Kung Fu Grip
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Edge #256: Why PS4 is your next console (Shots fired, post-DRM 180)
- Thread starter Nibel
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Can't really say I agree. Most of the articles on mainstream sites are pretty light and fluffy. Both articles here are really well written post-mortems with some nice facts and a dose of history to provide perspective. If all you are willing to take away from it is what you paraphrased, then no it's probably not worth it. But they touch on three other generations in the articles as well and provide a lot of comparison and history as well as "what they did right and wrong"
The official Xbone reveal with always on DRM, mandatory kinect and 24 hour check-ins was in june, no?
I'm in software development and that's a common look for upper managers. Some shitty thinkgeek or development product tee, blazer, and jeans. I hate that look.
ThePeoplesBureau
Member
I bought issue 1 back in 1993, didn't buy it again until the Dreamcast previews started showing up around '98. Bought every issue from then onwards for roughly 12 years, but stopped around 3 years ago. Edge (Future) really hasn't kept up with the times - their online presence is woeful, and the quality of articles dried up years ago. There's also doubtless been a shift where younger gamers are used to getting all of their news/reviews online, and would baulk at the idea of paying for 'old' news.
Yes, the magazine hasn't been shy of similarly thought-provoking covers in the past, but I don't recall ever seeing one that kicks a system that hasn't even been released yet into the dirt. I would have expected it from the tabloid-rag equivalents in the gaming press of old... but coming from Edge, it just has a faint stench of desperation to it.
Yes, the magazine hasn't been shy of similarly thought-provoking covers in the past, but I don't recall ever seeing one that kicks a system that hasn't even been released yet into the dirt. I would have expected it from the tabloid-rag equivalents in the gaming press of old... but coming from Edge, it just has a faint stench of desperation to it.
Damn, £3.99 is a bit steep, otherwise I'd have budged. Surely they can do the digital version cheaper?
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I have no access to the whole article, but the comparison with Sega is hardly fitting, they were in an entirely different situation with both Saturn and Dreamcast.
ShogunDarius
Member
it's cheaper if you sub but yeah it is priced too high
Saturn no, Dreamcast yes.
The comparison to Saturn is spot on. Sega was coming out of the 16-bit era with monstrous IPs and STILL tons of goodwill despite the recent 32x. Yet they still made hardware mistakes compared to their competitor (betting on the wrong features and customer interest like MS), released at a higher price (which like MS they could have lowered had they not been so stubborn), and sent the public and retailers a confusing message (launch, availability, 32x, etc). The Saturn is almost a downright scary comparison.
DC you are right about though. Sega just didn't have enough money at that point for the DC to survive against the PS2. Genuinely one of the biggest tragedies in the history of the industry.
They don't call either console out specifically... But Saturn is really what killed Sega, and I have a feeling that's what the article was referring to. DC has almost always been referred to as Sega's Hail Mary pass. A pass that actually connected with the receiver and he ended up getting to about the 2nd yard line before he was eventually brought down. They just didn't have the money to contend against a healthy Sony, a healthy Nintendo AND a new Microsoft willing to (and capable of) spend billions just to enter the industry.
While of course MS is corporately insincere in everything and I trust them as far as I can throw Manhattan, you do have to ask yourself, if you're giving an important presentation to a large audience, wouldn't you think of how to dress yourself?M°°nblade;68082351 said:What bothers me the most about MS is that, nothing they announce, feels authentic.
You have this bunch of suits give a presentation to cater to the shareholders, wearing expensive business shirts, bragging about shutting down the second hand market..
Then those same people put on some 'gaming culture' Tshirts for E3 to cater to core gamers.
I know I do. Maybe not necessarily to please the audience, but at least not too stand out too much, just look a bit better than the rest.
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Apart from the $100 price difference, I really can't see any significant resemblance. Saturn launched prematurely, on the heels of Genesis, SEGA CD and Saturn (the latter two both failures), only amplifying the already existing confusion among consumers. I don't foresee any such confusion with Xbox One in regard to Xbox 360 and Kinect, both very successful and clearly defined products (now, the Wii/Wii U situation, on the other hand...). Saturn hardware was difficult to develop for; Xbox One, even if its development environment is currently not as mature as that of PS4, is supposed to be very easy to work with. Saturn launched with only 6 games, practically all first party releases, which angered some third party publishers; Xbox One enjoys great first and third party support and has a compelling launch line-up. Saturn's surprise US launch enraged retail partners, causing some to even stop carrying the system; Microsoft went out of their way to please the retailers even before the policy reversal. Finally, whereas Saturn had nothing to justify the higher price point, Xbox One ships with additional hardware and accompanying features which offer functionality that is entirely (HDMI in) or partially (Kinect 2) absent from the competing platforms.
No, sorry, the implied comparison is deeply flawed.
BradleyLove
Member
Just read the iOS version of this Edge magazine.
What a waste of money and time. There's not enough content to justify the price IMO. As to the PS4/Xbone articles, I didn't think there was anything in to justify the cover.
There was a piece on both machines but no single article tying the two machines together and showing why PS4 is the superior choice.
In all honesty, GAF has provided more information and comparisons than Edge could ever dream of.
The cover is what it is, but IMO there's nothing inside the magazine to justify it. I certainly didn't come away more hyped for PS4; but I didn't come away with a more negative opinion of Xbone either.
What a waste of money and time. There's not enough content to justify the price IMO. As to the PS4/Xbone articles, I didn't think there was anything in to justify the cover.
There was a piece on both machines but no single article tying the two machines together and showing why PS4 is the superior choice.
In all honesty, GAF has provided more information and comparisons than Edge could ever dream of.
The cover is what it is, but IMO there's nothing inside the magazine to justify it. I certainly didn't come away more hyped for PS4; but I didn't come away with a more negative opinion of Xbone either.
Your comment is not the worst I've seen here just to make that clear. But nevertheless, I occasionally see negative comments about people's looks here at neogaf, and I have to say that I cringe every time I see it. These are real people, just so happen to be a part of the gaming industry, but perhaps belonging to the "wrong camp". That's basically their only crime. No one deserves a collective beatdown from a mob over their looks, especially not because of a pathetic videogame console turf war, or whatever the fuck reason. Just stop it.
Ofcourse I would think of how I dress myself.
My point was more that an execute putting on a T-shirt to pretend to be someone he isn't, hurts his authenticity.Maybe it's because I live in Europe, but a guy dressing himself up like what he imagines his audience - the average gamer - to look like, comes of pretty fake. It's the same with hiring employees to clap their hands to me. It even comes of even insulting imo because he's stereotyping. And nobody likes to be stereotyped.
It doesn't matter how hard he tries to blend in with his audience saying 'I may be a MS executive wearing a suite, but underneath that vest, I'm wearing a Tshirt because I'm one of you, guys!'. The truth is he's still a MS executive, trying to sugarcoat a message his audience clearly didn't like.
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M°°nblade;68136401 said:
I'll cut into this lovely fashion discussion just to point out that he wore the t-shirts to promote those games and small developers making them:
Phil Spencer in a Eurogamer interview said:
M°°nblade;68082351 said:
Serious question, do any (Sony,MS,Nintendo) of them feel "authentic" when they talk on stage. The presentations are rehearsed to nauseum in advance and they all have PR up their ass to make sure they don't stray from the rehearsed points.
They..are..all..fake.
This is a multi billion dollar industry, the talking heads for the public are all playing a role. They all have mcMansions and families and a real life outside of whatever inanimate box they are trying to get you to buy
Concerning the attire:
- Trying to have an audience relate to you is CRAZY
- Do you have any person pics of Phil Spencer to know how he dresses from day to day?
I still don't see the new article with Android, is it a Canada thing?
TacticalFox88
Banned
Cerny.
If that man isn't genuine, then every actor in the history of the profession needs to have their Oscars taken away.
Well said.
You can rehearse as much as you want and still be genuine.
It's up on the Ipad App. Downloading right now.
Genuine implies you a truly excited about the product, I just cannot see these executives being thrilled at that level.
Cerny I do agree with as he is directly involved with the creation. But has he ever presented before at a Sony event? It was pure genius for them to have him do it.
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The only problem is it doesn't, not anymore. I'm sure you'll notice that in various threads a significant number of people are now talking about actually picking up Xbox One, many at launch. It has plenty of interesting games coming, the policies that drove many away aren't in place anymore, and the inclusion of Kinect and the comparatively higher price evidently aren't terrible problems for a lot of folks.
Now, if Edge wasn't taking the most recent development of the situation into account, as some people have pointed out, those claims from the cover would make much more sense. But that's not the case.
Uno Venova
Banned
I didn't get the impression that there was any big shift, in any polls or the "Are you buying an Xbox one now?" Gaf thread.
That's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but mainstream sentiment hasn't changed significantly, as far as I can see. Numerous questions are still up in the air about how those DRM policies came about in the first place and those who were responsible for their inclusion, Kinect is still anathema to the hardcore gaming community, the hardware is less powerful in direct comparison to the competition, and the messaging is one that swings from pillar to post. Not exactly confidence inspiring when it comes to a clear direction for the console, and none of that has changed.
TheRagnCajun
Member
I don't think you're going to win that one. I think general sentiment is still pro-PS4.
Karsticles
Member
Never judge consumer responses via GAF. This place is an island mecca for gamers. Out in the no-GAF world, my experience is that a lot of people know about the original XBone policies and said "no way". However, far less people are even aware that MS did a 180 on those policies. MS is in need of a big information campaign.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
And all of this is opposed to Sony who have a very clear and direct message about all of those issues. It creates a narrative that few can deny.
I would say, if anything, that the sentiment has somewhat shifted to, 'I might eventually buy an Xbone now' from 'I will never buy an Xbone'. But I would be hard pressed to say that is even the general sentiment. My impression is that I see a lot more 'I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER MICROSOFT PRODUCT IN MY LIFE'.
Wrong. The general sentiment is still PS4 favored, by a large margin. It's pretty evident everywhere on GAF and around the internet. Can you prove otherwise?
You should probably read it first before making an argument like you did earlier. It is controversial yeah. Is it just to get attention, no. Is getting attention a big part of it, yes.
Lol, admitted? I don't think there's any shame in Boyes telling it like it is. First people say the #NoDRM campaign had no effect because Sony never planned it, and now they're saying Sony is evil for thinking of it just like MS. So which is it?
Whoa man, that's some Batman gambit level conspiracy there. Whoaaa.
This is what I've experienced also, a few of my co workers still didn't know about the MS 180 and when I told them about it they said they didn't care any more because the PS4 is cheaper, keep in mind these guys are Xbox fans I'm the only one with a PS3.
And yet...
Whiteshirt
Member
Flipping the switch doesn't solve everything unless you're assuming people have memories like goldfish.
People remember what Microsoft attempted to do before the huge reversal of policy and the huge clusterfuck that resulted from it. Even if you reverse the policy, people remember the policies that were designed to fuck certain groups of people in favour of others. If the Tory party started pushing liberal policies, you'd still be suspicious of their motive because of their history of being anything but that.
Because of the torrent of news and the huge policy reversal, who knows what the fuck is going on with the Xbox One and what they're planning to do in the future? I don't even know what the cloud does besides that silly Drivatar thingy because Microsoft has muddied the waters so much that its basically brown. We can't even get a straight answer whether or not that you get a headset in the box.
Yes, the same goes for Sony since everyone remembers their infamous 2006 E3 and still mocks them for it.
As for the "but but but but Sony is just as bad!", its very easy to argue that they're not worse. The easiest way to explain their DRM stance is that the Playstation department seem to be run by people who aren't completely evil and they're more than willing to maintain the status quo if required. No doubt they thought of DRM, hence that RF tag patent, but nothing leaked regarding some crazy complex always online DRM stance so its fairly safe to say that either Sony runs a really tight ship or the status quo was good enough for them.
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Sure, but all I'm saying is it's not pro-PS4 to the extent that justifies the issue's cover anymore. From what I've seen here and elsewhere, that much is quite obvious, but hey, if some people feel differently, that's their prerogative.
Glorified G
Member
The biggest problem I felt even more than the drm is the price. We can single out the differences with Kinect or Gaikai, streaming, cloud, etc. at the end of the day most of the software is going to be the same and there is a $100 difference. Not having price parity is the real issue for ms.
And again you're wrong. The cover justifies the general sentiment. The public is still pro PS4
I hated the 24 hour check in, so good on MS for removing that. Don't care about used games. Don't really care about price either. I can afford either system no problem. I do care the PS4 is significantly more powerful because long term that system is going to last longer, but the thing that kills any possibility of me buying the XB1 is kinect. I don't like it. I don't want it, and if MS is going to force it on me they can keep their whole system.
Also the XB1 is really damn ugly. If they were going to use a desktop case, they could have picked one that didn't look like an old VCR, and didn't have an external power brick.
Also the XB1 is really damn ugly. If they were going to use a desktop case, they could have picked one that didn't look like an old VCR, and didn't have an external power brick.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
I haven't seen a significant shift. There have always been people who were interested in its library and that wasn't going to change. It's alleviated one problem, but the rest still remain.
The DRM fiasco was only a fraction of a much larger issue with the Xbox One development as a whole -- from the severely underpowered, poorly designed hardware that looks to have been designed largely with OS interests in mind, to the high price of the system, to the forcing of Kinect -- these issues still remain, and probably won't go away for the entire generation.
It's great that Microsoft backed off their DRM plans, but the fact still remains that for gaming the PS4 is by far the obvious and superior choice.
The media still correctly picks up on this fact, and mainstream consumer sentiment still understands it.
The 180 decision didn't change much, just showed a complete lack of vision and confidence on Microsoft's part.
Typical gaming media. Flash cover, but the meat of the article is realistic bland and not nearly as vicious as they pretend to be.
A lot of print media is tabloid flash headlines. It reeks of desperation from a dying media.
Uhmm Mark Cerny. Read up on him.