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[Koala Driving a Ferrari]

I like Cerny i trust him

Me too; he's a fantastic engineer and I gain a lot of personal inspiration from his achievements throughout his career. It's also why I love the Xbox One X. It'll have put the fire into him. If I was a betting man (and I am), I'd wager that the PS5 is going to be an absolute monster and something special. He has been hilariously outdone by the team at Microsoft with the X. I don't think his next piece of hardware will make as many concessions as the PS4 Pro. I'm looking forward to the early surprise reveal of the PS5.

 

[MilkyJoe]

"we're making money anyway, so fuck it"

 

[nowhat]

He has been hilariously outdone by the team at Microsoft with the X. I don't think his next piece of hardware will make as many concessions as the PS4 Pro. I'm looking forward to the early surprise reveal of the PS5.

I think partially the advantage of X can be attributed to it appearing a year later - components do get cheaper over time (and yes, X is a bit more expensive too). But one thing I hope Sony/Cerny/whoever will be in charge of PS5 design takes note of is the cooling solution of X. That is so much better than what is in a Pro it's not really even comparable.

 

[grumpyGamer]

I think partially the advantage of X can be attributed to it appearing a year later - components do get cheaper over time (and yes, X is a bit more expensive too). But one thing I hope Sony/Cerny/whoever will be in charge of PS5 design takes note of is the cooling solution of X. That is so much better than what is in a Pro it's not really even comparable.

I do not believe the xbox one "beat" cerny on design and innovation.

They had to make a very good console with an accessible price point, and the original ps4 was just that, and the pro needed to expand on that and keep the "cheap" price.

While the xbox team, just lunched a stronger console, while the price point was not they´re problem, because it was supposed to be a hardcore game console, they elieneted half the fan base, while the ps4 pro did not do that.

 

[JimboJones]

How did the One X alienate half of it's fan base? It's literally the exact same concept as the Pro but an even higher spec.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Haha, so the X alienated half its fan base, but the pro, which his the EXACT SAME IDEA, didn't?

I'm just... Wow. That's fantastic stuff.

As for the Pro being "cheap" in price, it wasn't cheap. In fact pretty much everywhere was moaning because people wanted the Pro to release at the PS4 price, and the PS4 to drop to budget levels. People have totally unrealistic expectations. Granted, I do agree the X was released at too high a price point to make a good enough dent...

 

[Deto]

Haha, so the X alienated half its fan base, but the pro, which his the EXACT SAME IDEA, didn't?

I'm just... Wow. That's fantastic stuff.

As for the Pro being "cheap" in price, it wasn't cheap. In fact pretty much everywhere was moaning because people wanted the Pro to release at the PS4 price, and the PS4 to drop to budget levels. People have totally unrealistic expectations. Granted, I do agree the X was released at too high a price point to make a good enough dent...

2x PS4 = PS4 PRO

5x xone = XoneX

5x >> 2x

 

[thelastword]

So the PRO advantages are:

64 ROPS vs 32 on XBONEX
Vega Features: RPM
Custom Features: ID buffer, CB Hardware, Multiple Waverfronts (has a link to FP 16, in essence more computation per CU)
Bandwidth Saving Features: DCC-delta colour compression, PDA-primitive discard accelerator to save bandwidth because Cerny did not increase memory or bandwidth that much.

XBONEX Advantages are:
Higher clocked GPU with Less ROPS
More memory +3.5GB
Higher clocked CPU (This one is really not a differential as PS4 has more CPU resources available because of MS's 3 prong OS)


Before anyone asks, +3.5GB because PS4 PRO has 1GB of DDR3 that can be used for background apps and that frees up to 5.5GB on PRO for games.


The takeaway is this, the PS4/PRO is just a better designed system. To even further relieve bandwidth issues it also has the 20GB/s sub bus for CPU-GPU-MEM comms....outside of the DCC and PDA.....Lets be clear here, MS simply added more memory, got a VC to boost clock speeds to settle at 6TF, I think that was done more for marketting than engineering because there's not too much custom about XBONEX's design. I think the idea at MS was to deliver a console, where the math would lead to a marketting buzz of 4.2TF against 6TF, and there you go, but looking at the innards, we can see there's more on Sony's silicon and custom design.

If Sony launched in 2017, it may have very well given us 12GB for games and 4GB of DDR3 for background tasks/os, but they designed the PRO to be a $400.00 system in 2016 at a 2x mirror factor over base. Yet, an extra 4Gb of GDDR5 in 2016 would have costed and placed the price beyond $400.00....so hence no extra GDDR5.....vapor chamber or putting in hardware like UHD (and that was a good call not to put in UHD because it has no use in a console trying to keep the $400 pricepoint and it also has no pull in the market).


Cerny is a real engineer, he never lied. He said why he designed the PRO to do checkerboarding for AAA graphical showcases, he said some games will be native, he said there were other options like 1800p, 1970p etc..He said there are many rendering options available outside of custom rendering and CB. He spoke of geometry rendering, he spoke of better TAA solutions with CB etc...He said that you won't get 4k textures in TR or Primal, because of the ram and bandwidth....."Cerny says that these assets can cost "millions of dollars" and doesn't fit into the core PS4 Pro ethos - cheap, easy 4K support for developers."...That was the design philosophy, not to spit out "highest quality pixels", "the X is a true 4k machine, none of that CB and upscaling BS on PRO, you want that get an S or PRO type spiel"....As a matter of fact, Cerny made it clear that the 4.2TF console would NOT do 4k native on AAA graphical showcases, that's why there's CB hardware and other features to make up for that and still give a nice image on your 4k screen....

As a matter of fact Cerny informed/educated us, that it takes 8TF to give you 4k consistently, and looking at the number of Dynamic resolution games on XBONEX and 1800p games, it just shows he was right....Yet, MS tried to market the XBONEX as a true 4k machine....In the end by hardware design and by his words, Cerny came out on TOP in spades.........

 

[onQ123]

So the PRO advantages are:

64 ROPS vs 32 on XBONEX
Vega Features: RPM
Custom Features: ID buffer, CB Hardware, Multiple Waverfronts (has a link to FP 16, in essence more computation per CU)
Bandwidth Saving Features: DCC-delta colour compression, PDA-primitive discard accelerator to save bandwidth because Cerny did not increase memory or bandwidth that much.

XBONEX Advantages are:
Higher clocked GPU with Less ROPS
More memory +3.5GB
Higher clocked CPU (This one is really not a differential as PS4 has more CPU resources available because of MS's 3 prong OS)


Before anyone asks, +3.5GB because PS4 PRO has 1GB of DDR3 that can be used for background apps and that frees up to 5.5GB on PRO for games.


The takeaway is this, the PS4/PRO is just a better designed system. To even further relieve bandwidth issues it also has the 20GB/s sub bus for CPU-GPU-MEM comms....outside of the DCC and PDA.....Lets be clear here, MS simply added more memory, got a VC to boost clock speeds to settle at 6TF, I think that was done more for marketting than engineering because there's not too much custom about XBONEX's design. I think the idea at MS was to deliver a console, where the math would lead to a marketting buzz 4.2TF against 6TF and there you go, but looking at the innards we can see there's more on Sony's silicon and custom design.

If Sony launched in 2017, it may have very well given us 12GB for games and 4GB of DDR3 for background tasks/os, but they designed the PRO to be a $400.00 system in 2016 at a 2x mirror factor over base. Yet, an extra 4Gb of GDDR5 in 2016 would have costed and placed the price beyond $400.00....so hence no extra GDDR5.....vapor chamber or putting in hardware like UHD (and that was a good call not to put in UHD because it has no use in a console trying to keep the $400 pricepoint and it also has no pull in the market).


Cerny is a real engineer, he never lied. He said why he designed the PRO to do checkerboarding for AAA graphical showcases, he said some games will be native, he said there were other options like 1800p, 1970p etc..He said there are many rendering options available outside of custom rendering and CB. He spoke of geometry rendering, he spoke of better TAA solutions with CB etc...He said that you won't get 4k textures in TR or Primal, because of the ram and bandwidth....."
Cerny says that these assets can cost "millions of dollars" and doesn't fit into the core PS4 Pro ethos - cheap, easy 4K support for developers."...That was the design philosophy, not to spit out "highest quality pixels", "the X is a true 4k machine, none of that CB and upscaling BS on PRO, you want that get an S or PRO type spiel"....As a matter of fact, Cerny made it clear that the 4.2TF console would NOT do 4k native on AAA graphical showcases, that's why there's CB hardware and other features to make up for that and still give a nice image on your 4k screen....As a matter of fact Cerny informed/educated us, that it takes 8TF to give you 4k consistently, and looking at the number of Dynamic resolution games on XBONEX and 1800p games, it just shows he was right....Yet, MS tried to market the XBONEX as a true 4k machine....In the end by hardware design and by his words, Cerny came out on TOP in spades.........

No one believed me when I said it was 2 GPUs made into One with 64 ROPs & 8.4TF fp16

64 I guess

All signs point to PS4 Pro having 58.3 GP/s vs Xbox One X 37.5 GP/s from having 64 ROPs vs 32 ROPs then there is also the fact that Cerny said that the PS4 Pro " has some post-Polaris functionality that accelerates rendering of scenes with very small objects. ” which is most likely Primitive Shader

" In any case, however AMD is doing it, the updated geometry engines will also feature one more advancement, which AMD is calling the primitive shader. A new shader stage that runs in place of the usual vertex and geometry shader path, the primitive shader allows for the high speed discarding of hidden/unnecessary primitives. Along with improving the total primitive rate, discarding primitives is the next best way to improve overall geometry performance, especially as game geometry gets increasingly fine, and very small, overdrawn triangles risk choking the GPU."

However, as per our conversation with Mark Cerny in the run-up to the Pro's launch, what we actual get is an entirely unique design: more of a butterfly arrangement, in fact with the original PS4 GPU mirrored, in effect. What is curious is that the area taken up by the second array of CUs is actually larger than the first. A quick count reveals 40 CUs in total (vs the 36 total on AMD's Polaris) with four disabled so that chips with minor silicon defects can be saved from the production line and still used in final hardware.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2018-ps4-pro-and-xbox-one-x-processors-compared

 

[Armorian]

What's the point of more rops if you can't utilise them (not enough memory bw)? PS4 pro design is cheap and smart (2xPS4 gpu) but XOX is better in every way aside FP16 processing.

 

[onQ123]

What's the point of more rops if you can't utilise them (not enough memory bw)? PS4 pro design is cheap and smart (2xPS4 gpu) but XOX is better in every way aside FP16 processing.

If PS4 Pro stayed with 32ROPs at it's clockrate it could only move 29 GP/s & wouldn't benefit much when devs use fp16 because it would be ROPs limited.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Thelast word... I can't believe people like this exist. Seriously, you should work for Trump.

 

[Night.Ninja]

O onQ123 and thelastword are still here lol that's good

what happened to fp16

 

[onQ123]

O onQ123 and thelastword are still here lol that's good

what happened to fp16

What do you mean what happened to it? it's there devs just have to make the best of it.

 

[Armorian]

What do you mean what happened to it? it's there devs just have to make the best of it.

Too bad they're limited by X one standard in terms of async use in multiplaform games and standard PS4 for FP16. Realisticaly, FP16 can be used to the fullest only in exclusive games, problem is standard PS4 have to match their gfx features, most difference is put in resolution and half precision rendering can't help with that. Pro exclusive games would fix that but that won't happen.

 

[JimboJones]

Thelast word... I can't believe people like this exist. Seriously, you should work for Trump.

It's amazing to read, the amount of spin is making me dizzy.

 

[Nikana]

The spin. I'm so dizzy I'm gonna puke.

 

[Shin]

This thought process seems so backwards

PlayStation in a nutshell IMO and I hate it, we praise Cerny but WTF happen with Pro lacking super-sampling from day 1?
Now they just need to find someone that's better at x86, Cerny is an advisor and a game guy but he's not really visionary.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

That Elite controller excuse is Jim Ryan levels of bullshit

 

[Barakov]

It's amazing to read, the amount of spin is making me dizzy.

The spin. I'm so dizzy I'm gonna puke.

Haha. Even to a casual observer the XB1X is a much better upgrade on than the PS4Pro. The fact that Sony is releasing a supersampling mode for the Pro is telling.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

I do not believe the xbox one "beat" cerny on design and innovation.

They had to make a very good console with an accessible price point, and the original ps4 was just that, and the pro needed to expand on that and keep the "cheap" price.

While the xbox team, just lunched a stronger console, while the price point was not they´re problem, because it was supposed to be a hardcore game console, they elieneted half the fan base, while the ps4 pro did not do that.

Of course they beat Sony on design and innovation. The fact Sony took months to even release Boost Mode after the Pro came out and have now finally addressed supersampling is very telling. Also please explain how the Xbox One X alienates half the fan base but the Pro doesn't, is it because they actually provided a wider gap between the base and the improved model?

Amazing how hard it is for some to give props to Microsoft for anything.

 

[Alebrije]

XboxX looks a better mid term upgrade compared to PRO but recognize part of this is because original Xbone was a weak console. But being honest still find a better value to get a PRO because exclusive games.

It's ingesting to know how both companies approach the 4K topic, but basically at this moment is a marketeing tool than a real complete concept on AAA games. Guess next gen consoles will be truly 4K beast and really hope 4K 60 FPS games are a reality

XboneX is a great hardware btw the noise level, the compact concept and the graphic power it has , make the best console developed from MS since they jumped to the videogame industry.

 

[onQ123]

Haha. Even to a casual observer the XB1X is a much better upgrade on than the PS4Pro. The fact that Sony is releasing a supersampling mode for the Pro is telling.

That was coming anyway it was in the leaked documents that it would be added in a later update.

 

[RivalGT]

Very interesting design on the PRO by Sony, I wonder if any dev has actually made full use of the system since launch. If not, I hope some of the upcoming 1st party games make full use of the system. On the xbox X side the cooling tech used by MS is the most interesting thing about the system, they managed to have a CPU and GPU clocked higher, and keep all of it cool enough to not be a problem at all, and keep it all in a small box without the system being loud at all. Also how MS got rid of the ESRAM, and kept full comparability with the xbox one library is also very impressive. Its going to be very interested what Sony and MS come up with next, even though the systems this gen were a little similar, they still ended up being very different in their own unique ways.

 

[RafterXL]

Fuck an elite controller, at this point a DS4 with better battery life would be good enough

Said noone who has spent significant time with paddles.

 

[Bryank75]

For all the talk about how superior the One X is and how every outlet was saying it was a 'full step' vs Pro's half step... look at the games from Assassins Creed Origins to Monster Hunter and ask 'Is it worth the difference of a year in gaming and another 100 bucks on top?'

For me it's a definite 'no'.

 

[onQ123]

For all the talk about how superior the One X is and how every outlet was saying it was a 'full step' vs Pro's half step... look at the games from Assassins Creed Origins to Monster Hunter and ask 'Is it worth the difference of a year in gaming and another 100 bucks on top?'

For me it's a definite 'no'.

For people who got a Xbox One or didn't have a PS4 Pro & wanted a 4K console a year & $100 difference isn't that big of a deal. remember this isn't meant to be a mass market console. The only thing about that year & higher price is that they have to make the best of year 1 & 2 & hope they can get the price down before the new consoles cast a shadow over it.

 

[xabbott]

For all the talk about how superior the One X is and how every outlet was saying it was a 'full step' vs Pro's half step... look at the games from Assassins Creed Origins to Monster Hunter and ask 'Is it worth the difference of a year in gaming and another 100 bucks on top?'

For me it's a definite 'no'.

As someone who owns both a Pro and X, it is worth it. I don't regret the Pro but the X got me the picture I wanted more often. Even simple games like Overwatch in 4k are noticable.

I'm playing on a Sony x900 and it's one of those things that I really notice once I switch to a lower res game.

 

[Lort]

Pro = 2 ps4s duct taped together

Xbox one x is not 2 xboxs

Performance gains show that it can take a 1080p game to true 4k and 900p games to checkerboard 4k.

The xbox has the best cooling system and massive performance improvements from the redesign and obviously MS isnt trying to name drop technical specifics as its performance speaks for itself.

 

[grumpyGamer]

Of course they beat Sony on design and innovation. The fact Sony took months to even release Boost Mode after the Pro came out and have now finally addressed supersampling is very telling. Also please explain how the Xbox One X alienates half the fan base but the Pro doesn't, is it because they actually provided a wider gap between the base and the improved model?

Amazing how hard it is for some to give props to Microsoft for anything.

I give props to microsoft, nothing against them, but they had 100 dollar more margin to work with, and not all the xbox fan base will buy the console.
am i wrong?

 

[Louis Cyphre]

I give props to microsoft, nothing against them, but they had 100 dollar more margin to work with, and not all the xbox fan base will buy the console.
am i wrong?

You're not giving props to the design of the Xbox One X (cooling for example), all you are doing is trying to marginalize anything better about it. You also neglected to explain how this system is alienating half it's userbase while the Pro did not. They both get the same games as its underling and to perhaps mention HDR or some other feature the base unit doesn't support is your way again of trying to pick faults any chance you get.

 

[Insane Metal]

Lol, you guys are still arguing XBX x PS4P.

 

[thelastword]

What's the point of more rops if you can't utilise them (not enough memory bw)? PS4 pro design is cheap and smart (2xPS4 gpu) but XOX is better in every way aside FP16 processing.

Yes, but there's more on PRO's silicon, more in it's design and engineering. All MS did 1 year later was to do away with 32 ROPS which the PRO has, add 4 more CU's and 4GB of RAM. This is no engineering feat, they used a vapor chamber to push GPU clocks further than PRO, but if that's all they do 1 year after PRO with mature SOC processes, cheaper parts and no Vega features and still try to sell it to you at $500.00 and claim it as some true 4k, highest quality pixels engineering marvel, then I have some sea-water to sell you at a high price......

The truth is, if you take the PS4 PRO with it's 64 ROPS and add 4GB more RAM to it, it would trump the XBONEX and that's a 2016 design by SONY. It's crazy when I said that there's nothing special about XBONEX over PRO in GPU design, people mocked and did whatever it is they do, but here it is. Some folk thought, XBONEX GPU was some type of GTX1070 under the hood and of course that was propagated by DF, Leadbetter to be exact.

O onQ123 and thelastword are still here lol that's good

what happened to fp16

Check out F1 2017, You can check Farcry 5 when it launches and you can be sure to check out some of the first party releases from March 2018 and beyond..... for your FP16 fix........

Haha. Even to a casual observer the XB1X is a much better upgrade on than the PS4Pro. The fact that Sony is releasing a supersampling mode for the Pro is telling.

There is nothing telling by updating firmware on a console. The majority of games had supersampling on PRO, a few didn't, but instead had more features added in to the 1080p mode to sweeten the deal for 1080p screeners; AA, AF, AO, 60fps etc.....Funny that since the debut of supersampling, everybody wants these 1080p extras said games had now, yet, they would not play these modes before, fork and knives in hand because "Supersampling was like their lifeblood" .......I'll allow you to decipher the rest.....

 

[Unknown?]

Thelast word... I can't believe people like this exist. Seriously, you should work for Trump.

Sounds like you should work for trump. Don’t like facts? Fake news!! What there was incorrect? Pro is designed very well, doesn’t mean the X isn’t.

 

[JimboJones]

Check out F1 2017

What about it? The OneX has the better performing version of the game, as expected because it simply has more powerful hardware, there isn't anything special about the Pro either.

 

[grumpyGamer]

You're not giving props to the design of the Xbox One X (cooling for example), all you are doing is trying to marginalize anything better about it. You also neglected to explain how this system is alienating half it's userbase while the Pro did not. They both get the same games as its underling and to perhaps mention HDR or some other feature the base unit doesn't support is your way again of trying to pick faults any chance you get.

What i meant with the sentence alienating half its fan base, was that sony wanted a better console with the ps4 pro, but they also wanted to keep it within the affordable price point, so they sold the pro at 400, and the market agreed, because it sold well.

Now microsoft, the new xbox is better than the pro, but at the same time it is more expensive with 100 dollars, and not every xbox player will buy it because of that, that's all i was saying.
i love the cooling solution they did, but i still believe if it was cheaper they could have attracted more audience, not only the hardcore

 

[Nikana]

What i meant with the sentence alienating half its fan base, was that sony wanted a better console with the ps4 pro, but they also wanted to keep it within the affordable price point, so they sold the pro at 400, and the market agreed, because it sold well.

Now microsoft, the new xbox is better than the pro, but at the same time it is more expensive with 100 dollars, and not every xbox player will buy it because of that, that's all i was saying.
i love the cooling solution they did, but i still believe if it was cheaper they could have attracted more audience, not only the hardcore

While I agree with the logic I don't think M$ making the one X 399 by not implamrnting such a high end design philsophy would of really helped them.

Thr best advertisement for the Xbox One was the PS4 from day 1. It was cheaper and performed better and had a better physical design (I actually love the design of the xbone but I'm the minority )

If the one X wasnt able to keep it's small form factor and whisper quiet design to make it feel high end, I don't think it would resonate nearly as well as it has. It would feel more like just a PS4 Pro alternative vs a step up.

 

[grumpyGamer]

While I agree with the logic I don't think M$ making the one X 399 by not implamrnting such a high end design philsophy would of really helped them.

Thr best advertisement for the Xbox One was the PS4 from day 1. It was cheaper and performed better and had a better physical design (I actually love the design of the xbone but I'm the minority )

If the one X wasn't able to keep it's small form factor and whisper quiet design to make it feel high end, I don't think it would resonate nearly as well as it has. It would feel more like just a PS4 alternative vs a step up.

Yeah i agree with you too, they needed something different, but the x one did not really increase the momentum of ms.

 

[Nikana]

Yeah i agree with you too, they needed something different, but the x one did not really increase the momentum of ms.

It's way too early to tell that. I mean did it suddenly boost the Xbox one into space, no clearly not, but I also don't think it was intended to.

I still feel as if the one X was a product to try and start re-establishing the Xbox back to it's former brand heights as well as mesh more with the enitre hardware lineup from all Microsoft products. M$ knows they need to play the long game at the point.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Sounds like you should work for trump. Don’t like facts? Fake news!! What there was incorrect? Pro is designed very well, doesn’t mean the X isn’t.

Don't like facts...? Hmm... No, I love facts. I just don't like people who can turn something small, and make it sound like the worlds most amazing thing, then when proven wrong ignore that proof, and go on about something else.

I have an X/S/PS4/Switch/PC combo. I don't give a shit about console "wars". I just want to play good games. I can sit here are talk about the shit that MS do with their company and consoles just as much as the PS4. It makes no difference to me. But anybody that can read TheLastWords posts and actually nod in agreement needs a swift kick in the bollocks.

 

[Alebrije]

Original PS4 was so well designed and envisioned that makes looks PRO like a small step above, on the other side when I see my original Xbone and compare it to my XboneX they look like a compete different generation not only in power performance but in design; power brick has gone, reduced noise level due to best cooling system on a console, great form factor.

There are differences between PRO and XboneX depending of he game you compare, Does these differences are worth $100.00 extra bucks , for me yes and for some nope, but there are clearly games that look an perform better on XboneX because otherwise what would be the point of its existence.

Sony won this generation time ago, XboneX its just the the envision for next generation MSs console , its good to see Sony will need to work a lot to keep the leading role, and this is better for consumers after all.

 

[Mr. Grumpy]

Can we please not name drop members and then criticise them on a personal level. If you disagree with their opinions then counter them here but name dropping other members in the way that's happening is purely self serving and stifles genuine discussion.

Thank you.

 

[longdi]

I also been saying, Xbox 1x is a year later and $100 more.
Sony just made smarter use of customisation, just like PS4 beat down of the OG Xbox1. MS cant do shit without the additional year.
Cerny is good!

 

[ph33rknot]

For all the talk about how superior the One X is and how every outlet was saying it was a 'full step' vs Pro's half step... look at the games from Assassins Creed Origins to Monster Hunter and ask 'Is it worth the difference of a year in gaming and another 100 bucks on top?'

For me it's a definite 'no'.

not now but in a year every year games get more complex and run worse and worse on base systems

 

[grumpyGamer]

It's way too early to tell that. I mean did it suddenly boost the Xbox one into space, no clearly not, but I also don't think it was intended to.

I still feel as if the one X was a product to try and start re-establishing the Xbox back to it's former brand heights as well as mesh more with the entire hardware lineup from all Microsoft products. M$ knows they need to play the long game at the point.

Yeah it makes sense what you say, but i don´t see they´re software doing the same thing, it´s lacking a lot

 

[Nikana]

Yeah it makes sense what you say, but i don´t see they´re software doing the same thing, it´s lacking a lot

Their software is looking solid this year but to each their own. I'm very interested in Sea of Theives, Crackdown and Ori and the will of the wisps.

 

[grumpyGamer]

Their software is looking solid this year but to each their own. I'm very interested in Sea of Theives, Crackdown and Ori and the will of the wisps.

Glad you like they´re lineup, i have a different taste, but no problem there, i am curious of Ori

 

[Louis Cyphre]

What i meant with the sentence alienating half its fan base, was that sony wanted a better console with the ps4 pro, but they also wanted to keep it within the affordable price point, so they sold the pro at 400, and the market agreed, because it sold well.

Now microsoft, the new xbox is better than the pro, but at the same time it is more expensive with 100 dollars, and not every xbox player will buy it because of that, that's all i was saying.
i love the cooling solution they did, but i still believe if it was cheaper they could have attracted more audience, not only the hardcore

That's not alienating your fanbase, you're trying way too hard to validate the existence of one over the other. They are both intended to offers players a better alternative for those who want beefier specs. Seems as though your bias is getting in the way of being rational. The Elite controller is also an option that is far more expensive compared to the regular controller and it too is not alienating its other users. Its intent is to attract the more serious gamer, that's it.

 

[Bogroll]

As a matter of fact Cerny informed/educated us, that it takes 8TF to give you 4k consistently, and looking at the number of Dynamic resolution games on XBONEX and 1800p games, it just shows he was right....Yet, MS tried to market the XBONEX as a true 4k machine....In the end by hardware design and by his words, Cerny came out on TOP in spades.........

You come across as if you worship the ground he walks on, he may educated you on the number of teraflops required but not me and a lot of others and also theirs a lot of variables to getting 4k depending what your aiming for, eg frame rate and detail etc. For me he was just stating the obvious.

 

[Lort]

There is more to graphics than TF, 8tf will not be “next gen” at 4k. The xbox one x dynamic resolution on great graphics games often sticks to very close to 4k.

A next gen console will need at least 12tf+ (Equiv about 1080 ti) at 4k to produce improved graphics, and that still wont even come close to being capable of rendering detailed scenes without massive optimisation.

When the next gen comes out the xbox one x (equiv to about 1070 6 tf)will run next gen games at about 1440p compared to 4k on the new boxes. I will then bypass the ps5 and wait for the next gen xbox a year later with 16tf to ensure i get the best versions of multiplats.