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[oconnomiyaki]

Nintendo seems very much stuck in 1985 when it comes to this stuff. They held all the cards back then and got to dictate all the terms. If you wanted to be on Nintendo, you have to play by their rules -- and you did want to be on Nintendo. But times have changed and Nintendo really can't afford to look at third parties as if they're doing them a favour by letting them make games for their machines.

I can totally see what is being said here. That Nintendo just went out and did their own thing and was then like "There ya go!" Conversely, Microsoft and Sony engaged and said "What would you like to see?" It's no wonder that devs and publishers gravitate to one more than the other.

 

[Currygan]

why is this person speaking for everyone? That's just a tad arrogant. But just a tad

other points I can agree with, but what the fuck does he know about other devs?

 

[jmizzal]

Developed? I think Where's Waldo on NES.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bethesda_Softworks_games

Published? Wheelspin for the Wii in 2009. Which was only released in Europe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheelspin_(video_game)

A quote about Wheelspin from Official Nintendo Magazine:

And were done here

 

[w1gglyjones]

Nintendo seems very much stuck in 1985 when it comes to this stuff. They held all the cards back then and got to dictate all the terms. If you wanted to be on Nintendo, you have to play by their rules -- and you did want to be on Nintendo. But times have changed and Nintendo really can't afford to look at third parties as if they're doing them a favour by letting them make games for their machines.

I can totally see what is being said here. That Nintendo just went out and did their own thing and was then like "There ya go!" Conversely, Microsoft and Sony engaged and said "What would you like to see?" It's no wonder that devs and publishers gravitate to one more than the other.

The idea that it's "too late" because Nintendo never asked while the console was in R&D and now it's out is a bit silly. Even if they asked and delivered, that's just half the equation for getting 3rd party support.

Nintendo simply taking feedback from Bethesda or Dice and then saying, "Here ya go!" isn't any guarantee of 3rd party support. The issue is more complicated than that, and it's Nintendo prerogative to run their business the way they see fit. You can't really fault them unless they are in the red, though (which they currently are).

 

[ajjow]

People should grow up. This guy just show how poorly nintendo PR is been conducted. Hes not saying he hates Nintendo. Hes stating that for a hardware compny, Nintendo do not search for partners.

Everyone does that, only Nintendo does not. It show how bad the situation is. Reggie never looked for Bethesda! He and Iwata probably never talked to rockstar about GtaV.

Nintendo has a terrible management team. The fact they created the wii u and never talked with Bethesda about it just show how bad Nintendo situation is. Even if they create anothe wii sports and the core game ever, the new ocarina of time, their relation with 3rd parties is down the hole. iwata is a stupid arrofgant CEO who needs to let it go. he did good, but its time to change. Reggie is another problem.

Its pretty obvious they have lost the handle of things. This is such a naive mistake that u cant apologise. He knew the 3ds and wii just had the same mistake. He is arrogant and incompetent. Thats a fact!

 

[Woo-Fu]

But times have changed and Nintendo really can't afford to look at third parties as if they're doing them a favour by letting them make games for their machines.

Sure they can, from their point of view. They're perfectly happy if the only software you buy for your Nintendo hardware was produced by a Nintendo studio. Nintendo pays lip service to 3rd party in interviews and then goes back to business as usual.

With the increasing disparity in hardware they have even less use for 3rd party---which usually means multiplatform---software that is going to run/play the worst on their console.

 

[Schnozberry]

People should grow up. This guy just show how poorly nintendo PR is been conducted. Hes not saying he hates Nintendo. Hes stating that for a hardware compny, Nintendo do not search for partners.

Everyone does that, only Nintendo does not. It show how bad the situation is. Reggie never looked for Bethesda! He and Iwata probably never talked to rockstar about GtaV.

Nintendo has a terrible management team. The fact they created the wii u and never talked with Bethesda about it just show how bad Nintendo situation is. Even if they create anothe wii sports and the core game ever, the new ocarina of time, their relation with 3rd parties is down the hole. iwata is a stupid arrofgant CEO who needs to let it go. he did good, but its time to change. Reggie is another problem.

Its pretty obvious they have lost the handle of things. This is such a naive mistake that u cant apologise. He knew the 3ds and wii just had the same mistake. He is arrogant and incompetent. Thats a fact!

If Nintendo listened to GAF, they'd be more like Sony and Microsoft. The sad thing is, I wouldn't wish that on anyone, because if those companies had to survive on gaming alone they would have been out of business years ago.

 

[DAREALGUMMY]

Dammit Reggie, go out and get me my damn Pip-Boy on the Gamepad. I'll take FO3 or New Vegas ports at this point!


Although it was interesting to hear this when Reggie was talking about getting games like Skyrim and other types like that on the Wii U

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Past?

Passed?

Passed.

 

[PhantomR]

and Nintendo really can't afford to look at third parties as if they're doing them a favour by letting them make games for their machines.

You're projecting. That is not how Nintendo views publishers at all.

 

[ridethepiggy]

If Nintendo listened to GAF, they'd be more like Sony and Microsoft. The sad thing is, I wouldn't wish that on anyone, because if those companies had to survive on gaming alone they would have been out of business years ago.

This has nothing to do with replicating Sony or Microsoft. This has to do with Nintendo ceasing skimping on hardware. Ceasing to live and die by a gimmick. Ceasing to ignore third parties requests for capable hardware. Ceasing it's refusal to become a modern digital company in regards to proper account systems. Ceasing the regional restriction crap. Ceasing the terrible PR mistakes. Ceasing the price gauging of it's legacy library. Ceasing to recognize that by living and depending on a Japanese mentality for gaming they're going to continue to suffer. Ceasing to ignore the West when it comes to special editions, new colors, etc. Ceasing to release hardware with absolutely atrocious lineups. These issues have NOTHING to do with Sony and Microsoft.

 

[Trike]

I don't think you understand what being 'salty' actually means. Look around..several people already laughed at your bioware/bathesda mix up. No one thought it was a joke because it's too random and dumb. That's not being salty but pointing out that you are making little sense. I guess I should also forgive you for not realizing your post wasn't funny..or something

See all you're comments make it sound like it's some conspiracy lol Let me spell it out for you. Third party trouble on Nintendo consoles are due to the incompetence of Nintendo. Lack of effort, lack of features, weak hardware, poor planning and not communicating with third parties...take any combination of those factors and you have you reason as to why

Now if you think shortcomings in the past is an excuse for a new generation then I can't help you there. Gamepad was a bad idea. And I'm being objective here. Some users may have enjoyed it but looking at the sales results it's obvious the price hike that was caused by it and the corners that needed to be cut has not paid off for Nintendo. What they should have done was a powerful system with motion controls. Make the gamepad as a peripheral if they must.

It's not absurd if Nintendo was smart about it. Simple as that. They failed to cultivate a fanbase for genre like FPS by using first party resources on the wii. But they did launch a year early. They definitely would have been in a much better position with third party support with a comparably powerful system than they are now too. I see no logical reason why they would be 'worse' off than they are now. if mario doesn't appeal then they should make new titles that actually would interest them. Make sure your hardware is powerful and dev friendly enough to make third party multiplats perform the best on your system until the other consoles come to the market. That's how you try and expand your market among core gamers. If a company that makes the hardware themselves think it's no use trying to do so then the console is going to have a real rough time

Which is why we have the wiiU. You can't mend jack without being proactive and smart about your brand new console. They have already botched the launch big time on several fronts..let's see if they can recover.

It is like you just skim what I write and then proceed to go on some random tangent after recognizing a few key words. I am sorry, I cannot carry this conversation on with you anymore. Good luck, and have fun with your Bed "bathesda" and Beyond.

I doubt going to Bethesda in the first place would change things. Sort of how going to EA didn't change things. If these companies wanted to support the console they would.

You are right, it probably wouldn't have. I think Bethesda's suggestions would have just been a more powerful console and Nintendo would have refused. Maybe Bethesda would have been straightforward from the beginning though.

 

[phosphor112]

I don't really understand why both Bethesda and the gaming media keep dragging this on. So their chemistry isn't great. It's not like they are the only companies in the world who're not feeling each other's views.

Someone asked the question. Bethesda VP is there... he answered what he thought.

 

[TheContact]

EH I don't care I didn't buy the Wii U for third party developers anyway

 

[Nocturno999]

Another article regarding Bethesda's stance with Nintendo from Gamespot:

Bethesda: Nintendo should follow example set by Sony and Microsoft

"Vice president of public relations and marketing at the Fallout and Elder Scrolls studio has criticised Nintendo's approach to third-party involvement."

http://www.gamespot.com/news/bethes...low-example-set-by-sony-and-microsoft-6413963

 

[Novoitus]

I understand what he's saying but I don't like it.

i love it. nintendo needs to stop being so arrogant and get with it or get out of the hardware industry.

 

[ridethepiggy]

Another article regarding Bethesda stance with Nintendo from Gamespot:

Bethesda: Nintendo should follow example set by Sony and Microsoft

http://www.gamespot.com/news/bethes...low-example-set-by-sony-and-microsoft-6413963

"They involved us very early on…they say, 'here's what we're doing, here's what we're planning, here's how we think it's going to work' to hear what we thought," Hines said.

"You have to spend an unbelievable amount of time upfront doing that. If you're just going sort [of] deciding, 'we're going to make a box and this is how it works and you should make games for it'. Well, no. No is my answer; I'm going to focus on other ones that better support what it is we're trying to do."

Yes, Nintendo SHOULD be getting third parties involved early on. That is a lack of common sense on Nintendo's part of straight up hubris.

 

[Gonzo The Great]

Bethesda has literally never released a game on any Nintendo platform, so why are people surprised?

 

[Trickster]

Bethesda has literally never released a game on any Nintendo platform, so why are people surprised?

Bethesda the publisher has.

 

[Vibranium]

Hopefully Nintendo takes what third parties have to say about planning seriously and work with them to develop their future console. They need to be more open to hearing from other companies, they're doing pretty well with indie devs though which is great to see.

Dedicate a PR team to reaching out to places like Rockstar and maybe even Valve, if they use the proper methods (money helps...) things might change over time.

 

[ridethepiggy]

Hopefully Nintendo takes what third parties have to say about planning seriously and work with them to develop their future console. They need to be more open to hearing from other companies, they're doing pretty well with indie devs though which is great to see.

Dedicate a PR team to reaching out to places like Rockstar and maybe even Valve, if they use the proper methods (money helps...) things might change over time.

That's the problem. Nintendo doesn't care enough to do what it takes to get these companies on board. They just don't. Nintendo makes hardware for their 1st party studios and if third parties want to place their software on the hardware, fine. If not, fine. This is why Nintendo is suffering. While Sony and Microsoft outreach to both AAA publishers and Indies, Nintendo has basically given up on the AAA front. The amount of hubris at Nintendo is what's killing the Wii U.

*It was hubris that had Nintendo price the 3DS at $250 after seeing the reaction it received at the E3 reveal.
*It was hubris that had Nintendo ignore the needs and desires of many of the major third parties for the Wii U. 2GB of ram with 1 GB being used for games? Please. Barely upgraded hardware from the 360/PS3? Please.
*It is hubris that has Nintendo hardware missing an actual account system that isn't linked to hardware.
*It is hubris that has Nintendo continuing the regional restrictions even though MS and Sony decided to go the opposite route.
*It is hubris that has Nintendo going with the name 'Wii U' even though everybody and their mother stated it would confuse customers.

Nintendo is a company that even more than Microsoft refuses to alter their direction even in the face of most of their mistakes. Say what you want about MS but at least they actually listen to the negative feedback and low sales. Nintendo? Nope.

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

And nothing of value was lost.

It's funny that you said the same thing about EA and other third party pubs that are not publishing their games on Nintendo platforms.

 

[ridethepiggy]

It's funny that you said the same thing about EA and other third party pubs that are not publishing their games on Nintendo platforms.

Really? Wow...

 

[Glass Rebel]

While it's undeniable that Nintendo largely operates from an impenetrable bubble, I don't think asking Bethesda about hardware feedback would be that beneficial. They target significantly higher performance-levels and Nintendo has left that market. It'd be almost the same as Sony asking Nintendo for feedback. I mean, what's the point?

 

[ridethepiggy]

While it's undeniable that Nintendo largely operates from an impenetrable bubble, I don't think asking Bethesda about hardware feedback would be that beneficial. They target significantly higher performance-levels and Nintendo has left that market. It'd be almost the same as Sony asking Nintendo for feedback. I mean, what's the point?

And THAT is one of the problems. The Wii U has 1/4 of the ram that it's competitors have. That is a HUGE problem if you're trying to get third parties to put their games on your hardware for the next 4-5 years. As I said, Nintendo makes their consoles for their own developers and that's fine but don't be surprised when you're going to have to go it alone every single time.

 

[oconnomiyaki]

You're projecting. That is not how Nintendo views publishers at all.

It's certainly how they did and there is plenty of evidence to back that up. Leopards and spots and whatnot.

 

[wsippel]

To me, Nintendo has two options to try and get third party support for their home consoles.

1.) Build their next console to be a direct competitors to the Xbox 4 and PlayStation 5 on all levels including hardware power and control interface.
2.) Build their next console to be a $150-$200 box at launch built on high end mobile parts and try to recruit mobile/tablet/set top developers for support.

I feel option 2 makes a lot more sense given where they are in the market.

I'm not entirely sure there'll ever be a PS5, and I'm almost certain there won't be an Xbox 4. In fact, considering this is Microsoft we're talking about, Xbox One might sell millions and could still be discontinued a year or two from now (unless it's exceptionally successful). Because that's what Microsoft usually does once they don't consider an endeavor worthwhile anymore. And with the recent management shakeups, it's impossible to tell what'll happen.

 

[PhantomR]

It's certainly how they did and there is plenty of evidence to back that up. Leopards and spots and whatnot.

How THEY DID. Not how they do right now.

 

[ridethepiggy]

I'm not entirely sure there'll ever be a PS5, and I'm almost certain there won't be an Xbox 4. In fact, considering this is Microsoft we're talking about, Xbox One might sell millions and could still be discontinued a year or two from now (unless it's exceptionally successful). Because that's what Microsoft usually does once they don't consider an endeavor worthwhile anymore. And with the recent management shakeups, it's impossible to tell what'll happen.

There were people who were denying there would ever be a PS4 right up to the reveal of said machine. Regarding the Xbox One being the last gaming console of the Xbox brand? We'll see. I expect both the PS4 and XB1 to sell very well (much better than the Wii U). But it seems that what you're saying is you expect Nintendo to be left alone in the dedicated gaming sphere.

How THEY DID. Not how they do right now.

Yea, yea it is. Nintendo changed it's spots regarding Indies. AAA publishers? No. They still couldn't care less about these companies or else they'd have built the Wii U differently. They care about Indies because Indies are cheap to get on board and to support. They don't really have to invest anything while with AAA publishers Nintendo would have had to build the Wii U differently.

 

[oconnomiyaki]

How THEY DID. Not how they do right now.

Do you have any evidence to support their apparent new position? And I'm not talking about money-hatting Platinum.

 

[B.O.O.M]

It is like you just skim what I write and then proceed to go on some random tangent after recognizing a few key words. I am sorry, I cannot carry this conversation on with you anymore. Good luck, and have fun with your Bed "bathesda" and Beyond.

So basically don't have a proper argument to back your comments up. That's that then. Best of luck with your next attempt at a joke..may people find it funny

 

[w1gglyjones]

I'm not entirely sure there'll ever be a PS5, and I'm almost certain there won't be an Xbox 4. In fact, considering this is Microsoft we're talking about, Xbox One might sell millions and could still be discontinued a year or two from now (unless it's exceptionally successful). Because that's what Microsoft usually does once they don't consider an endeavor worthwhile anymore. And with the recent management shakeups, it's impossible to tell what'll happen.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure they won't repeat with a follow up console unless XB1 is very profitable and it's successor is very cheap.

 

[Mondriaan]

While it's undeniable that Nintendo largely operates from an impenetrable bubble, I don't think asking Bethesda about hardware feedback would be that beneficial. They target significantly higher performance-levels and Nintendo has left that market. It'd be almost the same as Sony asking Nintendo for feedback. I mean, what's the point?

I'm sure Sony wouldn't have problems having Nintendo give its feedback if they wanted to develop games for them.

Impenetrable bubbles are part of Nintendo's unique charm, though.

 

[akira28]

Talking like that quote in the OP, If I was Nintendo I'd say "Bethesda, you can kiss my ass."

I mean, Nintendo may do things in a really odd and unique way. But they still command respect. You're just gonna go step on your shinebox and proclaim you're not going to support my console?

 

[Glass Rebel]

And THAT is one of the problems. The Wii U has 1/4 of the ram that it's competitors have. That is a HUGE problem if you're trying to get third parties to put their games on your hardware for the next 4-5 years. As I said, Nintendo makes their consoles for their own developers and that's fine but don't be surprised when you're going to have to go it alone every single time.

Sure, but it's also a problem without feasible solution. I'm still surprised at people suggesting that they should try to directly compete with Microsoft and Sony on a comparable performance level. That is simply not an option for various reasons people keep ignoring. It's been speculated for a while that they will go with an ARM-based solution for their next console, which makes way more sense for them.

I also don't think they are honestly surprised that Bethesda specifically doesn't put their titles on Nintendo consoles. EA was a much bigger blow since they traditionally support a wide range of devices.

 

[Tripon]

Do you have any evidence to support their apparent new position? And I'm not talking about money-hatting Platinum.

I'm not sure what you're asking for. They have exclusive games coming out for their system, particularly for the 3DS. Monster Hunter, DQ 7, and Phoenix Wright 5, are all high profile 3rd party games that won't come to the competition anytime soon.

They're working with smaller size Devs like Next Level and Monster Games to make AA titles like Luigi Mansion 2 and the port of DKC:R.

They were also able to get ports of Watch Dogs, AC4, and CoD:Ghosts.

And well, the relationship with EA is fucked, but there's been multiple threads on why their relationship with EA is horrible at the moment.

The situation with AAA 3rd parties publishers is bad, but... and that's a big but, I think it will get better as companies figure out what they can or can't release on it.

There's no reason for a blanket statement about no support at all for a given system like Bethesda did in my mind.

 

[ridethepiggy]

Sure, but it's also a problem without feasible solution. I'm still surprised at people suggesting that they should try to directly compete with Microsoft and Sony on a comparable performance level. That is simply not an option for various reasons people keep ignoring. It's been speculated for a while that they will go with an ARM-based solution for their next console, which makes way more sense for them.

I also don't think they are honestly surprised that Bethesda specifically doesn't put their titles on Nintendo consoles. EA was a much bigger blow since they traditionally support a wide range of devices.

They didnt have to do 8GB of ram and go all in like Sony/ MS but Nintendo basically put a good portion of the cost into the gamepad. Why? For Nintendos 1st party studios. Why not remove the gamepad, up the specs to be closer to the competition, get thid parties on board, and differentiate their system with their first party support? Why the constant gimmicks? Why not have more confidence in your own software?

 

[w1gglyjones]

They didnt have to do 8GB of ram and go all in like Sony/ MS but Nintendo basically put a good portion of the cost into the gamepad. Why? For Nintendos 1st party studios. Why not remove the gamepad, up the specs to be closer to the competition, get thid parties on board, and differentiate their system with their first party support? Why the constant gimmicks? Why not have more confidence in your own software?

You seem to be content dissecting the past. All of your questions are focusing on hardware decisions that can no longer be changed. And sure, that's part of what is being said by Bethesda here. But if that's all there is to be said, then okay... we can stop saying stuff.

 

[ridethepiggy]

You seem to be content dissecting the past. All of your questions are focusing on hardware decisions that can no longer be changed. And sure, that's part of what is being said by Bethesda here. But if that's all there is to be said, then okay... we can stop saying stuff.

If you don't learn from your past mistakes you're destined to repeat them. Nintendo hasn't learned from their past when it comes to third party support, launch lineups, a steady flow of releases after launch, and more.

 

[oconnomiyaki]

I'm not sure what you're asking for.

Nintendo have historically treated third parties with contempt. You've (generally) always been able to publish on their machines, but it's their show. It bit them in the arse in the N64 era, where their "dream team" was comprised of companies like Williams, Ocean and GameTek. They've never really tried to court third parties with any seriousness, and certainly not if their own IPs aren't involved somehow. Having a bunch of releases on the system demonstrates nothing about them bring courteous or easy to work with -- and it's been well documented that they weren't.

Of course, as people said, why should they? They want you to buy their games. But I feel that's a mistake. They were on a downward spiral until the Wii, and that bubble burst. The current sales of the Wii U, coupled with the fact that they're dropping the price even though they're selling it at a loss, should highlight that their output alone is not enough to sustain a system.

 

[troushers]

Shorter Betashed: "Nintendo should be BEGGING us to release Wheelspin U"


I hate to break it to them, but Nintendo have been proactive about garnering third party support, just not with Bethesda. Maybe it's these sorts of statements that put them off - why waste time trying to convince Betashed to include your console in their broken porting jobs? It's obvious that Sony and Microsoft's consoles will always just happen to possess the power to fulfil their artistic vision, and the goalposts are always moving.

 

[ridethepiggy]

Shorter Betashed: "Nintendo should be BEGGING us to release Wheelspin U"


I hate to break it to them, but Nintendo have been proactive about garnering third party support, just not with Bethesda. Maybe it's these sorts of statements that put them off - why waste time trying to convince Betashed to include your console in their broken porting jobs? It's obvious that Sony and Microsoft's consoles will always just happen to possess the power to fulfil their artistic vision, and the goalposts are always moving.

Valve
Rockstar
EA
Bethesda
Deep Silver
Many 2K dev teams

Who needs them. Not Nintendo. Right?

 

[Dog food is delicious]

Nintendo have historically treated third parties with contempt.

The funniest thing about this is how the Lincoln years are romanticized yet his iron fist tactics are partially responsible for some of the historical issues between Nintendo and third parties.

 

[flatearthpandas]

They didnt have to do 8GB of ram and go all in like Sony/ MS but Nintendo basically put a good portion of the cost into the gamepad. Why? For Nintendos 1st party studios. Why not remove the gamepad, up the specs to be closer to the competition, get thid parties on board, and differentiate their system with their first party support? Why the constant gimmicks? Why not have more confidence in your own software?

First, the Gamepad is actually a real treat for many people who have played with it.

Also, remember how having good specs was great for the Nintendo Gamecube? Oh, wait, no, Sony got all the support with the weakest hardware and the highest install base.

Well, having the highest install base worked out great for the Wii! Oh, wait, no. Wii sold tens of millions more than the next best selling platform and was ignored by third parties. Early third party Wii games actually outsold early third party PS3 games. Games like Call of Duty.

Nintendo is literally damned if they do, damned if they don't.

They have the current highest selling console out right now with a bevy of great exclusive titles out in 2013 on the 3DS and you still can't scroll down the first page of GAF without finding a thread full of people eager to tell you why the 3DS is a kids console and the Vita is the best choice, despite it's inarguable lack of exclusive titles.

Nintendo's hurdle is to overcome the ingrained bias that has been built against them by core gamers. Nothing less. Apparently downright insulting shit like this is where the pulse is at.

 

[bishoptl]

Also, remember how having good specs was great for the Nintendo Gamecube? Oh, wait, no, Sony got all the support with the weakest hardware and the highest install base.

GameCube was released 18 months after the Playstation 2.

Context is everything.

 

[cartman414]

Supposedly talked to them what kind of computer architecture they would like to develop for.

But the more I think about it, the less I think a Power PC architecture should be that big of a hurdle. Yes, its uncommon in the consumer market, which is what most people are used to, but its not as if its just a totally alien architecture like the PS3 cell processor was, and Bethesda gladly released games for that console.

Power PC is a bit of a brick wall though. IBM hasn't really bothered to keep it contemporized for the consumer markets. Making a system more powerful while on that architecture likely wouldn't fly.

Talks about salt; becomes the saltiest of them all. It is okay if you didn't understand, I forgive you.

If a "Super" Wii U was made, I don't think things would have changed all that much. You are acting like the lack of third party support has been a recent trend, and not something that has been steadily getting worse since Gamecube, and was even worse with the N64. Those two specifically are consoles that were similar in power to the consoles of the time, yet both struggled. You could argue it had to do with their software format, ie cartridge and minidvd, but their handling of those consoles seemingly put more strain on their already strenuous relationship with 3rd parties. When you have troubles with third parties, you get less third party games. So you have arguably, about two and a half console cycles where the third party output was less than optimal. I count Gamecube as half, as they were still getting some pretty great third party titles for awhile.

With the Wii specifically, many Nintendo fans felt burned with their new business direction seemingly abandoning them, and they either quit gaming or found new consoles/PC. Is this the crowd you are talking about that would come back to a powerful Nintendo console? Because they weren't enough to make the Gamecube sell more than a newcomer in the console business.

I don't think the Wii U would be in a much better position if it was more powerful. It might be worse off. At they very least, the tech behind a more powerful machine would make the console be priced like the PS4 or Xbox One. And considering there is no reason Nintendo would have ever made a traditional console after the massive success of the Wii and DS, it would probably be at least as expensive as the Xbox One due to the Gamepad or whatever. Maybe Bethesda wouldn't have dismissed it so early on though, but if the sales were just as bad I'm sure they would dismiss it anyway.

I cannot explain to you enough the absurdity of PS/Xbox fans jumping ship before the next iteration of their console of preference is released. It would need a shit ton of third party support for that to even be seriously considered, which I doubt would have happened. Also no one is talking to the friends on Xbox Live or PS Home or whatever and saying "Yo, that New Super Mario Bros Wii U and/or Pikmin 3 look mad good, but that shit is to jaggy for me to drop $300+ on."

This is why I said that Nintendo needs to mend its relationship with both third party companies and console gamers before it can be successful again.

Part of the reason behind the cost of the WiiU, aside from the pad, is the tech involved in the low wattage, small form factor. A bigger console could contain more power at the same cost.

Nobody asked for smaller and more energy efficient. It was something they were able to work into the Wii.

To be honest, there's little point in talking to third parties for feedback and input on your hardware when you've already decided there are things you do and/or don't want to do. As far as 3rd party developer input, what exactly were they going to say? Increase the TFLOPs of your machine? Add more CPU cores? The only other thing Nintendo lacks is 1) audience and 2) a digital account system

As far as addressing the needs for certain parts of the gaming market/audience, the way MS and Sony do, Nintendo really needs to do more than just make a better console and get multiplatform parity. Their online system, as far as actually playing games online seems to be fine, AFAIK (maybe with a better box they'd have party chat or other things).

I personally think they could have tried for a bit more balanced approach than they have with their console hardware. I don't think the multiplatform support is fixed just by getting feedback from 3rd parties early on, and it's probably best for them to try and cultivate other audiences over a slower/longer period of time. Of course, that requires an investment, too.

Not make a tiny console again?

 

[FyreWulff]

Nobody asked for smaller and more energy efficient. It was something they were able to work into the Wii.

Parents did. They've outright mentioned this before. Nintendo has only shipped an overly large console once, and it was because they were intentionally mimicing VCRs.

 

[Game Guru]

GameCube was released 18 months after the Playstation 2.

Context is everything.

True, the PS2 was just going to be massive no matter what. It came off the back of the PS1 and was the same price at launch as it. However, GameCube did come out at the same time as the only slightly more successful Xbox. Only 2.76 million separated the Xbox's 24 million sales from the GC's 21.74 million sales. However, it is inarguable that the original Xbox got more third-party support. Then factor in that the PS3 ate most of Sony's PS1 & PS2 profits and the Xbox brand only started seeing some success in making money in 2010, and one can understand Nintendo's reasoning with the Wii...

In fact, if I'm not mistaken, both 360 and PS3 started making money in 2010. This is going to sound crazy, but what if the length of this particular generation caused most of the non-hardcore to buy two systems as if it were two generations, namely buying the Wii in 2006 and then buying either the 360 or PS3 in 2010? Hell, both consoles even released their versions of motion controls in 2010. Assuming this, it is possible that XBox One and PS4 will also suffer from lackluster sales until 2015 with their biggest competition being from the 360 and PS3. It's a horrible, horrible scenario that I would not wish on the console industry and it's hopefully a crazy, crazy thought that I had. I'd want all three companies to see success.

 

[Bel_Air_Jeff]

If Gamecube came out first and didn't use stupid mini-disks, that ps2 dominated generation could have been much different.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Yea, WiiU has some serious, undeniable issues at the moment. But, maybe Bethesda should focus on shipping a game for once that isn't so broken it's practically unplayable, before they go around throwing shade at other consoles.