Jeff Gerstmann definitely did it to get more clicks for the Giant Bomb Fallout 4 review.
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Phil Spencer: Some reviewers give games low scores to get more clicks
- Thread starter Raylan
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Jeff Gerstmann definitely did it to get more clicks for the Giant Bomb Fallout 4 review.
Did you watch the video? The guy himself complains about the controls being imprecise. And you linked one moment from the game. Bad games can have good segments. That 5 minute section doesn't make up for the rest of the game if people dislike the rest of the game. Most players probably won't even bother with that section. Different people have different opinions and play games differently. I tried the trial and found the game to be unpolished and mindless. When reviews express their different opinion they're not necessarily trolling. They just have different expectations and perspectives.
In Service
Member
Of course it does. It's the internet and there is advertising revenue to gather.
I doubt anyone suggests that a well written article that presents a personal review of why a score is low is "wrong". It's opinion.
It's the reviews we see from time to time with the "OMG you won't believe the score" headlines that set me on edge.
Where has the honesty of the internet gone?
/s
Jeff Gerstmann doesn't do shit for clicks. He just doesn't like bad games.
Spencer is clearly talking about Recore reviews and was using Forza as an example Regardless of what games he's talking about, it's still poor form to outright claim that as;
A, It makes you look desperate.
B, Trying to brush off the real reason why your game isn't reviewing well.
Furthermore Console wars, while incredibly pathetic and childish, will stick around and for better or worse is a part of gaming culture with Sony and Microsoft stroking the flame from time to time.
A, It makes you look desperate.
B, Trying to brush off the real reason why your game isn't reviewing well.
Furthermore Console wars, while incredibly pathetic and childish, will stick around and for better or worse is a part of gaming culture with Sony and Microsoft stroking the flame from time to time.
LordRaptor
Member
As something of a fan of Tom Chick, I'll tell you for free this absolutely does happen with regularity
Whilst this video was great to watch, and I'm quite liking Recore from the 5 or so hours I've spent with it... I don't think you can blame reviewers for not seeing the best in a game's mechanics if they may simply lack the skill required to get the most of it. I actually think Recore in many ways is similar to some of the better 3D Sonics, in that when played well on some of the more challenging segments the game can appear to look (and even actually play) better than the majority of games in its category... but that's not going to everyone's experience with it, and a reviewer shouldn't be demanding to "git gud" in order to have their impression considered valid. Especially in most of the audience they're reviewing for also won't "git gud", and as a result more likely share that reviewer's initial opinion.
Also like 3D Sonic, the game's scores and people's general impressions of it are/were harmed by a bunch collision bugs and long loading times, that may have elevated it noticeably had the game received a bit more time to have these ironed out.
Also "it's too punishing... controls like shit" is probably not the sort of commentary you want in a video to make the points you're making.
A lot of us say a lot of shit that we probably wouldn't (or at least shouldn't) say as a brand representative. Even if there's some truth to what you're saying. On GAF I can declare someone a blind fanboy who has nothing but praise for everything regarding one console manufacturer, and nothing but disdain for another... regardless of how similar certain aspects of the two are. Would I tweet that to any of them if my twitter handle was XboxUK? Fuck no... because then it cascades into more petty bullshit with a 20+ page GAF thread, where the general takeaway becomes "Xbox peeps = salty mothafuckas". There's all sorts of shit I can say here that I'd never ever say whilst representing any company/brand/whatever.
The game didn't scores as they would like. That's fine, there are plenty of people that are enjoying it, and not every game has to be for everyone. In fact, in some cases a game excelling in certain aspects, that may require dexterity beyond what many players possess won't resonate with them for that reason. That's neither their fault, nor the developer's fault.
BudokaiMR2
Member
The controls are not imprecise and I think the video itself shows that. I haven't read a single review of the game that cites the controls or any of the core gameplay to be the issue.
I'm sure they are out there though, but it doesn't seem to be the consensus.
Most of the negative points in the reviews were technical issues, bugs, or the content gating at the end of the game. To a lesser extent, I saw a lot of reviews point out that the story felt rushed in the last quarter of the game.
As I said before, I am obviously biased on this product but I don't really think that justifies knocking the score down to
Impeccable
Member
haha
Amazing.
Amazing.
randomengine
Banned
I find it hard to believe that every review of a game is legit. I am sure some reviewers, intentionally or not, score low or high to generate clicks.
The desire for attention is a powerful thing. Look at Steam reviews.
The desire for attention is a powerful thing. Look at Steam reviews.
TheDinoman
Member
You were the chosen one, Phil!
LegendofDragoonLives
Member
Gears is scoring pretty well though, but it is true at times. Anyone see that 4/10 for Uncharted 4? Either that guy is an absolute moron or doing what Phil says. I don't think the major review places would do this but other ones here and there, certainly possible. He will come off salty here though.
ethomaz
Banned
And these people here are pointed to be salty... why just not accept the score? GiantBomb give Recore 2/5... do you think they scored it for clicks? No.
There are sports competitions where a Judge give a 8/10 and another give a 5/10... that is why there where always more than one judge to score.
It is not about clicks.
It is about how the flaws actually decrease the enjoyment of the game for the reviewer... and you can't fight that when the review explain why the game didn't reach the score you expected.
I should give The Witcher 3 a 7/10 if I did a review just because I had no enjoyment due the subpar combat system... it is something that make I stop to play in little hours to never look back again.
Felix Lighter
Member
Had to take advantage of that crazy Recore hype one way or another.
randomengine
Banned
Well another issue, which falls under unintentional low-scoring is the editorial decision who to place on a particular game. For example, if you have a knowledgeable reviewer of a certain gameplay style, it would review higher. Expectation of the reviewer also plays a part. Hell, what that reviewer had for lunch or whether they are going through a break-up has an impact. Criticism is an art, not a science. It baffles me how many people here defend reviews, especially arbitrary scores, as if they are canon.
This wouldnt be the first time sites have been criticized for reviewing games based on clicks. Hasnt that been one of the problems people had/has with Polygon since it came around?
Not saying it doesnt happen, or that it is the case with Recore or FH3, but it seems like something I imagine most people would agree with.
Not saying it doesnt happen, or that it is the case with Recore or FH3, but it seems like something I imagine most people would agree with.
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
I think he comes more off as dumb and that his comment will enable foolish people. As shown by this thread.
LukasTaves
Member
Yeah, out of anger. Watch the whole video please.
In Service
Member
Hah! In that case, I refer you to my earlier caveat and I will just say the internetz is crazy.
Opinion reviews are the best reads. If you find a reviewer you "click" with then it's all about the words.
BudokaiMR2
Member
As someone pointed out above, this obviously is a much more nuanced conversation becuase you can't just focus on outlets but on writers themselves. However, it's still hard to see why Fallout 4 can be given this little caveat on it's Giant Bomb 4/5 review from Jeff:
However, on Brad's review of ReCore it seems like the end of the world:
When you take into account that one is a well-known IP that has had multiple iterations with the same exact problems and the other one is a fairly ambitious new IP with in a LOT of cases have much less critical bugs... I don't think Phil's comment about them being a bit harsh on it is too off-base.
I did watch the whole video. Read the whole post. There are more arguments in my post beyond the first sentence.
ScientificPizza
Banned
Nah
I mean this does happen. But for Recore? Nah
I mean this does happen. But for Recore? Nah
Saint of Killers
Member
Next he'll be telling us that, sometimes, positive reviews are bought and paid for!
That first picture in that thread, Jeff's response, got me laughing out loud. Really good thread. I completely forgot about this.
I really wish people like Phil Spencer, huge names in the industry, wouldn't say stuff like this. It's not only looks salty and seems unprofessional, but it gives the people that think every review publication they disagree with is bought off by AAA companies the feeling that they have some legs to stand on because, "Look, even Phil Spencer said it!"
Why can't he just say, "I don't agree with the reviews it received but we are working hard to improve its reception." Especially when they are doing that. That last patch was bomba compared to launch.
Next interview will be a list warz.
arts&crafts
Member
Although this has nothing to do with this game, it definitely does happen. Look at Pitchfork reviews...
uncledonnie
Banned
OP should really be updated with the full quote. I still don't think it's great for him to say this but given that he called out the review that gave FH3 a '4' and not any particular ReCore review, it's not as bad as it's made out to be either.
ScientificPizza
Banned
What
e: nvm it was a joke i guess?
JayWood2010
Member
You guys do realize Phil Spencer was talking about Forza Horizon 3, and not Recore right?
"I didn't try to tell anybody that it was a ten. I think we knew, as with any games, that there are certain things if we started from the beginning and we knew what we'd get, there's a couple of things we would've done slightly differently. But we're very proud of how the game ended up. And I think seven, eight, nine, like anywhere in there is fine. Three or four I mean somebody gave Forza Horizon 3 a four. I think there's certain reviews that are written more to get clicked on than they are to actually accurately reflect the quality of the game, and that kind of bums me out."
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-head-phil-spencer-talks-scorpio-ps4-pro-4k-re/1100-6444198/
"I didn't try to tell anybody that it was a ten. I think we knew, as with any games, that there are certain things if we started from the beginning and we knew what we'd get, there's a couple of things we would've done slightly differently. But we're very proud of how the game ended up. And I think seven, eight, nine, like anywhere in there is fine. Three or four I mean somebody gave Forza Horizon 3 a four. I think there's certain reviews that are written more to get clicked on than they are to actually accurately reflect the quality of the game, and that kind of bums me out."
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-head-phil-spencer-talks-scorpio-ps4-pro-4k-re/1100-6444198/
ethomaz
Banned
While it looks like the same issues maybe it is not... one can break the immersion/enjoyment of the game and other not.
Or in better word maybe Fallout 4 high points are enough to compensate the low points for the reviewer while Recore not.
Any of them are wrong? Absolutely not... they are reviewers.
BTW how Jeff scored Fallout 4???
Chobel
Member
You realize he's actually talking about both? Why is everyone ignoring "Three or four"?
Dee Dah Dave
Member
I'm sure he's not wrong in some cases. When the modern game journalism business makes it's living from ad revenue generated by clicks, there's bound to be at least some 'foul play'. It's the nature of the world we live in.
Recore though sucked. A game with that kind of weight behind it could and should have been much better. They should know the game they made was average at best without needing to hear reviews.
Horizon 3 though is a clear 9/10 game. When someone gives it 3/10 or whatever then that is stupid and uncalled for. Obviously some people just don't like certain games which is fair. But then a game like FH3 should get at least a 6/10 on technical merit alone IMO.
And as for the fanboys who are constantly bickering with each other and being negative about the plastic box their mum didn't buy them for Christmas. They are indeed pathetic and not 'true gamers', as P3 has mentioned before. I wish there was a game forum that instabanned all that shit. But again, I suppose the clicks are more important tehehe!
Recore though sucked. A game with that kind of weight behind it could and should have been much better. They should know the game they made was average at best without needing to hear reviews.
Horizon 3 though is a clear 9/10 game. When someone gives it 3/10 or whatever then that is stupid and uncalled for. Obviously some people just don't like certain games which is fair. But then a game like FH3 should get at least a 6/10 on technical merit alone IMO.
And as for the fanboys who are constantly bickering with each other and being negative about the plastic box their mum didn't buy them for Christmas. They are indeed pathetic and not 'true gamers', as P3 has mentioned before. I wish there was a game forum that instabanned all that shit. But again, I suppose the clicks are more important tehehe!
Shai-Tan
Banned
I do think there is an effect of hype that leads to high profile games getting a bump (like 10%) and possibly guarded against the impulse from some reviewers to not approach a review in good faith - we often see this with cult hit games with some of the initial reviews. Part of that is lack of understanding, however there are also likely reputation effects. I'm not saying this game is one of them (probably not) but there are clearly psychological biases behind critical reception that have differential effects on games apart from their quality even if it's just high profile games being less affected by chaotic interactions of mood on the day the game was played. There are more insidious effects like the "cheating on homework" effect as in reviews are less independent than they could be because some people are reading other reviews while writing their own.
randomengine
Banned
Did you personally play it? I often wonder how many times people tear down a game actually have.
To me it reads like he's talking about not agreeing with a 3 or 4 for Recore and subsequently attaching the same opinion onto a 4/10 score for FH3.
Most in this thread have different opinions to interpret that quote but that's my 2 cents.
Okami Haundo
Member
Ugh... While parts of that were a good interview, I don't buy the Recore comments. The fact that they wrote it as "he suggested" without any form of comment tied to it just smells like BS. I'm not saying that I think Phil wouldn't say that, just that I find writing like that to be extremely lazy.
It doesn't matter. It's not for the Head of Xbox to repeat opinions from random NeoGAF/GameFAQs/4chan posters. Just no.
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