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[The Antitype]

I think Call of Duty, as a franchise, is majorly responsible for the dispelling of that myth.

When "The biggest franchise in gaming" promotes 60fps as one of its main selling points, there's really no leg to stand on, is there?

Is it sight or feel when it comes to 30fps vs 60fps?

Honest question. I'm honestly not sure if I could tell the difference from eye-sight alone, but as soon as you put the controller in my hands I would know.

Honestly, frame-rate isn't a huge deal to me other than when it's fluctuating. I'd rather a game locked at 30fps than one that bounces between 50 and 60.

 

[adixon]

I think Call of Duty, as a franchise, is majorly responsible for the dispelling of that myth.

When "The biggest franchise in gaming" promotes 60fps as one of its main selling points, there's really no leg to stand on, is there?

You could also say gaming coming to greater prominence as a medium was an even more fundamental force in that change, since a lot of the "human eye can only perceive 30fps" people were film people in my experience. But yeah, I agree

 

[Fallout-with-swords]

Do we know for sure that review builds of the game didn't have the patch, a lot of people are assuming they didn't but couldn't it be the case that the review builds had the 1080p so patch?

 

[MonaKyshu]

Is it sight or feel when it comes to 30fps vs 60fps?

its gotta be both, its no doubt nicer on the eyes with smoother transitions without the need to have motion blur out the ass everywhere, but theres also the improved input latency, and between actually seeing the motions play out clearer on screen and being able to react faster to the motions, it makes it a better feeling experience.

 

[shadowsdarknes]

So correct me if I'm wrong, but it boils down to this:

A) The reviewers already reviewed the PS4 version and it was displaying in 1080p. This vindicates the journalists who said the PS4 version looks better.

B) The reviewers who have reviewed the PS4 version saw the SP in 720p. So while the PS4 version looked the same or better to some journalists, we can expect a large jump in IQ for launch.

Sounds like this all worked out.

 

[Lord Error]

That's what's blowing my mind. He could have EASILY sat on his hands, and kept his mouth shut and let everyone think it was actually right. But he comes out, while people are coming out to gloat and praise him and basically say, "No, wait guys. I'm actually still dumb. Don't congratulate me. Just wanted to clarify."

Why did he feel the urge to come out and clarify that his visual comparisons were actually multiplayer. Perhaps he's so deluded and so resolute in his belief that 1080p and 720p don't look different, that he felt he had to double down on his original claim, lest people actually think he was making sense for a second.

I know, I thought it was incredible. He'd rather throw his own credibility (or his peer's credibility) under the bus than to admit that God forbid, PS4 version actually will look visibly better. I really have a problem even believing they only compared MP like he's saying. You kind of have to be legitimately part-blind to not be able to see the difference that is a non-AA pixel soup of 720p and something rendered in a native 1080 resolution of a TV screen.

It's like some kind of religious fanatism where the sense of self worth is distant second to utmost belief in a "higher power". Except he's doing that over what exactly?

 

[Chobel]

Not really I can see what they mean. The PS4 was outputting in 1080p, and IGN captured at 1080p. Hence IGN was capturing in 1080p from a 1080p source. They were capturing every single pixel the 1080p source (ps4) was outputting.

It just so happens, that COD Ghosts was being upscaled from 720p to 1080p before ps4 was outputting it.

So absolute original source, the game, indeed wasn't native 1080p. But the ps4 was outputting in 1080p, and they were capturing that 1080p signal (hence calling it a 1080p source that was being captured).

They could have said "1080p source" instead they said "native 1080p source". That's why I called it a lie.

Edit: Ah okay. Well they weren't completely lying or misinformed. A part of the game (aka the actual part the majority play exclusively without even touching the SP) has been 1080p native from the getgo (the MP).

The video in IGN was from SP.

 

[Mononoke]

Do we know for sure that review builds of the game didn't have the patch, a lot of people are assuming they didn't but couldn't it be the case that the review builds had the 1080p so patch?

Well someone looked at the pixels on the IGN comaprison and proved the supposed 1080 was also 720p. At least I think that was the case.

Edit: or I guess not. I shouldn't speak when I don't know.

 

[antitrop]

You kind of have to be legitimately part-blind to not be able to see the difference that is a non-AA pixel soup of 720p and something rendered in a native 1080 resolution of a TV screen.

To be fair, 1080p can be a pixel soup without any AA, as well. I usually run my PC games at 1080p, 4x MSAA (and SweetFX SMAA injection) and sometimes with downsampling (OGSSAA). Turning AA off completely is... not good, at any resolution.

That said, I would still prefer 1080p with no AA to something like... 720p with 4x MSAA.

 

[Chobel]

To be fair, 1080p can be a pixel soup without any AA, as well. I usually run my PC games at 1080p, 4x MSAA (and SweetFX SMAA injection). Turning AA off completely is... not good.

Mark Rubin said there's no differences other than the resolution. Also 1080p without AA is still better than 720 without AA.

 

[Lord Error]

To be fair, 1080p can be a pixel soup without any AA, as well. I usually run my PC games at 1080p, 4x MSAA (and SweetFX SMAA injection) and sometimes with downsampling (OGSSAA). Turning AA off completely is... not good.

IMO, 1080, even with no AA looks OK on a 1080p TV. Less so on a monitor, but TVs are more forgiving. It also depends on content. For example, SSDHD on PS3 looks really fine with noAA due to its use of HDR glow that masks the edges a bit. I also think this CoD will be fine due to its low contrast colors.

 

[antitrop]

Mark Rubin said there's no differences other than the resolution.

Yeah, I would imagine both the Xbox One version and PS4 versions are running with 2x MSAA, as has been standard for CoD.

Also 1080p without AA is still better than 720 without AA.

Yes, objectively. That's just a fact.

 

[vcc]

Isn't that stupid graph for film content, not 3D rendered video games?

It's also based on actual 720p TV's rather than 720p upscale to 1080p which have issues other than being able to to distinguish clusters of pixels.

 

[Daingurse]

To be fair, 1080p can be a pixel soup without any AA, as well. I usually run my PC games at 1080p, 4x MSAA (and SweetFX SMAA injection) and sometimes with downsampling (OGSSAA). Turning AA off completely is... not good, at any resolution.

That said, I would still prefer 1080p with no AA to something like... 720p with 4x MSAA.

A lot of that is the close view distance that comes with monitors I think though. When I play games on my TV from 9ft away at 1080p, FXAA is enough honestly.

It's true, I'm definitely looking at it from the PC gamer angle, I can't help it.

But you're definitely right, it's different on a TV.

I know the struggle. I'd agree with what you said when I play on my desk pretty much. 1080p with no AA isn't enough.

 

[antitrop]

A lot of that is the close view distance that comes with monitors I think. When I play games on my TV from 9ft away at 1080p, FXAA is enough honestly.

It's true, I'm definitely looking at it from the PC gamer angle, I can't help it.

But you're definitely right, it's different on a TV. I wasn't really making any kind of argument, though, just kind of talking for the sake of talking, haha.

 

[LegendOfFalcon]

Okay, sorry my dinner was so long, I got take out. Came back with PC Colorblind mode comparison shots of the same scene that IGN was using (Left is On, Right is Off):

IGN Image:

Wow the xbox version really does appear to be in color blind mode. Thanks for getting the comparison pics.

 

[stew]

What if they've done this on purpose to show that there are differences? This way we wouldn't notice that both image are the same and don't start questionning about PS4 version?

 

[BigTnaples]

What if they've done this on purpose to show that there are differences? This way we wouldn't notice that both image are the same and don't start questionning about PS4 version?

I have read this 4 times and still have no clue what you are trying to say.

 

[Loofy]

This stupid chart is still going around? This is the biggest lie in the world, or it isn't based on people with 20/20 vision or better. I can see the difference between 720 and 1080 source material from further than that on my 55" Samsung. My eyesight is better than 20/20, but this chart always seemed like a waste. I thought this was just a way to peddle shitty HDTVs 5 years ago. PEACE.

Past 11 feet? I think youre lying...
Assuming the content isnt limited by bitrate.

 

[GoofsterStud]

Okay, sorry my dinner was so long, I got take out. Came back with PC Colorblind mode comparison shots of the same scene that IGN was using (Left is On, Right is Off):

IGN Image:

Thanks for proving it for me!

I didn't have the game. At least now people won't think I'm insane.

 

[stew]

I have read this 4 times and still have no clue what you are trying to say.

I'm sorry, I was talking about this Ign video. The color blind mode is activated, I know it's silly but I think they may have done it intentionally.

 

[CosmicGroinPull]

IGN failed to notice that single player was in 720p, and even said there was a very noticeable difference. But it was 720p. That is real evidence that resolution isn't so easy to see. Just saying you can tell the difference is not evidence of anything but your self-confidence.

So one party's opinion (IGN) qualifies as evidence while another's (gaffer) is not?

 

[Glass Shark]

The thing that baffles me is that IGN continues to say that what they played and captured was 1080p. I don't know why they would lie about that. Maybe it's a mistake, but I doubt it. I can't think of any possible reason they would dig in and claim over and over that the footage is 1080p when it's not. It would only come back to bite them in the end.

So something else is going on here. I just wish we knew what. I guess we'll have to wait until more people get the console and game in hand...

 

[gogosox8]

I'm sorry, I was talking about this Ign video. The color blind mode is activated, I know it's silly but I think they may have done it intentionally.

But why exactly would they do that? What would IGN gain by making themselves look bad (which they have) by claiming the ps4 version is sharper or whatever when its been confirmed it wasn't?

 

[Chobel]

The thing that baffles me is that IGN continues to say that what they played and captured was 1080p. I don't know why they would lie about that. Maybe it's a mistake, but I doubt it. I can't think of any possible reason they would dig in and claim over and over that the footage is 1080p when it's not. It would only come back to bite them in the end.

So something else is going on here. I just wish we knew what. I guess we'll have to wait until more people get the console and game in hand...

Now, I believe they're not lying (at least not intentionally), but they're probably just repeating what Activision told them.

 

[Roland1979]

P A T H E T I C

Has gaming come to this ?!?!

 

[TheKayle]

i think that this is the perfect answer to what someone of us was trying to say for days...

people should need to understand that this isnt just as simple as black and white
if you do an experiment and you start to paint a4 panels with lots of gradients between the black and the white...and you do a test you will see lots of ppl starting to call "white" gradients that are still grey....as you increase the gradient number as much increase the ppl that get wrong...

..this isnt anymore the 480*320 era....i remember that time when u havent any antialiasing or post production effect that could enanche the iq...and if u see a 480*320 (but also a 640*480) and then a 1024*768 you would immediatly see the difference...the jaggies everythin....
nowdays the resolution are so much higher and we need to realize that for the human eye (expecially to the one that arent used to do comparations) this jaggies and other problems are becoming everyday more little....and theres a limit (as the gradient example) where all start becoming irrilevant.......if we add the antialiasing techniques and all the image enanchments...

here is the same...if gaming journalist...made their brain be tricked from the imagination that they was watching a 1080p game ...(i mean ppl that are used to play and find differences between same version of the game betwween platforms...and they do this for job)..and they start to see differences that arent real...... imagine the "average joe" out there...

most gamers out there...will not have the the idea of where is the difference....most used gamers...if u let them see a ps4 screenshot @ 1080p and you close the image for 1 mins and then you show a 720p image without any comparation ..would not notice any change...most gamers out there.....havent 20/20 view......and most have eye problems and glasses...

im tryiing to defend the lower resolution? no...im not.....im a gamer from more than 20 years now....and i work with computer graphics.....i think that im able to see clearly that difference (as i did from the start saying that they looked exactly the same to me...taking insult from some of you)
im trying to say that this difference after this limit is important for a niche..of us..and dont change anything in the real experience that an average gamer could have from this game...
i think that we reach a good lvl of resolution and if i would work on something i would work on IQ,AA,and post production effects...isteat to care to increase the resolutions...
in fact im sure (and im really sure) that better developer than IW will put nicer things also working at lower resolution and im sure (and IM REALLY SURE) that the lower resolution will have enourmous greater quality than this 1080p monster ....im talking about the order 1886

the differences between 1080p and 720p are not noticable as ppl thing they are..at least for a great majority of ppl out there

i know that most of you like lions will start to bite after this post...also coz this was one of the few nice think happen to the ps4 after this round of review...but really...
we are talking about a mediocre game created by a mediocre developer...all of this just should get less attention

 

[davepoobond]

so now who thinks that we should allow for "graphics settings" on consoles?

 

[Roland1979]

i think that this is the perfect answer to what someone of us was trying to say for days...

I don't care about the video it's pathetic to have a update to be able to play in a higher resolution. It's a disgrace.

 

[GameAddict411]

So polygon weren't lying when they said they didn't see a difference.

 

[TheKayle]

I don't care about the video it's pathetic to have a update to be able to play in a higher resolution. It's a disgrace.

ppl should buy less games from mediocre developers

 

[nib95]

IGN failed to notice that single player was in 720p, and even said there was a very noticeable difference. But it was 720p. That is real evidence that resolution isn't so easy to see. Just saying you can tell the difference is not evidence of anything but your self-confidence.

Lol what a silly and illogical post. Most people on GAF (myself included) immediately mentioned that the PS4 footage and screens did not look 1080p. Or did you miss the dozens of posts, multiple threads etc regarding it? You have to have pretty poor eye sight or a very specific screen size to viewing distance ratio to not be able to see the differences between 1080p and 720p, and that's not just opinion, but scientific fact.

It's embarrassing that neither IGN nor Polygon could even tell it was running in 720p. Seriously, GAF > Gaming journalism every time.

ppl should buy less games from mediocre developers

And what games are you buying at launch with these next gen consoles?

 

[TheKayle]

So polygon weren't lying when they said they didn't see a difference.

polygon and some gaf "users"...both take millions of insults
from expert eye users

 

[gruenel]

This stupid chart is still going around? This is the biggest lie in the world, or it isn't based on people with 20/20 vision or better. I can see the difference between 720 and 1080 source material from further than that on my 55" Samsung. My eyesight is better than 20/20, but this chart always seemed like a waste. I thought this was just a way to peddle shitty HDTVs 5 years ago. PEACE.

I agree, I think this chart was made for TV shows/movies.

It's much easier to see resolution differences in games due to aliasing, even with good AA techniques.

 

[mjontrix]

Just when I was about to give Polygon the benefit of the doubt, they still continue to fail.

lol

They're not about to burn bridges here...so obviously they took a neutral approach.

Don't want to get blackballed by Microsoft/IW now do we?

 

[Yoshichan]

Someone PLEASE summarize wtf happened and is happening. Explain it all PLEASE!

 

[TheKayle]

Lol what a silly and illogical post. Most people on GAF (myself included) immediately mentioned that the PS4 footage and screens did not look 1080p. Or did you miss the dozens of posts, multiple threads etc regarding it? You have to have pretty poor eye sight or a very specific screen size to viewing distance ratio to not be able to see the differences between 1080p and 720p, and that's not just opinion, but scientific fact.

It's embarrassing that neither IGN nor Polygon could even tell it was running in 720p. Seriously, GAF > Gaming journalism every time.



And what games are you buying at launch with these next gen consoles?

right now i passed the ps4..theres no games..that i would play....i was interested in kz...but dont seem to be this good ...knack is a total fail...and resogun fun for how much it can be is too indie to spend 400 euro for..i think the smartest thing is to way 6 or 8 months...for the ps4...i upgraded my pc rig 1 month ago (prodigy m,asus maximus gene vi,i7 4770k 16gb vengeance pro ,2x 256gbsamsung 840 pro and two evga 660ti and im super happy)
so ill play multiplat on the pc
now im waiting the review of the xb1 games..if they fail too....ill pass both consoles for 1 year
but honestly the xb1 lineup looked better from the start than what the ps4 had....not putting in count the ui and ps4 os...day one limits will see how ms fail this time in some days

 

[Loakum]

This has really been an interesting launch for next gen gaming....

 

[Thrakier]

So polygon weren't lying when they said they didn't see a difference.

Of course not, they never where, no matter the factual resolution. That is the problem here at hand. It's incompetence.

 

[nib95]

are you f'ing kidding me!?

do you need me to translate Gies' tweet??...he isnt talking CBoat here...looks like plain English to me...but if you need help im here for you...

He's just straight up trolling us all now lol. Makes sense, we do ridicule him enough (with good reason mind, he brings it on himself).

 

[IvorB]

Oh my god! Really? They had the switch at 720p instead of 1080p by mistake?!?!? What they hell are they doing up there? Oh lawd...

 

[Marvel]

This has really been an interesting launch for next gen gaming....

It certainly has.

 

[xBuTcHeRx]

I give this much FUX about this game..... ZERO. I played it for campaign then took it back to REDBOX like a smart person should do. RENT the freaking game,

 

[onanie]

Almost gone unnoticed, if it weren't for the meddling types darn it.

 

[Loakum]

I'm not gonna jump into the fray about the reviews, because the statements are just so conaluted...I just can't .....anyway, what's the deal with Infinity Ward/Activision sending out retail copies of COD Ghosts to the press and state as fact "The PS4 version mp and sp runs at native 1080p, but in reality, the sp is 720p......but then has to release a "resolution patch" at launch, to put 1080p into a game, that suppose to already be native 1080p. After all the review videos showing 720p sp already went viral, via the press. *whew* Who does that? How could something like this happen?

 

[TheKayle]

i just know that most of the "is clearly visible the difference"...should eat their crow asap

 

[Gemüsepizza]

i just know that most of the "is clearly visible the difference"...should eat their crow asap

Dude, the difference *is* clearly visible. It was just harder to notice because of the high compression of those videos. And in the end we did notice it. Those journalists should also have noticed it, but they are just incompetent and Gies is simply lying.

Here are two uncompressed screenshots someone from her made:

http://abload.de/img/720pupscaledniz2l.png

http://abload.de/img/1080pnativerfxn0.png

If you can't notice a difference, you should go see a doctor.

 

[Roland1979]

I too don't play CoD but "i don't play this" or "play a good game" is no excuse for what they have done. Making people need a upgrade in order to play a certain resolution is a dangerous step for gaming. Plus it bypasses or ignores people that don't have access to internet, which was a lot of fuss about before this. The quality of CoD is irrelevant to this thread.

 

[hooijdonk17]

For. Fuck's. Sake.

 

[Loakum]

i just know that most of the "is clearly visible the difference"...should eat their crow asap

honestly, scoring any "forum talking points" is really minor, in the scheme of things. The bigger fish is how could a MAJOR developer, Infinity Ward/Activision, could make such a massive blunder like this?