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[ALLseeingEYE]

That's meaningless statement - Nintendo can hit 1080p on Wii U gpu since it comes down to design choices.

You aren't getting PS4 quality games using whole 1,8TF for 1080p on Scorpio at native 4k at the same frame rates since that would need over 7TFlops.
What you will be getting at native 4k resolution is games which already hit 1080p on xbox one.

How about we look at this all from a slightly different angle.

We all know what GPU is essentially inside a PS4 Pro, a downclocked RX 480. This is essentially a GTX 970, with great async compute support, and improved 4k abilities. A great 1080p 60FPS card, and good 1440p card, but a fairly weak, not all that viable native 4k solution.

Now, what might be in the Scorpio when it launches? If I was a guessing man, I'd say, it's going to essentially be the RX 490, 490X, or the Radeon Vega equivalent of what a hypothetical RX 490 would have been. It could possibly even higher. I'd guess, we'll see it land in power, somewhere close to a Radeon Fury or Fury X, likely slightly downclocked due to the small form factor. Add in 12GB of GDDR5, and a bit of a question mark when it comes to the CPU, and what do we get?

We get what will likely be a fairly significant upgrade from the PS4 Pro, a very capable 4k 30+ fps machine that can also boast great image quality, and potentially (this will be up to the developer), significantly better 4K texture quality.


Whether or not the Scorpio will be able to boast PS4-level visuals at 4k is somewhat moot, MS isn't porting Sony first party titles. The question is whether it will be able to boast Xbox One quality titles, with improved image quality at 4k. Many 1st and 3rd party games already run at native 1080p on X1, and with a 4.5x GPU upgrade, those will all likely render quite nicely at 4k 30 on Scorprio.

At the end of the day, it will very very interesting to see how devs utilize the extra power. I hope we see some awesome things there. I honestly hope most devs don't go for straight 4k. I would love to see 60fps prioritized with greater visual quality, and a still decent 1440p or 4k checkboard technique utilized.

I see... you already made your mind for disappointment.

Lol, Why would I be disappointed if I know essentially what I'm getting myself into, and am already very impressed with the quality the system will likely have?

Like, do you have some insider info on Scorprio that none of us here have? We both know you don't. None of us really know how things will play out, all we know is Scorpio will likely be a fairly significant hardware improvement over the PS4 Pro, and I hope devs use that is smart ways. I think MS seems to be well on the right track for Scorpio with all of their recent PC work, and 3rd parties are already in a great spot due to the rise in PC support. I think gamers are in for a treat in the coming years.

 

[demogorgon]

Ok, so just so this is clear, via approximation, you're still getting a frame buffer with 4K worth of pixels, yes ?

Why do people keep calling it upscaling then ? Upscaling is stretching something from a lower resolution to a higher. With CB, you're still rendering the native amount of 4K pixels. The accuracy might not be 1 : 1 to native 4K, but at least you won't have any up-scaling artifacts.

Either way, IQ will be much better than 1080p, game is shaping up to look like a graphical showcase for Pro.

I think this is the popular misconception. upscaling is not stretching. stretching would be using les pixels but making them bigger. TVs always output the correct about of pixels. upscaling is where the upscaler (sometimes done on the TV itself sometimes on the input side) guesses the missing pixels using an algorithm. not all upscalers are created equal. thats why some budget TVs may not look as good as better ones. samsung has an excellent upscaler for their TVs. a company like westinghouse or insignia won't.

it's honestly pretty debatable if an upscaled 1440p game on a 4k TV would look better then a native 1080p game on a 1080p TV. I have multiple samsung 4k TVs so i watch a lot of upscaled content. and play a lot of upscaled games as i have a PS4 and XB1 hooked into one of them as my gaming TV.

 

[EvB]

it's honestly pretty debatable if an upscaled 1440p game on a 4k TV would look better then a native 1080p game on a 1080p TV. I have multiple samsung 4k TVs so i watch a lot of upscaled content. and play a lot of upscaled games as i have a PS4 and XB1 hooked into one of them as my gaming TV.

People have really changed their tune of Kate, because the desirable reason to want a 1080p output on your game was to avoid upscaling.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

So basically 4K.

 

[Raonak]

Nice, final fantasy looks great a 1800c, keen to check this out

 

[EvB]

So basically 4K.

I turn on motion+ on my TV, it's basically 60fps

 

[ALLseeingEYE]

I think this is the popular misconception. upscaling is not stretching. stretching would be using les pixels but making them bigger. TVs always output the correct about of pixels. upscaling is where the upscaler (sometimes done on the TV itself sometimes on the input side) guesses the missing pixels using an algorithm. not all upscalers are created equal. thats why some budget TVs may not look as good as better ones. samsung has an excellent upscaler for their TVs. a company like westinghouse or insignia won't.

it's honestly pretty debatable if an upscaled 1440p game on a 4k TV would look better then a native 1080p game on a 1080p TV. I have multiple samsung 4k TVs so i watch a lot of upscaled content. and play a lot of upscaled games as i have a PS4 and XB1 hooked into one of them as my gaming TV.

If it's the game itself that is doing the render scaling, then 1440p on a 4k monitor is a significant improvement over 1080p on a 1080p TV. I would actually recommend turning off all upscaling, unless your TV or the game itself offers a great solution there.

For example, I have a 4k monitor that looks terrible when I set the OS or game to run at 1440p, as the monitor upscaling is awful, even from 1440p. On the other hard, setting my PS to 4k, and scaling the resolution to 1440p from the game's internal resolution scaling has excellent results.

 

[EvB]

If it's the game itself that is doing the render scaling, then 1440p on a 4k monitor is a significant improvement over 1080p on a 1080p TV. I would actually recommend turning off all upscaling, unless your TV or the game itself offers a great solution there.

For example, I have a 4k monitor that looks terrible when I set the OS or game to run at 1440p, as the monitor upscaling is awful, even from 1440p. On the other hard, setting my PS to 4k, and scaling the resolution to 1440p from the game's internal resolution scaling has excellent results.

Why not let your GPU do the scaling?

 

[Koobion]

Very impressed with the tech from this game. I wasn't expecting 4k checkerboard. Interested in seeing if there are any visual options available.

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

So basically 4K.

Sure, if basically means not actually.

It's like saying you're basically graduated when you have 50 credit hours left in your 120 credit hour diploma.

That's not how percentages work, that's not how statistics work.

 

[Lady Gaia]

traditional upscaling just multiplies the pizels and uses an algorithm to guess what the pixel should look like

temporal reconstruction borrows pixels from old frames

I might quibble with the term "multiplies" as applied to pixels, but you're doing okay up to this point.

checkerboard rending is a type of upscaling where pixels are still guessed using an algorithm it's just more effective then traditional upscaling was.

This is where you go off the rails. CBR borrows pixels from old frames where it can and fills in the gaps with an approximation based on neighboring pixels, so in that sense it's very much a temporal reconstruction technique.

As a best case it's identical to the target resolution, 2160p in Horizon's case. Worst case, it's more like upscaling but the source resolution is complicated because of the sparse rendering pattern. In terms of raw pixel count worst case would be ~1526p but with a far more pleasing quality because every pixel rendered maps 1:1 to a pixel onscreen, sidestepping the usual downside of non-integer scaling. The most typical case is a blend of these, with detail slightly softer only in areas in motion, which the eye can't track easily in any case and generally writes off as motion blur.

The worst artifacts of traditional software CBR, artifacts at object edges, are nicely mitigated by the ObjectID buffer in the PS4 Pro hardware. It's a nice trick, and so effective that even if you do have the capacity to render native 4K most developers would be sorely tempted to spend the extra horsepower on richer visuals in other respects instead.

 

[Chill Penguin]

So basically 4K.

Yes you will be seeing 4k as your output.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

Should have added ellipses

 

[Fafalada]

the difference is roughly 2x the quality level

If quality difference was roughly 2x(no idea how we quantify quality, but ok I'll go with it), noone would ever use the technique as standard upsampling gives you exactly that, but it's also considerably cheaper.

 

[ALLseeingEYE]

Why not let your GPU do the scaling?

To be honest, that's probably fine. The solution is likely just to turn off any upscaling if your monitor or TV's upscaling is poor.

 

[EvB]

It's a nice trick, and so effective that even if you do have the capacity to render native 4K most developers would be sorely tempted to spend the extra horsepower on richer visuals in other respects instead.

Yeah, when you see the comparisons that DF did with tomb raider you can really see how effective it is at reducing baggies, just as a native 4K is. I'm hoping that they do the same thing on Scorpio and then use the leftover grunt and memory to deal with using higher resolution textures, rather than the 1080p assets, which CBR still has enough of an improvement over 1080p to be embarrassed by.

 

[EvB]

To be honest, that's probably fine. The solution is likely just to turn off any upscaling if your monitor or TV's upscaling is poor.

That's what I prefer to do, especially with a 16:10 monitor, just render it 1:1 but with a smaller viewing area.

 

[dogen]

it's just another form of upscaling

traditional upscaling just multiplies the pizels and uses an algorithm to guess what the pixel should look like

temporal reconstruction borrows pixels from old frames

checkerboard rending is a type of upscaling where pixels are still guessed using an algorithm it's just more effective then traditional upscaling was.



in short all the "non native" techniques still display 4k but not all the pixels are rendered. it's not gonna look as good as native 4k. doesn't mean it looks bad but no matter what you still loose image quality. the less pixels that are "guessed" the better the quality will be. ideally you'd want native where every pixel is rendered and none are guessed.

It's actually funny because regardless of the technique we've seen people say that 900p upscaled looks "blurry as shit" with the upscaler guessing about 633k pixels. checkboard rending a 1440p res upscaled is guessing about 6million pixels. it's not gonna look clean regardless.

Only some pixels are guessed. CB is a form of temporal reconstruction that you mentioned.

 

[demogorgon]

People have really changed their tune of Kate, because the desirable reason to want a 1080p output on your game was to avoid upscaling.

My tuned never changed lol. personally i play all my games upscaled to 4k because the TV upscales them. and I think personally they look better then 1080p native did on my 1080p sets. I just said it's debatable.

Obviously I'd prefer native or the closer the better. it's why i skipped the pro and am holding out for the scorpio. well that and the lack of a UHD player. if the pro had a UHD player i would have gotten one but I'm good with my base PS4 for now.

 

[EvB]

My tuned never changed lol. personally i play all my games upscaled to 4k because the TV upscales them. and I think personally they look better then 1080p native did on my 1080p sets. I just said it's debatable.

Obviously I'd prefer native or the closer the better. it's why i skipped the pro and am holding out for the scorpio. well that and the lack of a UHD player. if the pro had a UHD player i would have gotten one but I'm good with my base PS4 for now.

It wasn't a criticism of anything you had said btw.
It's all super debatable , super subjective and super variable between setups.

 

[demogorgon]

If it's the game itself that is doing the render scaling, then 1440p on a 4k monitor is a significant improvement over 1080p on a 1080p TV. I would actually recommend turning off all upscaling, unless your TV or the game itself offers a great solution there.

For example, I have a 4k monitor that looks terrible when I set the OS or game to run at 1440p, as the monitor upscaling is awful, even from 1440p. On the other hard, setting my PS to 4k, and scaling the resolution to 1440p from the game's internal resolution scaling has excellent results.

I'd beg to differ. respectfully of course. non native is non native so somehting is filling in pixels not being rendered. obviously some techniques may produce better results but it's a case by case basis. I don't think you can say every game that "upscales itself" would look better then every game that allows the console or TV to do so

I might quibble with the term "multiplies" as applied to pixels, but you're doing okay up to this point.



This is where you go off the rails. CBR borrows pixels from old frames where it can and fills in the gaps with an approximation based on neighboring pixels, so in that sense it's very much a temporal reconstruction technique.

As a best case it's identical to the target resolution, 2160p in Horizon's case. Worst case, it's more like upscaling but the source resolution is complicated because of the sparse rendering pattern. In terms of raw pixel count worst case would be ~1526p but with a far more pleasing quality because every pixel rendered maps 1:1 to a pixel onscreen, sidestepping the usual downside of non-integer scaling. The most typical case is a blend of these, with detail slightly softer only in areas in motion, which the eye can't track easily in any case and generally writes off as motion blur.

The worst artifacts of traditional software CBR, artifacts at object edges, are nicely mitigated by the ObjectID buffer in the PS4 Pro hardware. It's a nice trick, and so effective that even if you do have the capacity to render native 4K most developers would be sorely tempted to spend the extra horsepower on richer visuals in other respects instead.

thanks for the clarification. so checkboard is closer to temporal reconstruction. similar to what we seen in quantum break or killzone give or take?
either way non native is non native it'll never look as good. but the less pixels that aren't rendered the better it'll look.

Only some pixels are guessed. CB is a form of temporal reconstruction that you mentioned.

which is still not rendered pixels hence loss of quality. IDK why they didn't just go all in for 4k for said screw it were gonna make only great looking native 1080p/60FPS games. I can't understand the Pro's market it's caught between a rock and a hard place. it's not good enough for 4k, but all the 4k mentions make it not look like a good 1080p device either. especially when the PS4 already had most it's games in 1080p. Seems like a small upgrade for what you get.

 

[demogorgon]

It wasn't a criticism of anything you had said btw.
It's all super debatable , super subjective and super variable between setups.

ah cool beans man

 

[adamsapple]

which is still not rendered pixels hence loss of quality. IDK why they didn't just go all in for 4k for said screw it were gonna make only great looking native 1080p/60FPS games. I can't understand the Pro's market it's caught between a rock and a hard place. it's not good enough for 4k, but all the 4k mentions make it not look like a good 1080p device either. especially when the PS4 already had most it's games in 1080p. Seems like a small upgrade for what you get.

No one's said Horizon is running at native 4K, but we've had more than enough sources like DF stating how CB 4K looks remarkably close to native 4K. You're bent on driving the "but it's not native 4K therefore it's irrelevant" aspect over and over again.

Even MS is encouraging devs to use CB with Scorpio, because it works. If you don't like it now, things aren't going to get that much better after Scorpio either.

 

[demogorgon]

No one's said Horizon is running at native 4K, but we've had more than enough sources like DF stating how CB 4K looks remarkably close to native 4K. You're bent on driving the "but it's not native 4K therefore it's irrelevant" aspect over and over again.

Even MS is encouraging devs to use CB with Scorpio, because it works.

I'm not bent on driving anything so I don't know where your angle is?

I'm happy it's getting good results. the more 4k or close to 4k content i can get for my TV the better. I'm just saying that the closer to looking like true 4k the better. But then again I'm not overly anal about things. I never had a problem playing 900p games on my XB1 or PS4 upscaled to 1080p then upscaled to 4k through my TV. It still looked good enough for me.

Personally I'm not a huge fan of DF. they seem to change their mind on stuff more often then my wife changes underwear

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

No one's said Horizon is running at native 4K, but we've had more than enough sources like DF stating how CB 4K looks remarkably close to native 4K. You're bent on driving the "but it's not native 4K therefore it's irrelevant" aspect over and over again.

Even MS is encouraging devs to use CB with Scorpio, because it works. If you don't like it now, things aren't going to get that much better after Scorpio either.

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

 

[dogen]

thanks for the clarification. so checkboard is closer to temporal reconstruction. similar to what we seen in quantum break or killzone give or take?
either way non native is non native it'll never look as good. but the less pixels that aren't rendered the better it'll look.

It's like killzone but improved with a checkerboard render pattern instead of every other horizontal line. Gives it more information for reconstruction and also improves the fallback scaling quality.

 

[ALLseeingEYE]

I'd beg to differ. respectfully of course. non native is non native so somehting is filling in pixels not being rendered. obviously some techniques may produce better results but it's a case by case basis. I don't think you can say every game that "upscales itself" would look better then every game that allows the console or TV to do so

I agree with that. Some games may have terrible internal scalers, so results likely vary. At the end of the day, it's all down to your individual setup, the game you are running, and your subjective opinion.

I'd say, play with your setup, but at the end of the day, 1440p should absolutely look better, even on a 4k screen, than 1080p on a native 1080p screen, so long as your can set it up properly, and your screen isn't forcing some terrible upscaling.

 

[Nabbis]

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

It's basically PS360 and fullhd all over again, 1440p is the new 720p. Marketing to confuse consumers.

 

[demogorgon]

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

that's still an option devs can use

It's like killzone but improved with a checkerboard render pattern instead of every other horizontal line. Gives it more information for reconstruction and also improves the fallback scaling quality.

yeah KZ just didn't look right. Great in screenshots but poor in motion. QB did a good job using it for sure. if they can run 1800p upscaled to 4k with similar results that QB got they would be impressive to me

 

[demogorgon]

I agree with that. Some games may have terrible internal scalers, so results likely vary. At the end of the day, it's all down to your individual setup, the game you are running, and your subjective opinion.

I'd say, play with your setup, but at the end of the day, 1440p should absolutely look better, even on a 4k screen, than 1080p on a native 1080p screen, so long as your can set it up properly, and your screen isn't forcing some terrible upscaling.

Funny enough I think it's all a bit overblown. even the whole 1080p/900p stuff from the launch models. it's like people always pick a minor difference and harp on it to suit their opinions. it's like the old N64/PS1 days lol

 

[III-V]

2160c and HDR.

Deal me in day 1.

 

[Wolfgang Jr]

There's pop-in literally 5 meters in front of the player.

 

[Liabe Brave]

I don't think such a definition is necessary because arguably no game wouldn't use non-native buffers or effects at some point. A game like Quake 1 has low res effects and shadows but it still renders/rasterizes at 4K.

Such a definition is absolutely necessary, because without it there's no way for you to justify your distinction between "true" rendering and CBR. That last sentence about Quake is meaningless unless you can tell me why the low-res effects and shadows don't count as rendering. And what are they then?

Checkerboard rendering is essentially a really good and somewhat complex post-processing upscaling technique using native elements and temporal frame trickery.

You are simply wrong here. CBR is most definitely not post-processing based solely on a pixel grid, like upscaling. Bear in mind that, though I'm not aware of any game that does this, the checkerboard reprojection step could precede the lighting pass for even more accuracy (but less savings).

it's just another form of upscaling

traditional upscaling just multiplies the pizels and uses an algorithm to guess what the pixel should look like

temporal reconstruction borrows pixels from old frames

checkerboard rending is a type of upscaling where pixels are still guessed using an algorithm it's just more effective then traditional upscaling was.

Scaling and CBR are completely different approaches, and have very, very little to do with each other. Scaling is altering frame size using algorithms that take only pixel values as input. CBR does not alter frame size, and uses algorithms that take polygon position and motion, time-offset shading results of that unique polygon, and pixel values as input.

They are very different in method, which is why they're so different in results.

I think this is the popular misconception. upscaling is not stretching. stretching would be using les pixels but making them bigger. TVs always output the correct about of pixels.

Actually, scaling in an even ratio does sometimes result in using fewer (effective) pixels. A 1080p signal on a 4K screen is 3840x2160, but can essentially have a quarter the real resolution, because all pixel values occur in 2x2 blocks.

It's like saying you're basically graduated when you have 50 credit hours left in your 120 credit hour diploma.

That's not how percentages work, that's not how statistics work.

That's exactly how percentages and statistics work: values can be more or less close to a metric. Your example only sounds silly because you deliberately chose a value very far from the target, and you added a binary term ("graduated") that has no number value. If instead I said, "Lebron basically scored 40 points last night", when he actually got 39, no one would say that was an abuse of the language.

The worst artifacts of traditional software CBR, artifacts at object edges, are nicely mitigated by the ObjectID buffer in the PS4 Pro hardware.

The ID buffer improves quality of all reprojected pixels, not just those at edges. And there are techniques to reduce sawtooth artifacts that don't rely on ID buffer at all (Rainbow 6 Siege does this on Xbox One, for example).

either way non native is non native it'll never look as good. but the less pixels that aren't rendered the better it'll look.

In fact, checkerboard 4K can look exactly as good as native 4K in some rare circumstances. This is not necessarily limited to still frames.

 

[jeffram]

[watches 4K Horizon footage from today]

I know some of you want to detract from the power of the PS4 pro because of what you expect from Scorpio, but Jesus people, pick your battles...

 

[Karish]

People debating this are weird. The checkerboard 4k games i have played on pro so far look incredible.

 

[JaggedSac]

Game is going to look damn good on a 4k tv.

 

[sector4]

Game is going to look damn good on a 4k tv.

^ This, can't wait to see it in motion at home.

 

[Space_nut]

There's pop-in literally 5 meters in front of the player.

I wish all that grass and foliage would fully interact with the character model like bending exactly where she touches and no clipping

 

[adamsapple]

Game is going to look damn good on a 4k tv.

Yes, all the shenanigans of this topic aside, game will look absolutely gorgeous. Here's hoping the gameplay/story/world side also delivers.

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

That's exactly how percentages and statistics work: values can be more or less close to a metric. Your example only sounds silly because you deliberately chose a value very far from the target, and you added a binary term ("graduated") that has no number value. If instead I said, "Lebron basically scored 40 points last night", when he actually got 39, no one would say that was an abuse of the language.

Graduation is very clearly defined as a numerical value, what sort of lewd argument is this?

You complete 120 credit hours satisfactorily, you get your diploma.

Seriously, why would you even try to dismiss that?

 

[Liabe Brave]

Graduation is very clearly defined as a numerical value, what sort of lewd argument is this?

You complete 120 credit hours satisfactorily, you get your diploma.

Seriously, why would you even try to dismiss that?

Because it's not true. "Graduated" is a description of a status. That status can be obtained with a different number of credit hours depending on school, major, and other factors. Your 120 hours is very common, and modal, but not exclusive.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

Such a definition is absolutely necessary, because without it there's no way for you to justify your distinction between "true" rendering and CBR. That last sentence about Quake is meaningless unless you can tell me why the low-res effects and shadows don't count as rendering. And what are they then?

They do count as "rendering," which is why native/non-native elements really have nothing to do with it. Is that not the point of my post? All games have sub-native elements to them.

I'm not really interested in playing definition games here. If your point is that there isn't an actual definitive difference between CBR and native rendering, then you've lost me. If you're trying to make a semantics point, you're just wasting everyone's time.

You are simply wrong here. CBR is most definitely not post-processing based solely on a pixel grid, like upscaling. Bear in mind that, though I'm not aware of any game that does this, the checkerboard reprojection step could precede the lighting pass for even more accuracy (but less savings).

When I said "upscaling," I was not referring to cheap upscalers in TV's, but rather the broader definition of "taking a resolution and making it bigger without actually sampling more pixels from the 3D render."

But then, of course, reading my post charitably would stop all of these super fun definition games.

 

[dogen]

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

I think developers will choose the method that gives the best results for their games.

 

[Liabe Brave]

They do count as "rendering," which is why native/non-native elements really have nothing to do with it. Is that not the point of my post? All games have sub-native elements to them.

If native/non-native elements have nothing to do with what counts as rendering, then what does distinguish rendering from checkerboard rendering? That's what I'm trying to get at.

When I said "upscaling," I was not referring to cheap upscalers in TV's, but rather the broader definition of "taking a resolution and making it bigger without actually sampling more pixels from the 3D render."

Okay. But generally CBR does not "take a resolution and make it bigger", by any method. The input and output of reprojection are the same number of pixels. In very fraught cases CBR does adjust its results via calculations much like scaling. However, note there were already tentative results to adjust. By contrast, upscaling generates values de novo to fill gaps.

 

[thelastword]

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

Yeah options and all are a bad thing amirite?

So strange for you make such a statement when many games are offering exactly what you are saying.....


UC4 1440p
Hitman 1440P
Dishonored 2 1440p
Firewatch 1440p
Farming Simulator 17 1440p
Lego Harry Potter Collection 1440p
Let it Die 1440p
Mafia III 1440p
TitanFall 2 1440p
The Witness 1440p

Soon Fallout 4

Hell, even Abzu is 1350P and RE7 1260P according to the devs as noted by our esteemed (Dark10x);

........and beyond that, several games with enhanced visuals at 1080p, like Paragon, The Division etc....

If the game can sport better or higher resolutions over 1440p, then it will or should do so....but then, OPTIONS and all............who needs them eh!

 

[Omnistalgic]

I've never seen so many people concerned about the details of something instead of the end result, dunno how you guys have stable relationships honestly.

Does checkerboarding looks comparable to 4K? Is it an improvement over 1080p? Do games like Horizon make use of these features in impressiveness fashion? Will Scorpio titles look even cleaner and better than this?

I don't see why answering yes to all those is causing so much dialog over nothing. The stuff looks good?? What the problem is?

 

[b00_thegh0st]

Both Microsoft and Sony are busy chasing a standard neither can truly meet in a market that is still in its infancy.

They could have focused on 1440p with supersampling to 1080p and gotten truly remarkable results, but nah.

Of course, my opinion and all.

The thing is, TV sets being sold right now are 4K ones, not 1440p.

Is there a reason for it stop someday? What's after 4K? TV manufacturers need to keep shoving new sets down our throats.

 

[Tripolygon]

Checkerboard rendering is essentially a really good and somewhat complex post-processing upscaling technique using native elements and temporal frame trickery. I don't consider that slander on the output, which undoubtedly looks very good from what I've seen.

This is exactly what it is not.

 

[Lady Gaia]

I'd beg to differ. respectfully of course. non native is non native so somehting is filling in pixels not being rendered.

Except in many cases it was rendered for a prior frame. It went through the whole traditional rendering pipeline and produced a high quality pixel that can simply be reused, even tracking motion in screen space.

thanks for the clarification. so checkboard is closer to temporal reconstruction. similar to what we seen in quantum break or killzone give or take?

It's several generations of sophistication beyond what Killzone did, and I'm not familiar enough with Quantum Break to comment.

Actually, the ID buffer improves quality of all reprojected pixels, not just those at edges. And there are techniques to reduce sawtooth artifacts that don't rely on ID buffer at all (Rainbow 6 Siege does this on Xbox One, for example).

My intent was to highlight one of the most commonly observed artifacts with prior CBR techniques, not to exhaustively explore the benefits of ObjectID. Filtering for sawtooth artifacts is a lot less selective and can impede reconstruction for high-frequency content. Better than nothing, to be sure, but each new refinement to the technique improves on the last.

 

[Tripolygon]

When I said "upscaling," I was not referring to cheap upscalers in TV's, but rather the broader definition of "taking a resolution and making it bigger without actually sampling more pixels from the 3D render."

But then, of course, reading my post charitably would stop all of these super fun definition games.

That is the opposite of what checkerboard rendering is doing. It is not taking a resolution and making it bigger, hence why it is not an upscale technique. You start with a resolution and end with the same resolution like traditional rendering, at no point do you change resolution.