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[kmag]

I cashed out about a week back, between that and ARM my limited boutique (mostly IT companies who's business I vaguely understand) of non pension share holdings have done ridiculously well. (especially in Nintendo's case when you convert into GBP). Of course, some of the other shares I have are in the UK banking sector so that's not been so good.

I had the Nintendo shares for years as well.

 

[Caipirinha]

Pretty much serves them right for not taking mobile seriously. This should be the biggest wake up call of all time that people want Nintendo games on non-Nintendo hardware.

 

[JoeM86]

Someone at Nintendo really fucked up in letting a dev use their IP with only a 13% stake in the game. They would never do anything close to that in the console space.

You really don't understand how Pokémon ownership is. Nintendo never gets 100% stake in them

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1008721&page=1#post155571604

Pretty much serves them right for not taking mobile seriously. This should be the biggest wake up call of all time that people want Nintendo games on non-Nintendo hardware.

You do know there has been a craptonne of Pokémon games on mobile platforms over the last 5 years and this is the first to do well.

Just because this does well doesn't mean all will

The real question from all this is, how much Nintendo hates themselves for not being more invested in the app, and how they were completely wrong about how to proceed with their properties, thinking people wouldn't eat up a good mobile app with their franchises.

This shows a massive lack of understanding in Nintendo's ownership of Pokémon, investment in Pokémon GO and involvement in Pokémon GO, as well as a lack of historical data showing Pokémon on mobile's lack of success before now

Nintendo should port their real Pokemon games

Yeah no

 

[spekkeh]

There was nothing about that app that screamed huge gains in profitability, speculative traders and rich fools who fell for the believe that Pokemon go was their next Wii.

Investors keep telling Nintendo to go to mobile because that's where the money is. "Nintendo" releases Pokemon Go and it ostensibly makes more money than all the other mobile games combined.

How does that not scream huge gains in profitability.

Pokemon Go is making bank, and so is Nintendo, they've just decided to keep the money in their subsidiaries. Which makes sense, given the fact that Nintendo likely already pays a fortune in taxes over their cash reserve and then needs to pay out dividends. The investors were (riding the tide and) hoping to get dividend out of the success, but Nintendo just told them that wasn't going to happen. Hence the correction.

 

[Phediuk]

That statement was accurate, though.

 

[wapplew]

Pretty much serves them right for not taking mobile seriously. This should be the biggest wake up call of all time that people want Nintendo games on non-Nintendo hardware.

The stock dropped, not the game. Game still alive and breaking records like breakfast.

 

[fabricated backlash]

Investors keep telling Nintendo to go to mobile because that's where the money is. "Nintendo" releases Pokemon Go and it ostensibly makes more money than all the other mobile games combined.

How does that not scream huge gains in profitability.

Pokemon Go is making bank, and so is Nintendo, they've just decided to keep the money in their subsidiaries. Which makes sense, given the fact that Nintendo likely already pays a fortune in taxes over their cash reserve and then needs to pay out dividends. The investors were (riding the tide and) hoping to get dividend out of the success, but Nintendo just told them that wasn't going to happen. Hence the correction.

Yeah, anyone seeing this as anything else than uninformed opportunists jumping in and out of a popular phenomenon are deluded or willfully ignorant.

 

[crinale]

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20160725-00000537-san-bus_all

It looks like stock went down to limit (for a day only though). It also took related shares along with and they went down severely also.

 

[aBarreras]

well, makes sense since this thing will be forgotten before the year ends.

just like pokemon in the 90s, amirite?

 

[Mpl90]

Pretty much serves them right for not taking mobile seriously. This should be the biggest wake up call of all time that people want Nintendo games on non-Nintendo hardware.

This is about their shares, not the game. And it has nothing to do with the game going down or collapsing. Your post, in this context, does not make sense. Not even for teens and kids.

 

[zoukka]

Just 13%?

Niantic soon to buy Nintendo confirmed.

 

[Rodin]

but has an "effective economic stake" of just 13 percent in the app, according to an estimate by Macquarie Securities analyst David Gibson.

Does he know this, and is he counting the cut they take from TPC, Niantc and Creatures, or he's just randomly guessing again?

I mean, obviously they don't get 100%, but that number seems a bit low all things considered.

 

[hongcha]

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20160725-00000537-san-bus_all

It looks like stock went down to limit (for a day only though). It also took related shares along with and they went down severely also.

I'll add this to the OP.

 

[MattKeil]

It is totally a word. Not one I use, because it's stupid, but if you are claiming it's not a real word then you are wrong as wrong can be.

Just because it's a mistake a lot of people make doesn't make something proper English. Something being in the dictionary just means "this is said often enough that we feel the need to define it," and since "irregardless" is defined as "regardless," it's about as much a word as "gazornenplatz," which is a word that also means "regardless."

 

[spekkeh]

Does he know this, and is he counting the cut they take from TPC, Niantc and Creatures, or he's just randomly guessing again?

I mean, obviously they don't get 100%, but that number seems a bit low all things considered.

It's a semi random guess. I tried to determine how he reached that number the other day, and I think he's assuming a 33% stake in TPC and an 8% investment in Niantic, based in turn on a split of 30/40/30 platform/dev/TPC.

It leaves out that Creatures is a subsidiary of Nintendo and Nintendo also owns a stake in Gamefreak. As to the size of their investment in Niantic, who knows, but I guess Gibson at least has some experience in these constructions.

I doubt it's as low as 13%, but it will also not be more than 30 I reckon.

 

[Milly Osworth]

Niantec is running off with Pokemon money.

Nintendo/Pokemon Company must have made a very bad deal.

Oh well back to #Nintendoomed

 

[Rodin]

It's a semi random guess. I tried to determine how he reached that number the other day, and I think he's assuming a 33% stake in TPC and an 8% investment in Niantic, based in turn on a split of 30/40/30 platform/dev/TPC.

It leaves out that Creatures is a subsidiary of Nintendo and Nintendo also owns a stake in Gamefreak. As to the size of their investment in Niantic, who knows, but I guess Gibson at least has some experience in these constructions.

I doubt it's as low as 13%, but it will also not be more than 30 I reckon.

Yeah i was thinking around 30% too, which is line with other guesses i've seen on the internet and here on gaf as well.

 

[Kathian]

Since the shares rose I have been wondering if these investors even realise how the app was made or how ownership of the IP worked.

Highlights limit of mobile vs console profits as well.

 

[JoeM86]

Since the shares rose I have been wondering if these investors even realise how the app was made or how ownership of the IP worked.

Highlights limit of mobile vs console profits as well.

Ownership of the Pokémon IP is the most convoluted thing I have ever seen in this industry. It doesn't surprise me that most people, even investors and analysts, have no idea how it works.

I have to explain it so often haha.

What I like is how, as exampled with Niantic and Genius Sonority, Nintendo owns a stake in those companies, but so does The Pokémon Company so Nintendo owns a stake in companies that a company they own also owns a stake in. (They both owned 19.5% of Genius Sonority a couple of years ago, but the Genius Sonority site no longer lists their shareholders).

Plus, while TPC has ownership rights, they don't have overall ownership which lies on Nintendo, Game Freak and Creatures Inc. All trademarks go through the three of them, not TPC.

As I said, convoluted.

 

[spekkeh]

^ you would expect TPC to be registered on the Cayman Islands.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Plus, while TPC has ownership rights, they don't have overall ownership which lies on Nintendo, Game Freak and Creatures Inc. All trademarks go through the three of them, not TPC.

As I said, convoluted.

Started off as three pals making a brewery and having fun and then the brewery turned into a multi-billion dollar corporation with its own autonomy, but the three pals still own that brewery.

The point is stocks are weird, go have a drink.

 

[El-Suave]

I wish they'd seperate stock fluctuations into bubbleware and rises/declines that are actually supported by concrete values. Not saying that there's no value in Go, on the contrary, but stock prices in general have been somewhat absurd for decades now. The interpretation of the up's and down's is hilarious sometimes, but in general it's quite sad that this is how the financial world works these days.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

Will it continue to decline to pre-Go days?

 

[CosmicQueso]

I wish they'd seperate stock fluctuations into bubbleware and rises/declines that are actually supported by concrete values. Not saying that there's no value in Go, on the contrary, but stock prices in general have been somewhat absurd for decades now. The interpretation of the up's and down's is hilarious sometimes, but in general it's quite sad that this is how the financial world works these days.

stock markets have worked this way for as long as they have existed. Speculative bubbles and runs are not a new thing. You can't take people making impetuous, irrational and at time stupid decisions out of the market.

 

[RealityCheque]

People in the stock market is so goddamn fickle

There are no people in the stock market. Just algo trading program vs algo trading program. It's one of the reasons Nintendo's stock went up so fast, profiting from short-term momentum is more important that investing in the underlying value.

 

[test_account]

No big surprise. A sharp increase also means a bigger chance for a faster drop.

I find the sharemarket to be immoral.

Why?

 

[GregLombardi]

I mean if its 13% that is pretty bad, but based on that report it is again someone else coming up with the number not Nintendo. Unless that is a part of theit statement? That article is confusing.

 

[massivekettle]

Welp, that's someone's final time in front of the press.

They would have had to disclose either way - their financials would have reflected the lack of financial impact.

What a mess. Nintendo's stock was way way overbought. People truly got caught in the Pokemon Go hype.

 

[E-phonk]

My interpretation of what Nintendo stated was that they have a 13% stake in the original deal, not all revenue generated.

They didn't state that, an analyst guessed/estimated this.

The only thing we know for sure is this:
- Nintendo owns 32% of TPC directly [link]
- Nintendo owns another, lower unknown percentage of TPC through owning part of Creatures Inc. Creatures inc holds 33% of TPC
- Nintendo owns a part of Niantic, amount undisclosed. So does Google.

It seems the analyst thinks nintendo has 13% direct ownership in Niantic, which would be possible, as far as we know the amount is undisclosed, we only know that combined they invested 20m

 

[Donnie]

Really don't understand why they needed Nintendo to tell them that this games effect on their financials would be limited. I mean outside of the issue that not all of its profits will go to Nintendo the simple fact is its a mobile phone game. Every time a new mobile phone game hits big people go insane because its selling millions of copies but seem to forget its selling for like £2 or £3 each.

Yes its great for return on investment because its nearly pure profit, but the impact it can have on the financial report of any large games company is always going to be nearly non existent. Because while the profit is large relative to the investment the total revenue is always going to be very small compared to a game on a dedicated system.

 

[GregLombardi]

These articles are bad. They need an original translation of the statement from Nintendo. Not only is the 13% number an estimate, but is Nintendo saying it wont impact this earnings release (wednesday) or earnings in general? That would be a key question.

Edit: Here is the English statement-

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2016/160722e.pdf

Nintendo themselves are unclear about which earnings period to which they are referring. Also once again, the 13% number is not verified as correct.

That said, one cannot look at this and say it is great news.

 

[Chaos17]

People in the stock market is so goddamn fickle

This

 

[maruchan]

How about that stupid Pokemon dongle for the game Nintendo is making... I pretty sure that thing if it sells. 1 million at launch worldwide would make quite a bit if cash as well right.

 

[Kouriozan]

I hope people got some easy money out of this, it was obvious it wouldn't last long for various reasons.

 

[Wollan]

13 percent is surprisingly low.

 

[GregLombardi]

13 percent is surprisingly low.

13 percent isn't verified and is just another estimate by a random analyst, FYI.

 

[dh4niel]

Meanwhile at Nintendo...

Lol. That animatronic is awesome.

 

[Xav]

I can't see Pokemon Go being popular for the next 20 years the same way the main series has been.

 

[itsgreen]

Foolish people (investors) who didn't read up on Nintendo, The Pokemon company and Niantic.

 

[The Boat]

Aaah the wonders of the stock market! I know this isn't very straightforward but some people really should investigate a bit before saying stupid things like "Nintendo made a bad deal" or "they only make 13%!"

From another thread:

I don't think anyone who has posted here understands why what they're saying means what it means.

Specifically, Nintendo says they have the Pokemon Company on their balance sheet under the equity ownership accounting method. when you do that, that means that Nintendo can't actually recognize the revenue from Pokemon Company directly under N's income statement because it is not their income. Instead Pokemon company will hold said cash on their books, so that Nintendo doesn't have to then pay taxes on the dividends received from Pokemon a Company by monetizing it. This way their investment grows in value but with no tax implications.

This doesn't mean that Pokemon company is not making bank on Pokemon Go, they probably are, it just means that the revenue will largely stay on Pokemon Company's books.

I think there is like some deferred tax liability stuff you will see on N's books... But I can't remember explicitly.

 

[Asd202]

I guess now people will finally stop saying Nintendo had an huge impact on Go.

Edit:
The 13% is just a guess? lol

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

This was obvious from the get-go. What dumbass thought they were going to use this as a key income driver?

Have you seen the Pokemon Go threads? Anyone suggesting this scenario was the case was being shouted down. Apparently, a lot of gaffers thought it would be lol.

 

[Wiped89]

It is totally a word. Not one I use, because it's stupid, but if you are claiming it's not a real word then you are wrong as wrong can be.

It's NOT a real word. 100%. It is a word made up by idiots who don't realise it is a total tautology (regardless already means regardless, the ir is totally redundant).

 

[Azuran]

Have you seen the Pokemon Go threads? Anyone suggesting this scenario was the case was being shouted down. Apparently, a lot of gaffers thought it would be lol.

Just as bad as people asking Nintendo to port Sun/Moon for mobile without taking into account the logistics of that dumb proposal.

 

[Kathian]

Just as bad as people asking Nintendo to port Sun/Moon for mobile without taking into account the logistics of that dumb proposal.

It's actually really clear the best thing for Nintendo will be to use the Pokemon brand to strengthen NX.

 

[Calm Mind]

It's NOT a real word. 100%. It is a word made up by idiots who don't realise it is a total tautology (regardless already means regardless, the ir is totally redundant).

Thank you!

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Just as bad as people asking Nintendo to port Sun/Moon for mobile without taking into account the logistics of that dumb proposal.

Aye, equally as short-sighted.

 

[driver116]

I'll bet Sony is relieved.

 

[AgeEighty]

I'll bet Sony is relieved.

Why?

 

[kiguel182]

They only went up to begin with because it seemed people didn't realize Nintendo has very little to do with the game.