the whole apu because of a CPU change.
But yes, of course Sony can change whatever they want. But this would also be counterproductive to the narrative that neo is just a small update, a reimagination of the ps4 and no architecture change that some used in their reasoning.
Not to say that MS has had even more time to change hardware as Sony's horse will be the first out of the stable.
GameAddict411
Member
Well, AMD is not going to develope a whole new GPU for Sony. And there is nothing in the market right now with 36 CU or anywhere close to that. Oh, and if it wasn't on the finFIT manufacturing node, the thermal performance would be terrible for a console. It would be significantly larger than the current PS4.
For multiplats I'm probably never picking console over PC again except in very special cases (like Diablo III where the console version isn't online-only and has local co-op). It's not even about power for me anymore, but rather the knowledge my game isn't locked to the whims of a single hardware manufacturer. I'm probably just going to upgrade to a 1070, but the PS4 today seems like a good platform for people who stick entirely to consoles.
Overall I think the PC-like features that have made their way onto consoles are a net positive. The only thing platform holders and publishers have really fucked up compared to PC is digital distribution, but that's a whole other discussion. I see upgraded consoles as a net positive too if manufacturers and publishers don't screw over people who don't immediately upgrade (I don't think third party publishers are stupid enough to).
Overall I think the PC-like features that have made their way onto consoles are a net positive. The only thing platform holders and publishers have really fucked up compared to PC is digital distribution, but that's a whole other discussion. I see upgraded consoles as a net positive too if manufacturers and publishers don't screw over people who don't immediately upgrade (I don't think third party publishers are stupid enough to).
Lifejumper
Member
Wonder what the price will be? 399? 499?
crazygambit
Member
Such as?
Remember they have to keep full compatibility with current PS4 titles, so CPU architecture can't really change all that much here.
Lister
Banned
Why are you always so hostile?
I can't see the Neo CPU situation being comparable to the PS4 ram situation. With the PS4 you're talking about a commoditised drop-in replacement part, which could be changed anywhere up until they get delivery of the GDDR5 modules (i.e. a few months before launch). Switching the Neo CPU from (say) Puma to Zen means an entirely different SoC needs to be taped out, which would take a year at a minimum. Unless Sony is actually taping out two separate SoCs and is only going to choose which one to ramp production on at the last minute (which would be a bizarre and extremely expensive way of going about things), then the Neo CPU is what the Neo CPU is, and there's not much they could do to change it.
I would certainly expect them to tinker with clock speeds up until release, and it's possible they're considering a boost on that front, but I'd be massively surprised if they somehow switched CPU architecture at the last minute.
It's not a matter of developing a whole new GPU. The whole reasoning behind grouping the GCN architecture into CU building blocks is to make it possible to build chips with as many or as few of them as you like as easily as possible (although generally in multiples of four, due to the way cache is shared). The entire basis of their semi-custom business is the fact that Sony, Microsoft or whoever else can go to them and say "I want X CPU cores and Y GPU CUs" and AMD can do that with minimal effort, regardless of what X and Y are.
Furthermore, I'm not saying that Neo is or isn't based on the Polaris architecture, or is or isn't built on 14nm. I'm just saying that this article doesn't give us any evidence one way or the other on either of these things.
The manufacturing process is a good point.. But there was no APU on the market with the same number of CUs as PS4 either when it was released. These are custom chips even if they're based on off-the-shelf architectures, and it's true there's nothing stopping Sony from paying for a port of the Liverpool design to a newer manufacturing node and scaling it out for Neo. AMD/Sony do not literally put PC GPUs into these systems, even if the chip they do design share config similarities with PC cards.
Lister
Banned
Price vs performance vlaue is fantastic, IMHO.
Uh since when?
ethomaz
Banned
All aboard!
nycgamer4ever
Member
I though the rumors were actually 5-6 TF?
Jean Valjean
Member
I just hope it comes out this year.
SneakyStephan
Banned
Since always
You didn't have 60 fps in the swamp or in irithill with a lower end or low clocked cpu
edit: and another one who doesn't believe me
I'm not going through this whole dance again to have the denier admit at the end of it that they had fps drops into the40-50s but didn't mind them, because that's what happens
OsirisBlack
Banned
I agree just sharing what was sent to me my personal thoughts are they would more than likely up clock speeds and remove the power brick if needed but that's about as far as I can see them going.
Edited to add: Been hearing from several buddies in the Dev community as of late and most of them are super excited about what is going on. They think it is a "Logical evolution of the business model." for consoles going forward.
Pretty much their MO throughout Neo/Scorpio reporting - even moreso its behind the DF brand...
ps3ud0 8)
I'm not talking about lower end. Using a i7 2600k at 3.4ghz but who knows maybe i missed it.
Journey
Banned
Yup, not just heat, but the power draw may also increase, and all that could be a waste if the CPU is bottlenecking performance. Still dope news if its using Polaris architecture.
potatohead
Member
Definitely a hard thing.
They have to consider yields for the GPU, and yields factors heavily into cost. Overclocking slightly means increasing the budget needed to buy the GPUs.
So true actually. DF likes to get "creative" if you get my meaning....
MissCauthon
Member
I really hope they make a bigger case , my ps4 is friggin louder than my 12000 dpu air conditioner at full blast. People complaining about it having a bigger case are nuts.
Netherscourge
Banned
Looks like Microsoft will have to sell their Scorpio for a higher price than the Neo, if all these spec rumors are true.
I guess the good news is that the Scorpio will actually have better hardware in it to justify the markup, if it happens.
Standalone RX 480 is $200, so add another $100 for the Neo to make it ~$300ish.
The Scorpio is looking at $400 to $500, unless Microsoft gets really aggressive and sells it at a loss for $300 to go head-to-head with Sony.
The Next-Gen battle should be very interesting to say the least.
I guess the good news is that the Scorpio will actually have better hardware in it to justify the markup, if it happens.
Standalone RX 480 is $200, so add another $100 for the Neo to make it ~$300ish.
The Scorpio is looking at $400 to $500, unless Microsoft gets really aggressive and sells it at a loss for $300 to go head-to-head with Sony.
The Next-Gen battle should be very interesting to say the least.
The Last One
Member
I just hope the Neo doesn't cost more than $400. Since the NX is delayed I'll buy it.
potatohead
Member
The thermal paste on your PS4 has probably gone kaput, or the heatsink is not sitting properly, or there is a crapload of dust in your PS4. Probably some combination of the 3.
I would send it for repair or do it yourself if you're techie enough to do that. It's easier to clean a computer obviously, but consoles work the same way (fans, lots of heat, need love and care, etc).