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Cow Mengde · Jul 31, 2017

Souldriver said:
lack of food and a prohibition of buying food, ...

Can someone explain this to me, or is it too horrifying to even talk about? I just can't fathom a government that is actively trying to starve its own people. What is there to gain by starving people? Revolutions start because of the lack of food.

Or are these people just so sick that they enjoy making the people of their country suffer?

Lonely1 · Jul 31, 2017

moffattron9000 said:
No we're not done growing. There is still a whole bunch of Asia that is still developing. That's before you even get to Africa, and the real growth that is there as we pull another billion out of poverty. This also ignores the huge change in technology incoming, and the real potential there to improve people's lives.

IMHO, Capitalism has reached its logical conclusion: Plutocracy.

Neo C. · Jul 31, 2017

Cow Mengde said:
Can someone explain this to me, or is it too horrifying to even talk about? I just can't fathom a government that is actively trying to starve its own people. What is there to gain by starving people? Revolutions start because of the lack of food.

Or are these people just so sick that they enjoy making the people of their country suffer?

I can't speak for Venezuela, but (recent) past examples mostly hint to sheer incompetence.

Cow Mengde · Jul 31, 2017

Neo C. said:
I can't speak for Venezuela, but (recent) past examples mostly hint to sheer incompetence.

I'm wondering about the situation in Venezuela.

I can understand corrupted people hoarding money and riches, but I don't understand food. If hoarding is what they're doing anyway.

Lonely1 · Jul 31, 2017

Cow Mengde said:
I'm wondering about the situation in Venezuela.

I can understand corrupted people hoarding money and riches, but I don't understand food. If hoarding is what they're doing anyway.

Step one: Kill all local production via expropriation, corruption and incompetence.
Step two: Kill your local currency via debt and out of control money printing.
Result: No much local production, and since your currency is monopoly money, the little there is exported. Also, can't import.

Rodolfo Brito · Jul 31, 2017

ultratruman said:
Pro-Maduro GAF, astonishing.

Shocking, isn't it?

Bregor · Jul 31, 2017

Cow Mengde said:
Can someone explain this to me, or is it too horrifying to even talk about? I just can't fathom a government that is actively trying to starve its own people. What is there to gain by starving people? Revolutions start because of the lack of food.

Or are these people just so sick that they enjoy making the people of their country suffer?

From what I understand three things caused this.

1. The Riches of the oil industry during the oil boom caused all other Industries including food to wither. Venezuela became an importer of most of what it needs to run.

2. Inflation began to push up the cost of food. In response the government fixed prices to keep food prices down. This of course just meant that Food suppliers could no longer economically run their businesses and simply closed their doors.

3. The government refuses to accept food aid from other nations because they are afraid of the image it would produce.

Planet Money has a decent episode on this:

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2016/10/21/498867764/episode-731-how-venezuela-imploded

Funky Papa · Jul 31, 2017

Herodotus said:
I really wonder if you actually believe this stuff.

Here's the thing: Maduro's opposition has shown time and time again to be corrupt, violent and murderous. Just because Maduro is an asshole doesn't mean that the people against him are not capable of despicable acts of violence and (yes) terrorism.

Maduro is an awful, authoritarian leader who doesn't believe in democracy nor wants any of it unless it happens to work for him (read: in his own benefit). He'll gladly launch a self-coup if he feels like that's the only way he can remain in power.

The politicians leading the opposition are also a bunch of protodespots and pro-coupists working towards the benefit of a few while pretending to be at the forefront of a democratic uprising. There's nothing benign about Capriles and his close circle. His saintly image is at odds with his deeds and ties.

Venezuela is at the brink of civil war. While people protesting against Maduro are damn right in doing so, the politicians in charge of the opposition are outright vile and shouldn't be trusted at all. It's not unlike what happened in Brazil just a few months ago. Only this time people are dying on the streets and there's a chance things may take a turn for the worse.

Feel free to pick a side if that's what you want. Just be mindful of the fact that everybody is incredibly dirty and that there's a glaring lack of democratic values at the top of both movements.

Rodolfo Brito · Jul 31, 2017

Bregor said:
From what I understand three things caused this.

1. The Riches of the oil industry during the oil boom caused all other Industries including food to wither. Venezuela became an importer of most of what it needs to run.

2. Inflation began to push up the cost of food. In response the government fixed prices to keep food prices down. This of course just meant that Food suppliers could no longer economically run their businesses and simply closed their doors.

3. The government refuses to accept food aid from other nations because they are afraid of the image it would produce.

Planet Money has a decent episode on this:

http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2016/10/21/498867764/episode-731-how-venezuela-imploded

There is still the fact that the government treats the few basic supply producers as "anti-revolutionary", and make their business state run, but not before making the people stop buying from these producers through intimidation and militia action.

On topic, I think that this video can show that this left-right thing is really missing the point of what makes most of Latin America to struggle: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bJTLYPPTCC4

Suikoguy · Jul 31, 2017

Rodolfo Brito said:
There is still the fact that the government treats the few basic supply producers as "anti-revolutionary", and make their business state run, but not before making the people stop buying from these producers through intimidation and militia action.

On topic, I think that this video can show that this left-right thing is really missing the point of what makes most of Latin America to struggle: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bJTLYPPTCC4

That video is sadly very apt for the developing situation in the US too.

ibyea · Jul 31, 2017

Funky Papa said:
Here's the thing: Maduro's opposition has shown time and time again to be corrupt, violent and murderous. Just because Maduro is an asshole doesn't mean that the people against him are not capable of despicable acts of violence and (yes) terrorism.

Maduro is an awful, authoritarian leader who doesn't believe in democracy nor wants any of it unless it happens to work for him (read: in his own benefit). He'll gladly launch a self-coup if he feels like that's the only way he can remain in power.

The politicians leading the opposition are also a bunch of protodespots and pro-coupists working towards the benefit of a few while pretending to be at the forefront of a democratic uprising. There's nothing benign about Capriles and his close circle. His saintly image is at odds with his deeds and ties.

Venezuela is at the brink of civil war. While people protesting against Maduro are damn right in doing so, the politicians in charge of the opposition are outright vile and shouldn't be trusted at all. It's not unlike what happened in Brazil just a few months ago. Only this time people are dying on the streets and there's a chance things may take a turn for the worse.

Feel free to pick a side if that's what you want. Just be mindful of the fact that everybody is incredibly dirty and that there's a glaring lack of democratic values at the top of both movements.

Any reading material regarding the opposition? I have never been a big fan of the opposition since the 2002 coup attempt, and the massive poverty Venezuela faced before Chavez happened under some of these people after all. At the same time, things never were quiet this bad under them so I would rather they win. I still remember the Bolivares inflation being so noticeable while I was growing up under Chavez.

iamblades · Jul 31, 2017

Lonely1 said:
But, since it requires permanent growing, we are at the end of its lifespan.

But it doesn't

Japan's economy hasn't really grown for the better part of three decades(and has no real prospect of ever growing substantially again, due to demographics), and is still a perfectly functioning capitalist society.

MrKaepora · Jul 31, 2017

Everytime I see people defending this kind of socialism is astounding.

Opposites really attract each other. The extreme left and the extreme right should hold hands, walk to edge of a cliff and jump. They deserve each other in their delusion were, to defend the ideology of their party, they go as far as forgetting how to be a decent human being.

For the ones on this thread screaming "fake news" I suggest you to go to the Colombian border and see the thousands of refugees coming from Venezuela or, if you're in Portugal like I'm, go to Madeira where hundreds of Portuguese immigrants are arriving every day fleeing from Venezuela.

Speaking about Portugal and the extreme left, the idiots of the PCP ( Portuguese communist party) went as far as holding a rally in one of Lisbon's main streets (Avenida da Liberdade) were about 200 idiots gave support to Maduro. During that rallly at least one person holding a sign against the Venezuelan regime was almost beaten up by the participants. Idiots.

As for the venezuelans...I wish you luck and hope that you can get your country back.

sechsterangriff · Jul 31, 2017

MrKaepora said:
Speaking about Portugal and the extreme left, the idiots of the PCP ( Portuguese communist party) went as far as holding a rally in one of Lisbon's main streets (Avenida da Liberdade) were about 200 idiots gave support to Maduro. During that rallly at least one person holding a sign against the Venezuelan regime was almost beaten up by the participants. Idiots.

This is why they are a dying party, let alone ever become government. Everybody knows their stance will always be party over everything else. For them communist regimes can do no wrong. I mean they still support the MPLA regime in Angola to this day. No wonder they were unable to capitalize during recent years of economic crisis.
Fortunately there are other left wing parties filling the void left by them.

The problem with "classic" communist parties is really that while they claim to be the party of the people, people are only "people" as long as they follow party line. If not they are just reactionaries. Even if those "reactionaries" are the majority of the population.

Foffy · Jul 31, 2017

V_Arnold said:
Well, I am not sure it is Marx's fault that even the idea of basic income is being tested in the Holy Almighty West like a dog tests the bathtub when it is time to wash: avoiding it like the plague, god forbid we have any usable data out of it instead of dismissing it out of spite.

We have data and still dismiss it. That's the hilariously tragic thing.

30 years of pilots and studies and the memes of its ineffectiveness run strong. It's not even an issue of scale and tests that create dissent: the idea itself is given dissent despite constant, observable trends. Will the US move with Y Combinators pilot or the Economic Security Project, the latter of which is a $10,000,000 project? Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeell no.

Sorry for the above being a tangent, but I can't help myself. For the more direct topic at hand, it is unfortunate to see what's unfolding in Venezuela. You would assume a sea of protests and marches would mean the society would get its shit together, but it appears to be doubling down on the insolubility. Tyrants are tyrants, and you could make a case that any ism is prone to being hijacked. Capitalism gets hijacked in a different way than Communism and Socialism: there's no man at the "heart" in power, but the market itself gets hijacked. Neoliberalism is this and how America has a corporatism at the moment.

That said, it's much easier to hijack the system politically as the leader of a nation than economic rigging, hence why when the parasitic activity happens, it's a much quicker metastasization of chaos. Tyranny comes fastest through established political orders, after all.

Funky Papa · Jul 31, 2017

The European hard left defending Maduro closely mimics what happened with Mugabe when he came to power. He had crushed a racist, authoritarian regime and was an ardent socialist, so he had to be a nice guy, right?

It really adds another layer of pathos to the situation.

Seeing Podemos and IU low key supporting Maduro in Spain makes me mad. I fully expect the PP to french kiss Capriles at every chance, but conservatives are not the ones running a campaign based on democratic regeneration and anticorruption policies.

CTLance · Jul 31, 2017

I am sorry that victims like Machados or other VenezuelaGaffers had to read through this thread. I mean, I wanted to jump through the monitor and smack around some fools in his thread, and I am living in utmost luxury as a natural-born Kraut in Germany, far off from any real trouble. I cannot imagine how some of the ignorant posts in this thread must come across to someone affected by this. My apologies.

My condolences to those directly and indirectly affected by this situation. I sincerely hope things will resolve themselves soon. Stay safe and live through this so you can build a better future, be that inside or outside Venezuela. Best of luck.

Condom · Jul 31, 2017

I'm member of an European hard left party and they haven't vocally supported Venezuela after 2013.

We still stand behind Bolivia/Morales for example.

Maybe that's the difference between socialist and communist parties.

Jackpot · Jul 31, 2017

Jimothy said:
I assume any Gaffer with access to internet and a paid-for e-mail address in Venezuela is a part of the upper middle class, which hasn't really benefitted that much from the government's policies compared to the working and poor classes.

empty_vessel?

Bl@de · Jul 31, 2017

Rodolfo Brito said:
Shocking, isn't it?

Yes, extremly shocking. Who would've thought?

Shiggy · Jul 31, 2017

Sad to see another of these socialist disasters in Latin America. While I hope not more will die, we all know that won't happen.

Boney · Jul 31, 2017

Funky Papa said:
Here's the thing: Maduro's opposition has shown time and time again to be corrupt, violent and murderous. Just because Maduro is an asshole doesn't mean that the people against him are not capable of despicable acts of violence and (yes) terrorism.

Maduro is an awful, authoritarian leader who doesn't believe in democracy nor wants any of it unless it happens to work for him (read: in his own benefit). He'll gladly launch a self-coup if he feels like that's the only way he can remain in power.

The politicians leading the opposition are also a bunch of protodespots and pro-coupists working towards the benefit of a few while pretending to be at the forefront of a democratic uprising. There's nothing benign about Capriles and his close circle. His saintly image is at odds with his deeds and ties.

Venezuela is at the brink of civil war. While people protesting against Maduro are damn right in doing so, the politicians in charge of the opposition are outright vile and shouldn't be trusted at all. It's not unlike what happened in Brazil just a few months ago. Only this time people are dying on the streets and there's a chance things may take a turn for the worse.

Feel free to pick a side if that's what you want. Just be mindful of the fact that everybody is incredibly dirty and that there's a glaring lack of democratic values at the top of both movements.

Pretty much. Maduro has a fucking mess on his hands due to the collapse of the oil prices and sensing a coup he centralized power on the executive. But the way the opposition has been white washed is insane, and they are an even a bigger threat to the Venezuelan people. I don't know if the constituent will help or damage things, but I do think it's a sensible decision to try to establish some order without violence, and Venezuela's elections have been said to be one of the most transparent in the world. The problem is that without the opposition participating, the results won't be representative.

But the pro Maduro people definately showed up to tote despite the violence and the number of election equipment trashed and burnt
https://twitter.com/javierrivasr33/status/891801738637922307

Here's people having to cross a fucking river since the roads have been occupied by terrorists
https://twitter.com/almeidapsuv/status/891692877474127875

Frozenprince · Jul 31, 2017

Boney said:
Pretty much. Maduro has a fucking mess on his hands due to the collapse of the oil prices and sensing a coup he centralized power on the executive. But the way the opposition has been white washed is insane, and they are an even a bigger threat to the Venezuelan people. I don't know if the constituent will help or damage things, but I do think it's a sensible decision to try to establish some order without violence, and Venezuela's elections have been said to be one of the most transparent in the world. The problem is that without the opposition participating, the results won't be representative.

But the pro Maduro people definately showed up to tote despite the violence and the number of election equipment trashed and burnt
https://twitter.com/javierrivasr33/status/891801738637922307

Here's people having to cross a fucking river since the roads have been occupied by terrorists
https://twitter.com/almeidapsuv/status/891692877474127875

I do enjoy how you try and spin that Maduro has absolutely no fault in his country protesting his regime.

The opposition being shite doesn't magically wash away the horrible things his government has done and tried to do. Doesn't make the hundreds of thousands of angry protestors all terrorists or hard right conservatives.

Easy_D · Jul 31, 2017

Funky Papa said:
The European hard left defending Maduro closely mimics what happened with Mugabe when he came to power. He had crushed a racist, authoritarian regime and was an ardent socialist, so he had to be a nice guy, right?

It really adds another layer of pathos to the situation.

Seeing Podemos and IU low key supporting Maduro in Spain makes me mad. I fully expect the PP to french kiss Capriles at every chance, but conservatives are not the ones running a campaign based on democratic regeneration and anticorruption policies.

I never thought I'd read "Mugabe" and "nice guy" in the same context. Man, people can be kind of stupid at times.

FreedomFighter · Jul 31, 2017

We're only getting one side of this story from US media.

Look at other sources as well. You can't really trust reporting from certain outlets once a nation is in the "regime change" cross hairs.

Mesoian · Jul 31, 2017

torta_smasher said:
My main point I was trying to make with my earlier post was that Venezuela is mostly so one sided in the way it has been portrayed that it's hard to take anything at face value. I'm not dismissing any bad shit that goes down there nor am I saying that the current govt there is the best. I'm not in a position to make that call. I am in the position to question whether smacking everything with a hammer is a good solution.
This is just my opinion

This is some amazing back peddling with a healthy dose of handwaving.

Funky Papa · Jul 31, 2017

Boney said:
Pretty much. Maduro has a fucking mess on his hands due to the collapse of the oil prices and sensing a coup he centralized power on the executive. But the way the opposition has been white washed is insane, and they are an even a bigger threat to the Venezuelan people.

Due to shit policies inherited from Chavez and of his own. He created this mess. Further, he made it much worse and made sure to pour gasoline on the flames time and time again calling for direct action against the opposition.

The opposition leaders are a threat to the Venezuelan people. But Maduro is actually victimizing them and it's been doing that since the first day. So while they are shit and nobody should be seeing them as saviours, they are not really comparable in the way you'd probably like.

The Venezuelan crisis is largely Maduro's fault.

Tiops · Jul 31, 2017

torta_smasher said:
.

Maybe I'll get banned for this, but I don't care. Go fuck yourself.

EDIT: Holy shit, I read more of the thread and there are actually more than a couple of posters defending Maduro, HOLY FUCKING SHIT. I won't quote everyone, will just leave a "go fuck yourselves" for everyone of you defending this shit.

clemenx · Jul 31, 2017

ibyea said:
Hell no. First of all, Noriega was a US created problem. Secondly, the US already intervened in Venezuela back in 2002, and it was crap. No thanks. Based on history, I know not to trust the US.

2002 is an extremely complex issue. The US did not "back" anything they just supported the coup after the fact. Just like any civilized nation did.

The only ones that failed there was the Venezuelan military by not wanting to execute Chavez.

gutter_trash · Jul 31, 2017

MrKaepora said:
Everytime I see people defending this kind of socialism is astounding.

Opposites really attract each other. The extreme left and the extreme right should hold hands, walk to edge of a cliff and jump. They deserve each other in their delusion were, to defend the ideology of their party, they go as far as forgetting how to be a decent human being.

For the ones on this thread screaming "fake news" I suggest you to go to the Colombian border and see the thousands of refugees coming from Venezuela or, if you're in Portugal like I'm, go to Madeira where hundreds of Portuguese immigrants are arriving every day fleeing from Venezuela.

Speaking about Portugal and the extreme left, the idiots of the PCP ( Portuguese communist party) went as far as holding a rally in one of Lisbon's main streets (Avenida da Liberdade) were about 200 idiots gave support to Maduro. During that rallly at least one person holding a sign against the Venezuelan regime was almost beaten up by the participants. Idiots.

As for the venezuelans...I wish you luck and hope that you can get your country back.

pretty much, all forms of dictatorships are bad, agreed. The will to be fully democratic is important but replacing the Far-Right with a Far-Left doesn't work. Netiher does the other way around.

the PCP can go fuck themselves for ransacking honnest working businesses during the Carnation "Revolution" post-1974 and ruining the economy for over a decade.

The PCP are parasite scum. They don't really care about democracy, they just want to install their own version of a Far-Left regime.and just steel everything and create nothing.

The worst part out of all this is that many Portuguese-Venezuelans are fleeing in masse back to Madeira, Portugal.
Many are 2nd generation or 3rd generation who immigrated to Venuzeulla half a century ago for a better life. Some created business like grocery stores, buthcer shops, fruit stores and bakeries. The Madura regime has ransacked the business of hard working people and now these people are going back to Madeira with nothing.

the PCP taking a Pro-Madruo stance while many Portuguese-Venezuelans are suffering in Venezuela and fleeing is really fucked up on the party of the parastiic PCP. But eh, what some of these guys pulled during the 1974 Carnation "revoultiuon" doesn't suprise me. The Communists are all about robbing honnest busines owners who busted their asses creating

ty_hot · Jul 31, 2017

https://youtu.be/onNMas1RN0E

if this isnt a terrorist attack, then I dont know what else is

and how are we supposed to call the people celebrating such an terrible act? democrats?

moffattron9000 · Jul 31, 2017

ty_hot said:
https://youtu.be/onNMas1RN0E

if this isnt a terrorist attack, then I dont know what else is

and how are we supposed to call the people celebrating such an terrible act? democrats?

Give some fucking warning before you post what appears to be people fucking dying via a bomb.

Linkark07 · Jul 31, 2017

Eylos said:
Like the aljazeera article Said i agree, the govermnent and oposition should sit on a table and negotiate. To end this violence and a better outcome to the people, If IS that Window still open IS the better result to everyone. Molotovs Wont solve this, you could kill someone.

How many times they have tried, yet Maduro and his cronies don't want to give an inch. They won't step down voluntarily.

Tomasoares · Jul 31, 2017

So is there actually people here defending Maduro's regime and blaming US for Venezuela crisis? lmao

Jackpot · Jul 31, 2017

FreedomFighter said:
We're only getting one side of this story from US media.

Look at other sources as well. You can't really trust reporting from certain outlets once a nation is in the "regime change" cross hairs.

European media doesn't count apparently. Or do you just group them all together as "evil capitalist pig-dogs"? Why don't you post some more Russia Today links, that'll show people how good your judgement of sources are.

Granjinha · Jul 31, 2017

Man, how little to none character and decency you must have to defend this government. It's not like i'm suprised, but how low can some people get, huh?

moffattron9000 · Jul 31, 2017

Jackpot said:
European media doesn't count apparently. Or do you just group them all together as "evil capitalist pig-dogs"? Why don't you post some more Russia Today links, that'll show people how good your judgement of sources are.

Didn't you hear, NATO's sole purpose is to make all non-neoliberal states bend the knee and join the New World Order. Everything that every member-state does is solely for this purpose.

Bl@de · Jul 31, 2017

Tomasoares said:
So is there actually people here defending Maduro's regime and blaming US for Venezuela crisis? lmao

It's expected when it comes to socialist regimes.

"The evil foreign capitalists and imperialists are the cause why It didn't work"

"We'll just have to try harder"

Rodolfo Brito · Jul 31, 2017

Eylos said:
Like the aljazeera article Said i agree, the govermnent and oposition should sit on a table and negotiate. To end this violence and a better outcome to the people, If IS that Window still open IS the better result to everyone. Molotovs Wont solve this, you could kill someone.

How can people negotiate in a situation like that?
I mean, not saying that you are wrong in proposing that, but the people are straight up starving to death and the armed repression is going on for months and there is no sign of slowing down.

I mean, the government uses the money of the taxpayers to finance armed militias against the opposition, killing civilians using the argument that they are "anti-revolutionary" or something like that.

To propose a negotiation between the parts here is straight up to propose thar one side "surrender" is this is not going to happen anytime soon. Maduro will not resign. The opposition will not surrender, knowing that they will eb considered terrorists and will be arrested for life. It is a really, really fucked up situation.

elrechazado · Jul 31, 2017

FreedomFighter said:
We're only getting one side of this story from US media.

Look at other sources as well. You can't really trust reporting from certain outlets once a nation is in the "regime change" cross hairs.

Yes, we should consult Maduro controlled media outlets for the true story. From the Regine that brought us press crackdowns and censorship and taking opposition media off the air.

Stone Ocean · Jul 31, 2017

FreedomFighter said:
We're only getting one side of this story from US media.

Look at other sources as well. You can't really trust reporting from certain outlets once a nation is in the "regime change" cross hairs.

How about read the thread and see what VenezuelaGAF has to say instead. Or read the story from other non-US medias

This isn't the 90's buddy, anyone with half a brain can actually read the story from other sources if you look for 5 minutes and lemme tell you, it's still a nightmare.

cromofo · Jul 31, 2017

Socialism?

Don't people ever learn from history? It fairly recent ffs.

Rodolfo Brito · Jul 31, 2017

It is bizarre, but not unpredictable to see some familiar faces from Brazilian foruns here supporting Maduro. These people are the same that, despite the fact the Brazil is facing a unprecedented financial, political and ethical crisis, still supports the Workers Party that is straight up the responsible for this crisis, after 13 years of economic populism and state companies pillage. The same party that endorsed and signed a public note supporting Maduro. This is just sad.

NeOak · Jul 31, 2017

FreedomFighter said:
We're only getting one side of this story from US media.

Look at other sources as well. You can't really trust reporting from certain outlets once a nation is in the "regime change" cross hairs.

Here you go:

https://twitter.com/nicolasmaduro

Everything seems to be fine according to the official press.

/s

Abilidebob · Jul 31, 2017

It's honestly impressively sad to see how there are still some fucking IDIOTS on this forum going all "uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that's just western media, don't believe what you've heard! I'm a rich privileged piece of shit and I know that everything is fine down there and only the rich are actually 'suffering'!", ESPECIALLY when there's been quite a few gaffers on this very fucking thread saying what's going on in Venezuela.

What the fuck is wrong with people?

enanogrande · Jul 31, 2017

Funky Papa said:
Here's the thing: Maduro's opposition has shown time and time again to be corrupt, violent and murderous. Just because Maduro is an asshole doesn't mean that the people against him are not capable of despicable acts of violence and (yes) terrorism.

Maduro is an awful, authoritarian leader who doesn't believe in democracy nor wants any of it unless it happens to work for him (read: in his own benefit). He'll gladly launch a self-coup if he feels like that's the only way he can remain in power.

The politicians leading the opposition are also a bunch of protodespots and pro-coupists working towards the benefit of a few while pretending to be at the forefront of a democratic uprising. There's nothing benign about Capriles and his close circle. His saintly image is at odds with his deeds and ties.

Venezuela is at the brink of civil war. While people protesting against Maduro are damn right in doing so, the politicians in charge of the opposition are outright vile and shouldn't be trusted at all. It's not unlike what happened in Brazil just a few months ago. Only this time people are dying on the streets and there's a chance things may take a turn for the worse.

Feel free to pick a side if that's what you want. Just be mindful of the fact that everybody is incredibly dirty and that there's a glaring lack of democratic values at the top of both movements.

Both this and your next post are disgusting, made worse by that fact you're a fucking mod and so people will give your opinion weight. Do everyone a favor and stick to talking shit about Spanish and European politics if this whataboutism, both sides are the same garbage is all you're going to add to the discussion.

moffattron9000 · Jul 31, 2017

NeOak said:
Here you go:

https://twitter.com/nicolasmaduro

Everything seems to be fine according to the official press.

/s

One of the tweets is a comment about voter numbers, accompanied by a gif featuring Blair from Gossip Girl. That should not be retweeted by a world leader.

EDIT: I also found what appears to be the poster for The Asylum's version of those cheap christian films that Pureflix makes.

Linkark07 · Jul 31, 2017

Rodolfo Brito said:
It is bizarre, but not unpredictable to see some familiar faces from Brazilian foruns here supporting Maduro. These people are the same that, despite the fact the Brazil is facing a unprecedented financial, political and ethical crisis, still supports the Workers Party that is straight up the responsible for this crisis, after 13 years of economic populism and state companies pillage. The same party that endorsed and signed a public note supporting Maduro. This is just sad.

Here in Panama, there are also idiots who support Maduro and his shitty government, despite we suffered from our own Maduro in the 80s.

There will be always people like that, regardless of country. You can see it yourself in Venezuela; there are still people who support Maduro.

NeOak · Jul 31, 2017

moffattron9000 said:
One of the tweets is a comment about voter numbers, accompanied by a gif featuring Blair from Gossip Girl. That should not be retweeted by a world leader.

He doesn't handle the Twitter. Someone does it for him.

moffattron9000 · Jul 31, 2017

NeOak said:
He doesn't handle the Twitter. Someone does it for him.

I know. It's just so dumb on so many levels.

Off topic, but I also saw this image of people crossing a river to vote. While the fact that a government that requires people to cross a river to vote despite being in power for nearly 20 years is a terrible endorsement for a government, that's not what I'm interested in. What I am interested in is that above the girl's on the lefts hat, there appears to be a path to cross the river.

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Maduro's regime has killed 14 people today in Venezuela.

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I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions

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never left the stone age

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