DeathoftheEndless
Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
They aren't humanizing the organization. Secret Empire is an anti-fascist story about the Avengers taking down Hydra.
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Marvel Want Comic Store Staff To Dress Like Hydra During Secret Empire
- Thread starter LordOfLore
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They aren't humanizing the organization. Secret Empire is an anti-fascist story about the Avengers taking down Hydra.
excelsiorlef
Member
The reveal came out almost a year ago and had be planned longer than that... this end game has been in work long before Trump was even an actual possibility.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
LMAO Right? People are fucking weird..
DeathoftheEndless
Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
I mean, I get it. I'd be mad as hell if there was actual Nazi sympathizing going on, but this isn't that.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
While I'm admittedly not entirely sure how well Star Wars comics actually are promoted
Hydra is linked (like it or not, which Marvel is clearly trending towards the latter) to the Nazis. The 'real life' Nazis murdered over 6 million real people.
The Empire did a lot of heinous shit, sure, but there's much more degrees of separation between blowing up a planet 'a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away', and stuff that happened here on Earth, in our history.
Populism and nationalist sentiment was alive and well a year ago, or even before.
I'll agree in that I don't think this was explicitly planned around Trump or anything, but they're certainly not shying away from it now either. (Not trying to claim a moral high ground in saying they can't, mind, I understand the business logistics underneath it all - just as they have to live with the optics)
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
If Lucasfilm put out a Star Wars movie about the empire taking over in a way that ran closely parallel to the recent presidential election and to promote it asked all of the movie theater operators to dress as space fascists and decorated all of the movie theaters with space fascist paraphernalia then they would be rightfully derided for the same reasons Marvel is being derided right now.
excelsiorlef
Member
...
It's a t-shirt with the Event name on it... and a logo they've sold for ages....
excelsiorlef
Member
Cosmic Cube nonsense...
Zen_Arcade
Banned
They shouldn't support this because it's extremely dumb of Marvel to ask them to pay for shirts to market their product, but some of you are going off the deep end with thinking that wearing a fictional villainous groups logo on your shirt is some terrible affront.
Seriously, some of you need a reality check. You really blur the lines between enjoying fiction and how it relates to the real world.
Seriously, some of you need a reality check. You really blur the lines between enjoying fiction and how it relates to the real world.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Reality changing nonsense to be specific
theres cosmic cube shenanigans behind trumps win?
The Broken Ska Record
Member
Then that would mean we could use it to change everything back.
The Silver
Member
also an eldritch abomination is responsible for grooming Trump behind the scenes
actually that sounds like Bannon
Rome? What?
The Empire has always been space nazis, no idea where you got this Rome idea from.
exmachina64
Banned
You can't just wave your hand and disentangle decades of association with Nazism.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
We are talking about a medium where the devil handwaved away an entire planet knowing Peter Parker was Spider-Man.
Handwaving shit away is the exact kind of fuckery comic books are known for. It's a universe that constantly mixes things like technology, magic, and intergalactic space beings. If you aren't into that then the medium is not your cup of tea.
Not every dictatorship is representative of Nazism.
Maybe he got the idea from the Roman republic collapsing and giving way to the dictatorship of the Caesars.
It has nothing to do with dictatorships, the Empire are just Nazis plane and simple. Like, Empire = Nazis is a known fact that has been the case since 1977, it's baffling that people are actually trying to argue against something so clear.
[edit]
More so when he's quoting an article talking about how George models the Empire after Nazis and he just handwaves it away by saying George changes his mind a lot. An article posted on the official Star Wars website written about the guy who created Star Wars.
Don't bother. You have people saying Secret Empire is the worst thing Marvel has ever done. After they've read the fucking prologue issue.
I really don't think these people actually read comics if they think this is in the top fifty dumb things Marvel's done.
he's just trying to make us ashamed for our words and deeds. give him some time; he'll figure it out!
exmachina64
Banned
Nazis have more real world connotations for people than whether Earth-616 knows Spider-Man's secret identity.
I've read comics on a weekly basis for thirteen years now.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
Yes, but nothing relating to Hydra and their relation to Nazis is real. They're a fictional group with a fictional relation to a real world group. Saying they can't change the relationships of a fictional group is asinine because the relationship never actually existed in the first place. They're not changing real world history by doing any of what they're doing.
Marvel doing this means equally as much to the real world as the devil erasing the entire world of Spider-Man's secret identity did. They both have zero effect to anyone who can parse out reality from fiction.
They didn't and they didn't try to hide it.
RedAssedApe
Banned
Wear this corny t-shirt isn't really the same as "dressing as hydra"...plus you have to pay for them?
It's just a shitty promo shirt. Lots of places from movie theaters to game and comic stores have these for employees.
It even says SECRET EMPIRE on the front to signify it's a shitty promo shirt, so it's not even like they're Hydra sympathizer shirts. I really don't get the issue.
This is no different than people who wear Star Wars shirts with Galactic Empire/Imperial iconography on them, because they were Nazi allegories too.
The First Order were about as unsubtle about it as possible too, and people still buy the merchandise.
Edit: Well I see I'm hardly the first to make the comparison. I guess I could argue that it's tone deaf, but I doubt that was anything related to their intention.
It even says SECRET EMPIRE on the front to signify it's a shitty promo shirt, so it's not even like they're Hydra sympathizer shirts. I really don't get the issue.
This is no different than people who wear Star Wars shirts with Galactic Empire/Imperial iconography on them, because they were Nazi allegories too.
The First Order were about as unsubtle about it as possible too, and people still buy the merchandise.
Edit: Well I see I'm hardly the first to make the comparison. I guess I could argue that it's tone deaf, but I doubt that was anything related to their intention.
excelsiorlef
Member
Secret Empire's got nothing on Avengers #200
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
No, the Empire and the plot of the first Star Wars movie was explicitly patterned after the Roman empire. It's not even remotely subtle. I'm not sure how you could miss this. I'm not saying he didn't take some aspects of the Nazis, but the framework of Star Wars has ALWAYS been about how a republic turned into a dictatorship in almost exactly the same way it happened in Rome with some space fantasy thrown in.
And George does change his mind all the time. You can find interviews where he brings up Rome as well. That article is pretty weak anyway, it cites one line from a DVD commentary, and it's not even a line that contradicts anything I've said.
You're talking about the prequels, when the Empire wasn't really a thing. You can't say the Empire, which are space Nazis, aren't space Nazis because of the political plotlines in the prequels, when the Empire as we know it, didn't even exist.
The Empire from the OT and its connotation, The First Order, are plane out Nazis and have nothing to do with Rome.
Like, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPhHl2DpD4E
How is that just some "aspects of Nazis", that's straight up Hiter.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I'm talking about the first Star Wars movie. The movie actually has very little exposition but a great deal of it is dedicated to talking about how there was a great republic before the emperor took control. Some of the very first dialogue in the movie is about how Princess Leia is a senator on a diplomatic mission and how they can't keep her prisoner for long because the senate will disapprove. Again, not subtle.
You know what else isn't subtle about Star Wars? That the Empire are Space Nazis.
What about the empire being basically racist against Aliens? In the movies you don't see any aliens being stormtroopers or other positions of their army.
It's a Nazi thread.
I apologize for my role in this.
I just popped in to ask if Captain America was evil.
And now I am suggesting you only saw a very small portion of a very large Empire. But if you believe the lore, Grand Admiral Thrawn wasn't human.
IrishNinja
Member
this is really all that needed to be said, but here we are
i love that image cause it fits their ability to quickly surrender to anyone with moderate fighting skills
also see: AIM
D E E P L O R E
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it's not, but i do think we're stretching a bit with this promo as pro-nazi
true, and Marvel Agents is rebuffing that, as well as MCU - but from reading the book (where cap kills skull for nazis messing up hydra's vision) you get that it's something else, though no doubt fascist
Shamelessly stolen from the other thread.
this reminds me, i meant to go back & read more of Byrne's run
i mean, maybe we should've then, though... that event was kinda awful
#factsonly
yes, but to be fair, that's a recent trend - they've only been left-leaning and included messages of social justice since damn near their inception
right but that doesn't make for a great bleedingool byline & thread of mostly drive-by posts
couldn't agree more
It's also worth noting that the cinematography in SW was directly inspired by Triumph of the Will. Perhaps the origin of the Empire was meant to be Rome-esque, but the way it is presented is straight Nazi.
It is mentioned repeatedly that Thrawn is the exception due to his brilliance. In Old EU he was the only nonhuman Grand Admiral.
It is mentioned repeatedly that Thrawn is the exception due to his brilliance. In Old EU he was the only nonhuman Grand Admiral.
excelsiorlef
Member
Good thing no one made them dress up as Nazis to promote comic books.
deadscreensky
Member
I must have missed a Star Wars film where the Empire traveled into the future and helped Hitler, at this point there's no other explanation for these comparisons that would otherwise be totally disingenuous.
Fancyarcher
Member
Yeah, this isn't gonna blow up in the company heads faces like at all.
excelsiorlef
Member
It's a t-shirt with a logo on it and the name of the event on it
They aren't being asked to dress up as Nazis.
Hydra t-shirts have been for sale for years
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Aren't Hyrdra literally Nazis
Now more than ever, Marvel is really baring their ass lately, ain't they?
Now more than ever, Marvel is really baring their ass lately, ain't they?
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
That tweet seems to be saying that they are asking them to change the store logo in addition to wearing shirts.
excelsiorlef
Member
Still not asking them to dress up as Nazis...
Given that Hydra is about secret takeovers the idea makes sense.
They're free to reject it but don't act like Marvel is asking you to dress up as a Nazi...
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