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famousmortimer: Xbox One OS and Xbox Live issues bouncing about as we approach launch

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H

Hindle

Banned
I'd be genuinely surprised if the problems are as bad as what's being made out. I still expect issues though, there is with any new console.
 
N

nampad

Member
famousmortimer has an incredible track record on leaks so I don't want to doubt him.

It just seems weird that of all companies to fuck up the OS side of things, Microsoft is the one. They are a software company and their 360 OS worked so well.
The change from an OS VoIP API to a game specific on os mindboggling. How does that make sense to move parties around?

Well, Sony does not have all their ducks in a row (suspend mode, HDCP,...) and some problems with a launch are to be expected, but if this is true than Microsoft is really fucked.
The word of mouth will be horrible and it is one of the most important aspects to drive sales.

The games are looking worse because of the weaker hardware and even their proudly heralded revolutionary user experience will be bad. All that for a higher price.
Additionally many people are still wary of them after the DRM and NSA stuff.

They should be happy that Sony fucked up the launch lineup and didn't move this years PS3 projects to the PS4 like them. They would have been crushed.
 
E

ElTorro

I wanted to dominate the living room. Then I took an ESRAM in the knee.
The first console launch [1] in the age of social media is incredibly entertaining.

[1] Yes, Wii U am cry
 
I

Into

Member
Krilekk said:
Major and Penello tried to answer questions only to be thrown shit at. The best choice of action is just to let GAF be GAF (nobody will buy Kinect, Wii U is the greatest thing ever, nobody will buy Kinect again) and answer on launch day. The system will work flawless as advertised and slowly people will realize they've been played hard by the marketing shills they call insiders. GAF is so easy to manipulate, of course marketing on both sides uses that. Isn't it strangely convenient that for every good MS news there is a new bomb hanging over X1? I have never experienced such a campaign to desperately get people to not buy a console. I mean I'm getting an X1 but why should I care what you get?

And if you look closely you see the same BS in every one of the so called insiders posts. Things are incredibad for X1 ... But they might just work it out in time. Resolution is 720p but they are working on it. ESRAM has issues bzt they might make it work. There are yield issues but that could change come launch. The OS and Xbox Live are having huge issues but they have some time left. It's their insurance. To keep their account alive. It's moronic. You either have info and stand behind it with your credibility or you don't. The way it currently works here some can spread the most ridiculous BS and get away with it.

"I heard PS4 will be delayed to 2014 because the system runs too hot with release code and constantly shuts down. Sony is hard at work finding a solution, but they might still make it. Doesn't look good though."

See how that works? If you see the infamous but, be sceptical.
Click to expand...


"So called insiders"? CboaT has been a very reliable insider for years. You sound like you desperately do not want any of this to be true, the mods and most people on this site have full faith in him, for a very good reason, he has come through 98% of the time.

And no i dont see how it works, why would anyone believe you? Are you seriously putting yourself at the same level as CboaT here? Because that is what you seem to be trying to do. Why would people believe Major or Penello, both are paid to say certain things, no different than Shu or Boyes, or Bill Trinen and Reggie?

The exact same responses came a year ago when EDGE broke the story of always online, DRM and anti used games, people did not want to believe any of it, "this isent true!" and it turned out to be 100% true, every part of it.

Some people have earned our trust, you simply sound like you do not want any of this to be true.
 
S

SwiftDeath

Member
Shrewder said:
I'd say(for anyone)...take the approach to hold on loosely to either scenario. Good, or Bad, It is what it is. I think chatting about all of these situations is fine. Questioning these situations are fine.

Many things are still very open and I think the discussion is great. We still have a short window of time, for things to be leaked or reported, until the systems are launched. I see the real big test is when users go to use the product and services. Things may or may not get real crazy at that time.

If things are as crazy as it seems, and things are seriously busted at release, then the Xbox chain of command would probably get hit even harder for their silence while the community was trying to understand situations before the product launch.
Click to expand...

Yep I would never assume that the issues will be rampant at launch. MS may fix it by then but it's worth discussing and debating and looking at all present info

Amir0x said:
famousmortimer source, any back up sources? Not that I don't trust him, just wondering if it blew up even further since his comment...

I feel like I can't leave NeoGAF for even ten minutes without some crazy news breaking :(
Click to expand...

Ami this may be of use to you

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=87786946#post87786946
 
F

Faustek

Member
TAJ said:
What makes you so sure that GTAIV or Skyrim will run on Steam OS?
Click to expand...

But Sir/Madam! Haven't you heard? Folks at Valve fart magic and eat Unicorns! They can do whatever they please as long as they set their mind to it!

Believe in Magic! Believe in Valve!

Beta tested By a myriad of Valve engineers!
 
F

Frodo

Member
Praha said:
I've seen Xbox One OS twice. I haven't seen Xbox Live in action (aside from basic functionality of the dashboard), but I have to say that all of this isn't surprising.

A Microsoft rep said to me at an Xbox One media briefing a few months back that engineers will be working on the dashboard and Xbox Live right up until the minute the console launches. He said it in a very light, casual way, like as if to say, "Oh man, our engineers will be working on this beast right up until launch! How awesome is that!?" I didn't know how to respond. But he only said it after the person demoing the OS started having issues with it.

Again, this isn't surprising.

It's all a work in progress right up until it launches. And both consoles will be getting very large updates at launch.

This seems very trivial in the scheme of things. I'm sure MS will fix it.
Click to expand...


I would also wait before making all these knee-jerk statements people have been doing, as much probably both consoles will experience a problem or another during launch as it always happens. But it seems that every single bad news for MS doesn't need confirmation before being accepted as a fact by a few people here.
 
C

Corto

Member
Amir0x said:
famousmortimer source, any back up sources? Not that I don't trust him, just wondering if it blew up even further since his comment...

I feel like I can't leave NeoGAF for even ten minutes without some crazy news breaking :(
Click to expand...

This weekend I was glued to my iPhone trying to keep up with this shenanigans. I wasn't here at that time, but was Xbox360/PS3/Wii launch this crazy with leaks and counter-leaks?
 
M

Moonstone

Member
Into said:
"So called insiders"? CboaT has been a very reliable insider for years. You sound like you desperately do not want any of this to be true, the mods and most people on this site have full faith in him, for a very good reason, he has come through 98% of the time.

And no i dont see how it works, why would anyone believe you? Are you seriously putting yourself at the same level as CboaT here?
Click to expand...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/search.php?searchid=8106445
 
H

Hindle

Banned
Im always sceptical of so called insiders who only give vague tweets saying they know something. If you know what's happening, come out with the full information.
 
I

IchigoSharingan

Member
Frodo said:
I would also wait before making all these knee-jerk statements people have been doing, as much probably both consoles will experience a problem or another during launch as it always happens. But it seems that every single bad news for MS doesn't need confirmation before being accepted as a fact by a few people here.
Click to expand...

Well why the fuck not? Some Gaffers have earned their rep by now and they are trustworthy.
 
G

Garrett 2U

Member
SwiftDeath said:
So does anyone really think mort's leak is not true?

He has posted follow up snippets of it in this thread and by Gaf's rules for leaking must have provided the mods with at least two sources or face instant ban

I may or may not be stating this to try and get a comment from a passing mod, please don't hurt me MUST FINISH SUMMARY
Click to expand...
I can believe the quoted leak about VOIP issues.
But when he takes that leak, and uses it to reinforce an anonymous rumor that the Xbone OS is in shambles... that is sketchy.
Of course he has the right to post his own hypothesis or opinions on his own blog, but people here are quoting that as fact and part of the leak.

Hell, the title of his leak is "Xbox One OS and Xbox Live issues bouncing"...
His two quoted sources only mention VOIP and toast notification issues.
One of which mentions that the issues might be fixed by launch, another says "months"...
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
crazepharmacist

crazepharmacist

Member
Speedy Blue Dude said:
1. Isn't Gamestop's return policy for opened new products that you can only return it if it isn't open? Not really an option if I decide to play my Xbox One for a few days, and it's as bad as it seemed and decide I'd rather own it at a later date.

2. I would agree with you. I'm honestly on the verge of just canceling the Xbox One, only getting the PS4 in November and holding off on the Xbox One until I see that it's fine and dandy.

3. Yeah, mostly hope. I'm not sure how good and stable the Dashboard OS is right now, hell it might still be a bloody mess, and 3 weeks of work might not help. Thankfully we do still have 3 weeks for confirmation to be made, and that's enough time to wait and watch on the system before deciding to purchase now or later.
Click to expand...

Costco has lifetime return policy on consoles. I'd never buy one anywhere else.
 
T

TAJ

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Corto said:
This weekend I was glued to my iPhone trying to keep up with this shenanigans. I wasn't here at that time, but was Xbox360/PS3/Wii launch this crazy with leaks and counter-leaks?
Click to expand...

It was even crazier. Back then, you could get banned just for stating facts about Wii. That's how in denial people were.
 
C

CLEEK

Member
nampad said:
famousmortimer has an incredible track record on leaks so I don't want to doubt him.

It just seems weird that of all companies to fuck up the OS side of things, Microsoft is the one. They are a software company and their 360 OS worked so well.
The change from an OS VoIP API to a game specific on os mindboggling. How does that make sense to move parties around?
Click to expand...

Microsoft's history is littered with successes and massive fuck ups. They've produced amazing OS like XP and 7, but also utter turds like Windows ME and 8.

The 360 and One have clearly been designed by different people with different agendas and visions. The 360 was a networked games console, that over time grew into a multi purpose entertainment device. The One was designed from the start to be a Kinect controlled, TV integrated, targeted ad pushing, entertainment device that also plays games. There would be a reason somewhere, made by someone, for changing how the OS works. But you can bet the decision wasn't made as it made the One a better games console.
 
M

mocoworm

Member
Krilekk said:
GAF is so easy to manipulate, of course marketing on both sides uses that. Isn't it strangely convenient that for every good MS news there is a new bomb hanging over X1? I have never experienced such a campaign to desperately get people to not buy a console. I mean I'm getting an X1 but why should I care what you get?

And if you look closely you see the same BS in every one of the so called insiders posts. Things are incredibad for X1 ... But they might just work it out in time. Resolution is 720p but they are working on it. ESRAM has issues bzt they might make it work. There are yield issues but that could change come launch. The OS and Xbox Live are having huge issues but they have some time left. It's their insurance. To keep their account alive. It's moronic. You either have info and stand behind it with your credibility or you don't. The way it currently works here some can spread the most ridiculous BS and get away with it.

"I heard PS4 will be delayed to 2014 because the system runs too hot with release code and constantly shuts down. Sony is hard at work finding a solution, but they might still make it. Doesn't look good though."

See how that works? If you see the infamous but, be sceptical.
Click to expand...

Brilliant post. Nailed it.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
Krilekk said:
Major and Penello tried to answer questions only to be thrown shit at. The best choice of action is just to let GAF be GAF (nobody will buy Kinect, Wii U is the greatest thing ever, nobody will buy Kinect again) and answer on launch day. The system will work flawless as advertised and slowly people will realize they've been played hard by the marketing shills they call insiders. GAF is so easy to manipulate, of course marketing on both sides uses that. Isn't it strangely convenient that for every good MS news there is a new bomb hanging over X1? I have never experienced such a campaign to desperately get people to not buy a console. I mean I'm getting an X1 but why should I care what you get?

And if you look closely you see the same BS in every one of the so called insiders posts. Things are incredibad for X1 ... But they might just work it out in time. Resolution is 720p but they are working on it. ESRAM has issues bzt they might make it work. There are yield issues but that could change come launch. The OS and Xbox Live are having huge issues but they have some time left. It's their insurance. To keep their account alive. It's moronic. You either have info and stand behind it with your credibility or you don't. The way it currently works here some can spread the most ridiculous BS and get away with it.

"I heard PS4 will be delayed to 2014 because the system runs too hot with release code and constantly shuts down. Sony is hard at work finding a solution, but they might still make it. Doesn't look good though."

See how that works? If you see the infamous but, be sceptical.
Click to expand...

except that mortimer waited until he had a couple of sources to back up his story. That makes it less than idle speculation, and he is a reliable poster.

Do you actually have any source saying anything different, or is it just assumption that a company will not have any issues at launch?
 
B

Bundy

Banned
something fishy said:
strange for such a mature and stable service to hit these problems but it sounds like they have changed them quite significantly.
Click to expand...
Well:
On 360, the OS handles all of the party and chat functionality. All you do is hook up the XBL VOiP OS API into your game, and it does most of the work for you. With it results in is a shared experience across multiple entertainment. If you’re watching movies or playing games, you can do it together. However, this system is entirely different on Xbox One. So, lets say me, you, and Thuway have xbox one’s that are online. We are signed in our profiles. Sitting at the home screen, we are considered to be in a “Xbox Party” on the server. There are no more ‘party leaders’. With that said if any one of us decide to start a game, the party is shifted over to that game’s party system. Each game now has their custom written VOIP.”
Click to expand...
And:
“The system OS and network integration was written by a group of people who do not play games. They don’t understand why things were set up in the ways they were designed by J Allard back in ’05.”
Click to expand...
 
S

SwiftDeath

Member
Vitor711 said:
F*cking beautiful post. Missed a bunch of that info despite being fairly caught up on things so thank you.

*Slow Clap*
Click to expand...

Thanks been missing sleep trying to summarize things effectively

Always looking to add anything noteworthy to the summary people

If I'm missing anything on either system let me know
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
mocoworm said:
Brilliant post. Nailed it.
Click to expand...

It's not actually brilliant because that would be the only way anyone could leak launch console news - every bad bit of information would by default be being "worked on", else the company in question wouldn't just have a problem, they'd also be incompetent. It's not "insurance", it's a fact. ESRam is an issue, it will eventually be less of an issue. If there are OS problems now, of course eventually they're going to be ironed out.

That's just stating the obvious. Which needs to be done around here and elsewhere since sometimes people overreact.
 
P

p3tran

Banned
Corto said:
This weekend I was glued to my iPhone trying to keep up with this shenanigans. I wasn't here at that time, but was Xbox360/PS3/Wii launch this crazy with leaks and counter-leaks?
Click to expand...
yes it was. back in november 2005, i almost believed myself when driving back home that I was returning having just purchased an "XBOX ONE POINT FIVE"
then I plugged it in and it was awesome.

problem is usually you dont anticipate where the problem will hit you from..

in 360's case, it wasnt that it had no power etc as was rumored. the problem with 360's was that if you wanted to play every day, you'd have to buy a new console once a month to keep at it.

so, again I will see first hand what these new consoles achieve and what they fail.

Bring on the launch dates you stupid greedy motherfucking multinationals!
 
S

something fishy

Member
the problem we have now is circular rumour mongering, rab could have been told about the stuff hear and be tweeting it and we take it as further confirmation.

I've a feeling this is api level if they really have done it this way and if so , could it not lead to some games having features limited until it's patched?
 
K

kinggroin

Banned
Krilekk said:
Major and Penello tried to answer questions only to be thrown shit at. The best choice of action is just to let GAF be GAF (nobody will buy Kinect, Wii U is the greatest thing ever, nobody will buy Kinect again) and answer on launch day. The system will work flawless as advertised and slowly people will realize they've been played hard by the marketing shills they call insiders. GAF is so easy to manipulate, of course marketing on both sides uses that. Isn't it strangely convenient that for every good MS news there is a new bomb hanging over X1? I have never experienced such a campaign to desperately get people to not buy a console. I mean I'm getting an X1 but why should I care what you get?

And if you look closely you see the same BS in every one of the so called insiders posts. Things are incredibad for X1 ... But they might just work it out in time. Resolution is 720p but they are working on it. ESRAM has issues bzt they might make it work. There are yield issues but that could change come launch. The OS and Xbox Live are having huge issues but they have some time left. It's their insurance. To keep their account alive. It's moronic. You either have info and stand behind it with your credibility or you don't. The way it currently works here some can spread the most ridiculous BS and get away with it.

"I heard PS4 will be delayed to 2014 because the system runs too hot with release code and constantly shuts down. Sony is hard at work finding a solution, but they might still make it. Doesn't look good though."

See how that works? If you see the infamous but, be sceptical.
Click to expand...


I'm going to chalk it up to your junior status and assumed inexperience with this forum, but there is no GAF where the Wii U is the best thing ever.
 
L

LiquidSolid

Member
famousmortimer said:
I haven't read a single post in this thread yet (I will read every single one, eventually... trust me). But I'm getting a ton of tweets and I'm sure you guys have questions and I'm still talking to my contact and I wanted to share this exchange.



Him: I can explain why this would be a challenge to fix, if you need some clarification.

Me: Yes, please!

Him: Alright, the problem stems from the fact that it's both launching on the 22nd, and each team has had to write their system to write their party system to handle party hand-offs from the OS side. So if you change the way the way the system handles matchmaking or parties or voice chat in parties or voice chat in games, you run the risk of breaking every released game's individual API, because you have to account for how each individual game's XBL functionality is written. However, the way it is now is a huge cluster mess of probs.

So, in a weird way, they can't fix it on the OS side. What you could do is you could write an all encompassing XBL-API and hand it to each dev. But then you'd have to make that the standard, the OS side would have to be patched to recognize only api handshakes from the game to the OS with that particular code. Meaning some games would still end up breaking, but it'd be fewer. And it'd be more future proof.

No word on what MS is going to do about it though, and with the trouble they are having pushing online clients to Thunderhead to begin with.

They have bigger fish to fry if they want their next 6-months of titles to launch on time.
Click to expand...

I slept through the thread being created and it's moving so fast it's hard to keep up but what's with this part? Microsoft's having trouble convincing third parties to use their dedicated servers? Not that surprising, I guess, considering Infinity Ward said at first that they were sticking with P2P before they pulled a 180.
 
M

Miles Quaritch

Member
Sigh. J.Allard....where for art thou??? Return and save us from this misery.

Biggest mistake MS ever made in letting him and Bach leave. I don't believe it's unfair to say their departure destroyed the division and we're only really seeing the effect of that now ...
 
S

SwiftDeath

Member
Miles Quaritch said:
Sigh. J.Allard....where for art thou??? Return and save us from this misery.

Biggest mistake MS ever made in letting him and Bach leave. I don't believe it's unfair to say their departure destroyed the division and we're only really seeing the effect of that now ...
Click to expand...

My belief too buddy

I miss allard which I really shouldn't but he was a good one
 
C

CLEEK

Member
LiquidSolid said:
I slept through the thread being created and it's moving so fast it's hard to keep up but what's with this part? Microsoft's having trouble convincing third parties to use their dedicated servers? Not that surprising, I guess, considering Infinity Ward said at first that they were sticking with P2P before they pulled a 180.
Click to expand...

I'd imagine thats clients as in clients and servers. Trouble getting clients (Xbones) talking to the servers.
 
P

Paz

Member
Amir0x said:
famousmortimer source, any back up sources? Not that I don't trust him, just wondering if it blew up even further since his comment...

I feel like I can't leave NeoGAF for even ten minutes without some crazy news breaking :(
Click to expand...

More like you can't leave GAF without people blowing up over ANYTHING, although there have been a number of legitimate bombs.

My simple comment yesterday stating that some speculative comments didn't match my experience was blown up to a front page N4G article and re-published/tweeted around the internet, things are getting crazily out of control in the lead up to the next gen console launches.
 
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