• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

LTTP: Sometimes Gamers Suck - Bioshock 2 Does Not

K

Kevin Shields

Member
Rewind to 2011, I'm just finishing Bioshock for the first time at like 2 AM and I'm looking up explanations on what just happened and generally happy I just finished an awesome game. After finally wrapping my head around the story, my next move is to obviously research Bioshock 2 to see if I was going to buy it or not. On several game forums and sites this is what I remember seeing.

B team. Not original creators

Cash grab

Stupid sequel. Not a true sequel

Made for tv sequel.

Totally nonsensical.

Now as I am in the middle of Siren Alley on the PS4, I am simultaneously thrilled with this game and pissed off at all the hyperbolic idiots who convinced me to never play this.

Frankly I was gonna skip to infinite but I noticed on Gaf that some people had changed their tune a bit so I gave it a shot

First off the game is really fun to play. The weapons and plasmid combos are so much better than the first. Gameplay is smoother and guns feel and hit so much better. Although my major complaint is my gun sounds are really quiet. Not cool.

The levels so far have been well designed. They are large with more layers then the first game (more verticality and such) and playing with the arrow off has made it really fun to explore.

Yes everything feels familiar, but I'm still loving exploring rapture. When I first got to siren alley and saw a shrine with a crashed plane I thought that was a pretty awesome callback. The story has me invested even if there is not as much mystery. Sometimes I don't need all these crazy twists with gene-age enhancing run arounds. A straightforward story is fine and so far this seems like that although there may be twists ahead.

I also think I love the locations that don't feel quite as bright and in your face as the first game. It feels like a real place with an angle on the more impoverished places of Rapture.

Long story short. I can't wait to play more and I can't believe I waited so darn long. I loved Bioshock and Infinite and this game seems to be as good if not better than those two gems.
 
MAtgS

MAtgS

Member
I lost interest after the upteenth "protect little sister from swarm of enemies that just so happen to attack at that exact moment".
 
S

Staf

Member
I really liked it, not as good as the first one though. Bioshock > Minerva's Den > Bioshock 2 > Bioshock Infinite.
 
I

Izuna

Banned
BioShock 2 >>>>>>>>>. Infinite


and Infinite DLC makes BioShock 2's story non-canon which pissed me off

Gameplay and Ending is great
 
W

wenis

Registered for GAF on September 11, 2001.
Bioshock 2 had better gameplay, but built upon something I didn't care for the first time around. I still beat it just using a couple weapons.
 
G

Glass Rebel

Member
Izuna said:
BioShock 2 >>>>>>>>>. Infinite


and Infinite DLC makes BioShock 2's story non-canon which pissed me off

Gameplay and Ending is great
Click to expand...

rTVmo6D.png


From my point of view, Infinite is non-canon
 
H

hotcyder

Member
Two is just a much more improved game. Fills in the last little details of the world and recontextualises it through a new villian and level of decay.

Gameplay is better expanded, the little sister sections break up the exploration/puzzle loop of the game, relies on solid character writing over a big twist - lots to like about it.

Less said of Infinite the better
 
T

Timeaisis

Member
"B Team" complaints are so stupid and easily some of the most annoying game development criticisms. There are no A teams and B teams, only good teams and bad teams. Hell, you could consider the original Bioshock developer a "B Team", since they hadn't released a game together as a team up to that point.

Anyway, I enjoy Bioshock 2. I still think 1 has the better overall experience, but I admit part of that is definitely the novelty. Bioshock 2 has much tighter gameplay and arguably better level design in some parts.
 
A

admiraltaftbar

Member
Solid game but it failed to bring about the same kind of "you must play this" talk that the original Bioshock did so it got a lot of (probably hyperbolic) hate. 2K didn't do themselves any favors by pushing the half assed multiplayer mode and the storyline being pretty tepid compared to the original. Overall it's fun and does a lot of things right/better than the original but it falls short of masterpiece.
 
L

Lord of Ostia

Member
Played it for the first time with the collection, and thought it was great. Better than Infinite in terms of gameplay, and I thought the little sister defense parts were a nice test of your resource management, and made use of some abilities that were kind of worthless in the original Bioshock like traps. Minerva's Den was good too, though I had a crash and my save file corrupted at the end of it, so I couldn't finish it. Story was kind of dumb in the main game, felt like they just tried to tack stuff onto Bioshock, but the environments and level design were good. Fun game.
 
S

specdot

Member
Welp, op you've convinced me to try it out. I was one of those detractors. Kinda low on funds at the moment so I'll be playing the PS3 version. I played Bioshock and Infinite on PS3 so I wouldn't mind playing this one on PS3 as well. I have the Minerva's Den DLC as well.
 
G

Gilzor

Member
Izuna said:
and Infinite DLC makes BioShock 2's story non-canon which pissed me off
Click to expand...

Wait, it does?

I always interpreted this as
Infinite's multiple-realities meaning the Rapture that followed in the DLC was never meant to be the exact specific one from the original game and Bio2, but one of the many infinite possibilities that was just somehow closer to the original game but not quite entirely (hence Skyhooks).

Did I just totally misunderstand that? :(
 
Y

yuoke

Banned
2 is waaaay better than infinite, especially in gameplay.

The main story itself is kind of weak, but still also probably better than infinite's. Although they are similar.

1 is still better than 2 though overall.
 
nekkid

nekkid

It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
I liked all of them, but there's something about it being underwater that really attracted me to BioShock, and why I prefer 1 and 2 over Infinite.

I still prefer BioShock, but 2 is fantastic. Some gamers let their hyperbolic reaction to things like dev changes override their impression of the game, so best to ignore those people.

Still haven't played Minerva's Den, though.
 
G

Gator86

Member
Glass Rebel said:
rTVmo6D.png


From my point of view, Infinite is non-canon
Click to expand...

This is a terrific post. Infinite is great but the DLC is a goddamn abomination. Bioshock 2 is a fantastic game and so much of the criticism was completely off the mark. I kind of want to replay it now even though I did just a few months ago.
 
V

Van Bur3n

Member
Bioshock 2 is a good sequel to the first Bioshock that improves upon it in every way besides a weaker story. But then has DLC with a fantastic story.

Infinite lacks everything good about a Shock game while including a nonsensically written story. And then digs deeper in the pile of shit it was already in with its DLC.
 
B

Betty

Banned
Improved gameplay wise but the story wan't as compelling, and the villain felt like a Andrew Ryan wannabe rather than her own character.
 
B

blackw0lf

Member
The lead on Bioshock 2, Jordan Thomas, designed the masterful Shalebridge Cradle from Thief:DS and Fort Frolic from Bioshock.

Always found the "B team" comments kind of baffling.
 
J

Jimnymebob

Member
It's the best one.

My only complaint is that I was hoping I'd feel more like an actual Big Daddy, so an unstoppable force, but you still feel like a regular FPS protagonist. The story is nowhere near as good (or should I say memorable?) as the original, but it's still fun.
 
A

Ajszenk

Member
I didn't care for the story much, but it was a fun game and Rapture is just such a great environment to explore.
 
G

Grisby

Member
The sequel is a legitimately good game and arguably has some of the best gameplay in the series.

The Big Sisters are also one of my favorite enemies in all of gaming.
 
A

AlmostMilk

Member
I greatly enjoyed Bioshock 2, maybe even more than Infinite. The story wasn't as good as the first but everything else was better. Never got to play any of the expansions so hopefully I can get a good deal on the remaster to go through it all again.
 
M

Modest Mauser

Member
Imo it still is the video game equivalent of a direct-to-DVD sequel. If you care about gameplay above all, it's definitely a tighter experience but the first Bioshock was memorable for its story and setting which are very blandly recycled for 2.
 
Roni

Roni

Gold Member
Bioshock 2 is amazing, I remember reading the same complaints, but I'm stubborn so went with it anyway and was thrilled this was the better game of the two.

Tip: if you can, play as a true Big Daddy.
Make full use of the Drill only thingy.
 
I

Izuna

Banned
Gilzor said:
Wait, it does?

I always interpreted this as
Infinite's multiple-realities meaning the Rapture that followed in the DLC was never meant to be the exact specific one from the original game and Bio2, but one of the many infinite possibilities that was just somehow closer to the original game but not quite entirely (hence Skyhooks).

Did I just totally misunderstand that? :(
Click to expand...

Nah, because BioShock 2 happens in the same universe as the original. Infinite completely changes how certain things were done so it made it non-canon
 
S

Sethista

Member
MAtgS said:
I lost interest after the upteenth "protect little sister from swarm of enemies that just so happen to attack at that exact moment".
Click to expand...

The splicers attacked because the little sisters are vulnerable when they take adam from corpsea, the splicers also are drawn to it when they harvest, the preparation time you had was because you knoew the splicers would come while they harvest.

Also minervas den is one of the beat dlc ever.
Alongside cidatel in mass effect
 
TheMadMan007

TheMadMan007

Member
Thing is, this is a bandwagon game. I always liked it more as a game than the first one (The setting just is reused so it doesn't have the impact of the first game, but it's a better game all around than the first), But everyone hated it until last year when the remaster came out the everyone changed their tune to "oh no, it's good, it's the best in the series"
 
B

BRocknRolla

Member
Never understood the hate for B2. For me B2 > B1.

Story - Lacks the originality of the setting, of course, but trucks in different ideas and still does them well. Has some incredibly interesting moments that absolutely surpass much of of what was done in the first game (Little sister stuff specifically). I'd put B1 and 2 on about equal ground here.

Pacing - The biggest overall improvement. The game feels even and pushes you forward throughout. It also Lacks the rather bad final act of the B1; something that took much of the shine off the first game for me.

Gameplay - Hugely improved. More responsive. More creative. You feel like an actual Big Daddy.

And honestly, as far as Infinite goes, I would say about the only thing I thought worthwhile about that game was the aesthetics. Everything else from the story, to the pacing, and particularly the gameplay was varying shades of not great.
 
B

BiggNife

Member
The gameplay in BS2 is fun. The story sucks and is super forgettable.

Minverva's Den, tho. Now that's the good shit.
 
G

Gilzor

Member
blackw0lf said:
The lead on Bioshock 2, Jordan Thomas, designed the masterful Shalebridge Cradle from Thief:DS and Fort Frolic from Bioshock.
Click to expand...

And he worked on BioShock Infinite too, before heading off to make his own (very good) game The Magic Circle.

Izuna said:
Nah, because BioShock 2 happens in the same universe as the original. Infinite completely changes how certain things were done so it made it non-canon
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, I know that Bio1 and 2 are the same universe, but what I meant was that I always saw the lighthouse moment in Infinite as setting up the notion that whatever might follow -- like the two-part DLC -- wouldn't ever be exactly the reality of Bio1 and 2, but more a version of that reality with some differences. So to that end, that's how Rapture in the DLC is designed more to accommodate Infinite's gameplay than the originals, as it's just one of countless theoretical versions. Like I say, I may have gotten that completely wrong though!
 
I

Izuna

Banned
Infinite took enough liberties as possible (where the ending to dlc 1 is a plot hole) just to claim as much as possible that it led into BioShock 1.
 
C

Conciliator

Banned
I've been yelling insanely from the Bioshock-2-is-the-best-bioshock mountain basically since it came out and I have no desire to stop now. It has by far the richest gameplay of the series, and while the main story is weak-ish, the side characters and stories are engaging and dig into elements less explored in the first game.
 
K

Kevin Shields

Member
Modest Mauser said:
Imo it still is the video game equivalent of a direct-to-DVD sequel. If you care about gameplay above all, it's definitely a tighter experience but the first Bioshock was memorable for its story and setting which are very blandly recycled for 2.
Click to expand...

No offense, but that really gives the wrong impression of what the game actually is... for starters, I have never heard one argument that a straight to DVD sequel was better than an original, so that even a handful of people think it's better means it shouldn't be on the same sphere.

Also a straight for DVD sequel usually has horrible actors, no directors or producers or team from the first movie and is usual straight trash

That you would say gameplay, a freaking pillar of a... game.is better than the original, that's pretty significant. So if a story is not as good and you don't appreciate the atmosphere makes it straight trash is a bit much.

I'm not saying you can't think Bioshock 1 is immensely better, but it's hardly like an 18th American pie movie or Ace Ventura Jr. or Lion King 2 - Simba becomes a monkey.

Made for DVD try to get cheap sales and a cheap cash grab. Even not liking Bioshock 2, you can admit care and attention was paid to it.

Sorry had to rant.
 
K

Kevin Shields

Member
Conciliator said:
I've been yelling insanely from the Bioshock-2-is-the-best-bioshock mountain basically since it came out and I have no desire to stop now. It has by far the richest gameplay of the series, and while the main story is weak-ish, the side characters and stories are engaging and dig into elements less explored in the first game.
Click to expand...

I really like the Ryan vs Lamb debate tapes and I don't feel like she is shoehorned in at all. Bioshock 1 dealt mainly with criminal underworld and revolution so it kind of makes sense why she wouldn't be mentioned if even if she was well known.
 
G

Gorillaz

Member
I will forever say Bioshock 2 was the best in the series. I actually liked the plot in the back half waaaaaay more then Bioshock 1. It knew what it wanted to accomplish and pulled it off well. Final act shits on B1's.

Infinite is ok but it's carried entirely by it's twist
 
T

Toa TAK

Banned
I think each BioShock game is special, but gun to the head, BioShock 2 is my favorite. Still one of the best DLC's ever put out.
 
H

Hazmat

Member
Bioshock 1 is a better game because it introduced Rapture, and Bioshock 2 is mostly just playing around in 1's world. However, 2 absolutely plays better. It lacks the "Whoa" factor that the original had, but people who dismissed it because it was by another team really missed out. It's a great game.
 
semiconscious

semiconscious

Member
Kevin Shields said:
Long story short. I can't wait to play more and I can't believe I waited so darn long. I loved Bioshock and Infinite and this game seems to be as good if not better than those two gems.
Click to expand...

not quite as good as the original, but a whole lot better than infinite. glad you're enjoying it - great game! :) ...
 
P

Prince of Space

Banned
A lot of the reactions to BioShock 2 remind me a fair bit of Super Mario Galaxy 2 in that both games are absolutely an improvement on their predecessors, but because those first games were so massive when they landed, their sequels tend to be judged by many as expansion packs, at best.
 
D

DrunkShogun

Member
Favourite out of three. Sure bioshock 1 has a stronger twist but the stories are in pat ignoring that. Gameplay bioshock 2 was king and didn't have any annoying parts that 1 had such as the final boss and collecting items.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Bioshock is still so good
2
79
3K
Chuck Berry replied
Would it be worth it to play Dragon's Dogma 1 before 2?
2
77
4K
Arachnid replied
What is the most memorable game that did not live up to your hype?
2
93
3K
Freelance Yakuza replied
LTTP: Lost Judgement: The Great Kamarucho Detective Caper
32
2K
SCB3 replied
  • Poll
Which great, underperforming Square Enix game is better - Octopath 2 or FF7 Rebirth
2
58
2K
Lokaum D+ replied
Top Bottom