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Reddit Compiles Definitive List of All NMS Missing Features/False Marketing +Sources

yeah you guys are right, he's a liar and we should limit game maker's free speech unless they are official PR. good idea.
Myself and other devs have made a whole bunch of posts that counter anything you've said.

I urged you to read the thread (the whole thing) and it seems you haven't.

I can easily counter any one of your posts by just quoting past discussion.

Do yourself a favor - catch up!
 
yeah you guys are right, he's a liar and we should limit game maker's free speech unless they are official PR. good idea.

Lol i find it hilarious that you rarely ever respond to a full post but rather pick and choose parts of posts to address while conveinently ignoraring all the main arguments in favor of Sean lying. You legit reply to the same 2 points over and over yet ignore the other 10. What do you have to say about Sean (and yourself) claiming NMS is a seemless space game when many on gaf have shown that this is not infact the case? Additionally do you have any evidence/links from Sean/the dev team to support your claim that the lack of real physics and rules actually makes the game better or is this just your own opinion based on your experience with the game? If so then how you feel about the lack of a feature in a game that was promised to have said feature is irrelevant. If people are upset its missing they are justified in feeling upset because they were lead to believe the game would have the feature. If battlefield 1 launches and turns out to be a science fiction mp shooter and not a ww1 mp shooter, regardless of everything we've seen, people would be upset and feel mislead. And if you think this example is too hyperbolic (because it is) according to you nothing about games during development are official and things are always subject to change regardless of what the devs. have said/shown. According to you under these circumstances consumers have no reason to feel mislead since they still got a mp shooter, the ww1 part just changed during development.
 

Nepenthe

Member
yeah you guys are right, he's a liar and we should limit game maker's free speech unless they are official PR. good idea.

Gamers talking about free speech drives me up the wall, because it's almost always a selfish, accusatory appropriation of the concept based not on anyone's rights actually being violated, but by the emotional hurt that happens when consumers exercising their right to disagree with a fragile person's favorite product and that product's creator, which in itself is free speech.

On top of that, it just reeks of white knighting. I am an artist- an animator- who has been subject to harsh personal criticism of my work regardless of my own intent, as well as been invited to critique the work of others in turn on multiple levels. It is how I and other artists have grown, and it's how mediums have bettered themselves, and I would be shocked if any potential fans of mine were trying to silence my dissenters, because they are cutting off a base of knowledge for me to continue improving all in the name of trying to stick up for me, as if I can't stick up for myself. Artists producing a work and then having criticism and backlash against that work for technical, quality, and/or social reasons are entering a highly valuable and necessary dialogue that doesn't need to be hijacked and undermined by fanboys and non-artists who are not interested in the discourse at all. Like me, Sean can take care of himself; he doesn't need you or anyone else standing up for his non-violated rights.

By complaining in this manner, by saying that we are limiting Sean's free speech because we believe he misrepresented his product (a form of which is actually illegal), you inevitably shit on free speech itself. You and the elements of gamer culture that subscribe to this thinking would ultimately do well to keep the term "free speech" out of your mouths versus trying to bludgeon every person with it who is willing to critique video games and their creators, less you hack and dilute the term further into meaninglessness than you already have.
 

Ollie Pooch

In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
On top of that, it just reeks of white knighting. I am an artist- an animator- who has been subject to personal criticism of my work regardless of my own intent, as well as been invited to critique the work of others in turn on multiple levels. It is how I and other artists have grown, and it's how mediums have bettered themselves. Artists producing a work and then having backlash against that work for technical and/or social reasons are entering a highly valuable and necessary dialogue that doesn't need to be hijacked by fanboys and non-artists who are not interested in the discourse at all. Sean can take care of himself; he doesn't need you or anyone else standing up for his non-violated rights.
This. I do graphic design work for people (some of which is sold on an online marketplace - with 'preview' images of what they should expect). If they ordered based on those images and they got something completely sub-standard, I'd probably get shut down, or be forced to refund them at the least.

People paid good money for this game - myself included - on good faith for Hello being an ambitious indie studio and the outright deception that Sean Murray sold as features. Fuck him and his 'rights' to say whatever mistruth he wants about his product just to make money.

Thank god places like Steam have a review system to warn people and steer them away.
 

Nepenthe

Member
This. I do graphic design work for people (some of which is sold on an online marketplace - with 'preview' images of what they should expect). If they ordered based on those images and they got something completely sub-standard, I'd probably get shut down, or be forced to refund them at the least.

People paid good money for this game - myself included - on good faith for Hello being an ambitious indie studio and the outright deception that Sean Murray sold as features. Fuck him and his 'rights' to say whatever mistruth he wants about his product just to make money.

Thank god places like Steam have a review system to warn people and steer them away.

I've admittedly caused a bit of a row before by being extremely late just on personal commissions I've owed clients. Not only did I offer these people refunds, but I finished the work beyond their specifications on top of the refunds anyway, so they inevitably got free work. Trust was reestablished, I learned my lesson, and I grew in terms of my professionalism and management. But had I had a fanbase that proceeded to defend me mindlessly because the criticism was harsh ("she didn't give a date of completion!" "you don't know if she's spent the money!"), I might have been tempted to continue ripping people off. I wouldn't have learned a thing.

I just wish our people could take a bit of a step back and stop trying to bring about the "ethics" of criticism into discussions that are ultimately about business, because if nothing else it is this dogged loyalty that has led to companies being able to get away with just about anything. We could do with a lot more Xbone-esque backlash to bad business!

Also, I do love Steam's review system. My motto: If it don't have a 90%, I don't want it. xP
 

thumb

Banned
Gamers talking about free speech drives me up the wall, because it's almost always a selfish, accusatory appropriation of the concept based not on anyone's rights actually being violated, but by the emotional hurt that happens when consumers exercising their right to disagree with a fragile person's favorite product and that product's creator, which in itself is free speech.

You're not the only one frustrated:

http://www.pointandclickbait.com/2016/02/free-speech-advocate-is-arsehole/
 

MrGerbils

Member
"I'm going to paint the most beautiful woman ever!"
*Paints a bowl of fruit*

"Star Wars will be an epic space opera!"
*Makes movie about Pirates of the Caribbean*

If that's how you mean it, sure.

This is why I can't take any of this shit seriously. The hyperbole about these little things is unfickingbelievable and just let's me know that it's not coming from people who were ever actually excited about the game, it's just people that want to join a mob.

You think the lack of multiplayer or variable ship handling is the same thing as these examples.

It's a space exploration survival game with planets the size of planets all in an interconnected universe. That's what was described and that's what it is.

It is not like the game released and is suddenly a linear game about pirates.

Maybe if your example was, "I'm going to make a movie called Star Wars where a young man named Luke learns about the force and confronts an evil empire. At some point he'll come across a space trader named Wilson, but that's really not the point of the movie. It's a scene so small you might not even notice it. Please don't come to the movie expecting it to be about Wilson."

*scene with Wilson gets cut before release / early script is leaked and Wilson isn't even in it (!!!!!!)*

"Holy shit this movie doesn't even have Wilson in it! We were fucking lied to on purpose! Let's start an internet hate mob cuz this is about ethics in movie advertising!"
 

PsychBat!

Banned
Gamers talking about free speech drives me up the wall, because it's almost always a selfish, accusatory appropriation of the concept based not on anyone's rights actually being violated, but by the emotional hurt that happens when consumers exercising their right to disagree with a fragile person's favorite product and that product's creator, which in itself is free speech.

On top of that, it just reeks of white knighting. I am an artist- an animator- who has been subject to harsh personal criticism of my work regardless of my own intent, as well as been invited to critique the work of others in turn on multiple levels. It is how I and other artists have grown, and it's how mediums have bettered themselves, and I would be shocked if any potential fans of mine were trying to silence my dissenters, because they are cutting off a base of knowledge for me to continue improving all in the name of trying to stick up for me, as if I can't stick up for myself. Artists producing a work and then having criticism and backlash against that work for technical, quality, and/or social reasons are entering a highly valuable and necessary dialogue that doesn't need to be hijacked and undermined by fanboys and non-artists who are not interested in the discourse at all. Like me, Sean can take care of himself; he doesn't need you or anyone else standing up for his non-violated rights.

By complaining in this manner, by saying that we are limiting Sean's free speech because we believe he misrepresented his product (a form of which is actually illegal), you inevitably shit on free speech itself. You and the elements of gamer culture that subscribe to this thinking would ultimately do well to keep the term "free speech" out of your mouths versus trying to bludgeon every person with it who is willing to critique video games and their creators, less you hack and dilute the term further into meaninglessness than you already have.
giphy.gif
 

MUnited83

For you.
This is why I can't take any of this shit seriously. The hyperbole about these little things is unfickingbelievable and just let's me know that it's not coming from people who were ever actually excited about the game, it's just people that want to join a mob.

You think the lack of multiplayer or variable ship handling is the same thing as these examples.

It's a space exploration survival game with planets the size of planets all in an interconnected universe. That's what was described and that's what it is.

It is not like the game released and is suddenly a linear game about pirates.

Maybe if your example was, "I'm going to make a movie called Star Wars where a young man named Luke learns about the force and confronts an evil empire. At some point he'll come across a space trader named Wilson, but that's really not the point of the movie. It's a scene so small you might not even notice it. Please don't come to the movie expecting it to be about Wilson."

*scene with Wilson gets cut before release / early script is leaked and Wilson isn't even in it (!!!!!!)*

"Holy shit this movie doesn't even have Wilson in it! We were fucking lied to on purpose! Let's start an internet hate mob cuz this is about ethics in movie advertising!"

Except, you know, it just not small details that are missing. Several gameplay systems were part of the lie as well.
 
This is why I can't take any of this shit seriously. The hyperbole about these little things is unfickingbelievable and just let's me know that it's not coming from people who were ever actually excited about the game, it's just people that want to join a mob.

You think the lack of multiplayer or variable ship handling is the same thing as these examples.

It's a space exploration survival game with planets the size of planets all in an interconnected universe. That's what was described and that's what it is.

It is not like the game released and is suddenly a linear game about pirates.

Maybe if your example was, "I'm going to make a movie called Star Wars where a young man named Luke learns about the force and confronts an evil empire. At some point he'll come across a space trader named Wilson, but that's really not the point of the movie. It's a scene so small you might not even notice it. Please don't come to the movie expecting it to be about Wilson."

*scene with Wilson gets cut before release / early script is leaked and Wilson isn't even in it (!!!!!!)*

"Holy shit this movie doesn't even have Wilson in it! We were fucking lied to on purpose! Let's start an internet hate mob cuz this is about ethics in movie advertising!"
I was being hyperbolic :|

Then I directed the poster to read the thread to see how we discussed "things change" as an excuse. But I'm sure you just skipped over that part as shown by the snippet you quoted.

I made it VERY clear the red flags that Murray kept throwing up. He doesn't want to read it - Not my problem.

If you don't want to read any of those, still not my problem. You'd clearly see where I'm coming from. That's too much to ask, apparently.

-

To anyone driving by: read the thread. It will help.
 

OraleeWey

Member
The biggest lie which pains me the most is when Sean gave the controller to a reviewer (or someone) and the reviewer was about to land on a planet and he said, "ohh look, it's half dark on this side, half lit by the sun on this side, I'll just go to the daytime half". Sean Murray then said "interesting, you're the first person to discover that". He then goes on to explain how each planet revolves around the sun and simulates real world revolution. I'm highly paraphrasing of course but that how the conversation went down, for the most part. When I saw that, that was what sold me on the game. Turns out it's all bullshit and it's a background when it changes from day to night or vice versa. How is this not false advertising is beyond my legal comprehension. Someone with money should sue the man, he flat out lied about the game. Why isn't he facing any legal action? Which other profession allows such lies to go unpunished? Sean Murray? Nothing, he's just looking at his bank account increasing 0's.

Can anyone link to that video btw?
 
So I've been wondering if the flood that hit HG offices did actually destroy some important development material?

Or maybe SM pissed off some member of staff and they deleted a load of source code?
 

Ollie Pooch

In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
This is why I can't take any of this shit seriously. The hyperbole about these little things is unfickingbelievable and just let's me know that it's not coming from people who were ever actually excited about the game, it's just people that want to join a mob.

You think the lack of multiplayer or variable ship handling is the same thing as these examples.

It's a space exploration survival game with planets the size of planets all in an interconnected universe. That's what was described and that's what it is.

It is not like the game released and is suddenly a linear game about pirates.

Maybe if your example was, "I'm going to make a movie called Star Wars where a young man named Luke learns about the force and confronts an evil empire. At some point he'll come across a space trader named Wilson, but that's really not the point of the movie. It's a scene so small you might not even notice it. Please don't come to the movie expecting it to be about Wilson."

*scene with Wilson gets cut before release / early script is leaked and Wilson isn't even in it (!!!!!!)*

"Holy shit this movie doesn't even have Wilson in it! We were fucking lied to on purpose! Let's start an internet hate mob cuz this is about ethics in movie advertising!"
Those examples are hyperbolic but if you read the thread you'd understand why people are saying we were sold a game that didn't exist.
'Playing with your friends' - not in the game.
Ship classes and naming ships - not in the game.
Character customisation - not in the game.
Planetary physics - not in the game.
Being able to fly to other systems manually - not in the game.
Real stars - not in the game.
Seeing other players - not in the game.
Multiplayer - not in the game.
Animals affecting the environment, despite being used in trailers - surprise! not in the game.
Undiscovered elements - not in the game.
Atmospheric refraction or whatever the fuck - not in the game.
Resources varying on distance from sun - not in the game.
Algorithm creating more 'mutated' or wild creations towards the centre - not in the game.
Algorithm creating more mutated or wild creations in different start systems - not in the game.

Now some of these are incidental, no doubt, but it shows a habit on his behalf of just making shit up.
 

Raiden

Banned
Since i really love this game i fezl conflicted about all this. I went in with zero knowledge and hype, saw maybe two trailers. Read some stuff here when it released and bought it and i am having a blast. But i get when you have been anticipating this game for years and was looking forward to all the cool stuff that did not make it.. yeah that would suck. Primary lesson .. dont get hyped?
 

melkier33

Member
So I've been wondering if the flood that hit HG offices did actually destroy some important development material?

Or maybe SM pissed off some member of staff and they deleted a load of source code?


I was wondering the same thing but I haven't really seen it brought up and I don't know the timeline of events/interviews well enough. I know I read they would have cancelled the game if it wasn't announced at E3. I'm wondering if they lost more work then they are willing to admit to.
 

Speely

Banned
I really like this part of the interview he did with RPS in 2015:
So has that been the hardest aspect? Communicating No Man’s Sky faithfully to other people?

“No. Making the game is the hardest thing, definitely,” he laughs.

Okay, so onto the game itself.

We start with the central mystery and one of the methods by which Hello Games how to keep players moving – what’s at the centre of the galaxy. “How is that different to the Curiosity cube?” is what I want to know. “Am I going to find Peter Molyneux’s disembodied head?”

“Wouldn’t that be amazing?” replies Murray.

“I think that would be a lot of work for one joke.”

“For a joke? This isn’t a joke!” He’s mock-affronted at this point.

“Imagine if that’s what it was and now I have to answer this question awkwardly – like ‘Hahaha, imagine…’ No,” he continues, “It’s going to be like the end of Star Wars and you have Braben, Molyneux, Levine…” He tails off giggling then adds, “Good job, Sean. Good job on the hype.”

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/07/no-mans-sky-interview/

Yeah. It's like the best troll of all time.
 

Ollie Pooch

In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
The Angry Joe review condenses this thread nicely.

Murray is a fucking snake oil salesman and a liar. It's outrageous and infuriating to watch.
 

213372bu

Banned
Those examples are hyperbolic but if you read the thread you'd understand why people are saying we were sold a game that didn't exist.
'Playing with your friends' - not in the game.
Ship classes and naming ships - not in the game.
Character customisation - not in the game.
Planetary physics - not in the game.
Being able to fly to other systems manually - not in the game.
Real stars - not in the game.
Seeing other players - not in the game.
Multiplayer - not in the game.
Animals affecting the environment, despite being used in trailers - surprise! not in the game.
Undiscovered elements - not in the game.
Atmospheric refraction or whatever the fuck - not in the game.
Resources varying on distance from sun - not in the game.
Algorithm creating more 'mutated' or wild creations towards the centre - not in the game.
Algorithm creating more mutated or wild creations in different start systems - not in the game.

Now some of these are incidental, no doubt, but it shows a habit on his behalf of just making shit up.
And all of these are just a small section of the supposed 'big' launch features promised.
 

pj

Banned
Gotta love a small indie studio doing things different.
That article sound like Sean never intended for the game to have multiplayer, what a barefooted Jesus.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....Sean-Murray-No-Man-s-Sky-Mods-Hello-Games/amp

The biggest lie is that they want you to feel lost and as though you are on the frontier of space exploration.

I've yet to land on a planet that does not have multiple manned trading outposts and other space ships flying around almost constantly. Not to mention the space stations that are at most a 2 minute journey from anywhere you can be in this game.
 
Since i really love this game i fezl conflicted about all this. I went in with zero knowledge and hype, saw maybe two trailers. Read some stuff here when it released and bought it and i am having a blast. But i get when you have been anticipating this game for years and was looking forward to all the cool stuff that did not make it.. yeah that would suck. Primary lesson .. dont get hyped?

How about you address the many valid points in this thread instead of advertising the game on HG's behalf. The an OT thread right there if you want to discuss your appreciation with the game.
 
So I came upon this file while datamining the game, anybody know what it means?

Code:
// filename: FRA

1 // Once you have their money, you never give it back.
3 // Never spend more for an acquisition than you have to. 
6 // Never allow family to stand in the way of opportunity.
7 // Keep your ears open and your eyes on the mark.
9 // Opportunity plus instinct equals profit.
10 // Greed is eternal.
16 // A deal is a deal.
17 // A contract is a contract is a contract... but only between Ferengi.
18 // A Ferengi without profit is no Ferengi at all.
21 // Never place friendship above profit.
22 // A wise man can hear profit in the wind.
23 // Nothing is more important than your health... except for your money.
31 // Never make fun of a Ferengi's mother.
33 // It never hurts to suck up to the boss.
34 // War is good for business.
35 // Peace is good for business.
45 // Expand or die.
47 // Never trust a man wearing a better suit than your own.
48 // The bigger the smile, the sharper the knife.
57 // Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them. 
59 // Free advice is seldom cheap.
62 // Profit is its own reward.
74 // Knowledge equals profit.
75 // Home is where the heart is, but the stars are made of latinum.
76 // Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies.
94 // Females and finances don't mix.
95 // Expand or die.
98 // Every man has his price.
102 // Nature decays, but latinum lasts forever.
103 // Sleep can interfere with...
109 // Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack.
111 // Treat people in your debt like family... exploit them.
112 // Never have sex with the boss's sister.
125 // You can't make a deal if you're dead.
139 // Wives serve, brothers inherit.
168 // Whisper your way to success.
190 // Hear all, trust nothing.
194 // It's always good to know about new customers before they walk in your door.
203 // New customers are like razor-toothed gree-worms. They can be succulent, but sometimes they bite back. 
208 // Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. 
211 // Employees are the rungs on the ladder of success. Don't hesitate to step on them. 
214 // Never begin a business negotiation on an empty stomach. 
217 // You can't free a fish from water. 
223 // (incomplete, but presumably concerned the relationship between "keeping busy" and "being successful") 
229 // Latinum lasts longer than lust. 
239 // Never be afraid to mislabel a product.
240 // It may be worth it to go barefoot so that they let their gaurd down.
243 // If you think they are on to you, it's best to act like nothing is wrong.
245 // Never admit to a mistake until the money is secure.
263 // Never allow doubt to tarnish your lust for latinum.
272 // It may be worth going barefoot to earn their trust.
275 // Make them think your operation is small and you will be able to sell them anything.
285 // No good deed ever goes unpunished. 
286 // A man is only worth the sum of his possessions. 
287 // After you've exploited someone, it never hurts to thank them. That way, it's easier to exploit them next time.
288 // A good lie is easier to believe than the truth.
 

BorkBork

The Legend of BorkBork: BorkBorkity Borking
So I came upon this file while datamining the game, anybody know what it means?

Code:
// filename: FRA

1 // Once you have their money, you never give it back.
3 // Never spend more for an acquisition than you have to. 
6 // Never allow family to stand in the way of opportunity.
7 // Keep your ears open and your eyes on the mark.
9 // Opportunity plus instinct equals profit.
10 // Greed is eternal.
16 // A deal is a deal.
17 // A contract is a contract is a contract... but only between Ferengi.
18 // A Ferengi without profit is no Ferengi at all.
21 // Never place friendship above profit.
22 // A wise man can hear profit in the wind.
23 // Nothing is more important than your health... except for your money.
31 // Never make fun of a Ferengi's mother.
33 // It never hurts to suck up to the boss.
34 // War is good for business.
35 // Peace is good for business.
45 // Expand or die.
47 // Never trust a man wearing a better suit than your own.
48 // The bigger the smile, the sharper the knife.
57 // Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them. 
59 // Free advice is seldom cheap.
62 // Profit is its own reward.
74 // Knowledge equals profit.
75 // Home is where the heart is, but the stars are made of latinum.
76 // Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies.
94 // Females and finances don't mix.
95 // Expand or die.
98 // Every man has his price.
102 // Nature decays, but latinum lasts forever.
103 // Sleep can interfere with...
109 // Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack.
111 // Treat people in your debt like family... exploit them.
112 // Never have sex with the boss's sister.
125 // You can't make a deal if you're dead.
139 // Wives serve, brothers inherit.
168 // Whisper your way to success.
190 // Hear all, trust nothing.
194 // It's always good to know about new customers before they walk in your door.
203 // New customers are like razor-toothed gree-worms. They can be succulent, but sometimes they bite back. 
208 // Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. 
211 // Employees are the rungs on the ladder of success. Don't hesitate to step on them. 
214 // Never begin a business negotiation on an empty stomach. 
217 // You can't free a fish from water. 
223 // (incomplete, but presumably concerned the relationship between "keeping busy" and "being successful") 
229 // Latinum lasts longer than lust. 
239 // Never be afraid to mislabel a product.
240 // It may be worth it to go barefoot so that they let their gaurd down.
243 // If you think they are on to you, it's best to act like nothing is wrong.
245 // Never admit to a mistake until the money is secure.
263 // Never allow doubt to tarnish your lust for latinum.
272 // It may be worth going barefoot to earn their trust.
275 // Make them think your operation is small and you will be able to sell them anything.
285 // No good deed ever goes unpunished. 
286 // A man is only worth the sum of his possessions. 
287 // After you've exploited someone, it never hurts to thank them. That way, it's easier to exploit them next time.
288 // A good lie is easier to believe than the truth.

The hilarity of finding the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition – a code centered around greed and exploitation – in the heart of NMS would be too much for me to handle.
 

Speely

Banned
So I came upon this file while datamining the game, anybody know what it means?

Code:
// filename: FRA

1 // Once you have their money, you never give it back.
3 // Never spend more for an acquisition than you have to. 
6 // Never allow family to stand in the way of opportunity.
7 // Keep your ears open and your eyes on the mark.
9 // Opportunity plus instinct equals profit.
10 // Greed is eternal.
16 // A deal is a deal.
17 // A contract is a contract is a contract... but only between Ferengi.
18 // A Ferengi without profit is no Ferengi at all.
21 // Never place friendship above profit.
22 // A wise man can hear profit in the wind.
23 // Nothing is more important than your health... except for your money.
31 // Never make fun of a Ferengi's mother.
33 // It never hurts to suck up to the boss.
34 // War is good for business.
35 // Peace is good for business.
45 // Expand or die.
47 // Never trust a man wearing a better suit than your own.
48 // The bigger the smile, the sharper the knife.
57 // Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them. 
59 // Free advice is seldom cheap.
62 // Profit is its own reward.
74 // Knowledge equals profit.
75 // Home is where the heart is, but the stars are made of latinum.
76 // Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies.
94 // Females and finances don't mix.
95 // Expand or die.
98 // Every man has his price.
102 // Nature decays, but latinum lasts forever.
103 // Sleep can interfere with...
109 // Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack.
111 // Treat people in your debt like family... exploit them.
112 // Never have sex with the boss's sister.
125 // You can't make a deal if you're dead.
139 // Wives serve, brothers inherit.
168 // Whisper your way to success.
190 // Hear all, trust nothing.
194 // It's always good to know about new customers before they walk in your door.
203 // New customers are like razor-toothed gree-worms. They can be succulent, but sometimes they bite back. 
208 // Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. 
211 // Employees are the rungs on the ladder of success. Don't hesitate to step on them. 
214 // Never begin a business negotiation on an empty stomach. 
217 // You can't free a fish from water. 
223 // (incomplete, but presumably concerned the relationship between "keeping busy" and "being successful") 
229 // Latinum lasts longer than lust. 
239 // Never be afraid to mislabel a product.
240 // It may be worth it to go barefoot so that they let their gaurd down.
243 // If you think they are on to you, it's best to act like nothing is wrong.
245 // Never admit to a mistake until the money is secure.
263 // Never allow doubt to tarnish your lust for latinum.
272 // It may be worth going barefoot to earn their trust.
275 // Make them think your operation is small and you will be able to sell them anything.
285 // No good deed ever goes unpunished. 
286 // A man is only worth the sum of his possessions. 
287 // After you've exploited someone, it never hurts to thank them. That way, it's easier to exploit them next time.
288 // A good lie is easier to believe than the truth.

I spit tea all over my keyboard. Thanks.
 

Scrooged

Totally wronger about Nintendo's business decisions.
So has it been confirmed that there are no ship scanner upgrades? There's a blueprint category for them but they don't seem to exist. Same with the 'Curiosity' category in your backpack.
 
So has it been confirmed that there are no ship scanner upgrades? There's a blueprint category for them but they don't seem to exist. Same with the 'Curiosity' category in your backpack.

The upgrade meters on your gear make no sense. I have every upgrade installed (except for the multi-tool, where there's not enough room), and my meters aren't full, except for protection on my exosuit.

And yeah, why is there even a meter measuring your ship's scan capabilities if there aren't upgrades for it?

Why does the naming scheme for upgrades make no sense?

There's so many weird little things like this in the game that show lack of polish. I really hate when people call "lazy devs," but there are parts of No Man's Sky that really make me wonder what exactly they were working on for 3-4 years.
 

terandle

Member
There's so many weird little things like this in the game that show lack of polish. I really hate when people call "lazy devs," but there are parts of No Man's Sky that really make me wonder what exactly they were working on for 3-4 years.

Yeah. Too ambitious of a game for them. Had to cut a bunch of half baked features in order to ship something.
 

Scrooged

Totally wronger about Nintendo's business decisions.
The upgrade meters on your gear make no sense. I have every upgrade installed (except for the multi-tool, where there's not enough room), and my meters aren't full, except for protection on my exosuit.

And yeah, why is there even a meter measuring your ship's scan capabilities if there aren't upgrades for it?

Why does the naming scheme for upgrades make no sense?

There's so many weird little things like this in the game that show lack of polish. I really hate when people call "lazy devs," but there are parts of No Man's Sky that really make me wonder what exactly they were working on for 3-4 years.

You probably have to have all similar upgrades touching each other to get the bonus to max out the bars.

But yeah, the game has a lot of little things like you mentioned that indicate it had a troubled development. I have a list of things I've noticed that seem to be left over from previous builds.

- Ship Scanner and Backpack Curiosity blueprints missing
- The craftable minerals/rocks that you sometimes find after killing pirates. The math just doesn't work for these to be worth crafting and selling (especially considering space limitations), and they're not used in any blueprints that are currently in the game.
- Nothing of importance in the v2 and v3 rooms. The keys are incredibly difficult to find, so this is bizarre.
- Blueprint RNG. You end up getting duplicate blueprints 99% of the time after a while, making almost all outposts useless. This gameplay system is basically broken and seems like it's from an Alpha build.
- What's up with the stock price things on the wall that always give you 1500 units? Did these things have a different purpose at some point?
- If you equip your ship cannons and point directly at a building on a planet at just the right angle, the reticle will turn red. Why? This may be left over from a build that let you destroy buildings, similar to how Sean said that you'd be able to destroy space ports.

That's just a few of the things that make me think about what they were trying to do with this game.
 
So I came upon this file while datamining the game, anybody know what it means?

Code:
// filename: FRA

1 // Once you have their money, you never give it back.
3 // Never spend more for an acquisition than you have to. 
6 // Never allow family to stand in the way of opportunity.
7 // Keep your ears open and your eyes on the mark.
9 // Opportunity plus instinct equals profit.
10 // Greed is eternal.
16 // A deal is a deal.
17 // A contract is a contract is a contract... but only between Ferengi.
18 // A Ferengi without profit is no Ferengi at all.
21 // Never place friendship above profit.
22 // A wise man can hear profit in the wind.
23 // Nothing is more important than your health... except for your money.
31 // Never make fun of a Ferengi's mother.
33 // It never hurts to suck up to the boss.
34 // War is good for business.
35 // Peace is good for business.
45 // Expand or die.
47 // Never trust a man wearing a better suit than your own.
48 // The bigger the smile, the sharper the knife.
57 // Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them. 
59 // Free advice is seldom cheap.
62 // Profit is its own reward.
74 // Knowledge equals profit.
75 // Home is where the heart is, but the stars are made of latinum.
76 // Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies.
94 // Females and finances don't mix.
95 // Expand or die.
98 // Every man has his price.
102 // Nature decays, but latinum lasts forever.
103 // Sleep can interfere with...
109 // Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack.
111 // Treat people in your debt like family... exploit them.
112 // Never have sex with the boss's sister.
125 // You can't make a deal if you're dead.
139 // Wives serve, brothers inherit.
168 // Whisper your way to success.
190 // Hear all, trust nothing.
194 // It's always good to know about new customers before they walk in your door.
203 // New customers are like razor-toothed gree-worms. They can be succulent, but sometimes they bite back. 
208 // Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. 
211 // Employees are the rungs on the ladder of success. Don't hesitate to step on them. 
214 // Never begin a business negotiation on an empty stomach. 
217 // You can't free a fish from water. 
223 // (incomplete, but presumably concerned the relationship between "keeping busy" and "being successful") 
229 // Latinum lasts longer than lust. 
239 // Never be afraid to mislabel a product.
240 // It may be worth it to go barefoot so that they let their gaurd down.
243 // If you think they are on to you, it's best to act like nothing is wrong.
245 // Never admit to a mistake until the money is secure.
263 // Never allow doubt to tarnish your lust for latinum.
272 // It may be worth going barefoot to earn their trust.
275 // Make them think your operation is small and you will be able to sell them anything.
285 // No good deed ever goes unpunished. 
286 // A man is only worth the sum of his possessions. 
287 // After you've exploited someone, it never hurts to thank them. That way, it's easier to exploit them next time.
288 // A good lie is easier to believe than the truth.

I believe you get this text after you find the 15 billionth planet.
 

OraleeWey

Member
So I came upon this file while datamining the game, anybody know what it means?

239 // Never be afraid to mislabel a product.
240 // It may be worth it to go barefoot so that they let their gaurd down.
243 // If you think they are on to you, it's best to act like nothing is wrong.
245 // Never admit to a mistake until the money is secure.
272 // It may be worth going barefoot to earn their trust.
275 // Make them think your operation is small and you will be able to sell them anything.

xGT3U2Sh.jpg
 

Speely

Banned
Would any of you guys buy He'll Games next game, day 1, knowing how bad they have deceived the public with NMS?

Even if they released a final product that was the exact same code that had been beta tested mere days before: No. I will never support this developer again.

Had you asked me a day or two or even three after release, I would have said "maybe" because I was giving them the benefit of the doubt.

Now? Hell no. Not only will I never purchase anything from Hello Games, but I will actively remind others of their history every chance I get.
 

Griss

Member
Would any of you guys buy He'll Games next game, day 1, knowing how bad they have deceived the public with NMS?

Not a chance in hell. I bought this one after I knew what was cut, and knew what it was, because I was interested in it as 'algorithmic art' and thought I'd get my money's worth. And I did.

But as for trusting them? To the extent that I'd buy their next game day 1? Nah. Unlike most I genuinely believe that a lot of this misdirection and deceit were intentional. It's the radio silence since launch that sealed it for me. Not the actions of honest people who made a mistake.

I never bought another Molyneux game after I got burned the first time. I can't stand this sort of marketing.
 

Tenshin

Member
but even though the features that are "missing" its still minning , get a ship and travel to another system and rinse and repeat.. the idea what no man sky is still there.. quintillion planets to discover go in and out a planet seamlessly. destiny is much worst.
 

Ollie Pooch

In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
But as for trusting them? To the extent that I'd buy their next game day 1? Nah. Unlike most I genuinely believe that a lot of this misdirection and deceit were intentional. It's the radio silence since launch that sealed it for me. Not the actions of honest people who made a mistake.
Yeah, after initially feeling like it was a 'hyped up by the audience, developer was in over their heads' it's actually not possible to think of it as anything other than outright deception. Murray's name on a game would be enough to turn me (and I imagine a lot of others) away completely.
 

Jinkies

Member
I believe Sean Murray was in denial about what Hello Games could accomplish… for a time.

When it became clear that Sony's patience was running out (and with it, their money), Sean made the mistake of not backpeddaling, in order to retain sales figures.

It's tragic, and I feel badly for him, but that doesn't mean that I don't blame him. He showed no accountability to his audience for the sake of money. Not only is his reputation as a dev ruined, but also as an auteur.
 
they were lies as much as going back to the first draft of a movie is a lie. or the rough sketches an artist does before they make a painting is a lie.

Except "bubu first draft!" doesn't apply here because there are many examples of him lying about elements, mechanics, and features of the game leading all the way up to release. So no, for your example to work it would have to be more like a movie studio using elements and footage shot from that first draft to promote and describe their film, years after they'd removed those things from the film.

I mean, he lied. Whether that matters to you or not is one thing, but there's no denying that he did. Personally I am ok with developers shooting for the stars, but he marketed this game all wrong.
 

Seiniyta

Member
The upgrade meters on your gear make no sense. I have every upgrade installed (except for the multi-tool, where there's not enough room), and my meters aren't full, except for protection on my exosuit.

And yeah, why is there even a meter measuring your ship's scan capabilities if there aren't upgrades for it?

Why does the naming scheme for upgrades make no sense?

There's so many weird little things like this in the game that show lack of polish. I really hate when people call "lazy devs," but there are parts of No Man's Sky that really make me wonder what exactly they were working on for 3-4 years.

It seems like modders found that almost half of the present files aren't being used by the game at the moment. So there's huge amount of stuff they disabled for whatever reason.

The exciting stuff is to see how much of it can be activated again and figure out why it was disabled.
 
It seems like modders found that almost half of the present files aren't being used by the game at the moment. So there's huge amount of stuff they disabled for whatever reason.

The exciting stuff is to see how much of it can be activated again and figure out why it was disabled.

Where is this being discussed?
 

Seiniyta

Member
Where is this being discussed?

Nexus mods discord channel. See the link to it in my previous posts. Before I went to bed the modders seemed to think there are a lot of unused files.
they are working on a recompiler for the mbin files which is the heart of the game.Seems like once they get working the game is super moddable

https://discordapp.com/channels/215514623384748034/215569790801018880

There to be exactly. Really interesting stuff. They were at least planning to have flight stick support.
 
Gamers talking about free speech drives me up the wall, because it's almost always a selfish, accusatory appropriation of the concept based not on anyone's rights actually being violated, but by the emotional hurt that happens when consumers exercising their right to disagree with a fragile person's favorite product and that product's creator, which in itself is free speech.

On top of that, it just reeks of white knighting. I am an artist- an animator- who has been subject to harsh personal criticism of my work regardless of my own intent, as well as been invited to critique the work of others in turn on multiple levels. It is how I and other artists have grown, and it's how mediums have bettered themselves, and I would be shocked if any potential fans of mine were trying to silence my dissenters, because they are cutting off a base of knowledge for me to continue improving all in the name of trying to stick up for me, as if I can't stick up for myself. Artists producing a work and then having criticism and backlash against that work for technical, quality, and/or social reasons are entering a highly valuable and necessary dialogue that doesn't need to be hijacked and undermined by fanboys and non-artists who are not interested in the discourse at all. Like me, Sean can take care of himself; he doesn't need you or anyone else standing up for his non-violated rights.

By complaining in this manner, by saying that we are limiting Sean's free speech because we believe he misrepresented his product (a form of which is actually illegal), you inevitably shit on free speech itself. You and the elements of gamer culture that subscribe to this thinking would ultimately do well to keep the term "free speech" out of your mouths versus trying to bludgeon every person with it who is willing to critique video games and their creators, less you hack and dilute the term further into meaninglessness than you already have.

That was a beautiful post...I don't feel as invested in the whole issue as some others are but I do feel it was wrong for Sean Murray misrepresent his product and not own up to his mistake.
 
I am still kind of in love with the game NMS was marketed as. Watching the material used to hype the game, I just still sort of want to believe that that game exists. Now I simply hope another developer comes along and knocks it out of the park for real.

Multiplayer was never a huge deal for me, I still wanted to see people gather and do stupid things in game together. It's a sandbox, it's what you do... you get together and do stupid things.
 
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