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[TheGreatMightyPoo]

I'm not quite saying F the core, although I do feel ambivalent-at-best toward much of that crowd.

Their priorities seem screwy, their tastes make me say ugh, their sense of financial reality seems disjointed (I'm being kind on this point). I just don't want to see Nintendo bending over backwards, becoming something they aren't for an audience that, I think, has largely made-up their mind on the company. Nintendo's best chance, I think, lies with the folks they've lost over the years. Make the games that they loved - the F-Zeros, etc- and they will come.

HylianTom would gladly join me in toilet papering third party developers' homes.

How about we start with the ones that gave that glowing praise of the Wii U in testimonials???

Not Peter Moore though or Yves, they will actually put games on the platform.

 

[Fantastical]

Lol, RMC will never tease something he knows ever again. He's typically not one to do this anyways.

 

[NateDrake]

Nintendo should be ashamed of themselves if they don't change the Wii U name.

It would be an unbelievable example of not learning from past mistakes. It still haunts the 3DS to this very day, a year after release and I suggest that it will effect the Wii U long term as well. The name alone needs to let people know that this isn't just a revision.

I just can't believe they wouldn't look at what happened with the 3DS and not realise this. Mental.

The 3DS hit the problem because Nintendo made too many revisions. DS > DS Lite > DSi > DSi XL. 3DS just sounded like another entry to that line & not a successor.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Could be, but that Castlevania game for the PS360 came out last year. Not sure if they meant "no releases in a while" on handhelds or the (3)DS though.

Oh, didn't think of that.

I'm just desperate for a Castle/Metroidvania game.

No Nintendo portable should be without one:[

 

[DragonKnight]

HylianTom would gladly join me in toilet papering third party developers' homes.

How about we start with the ones that gave that glowing praise of the Wii U in testimonials???

Not Peter Moore though or Yves, they will actually put games on the platform.

Just wish you would pull yourself out of the equation. Nintendo never had third party problems with the NES and SNES and had they followed their simple requests back in the day, they probably wouldn't be having any now and would be even more profitable. First party and third party support is what made the SNES fucking awesome.

 

[Izick]

Oh, didn't think of that.

I'm just desperate for a Castle/Metroidvania game.

No Nintendo portable should be without one:[

I would buy a 3DS solely for a 2D Metroid.

Is that irony?

 

[Skiesofwonder]

Didn't say casuals won't come back. I said they won't come back in such large numbers. Wii selling like hot cakes was lighting in a bottle. I can see that you're expecting lighting to strike twice. I don't and nintendo doesn't and therefore they are looking to their core.

I've already said the Wii-U will not sell as well as the Wii. I'm not expecting lighting to strike twice, I'm expecting a bunch of people to continue to to buy Nintendo products because they like what they previously experienced and know that it is a great experience for everyone. Nintendo is ALWAYS looking at the core. Nintendo's strategy this go around is to initially snag the core then go after the casual market further down the road like they are doing with the 3DS right now. Nintendo is trying to get third party support because obviously that was the main flaw of the Wii. That doesn't mean that without said support Wii-U couldn't be a successful console. It also doesn't mean that Nintendo is abandoning the casual market. Unless the Wii-U was a complete disaster, it will never be the GCN sales-level system you expect to be, even without UE4. It will have way too many extremely popular franchises. Look at the 3DS, it's basically floating respectfully in America just because of Mk7 and SM3DL.

BTW, you just can't say "oh 25m bought GCN, and 100m bought Wii, so therefore 75m were casual gamers". It's never as simple as that.

 

[ElFly]

Checking that pdf you can also get the attach rate for the DS.


90 031 / (15 152 + 2678 + 1212) = 4.72802227

(total soft/ds + dsi + dsxl)

Which is kind of low, but I guess people rebuy portables a lot more.


3ds has

4542 / 1713 = 2.65148862

Which is ok I guess for a console that's been out for little more than a year. And the future is, uh, not that good I think, according to their own expectations

(7300 + 4542) / (1713 + 1850) = 3.3236037


The thing said that actual sales DO count bundles, so that 8.5 has to discount Wii Sports / Mario Kart / Wii Sports Resorts for a lot of consoles.

 

[Anth0ny]

In my opinion, Sunshine gets a lot of rose tinted glasses from folks. Galaxy was exactly the direction the series needed to go in after Sunshine which left out too much of the series' roots. There was too much sandbox and not enough sandcastle, namely: proper platforming (Fludd'less stages were good but those were more like bonus areas).

And there were more than a few open ended stages in Galaxy like Honey Hive and Sea Slide. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Sunshine but it's pretty weak compared to Galaxy and the fact it had so little meat to it made the five year wait until SMG all the more painful.

If they make a sequel they need to do the following to get me on board (in response to EuropeOG's original post):

Add more action and platforming, more enemies, a LOT less recycled missions, NO blue coin garbage - just give us actual missions for the extra shines, more stages, more bosses, better integration of Yoshi and I'm there.

I don't think it's nostalgia. Mario 64 and Sunshine took the series in a different direction, and put a focus on exploration (7 stars per stage with 15 stages total, as opposed to reaching the goal at the end of dozens of stages).

Galaxy was definitely a return to the series' more linear roots, with more of a focus on platforming and simply getting to the end of the stage instead of exploring the stage and finding stars.

I would love to see a 2D Mario this year (NSMB2), an open world, SM64/Sunshine style Mario next year, and a linear, Galaxy/3D Land style Mario in two years. Rinse and repeat that cycle. All three styles have something different to offer, and prevents the "mainline Mario" series from becoming stale.

 

[Redford]

The 3DS hit the problem because Nintendo made too many revisions. DS > DS Lite > DSi > DSi XL. 3DS just sounded like another entry to that line & not a successor.

Yep. It's not necessarily the same.

However the one character difference... I'm sure they could have come up with something a bit more substantial that would convey the same message.

 

[Mpl90]

I would buy a 3DS solely for a 2D Metroid.

Is that irony?

Not so much, stereoscopic 3D with 2D games can be AWESOME.

 

[Nilaul]

What if no one shows up but Iwata???

That would make my day, and the whole year

Thanks everyone for there wishes

 

[DragonKnight]

I've already said the Wii-U will not sell as well as the Wii. I'm not expecting lighting to strike twice, I'm expecting a bunch of people to continue to to buy Nintendo products because they like what they previously experienced and know that it is a great experience for everyone. Nintendo is ALWAYS looking at the core. Nintendo's strategy this go around is to initially snag the core then go after the casual market further down the road like they are doing with the 3DS right now. Nintendo is trying to get third party support because obviously that was the main flaw of the Wii. That doesn't mean that without said support Wii-U couldn't be a successful console. It also doesn't mean that Nintendo is abandoning the casual market. Unless the Wii-U was a complete disaster, it will never be the GCN sales-level system you expect to be, even without UE4. It will have way too many extremely popular franchises. Look at the 3DS, it's basically floating respectfully in America just because of Mk7 and SM3DL.

BTW, you just can't say "oh 25m bought GCN, and 100m bought Wii, so therefore 75m were casual gamers". It's never as simple as that.

Oh I know it isn't that simple but the Wii audience breakdown is overwhelmingly more casual than core. Make no mistake about that.

And don't talk about nintendo franchises. They didn't help during the 64 days and they didn't help the GCN. You need help sometimes.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Just wish you would pull yourself out of the equation. Nintendo never had third party problems with the NES and SNES and had they followed their simple requests back in the day, they probably wouldn't be having any now and would be even more profitable. First party and third party support is what made the SNES fucking awesome.

Simple requests???

Hey guys, let's do whatever other companies want for OUR company.

They're still getting whining nowadays despite bending over backwards for these companies.

It'll never be enough for these developers with odd priorities.

 

[BY2K]

So we're back to Castlevania?

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

I would buy a 3DS solely for a 2D Metroid.

Is that irony?

No, every Nintendo portable should have 2D games.

They could do some wonders with 3D though in these 2D games.

The reason I am desperate for them on the 3DS is I see no way these 2D franchise games end up on the Wii U.

 

[AceBandage]

Simple requests???

Hey guys, let's do whatever other companies want for OUR company.

They're still getting whining nowadays despite bending over backwards for these companies.

It'll never be enough for these developers with odd priorities.

It's always easy to spend other people's money.

 

[DragonKnight]

Simple requests???

Hey guys, let's do whatever other companies want for OUR company.

They're still getting whining nowadays despite bending over backwards for these companies.

It'll never be enough for these developers with odd priorities.

Hey. Make it powerful, profitable, and affortable. Every company must have standards and at the same time must be able to show a little leg room. Nintendo, admittedly, can open up a little more and they are doing that. I never said they should bend over backwards. Question: are you a nintendo only gamer or a pc/nintendo gamer?

 

[Izick]

Now I'm just more pissed that I'm not going to play Metroid Prime 3....fuck.

 

[Instro]

About the RMC tease for the 3DS game, what I've seen so far from his Twitter

1) It's a third party game. The company is a long-running, well-known one.

2) It's NOT a localisation announcement for something we already know. So, it isn't AA v.s. PL


3)It's a game from a franchise which hasn't seen many releases for a while.


4)It was one of those games rumoured in the last months

5)He's sent an email to the company to see if he can get the possibility of doing an official tease

Soo...Castlevania? Contra? What has been rumoured in the last months?

Paging ShockingAlberto.

 

[Penguin]

Oh I know it isn't that simple but the Wii audience breakdown is overwhelmingly more casual than core. Make no mistake about that.

And don't talk about nintendo franchises. They didn't help during the 64 days and they didn't help the GCN. You need help sometimes.

Well they did help.. I mean a reason those systems stayed afloat and Nintendo isn't hanging out with SEGA at this point.


Either way, I don't think.. or hope no one will deny that Nintendo needs help to build up their console's audience.

 

[Redford]

I'm predicting a much healthier, slower but steady rate of purchase over time, among the general consumer population. It will be good.

 

[Fantastical]

About the RMC tease for the 3DS game, what I've seen so far from his Twitter

1) It's a third party game. The company is a long-running, well-known one.

2) It's NOT a localisation announcement for something we already know. So, it isn't AA v.s. PL


3)It's a game from a franchise which hasn't seen many releases for a while.


4)It was one of those games rumoured in the last months

5)He's sent an email to the company to see if he can get the possibility of doing an official tease

Soo...Castlevania? Contra? What has been rumoured in the last months?

I think there's a very good possibility it's Contra. RMC is a huge fan. Then again, he's also a huge fan of Castlevania.

 

[DragonKnight]

Well they did help.. I mean a reason those systems stayed afloat and Nintendo isn't hanging out with SEGA at this point.


Either way, I don't think.. or hope no one will deny that Nintendo needs help to build up their console's audience.

That's exactly what some posters are saying. The nintendo hive mind is impressive indeed.

 

[Izick]

I'm predicting a much healthier, slower but steady rate of purchase over time, among the general consumer population. It will be good.

That shit wins the race, yo.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

I think there's a very good possibility it's Contra. RMC is a huge fan. Then again, he's also a huge fan of Castlevania.

A 3D Contra would be a disaster.

Hopefully, it'll be 2D with 3D effects.

 

[Redford]

That's exactly what some posters are saying. The nintendo hive mind is impressive indeed.

Careful with this shit.

 

[Father_Brain]

But exclusives and first party games will set the tone.

Why would gamers that traditionally buy the other systems flock to Nintendo over systems that will be more powerful that play those games they are used to???

Well, to make the argument that I've been making for over a year now: If Nintendo doesn't give any significant percentage of the current PS3/360 audience any incentive to make Wii U their primary system for multiplatform games, then multiplatform titles will bomb early on, the perception that "third-party core games don't sell on Nintendo platforms" will once again stick, those third parties will largely pull their support by mid-to-late 2014, and Wii U will end up a failure in that market.

Nintendo has no easy road to winning over the current HD core market, but they at least have a shot if whatever exclusive content they have aimed at that market early on is high-quality and marketed well enough. They do not, however, have a shot at sustaining that beyond the first 18-24 months or so if they can't get and keep a steady stream of multiplatform titles coming to the platform.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

 

[Fantastical]

A 3D Contra would be a disaster.

Hopefully, it'll be 2D with 3D effects.

I think that's a given.

 

[Skiesofwonder]

Just like they set the tone for the GCN, right? And what third party exclusives are you talking about. Killer freaks and Lego stories are all we known right now.

And figuring out how to get them to flock to the WiiU is nintendo goal and thus there problem. I'm simply suggesting some ways for them to make it happen.

You truly underestimate the growth of Nintendo's franchises the last ten years.

And stop playing the defense card and back-peddling on what you originally said. I'm not doubting that Nintendo is going after the core audience and I'm also not saying they don't need them. I welcome third party support always. But Nintendo doesn't need UE4 support to succeed. They aren't Microsoft or even Sony. They can float on their own innovations, ideas, and most importantly software. Wii proved this.

Yes the casual market is harder to capture becuase their is more competition. But it's still there, and it's bigger then ever. Nintendo games are no longer looked at as for "kids only" experiences. The general population looks at Nintendo titles now knowing they are experiences for everyone, similar to Pixar or Disney. Wii might not of had a positive effect on the posters here, but the general population now views Nintendo (Wii) in another light.

There is nothing stopping the Wii-U from grasping a huge group of the casual market again with compelling innovations, software, and ideas. I believe Nintendo saw what Microsoft did with Kinect and figured out it might be able to have its' cake and eat it too. Therefore they will play a strong hand for the core at first, then go after the casual market the next year with a price drop and casual friendly titles.

Same way the 3DS is getting NSMB2, Animal Crossing, and Brain Training all this year.

 

[Izick]

Gross. Come on man I was at work. How am I going to explain this to my boss?

 

[japtor]

The Making of The Witcher 2 - DF on the genesis of the epic RPG and its miraculous 360 adaptation

Pretty interesting points imo - I wonder how the WiiU compares..

Well the CPU should be significantly faster if it has out of order execution as many are speculating, and BD can read pretty fast I guess, plus the system sounds like it'll have 1.5-2GB RAM which will help as well.

Exactly. Both Galaxy games are platforms, while Mario 64 is more an adventure. All of them are great in their own way, although I prefer the Galaxy style. However, to change things up a bit, I'd like more if next 3D Mario was more a big, open adventure. Especially since all latter ones (Galaxy 1/2, NSMB 1/2/Wii and 3D Land) are linear and mostly platform-based. I already miss 64 and Sunshine style.

I could never get into 64 cause I guess it felt too spartan, like many of the exploration levels just seemed deserted. I liked Sunshine a lot, so that's the main difference between them that I can think of...I remember a lot of running around in 64 just looking for crap and not much jumping.

In my opinion, Sunshine gets a lot of rose tinted glasses from folks. Galaxy was exactly the direction the series needed to go in after Sunshine which left out too much of the series' roots. There was too much sandbox and not enough sandcastle, namely: proper platforming (Fludd'less stages were good but those were more like bonus areas).

And there were more than a few open ended stages in Galaxy like Honey Hive and Sea Slide. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Sunshine but it's pretty weak compared to Galaxy and the fact it had so little meat to it made the five year wait until SMG all the more painful.

If they make a sequel they need to do the following to get me on board (in response to EuropeOG's original post):

Add more action and platforming, more enemies, a LOT less recycled missions, NO blue coin garbage - just give us actual missions for the extra shines, more stages, more bosses, better integration of Yoshi and I'm there.

Sounds like you want 3D Land + Yoshi. (hell that'd be fine to me)

 

[Penguin]

That's exactly what some posters are saying. The nintendo hive mind is impressive indeed.

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.
I thought it was that they don't necessarily need Unreal Engine 4 to make that happens.
And that may be true-ish for the first year or two, and really by that point, I think 3rd parties would have a read on the system anyhow.

 

[Redford]

There is nothing stopping the Wii-U from grasping a huge group of the casual market again with compelling innovations, software, and ideas. I believe Nintendo saw what Microsoft did with Kinect and figured out it might be able to have its' cake and eat it too. Therefore they will play a strong hand for the core at first, then go after the casual market the next year with a price drop and casual friendly titles.

While this part sounds awful; overall...

A good post.

Sounds like you want 3D Land + Yoshi. (hell that'd be fine to me)

Or just Yoshi. I have a good feel about this.

 

[Spieler Eins]

I think there's a very good possibility it's Contra. RMC is a huge fan. Then again, he's also a huge fan of Castlevania.

Who's RMC? Anyway, it's time for new 2D Metroidvania or Contra on 3DS. I'm worried about last years Contra teaser though. Gears of War clone incoming?

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

About the RMC tease for the 3DS game, what I've seen so far from his Twitter

1) It's a third party game. The company is a long-running, well-known one.

2) It's NOT a localisation announcement for something we already know. So, it isn't AA v.s. PL


3)It's a game from a franchise which hasn't seen many releases for a while.


4)It was one of those games rumoured in the last months

5)He's sent an email to the company to see if he can get the possibility of doing an official tease

Soo...Castlevania? Contra? What has been rumoured in the last months?

Iga headed Contravania plz!

 

[qq more]

Who's RMC? Anyway, it's time for new 2D Metroidvania or Contra on 3DS. I'm worried about last years Contra teaser though. Gears of War clone incoming?

RawMeatCowboy. He made that certain go to Nintendo site.

 

[Skiesofwonder]

Oh I know it isn't that simple but the Wii audience breakdown is overwhelmingly more casual than core. Make no mistake about that.

And don't talk about nintendo franchises. They didn't help during the 64 days and they didn't help the GCN. You need help sometimes.

Explain then how the 3DS is Nintendo's fastest selling console ever? Besides Japan it has similar third party support to what the GCN did.

Wii-U will be the same way IMO. It will garner significant Eastern Support, and Western Support similar to the GCN. It will do fine. Also Nintendo created that "lighting in a bottle" by releasing compelling casual support. They created Wii Sports, WSR, Wii Fit, Wii Fit Plus, Wii Play, and turned core-focused franchises like Mario Kart and Punchout into bridge titles. Do you really think without said software Wii would of sold so well? Motion controls or not, Nintendo floated the Wii to the second best selling console of all time mainly with its "bubble".

If you somehow do think a motion-controlled system would sell itself, I would like to point you to the move.

 

[HylianTom]

Simple requests???

Hey guys, let's do whatever other companies want for OUR company.

They're still getting whining nowadays despite bending over backwards for these companies.

It'll never be enough for these developers with odd priorities.

Pretty much.
(and I won't go too much into how I honestly feel about some third parties.)

I'd love to see Nintendo get a respectable level of small and medium-sized developers in an "alliance of the sane," keeping development costs in check, and bringing a diverse enough number of games to appeal to more than just us fanmen. With enough of this support, and with their own games development ramped-up, Nintendo would be able to shrug at those developers who snipe and bitch at 'em.

 

[japtor]

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.
I thought it was that they don't necessarily need Unreal Engine 4 to make that happens.
And that may be true-ish for the first year or two, and really by that point, I think 3rd parties would have a read on the system anyhow.

I guess that's a reasonable point since a lot of devs have their own engines. That said, UE4 support is still important from a technical standpoint since other internal engines will likely use similar features. Like if the hardware can't support it, then other third party engines may have issues as well. It all leads to the same doomed endgame.

 

[DragonKnight]

Explain then how the 3DS is Nintendo's fastest selling console ever? Besides Japan it has similar third party support to what the GCN did.

Wii-U will be the same way IMO. It will garner significant Eastern Support, and Western Support similar to the GCN. It will do fine. Also Nintendo created that "lighting in a bottle" by releasing compelling casual support. They created Wii Sports, WSR, Wii Fit, Wii Fit Plus, Wii Play, and turned core-focused franchises like Mario Kart and Punchout into bridge titles. Do you really think without said software Wii would of sold so well? Motion controls or not, Nintendo floated the Wii to the second best selling console of all time mainly with its "bubble".

If you somehow do, I would like to point you to the move.

Let's agree to disagree. You're not seeing my point of view and I'm not seeing yours. We will see how things turn out in a few years.

 

[Redford]

A little less than salty in here today... Peppery?

 

[AceBandage]

A little less than salty in here today... Peppery?

Cumin.

 

[IdeaMan]

I'll post a new tidbit (well, more a confirmation) when i catch up

 

[AceBandage]

I'll post a new tidbit (well, more a confirmation) when i catch up

Finally.
Confirmation that the Wii U includes an ice cream maker.

 

[DragonKnight]

I'll post a new tidbit (well, more a confirmation) when i catch up

Hmm. How about you skip the morsels and start giving some appetizers? . I'll be away so hopefully it'll be worthwhile when I get back.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Well, to make the argument that I've been making for over a year now: If Nintendo doesn't give any significant percentage of the current PS3/360 audience any incentive to make Wii U their primary system for multiplatform games, then multiplatform titles will bomb early on, the perception that "third-party core games don't sell on Nintendo platforms" will once again stick, those third parties will largely pull their support by mid-to-late 2014, and Wii U will end up a failure in that market.

Nintendo has no easy road to winning over the current HD core market, but they at least have a shot if whatever exclusive content they have aimed at that market early on is high-quality and marketed well enough. They do not, however, have a shot at sustaining that beyond the first 18-24 months or so if they can't get and keep a steady stream of multiplatform titles coming to the platform.

While I think this is true to an extent, I also don't think it's going to be quite so "all or nothing" for multiplatform performances. It took a solid 2 years for basically everything to stop "bombing" on PS3, and that was coming off the PS2 and only a year later than the lead machine it was getting ports from. I think multiplatform sales are pretty much guaranteed to be low for Wii U upfront, but I'd also expect publishers are going in knowing that and budgeting accordingly (ie: why Darksiders II gets no performance gains). Porting is comparably cheap, as long as Wii U versions make a return, publishers will continue investing in it.

What needs to really earn it's keep and drive the platform is 1st party games and 3rd party exclusive deals. That's what Nintendo's going to be counting on to drive userbase as fast as possible, and what will really ensure Wii U remains a viable destination for ports going forward.

 

[Izick]

Finally.
Confirmation that the Wii U includes an ice cream maker.

About damn time.

 

[HylianTom]

A little less than salty in here today... Peppery?

I can be a bit salty when it comes to third parties, hehe.. thus, my constant allusions to Reggie's remarkable flatulence, red ink, etc.