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[A Black Falcon]

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/publishers-to-receive-cut-of-xbox-one-pre-owned-sales-at-retail/0116137

"Retailers will be free to charge whatever they wish for pre-owned Xbox One games, but both Microsoft and publishers will take a percentage cut of every sale."

Yeah, that is absolutely unacceptable. Once you own something, you own it. I'm sure the courts will back this kind of companies-over-people move up, if it ever went there, but seriously, it's tragic that things seem to be moving towards that kind of future, with companies getting precedence over peoples' rights to actually own the things that they own. That is not okay.

 

[Krowley]

Percentage chance that MS even addresses this at all in their E3 press conference?

My guess: The only way you'll hear about it during E3 is if they get cold feet and decide to roll it back...

You might get a statement like, "We have heard the outcry, and we listen, and blah blah.."

Probably too late for that, but you never know. They might be able to do whatever the fuck they want.

I can tell you one thing: I've been on this board for a very long time, and I've never seen such a poisonous atmosphere towards any console as this. Xbone is fucking hated right now in the enthusiast community. Hated.

And enthusiasts are among the earliest adopters of expensive tech, so their opinion matters. MS can't be enjoying this kind of buzz right out of the gate from a very important community, one that they've had good success with in the past.

 

[Zabka]

Though agile of both mind and body, Major Nelson can not be shaken from his PR path.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

Season 4 was awful

You mean 5, right?

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Nothing they say will be enough for some people. So those who are actually interested in the console will just wait for all the facts and details to be out and see what they have to show at E3 and then proceed from there.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Not looking good for
Majornelson

As it should be. Hell, let's get on there too and show our disgust for this move.

 

[Vandiger]

Would have been better off just making Xbone a digital platform no more confusion

 

[commedieu]

Problem is, when Microsoft stops surporting that "console"(ie Killing off Xbox live Support for Xbone), all it's games die with it. That's the Bullshit I don't want to pay for.

Oh you'll fucking pay alright.


Xbox, Destroy...

 

[Rebel Leader]

The 5 D's of PR:

Dodge
Duck
Dip
Dive

Dodge

 

[UrbanRats]

 

[Fistwell]

"Over the paste few days"

Go home Xbone, you're drunk.

What a goddam trainwreck.

 

[The Librarian]

Not looking good for
Majornelson

Okay. How many of those people are GAFers?

 

[Sola Scriptura]

Microsofts entire reveal was a failure. That is Microsoft dropping the ball. They released muddled information, contradicting information, and wouldn't answer questions about the issues they raised. I don't think any part of his post suggested Sony wouldn't do this. Sony had "Draconian DRM" however SOny has said that users will specifically be able to enjoy their console, without internet, because some places don't have internet. Thats more definitive than anything microsofts said in the past 72 hours.

There are smart ways to do things, Microsoft is showing how to 100% do it wrong. From the announcement to dealing with the announcement, and here again, an OFFICIAL announcement saying absolutely nothing. Sony didn't tell gamers to fuck off until E3, and to not bother watching.

At this point, Sony doing something similar regarding used/resale is completely irrelevant. Even if Sony's policy ends up being almost identical to Microsoft's, Microsoft is going to take the heat.

This is an unmitigated disaster on Microsoft's part. By revealing the console and unwittingly raising used/resale issues with the reveal, they have placed themselves in a no-win situation unless they completely backpedal out of it and reverse course.

 

[Mr.Wreckless]

Sony didnt just have a conference though, if they had and fucked it up like this they would be getting the same shit. Ms have fumbled the ball on this.

Yeah they fumbled by even partially mentioning their plans. What they should have done is gone the Sony route and be even more vague by saying almost nothing, that way people won't go crazy with rage for not knowing enough details. By the time it comes out that a lot of the Sony games will have the same deal people will have spent all their anger weeks prior at another company.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Okay. How many of those people are GAFers?

Not enough.

 

[Jmanunknown]

I can't believe MS planned all of this out so fucking badly. How could they not have prepared a complete statement to give about this crap? Did they really not realize that people would get pissed off, and that there would be a thousand questions about their incomplete BS statements? Now they're stuck doing damage control, and failing pretty spectacularly at it. It really makes it seem like they weren't really prepared for this reveal at all.

They had time to prepare they just did not and currently do not care what the consumer thinks. They have invested money probably a nice size amount into their always online new used game strategy they are not gonna go back now. They are hoping that the content they put on to the xbox one is compelling enough despite its flaws people begrudgingly buy the system.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

I hope it works like this:

this would be smart and reasonable.

 

[Capital_Five]

I wish they would just say that it's going to be the same as on the 360. This means that it isn't though, doesn't it?

Someone tell me it's all going to be fine and we can all love Microsoft again!

 

[MYeager]

Yeah, that is absolutely unacceptable. Once you own something, you own it. I'm sure the courts will back this kind of companies-over-people move up, if it ever went there, but seriously, it's tragic that things seem to be moving towards that kind of future, with companies getting precedence over peoples' rights to actually own the things that they own. That is not okay.

You haven't read an EULA on a game you've purchased in the last few years then. They'll agree you own the disk is on and box the game came in, but not the code on the disk.

 

[Codeblue]

Just say it. It won't make people any less angry if you announce Halo right after telling us that used games will now be on Microsoft's terms and not ours. No point in waiting for E3.

Rip the bandage off already.

 

[SlowRevolution]

Reddit and Facebook are monsters that weren't as big in 2006 and they are apparently bitching to high heaven too. The world has changed and with it PR. MS has not changed their policies and they're still holding out hope the delay and distract will solve everything

I haven't looked much but it seems like /r/gaming has been pretty pro-Xbox One, I kept seeing dumb image macros defending it when I went to see the reactions.

 

[farisr]

My guess: The only way you'll hear about it during E3 is if they get cold feet and decide to roll it back...

You might get a statement like, "We have heard the outcry, and we listen, and blah blah.."

Probably too late for that, but you never know. They might be able to do whatever the fuck they want.

It's only too late if they've made deals with third party developers that specifically hinge on this feature as being part of the console. In that case, the best they can do (if they see it's damaging sales) is remove the restrictions once the contracts run out, or possibly pay a big severance fee to get out of it.

Most of this stuff can be corrected through software patches if they really want to.

 

[Oni Jazar]

And here it is:

http://majornelson.com/2013/05/24/xbox-one-and-used-games-2/



Well glad that's all cleared up then.

So a big FU to renters then?

 

[tuffy]

My guess: The only way you'll hear about it during E3 is if they get cold feet and decide to roll it back...

You might get a statement like, "We have heard the outcry, and we listen, and blah blah.."

Probably too late for that, but you never know. They might be able to do whatever the fuck they want.

If Microsoft is already setting up server farms and other infrastructure to have it going by launch, there's no way it'll be rolled back. All that stuff was decided before the console was ever unveiled and they're sure to stick with it to the bitter end.

 

[Kacho]

Never forget . . .

Huh?


The comments section on his website is getting hammered. lol

 

[NullPointer]

You haven't read an EULA on a game you've purchased in the last few years then. They'll agree you own the disk is on and box the game came in, but not the code on the disk.

You own a license for its use though.

 

[Robot Pants]

I hope it works like this:

What if someone steals your game?
They can just activate it on your their account and it deletes from yours?

I guess you'd be SOL anyway, since the disc code is tied to your account. You'd have to get another one anyway.

 

[dinosaur_hunter2]

He literally said nothing. As vague as the statements before this one. FOR FUCKS SAKE, give drect answers!

Also, how are all the reports inaccurate if all of them were based on something MICROSOFT had said before? It's just ridiculous.

 

[BobTheFork]

"The ability to trade in and resell games is important to gamers and to Xbox. Xbox One is designed to support the trade in and resale of games"

That's the same thing you have been saying. It's possibly the forth time someone has clarified the issue while not being clear.

It's insulting.


Edited because you guys are right, Mj Nelson doesn't deserve it.

 

[commedieu]

Okay. How many of those people are GAFers?

https://twitter.com/search/realtime?q=@majornelson&src=typd

edit;

Jesus.. I know larry is doing a job. and gets paid... but hes also part of the community. We are like wolves... :\

I almost feel bad.

 

[Struct09]

They're probably not ready to announce the details since they haven't been finalized, but at the same time they needed to announce the console and some base features. I do not envy the PR team over there, this must be a nightmare.

Hope their solution is solid, I'm anxious to hear what their plan is.

 

[madmackem]

Klepk nails it on giantbomb

http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/microsoft-digs-bigger-hole-over-used-games/1100-4647/

 

[emb]

If that's there official statement, meant to clarify and fix the situation, then lol. I'm even less happy with them now. They go to all that trouble just to basically say "no comment". But at the same time, sounds like further confirmation that there is a "policy" to worry about, and that the One is only worth ignoring.

 

[Courage]

Problem is, when Microsoft stops surporting that "console"(ie Killing off Xbox live Support for Xbone), all it's games die with it. That's the Bullshit I don't want to pay for.

Then they'd have to offer a backup plan like Valve does with Steam. Maybe override the policy when they stop supporting Live for the Xbone.

 

[Archpath1]

"We will disclose more information in the near future."

for a small fee....

 

[The Librarian]

What if someone steals your game?
They can just activate it on your their account and it deletes from yours?

How common are videogame thefts?

 

[smurfx]

they're probably trying to confuse people and let the kiss ass gaming sites spin everything they are gonna do into being positive.

 

[PFD]

That statement literally said nothing.

I'm pretty sure it said something.

 

[Stampy]

Yeah they fumbled by even partially mentioning their plans. What they should have done is gone the Sony route and be even more vague by saying almost nothing, that way people won't go crazy with rage for not knowing enough details. By the time it comes out that a lot of the Sony games will have the same deal people will have spent all their anger weeks prior at another company.

brilliant strategy... now that is a good PR.

 

[SneakySneaks]

I haven't looked much but it seems like /r/gaming has been pretty pro-Xbox One, I kept seeing dumb image macros defending it when I went to see the reactions.

Did the same and saw the "Who'd want this shit" post to be really popular. I almost never go to Reddit outside nosleep but it seemed to mirror gaf.

How's 4chan reacting? I imagine they're equally pissed off.

 

[chubigans]

Klepk nails it on giantbomb

http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/microsoft-digs-bigger-hole-over-used-games/1100-4647/

That was good stuff, nice to see Scoops calling them out on it.

 

[Jachaos]

I think you are underestimating just how many times the press has asked about this stuff. This is their response.

I'm sure. I just wish for a small time independent blogger or a fan or someone like that, to find a way to ask them and be aggressive about it, not let up and insist at an open session where a public is watching, until he gets answer to extremely specific questions and scenarios where there's no dancing around the question.

But there's no way major outlets sitting with a PR guy in a closed session will get anything, and this is the situation they want you guys to be in. I know it's not due to lack of asking, it really is just frustrating.

 

[Robot Pants]

How common are videogame thefts?

it can still happen.

 

[UberTag]

I wish they would just say that it's going to be the same as on the 360. This means that it isn't though, doesn't it?

Someone tell me it's all going to be fine and we can all love Microsoft again!

The honeymoon is over, Capital_Five.
Microsoft has declared war on gamers all the while still pretending to be our friends.

 

[PhatSaqs]

Klepk nails it on giantbomb

http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/microsoft-digs-bigger-hole-over-used-games/1100-4647/

Pretty much.

 

[CambriaRising]

He didn't say anything in that statement. He disproved nothing.

What the fuck was the point of saying anything at all?

 

[BlazingDarkness]

#xboxone#boycott

 

[McHuj]

they're probably trying to confuse people and let the kiss ass gaming sites spin everything they are gonna do into being positive.

That's exactly what is happening. Confuse people and ride it out until they the complainers tire or get distracted by something else.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

Friends still have to pay to borrow, stores will offer you less for used xbone games because of our fee/cut.

 

[Baller. PhD]

I love Kelpek's response:

In a bizarre attempt to provide “clarification” over the mixed signals on how Xbox One will handle used games, Xbox evangelist Larry “Major Nelson” Hryb has issued a statement meant to clarify the company’s stance. The statement does not succeed in doing that.

Here’s what he passed along:

“The ability to trade in and resell games is important to gamers and to Xbox. Xbox One is designed to support the trade in and resale of games. Reports about our policies for trade in and resale are inaccurate and incomplete. We will disclose more information in the near future.”

This conversation about used games as we become digital consumers was coming, and it was only a matter of which hardware manufacturer pulled the trigger first. Why, though, would Microsoft decid to stick its foot into the used games discussion without specific answers for consumers? There’s no room for half measures with used games. You are taking away some consumer rights, and if consumers are gaining anything in this transaction, Microsoft needed to make that clear from the very beginning.

Now, it's backpedaling. Now, it's trying to clarity. That means you've already lost the messaging war.

It’s possible there’s actually a pretty reasonable situation where players have the ability to turn in digital licenses for purchased games in exchange for Microsoft Points to spend on the Xbox Marketplace and used games continue to exist at GameStop and other retailers. Since the details of those arrangements is clearly changing, the onus would be on Microsoft to make the coming changes abundantly transparent.

Microsoft didn't, and it wants to pretend it's not its fault.

The statement itself is a joke, too.

“Reports about our policies for trade in and resale are inaccurate and incomplete.”

Microsoft is the one who put its executives and representatives in front of the press earlier this week, and presented increasingly conflicted information. The problem has been getting anything remotely resembling a clear answer out of them. The press hasn’t mangled Microsoft’s message, it’s that Microsoft has very little to say, and wants to point the blame at someone else with the wave of a hand. It won't work.

Sorry, Microsoft. It’s your problem, not mine. Try a little honesty next time?

dat last sentence. mmmmmm