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Marvel Want Comic Store Staff To Dress Like Hydra During Secret Empire
- Thread starter LordOfLore
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Oh yeah, I know. They've been laughable tabloid nonsense for years.
But honestly, this is probably the first time I've been legitimately disgusted by one of their articles. The fact that they took some random fucking dude on Twitter who happens to be a white supremacist to try and make Marvel look like they're on the side of Nazism is gross.
Marvel has been going down the tubes for a while. It started with the ridiculous way they ended the Spider marriage. Jonathan Hickman's outstanding FF/Avengers/Secret Wars work kept me interested for a long while, but I'm out now. At this point, the only Marvel books I read are Silver Surfer and Thor, which are pretty much separate from the rest of the Marvel Universe.
Fortunately, as Marvel has stumbled, DC has turned things around. The New 52 was dogshit for the most part, but I've been shocked out how good so many of the books have been since Rebirth. I am a little worried that they'll fuck everything up as they start integrating the Watchmen stuff more and more, but Ive been mostly pleased so far.
The no true Scotsman routine doesn't fly when before that the whole mcu including AoS had this Nazi "offshoot" of hydra powerful enough to take over shield and threaten the world then come back this season and re-establish they are Nazis.
DeathoftheEndless
Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
We need to ban all villain merchandise apparently.
They're obviously trying to fix that.
They spent the last year and 16 issues of a comic to explain away the Nazi links to get a Hydra Cap villain for the event, I don't know what else they could have done.
But yeah, maybe this ask was too big, considering less people read comics than react to what happens in comics.
That is the quick and easy article generator of today. Find a potential hot issue and search twitter for the posts that go for either side. As nutty as twitter is if you look long enough you will find a shit post to build a story on. "Journalism" has never been so easy
itwasTuesday
He wasn't alone.
I wanna be able to enjoy my fictional villains.
Sgt. Kabukiman
Banned
You can't retcon shit like that. Cap was fighting Hydra during WW2 in First Avenger. That's how most people first heard about Hydra. The Nazi connection will never go away.
The vast majority of Marvel Comics is liberal-slanted. Like, heavily.
No, they are not trying to "fix that" by putting out t-shirts with a Hydra logo for a Hydra-themed event. Just like they weren't trying to "fix that" when they put out a storm of Hydra merchandise after Winter Soldier hit.
Ignoring the marketing that still hasn't chnaged
Of course they can. And Hydra was part of the Reich, and Red Skull totally a nazi.
They added bullshit, they didn't take anything away.
Sgt. Kabukiman
Banned
Well let me fix that then: you can't retcon shit like that in people's minds.
Marvel can edit the wiki page for Hydra all they want but it's too late.
AlfonzoPalutena
Member
This is especially funny to me, because Agents of Shield is actually doubling down on the fact that Hydra are definitely derived from Nazis.
They're in an alternate reality dominated by fake news, and ruled by Hydra. Many of the Hydra members have the Hitler youth undercut, but they vehemently deny that they came from the Nazi's mad science division. It's heavy on satire from our current political climate in the US, very well done.
Then at one point Simmons literally has to say, "oh and btw, Hydra definitely used to be Nazis, don't let them tell you otherwise".
DeathoftheEndless
Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
Wearing a Hydra shirt means you support Nazi-ism. Just like wearing a Joker shirt means you support rape, murder, and dropping people into vats of acid.
More people see their movies that made overt visual and chronological links between Hydra and Nazism than read comics, yes. Marvel as a brand frequently uses the link between the two as a shorthand for "this is how bad our bad guys are." They're only trying to brush that away now so that they can sell these kinds of t-shirts and coffee mugs or promote Hydra characters in comics without people complaining.
This is not some kind of tragic situation Marvel was forced into by unknown forces beyond their control. They have created a successful media empire where their accented dudes in WW2 wearing specifically evocative uniforms have been viewed by millions of people.
They did that shit; not Bleeding Cool.
RipperGrim
Member
Dude the mainstream aren't even going to recognise the logo on the shirt. People are acting like the employees are going to be wearing SS uniforms.
Or wearing an empire shirt means you are blowing up planets, and enslaving wookies
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
I believe they were referring moreso to the 'popular/mainstream' opinion, rather than the specific 16 issue-long retcon to try and distance Steve.
Changing popular opinion of Cap to "sure, I can accept he's 'Totally-not-a-Nazi' now" would be rather tough to do, considering the (more than incidental) exposure of the vast majority people probably being the movies.
excelsiorlef
Member
Again with all due respect this shirt is no different than an Empire Shirt, or a First Order Shirt, or a Storm Trooper shirt, or a Death Eater's Shirt, or a Darkseid shirt or god knows what other super evil group you can get merch of.
I don't think Marvel should start basing comic storyline decisions on what the movie audiences would think about it.
They wanted to sell 16 issues, so they made a ludicrous twist in issue one and slowly explained it away.
If you are shocked by the revelation and want to know why, you need to pony up the cash and read the story, this is how the business works.
None of those organizations are connected in-universe to the regime that orchestrated the Holocaust, though.
excelsiorlef
Member
Hydra shirts have been for sale for you know ages...
I mean just understand we are talking about a shirt with a logo on it and nothing else.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
Eh. While I'm sure this will sell, in no small part given the controversy surrounding it, I'm rather doubtful that as a whole, this is going to grow Cap's brand to any significant level (and in fact, risks turning people off entirely).
Which, insofar as it relates to making more money for Marvel, kind of is the point, especially as it relates to the movies, and their connection to the comics?
Granted, Marvel makes so much money off the movies it really probably doesn't matter how well this specific comic does (especially when it'll get retconned again at some point down the line), but that doesn't change the optics, or how it messes with the entire history of the character created by Kirby and Simon in the 40s.
I'm not sure I quite agree with that. Hydra is simply cap's arch nemesis, something people were aware off after the movies. Sure that the Nazi connection adds shock to it but revealing that Luke Skywalker works for the empire would make similar headlines.
The Galactic Empire is heavily modeled off of Nazi Germany. Is that enough to earn all storm trooper cosplayers scorn?
I think their goal is to position similar to a wrestling heel. Some of the dick moves are enjoyable to watch, but you still know he is bad.
You like to see him try and save a Hydra suicide bomber, but then you see him try and sabotsge the shield.
You see him lock
Carol Danvers in space
He will die ans come back or whatever they will do, the return of Good Cap will be the event tu push his brand.
No part of Star Wars takes place on our own planet, let alone alongside our real historic timeline right when massive atrocities actually took place.
Comparing the two is disingenuous.
The Netflix shows have had huge success, but I doubt an article about someone heroic teaming up with the Hand would garner the same reaction as a Hydra reveal.
Modeled off of, not literally connected to in-universe.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I thought the Empire in Star Wars was modeled more on the Roman Empire anyway, at least in the first movie.
Yes, but the problem is that this controversy is over a t-shirt with a Hydra logo -- something that has been on t-shirts for years and years.
If a comic shop sells t-shirts, they absolutely have sold multiple Hydra-branded shirts and other merchandise in the years since Winter Soldier.
The issue some of us have with this controversy is that Bleeding Cool is painting it as "dressing up as Hydra" and people on Twitter are re-tweeting it based on the headline. If you see the headline, you imagine that Marvel is asking people to dress up in Nazi-like uniforms.
But that's not what's happening. It's a freaking t-shirt with the name of the event on it.
Yes, Marvel trying to separate Hydra from the Nazis is dumb. But Bleeding Cool is painting this narrative as something it simply isn't. Quoting some random asshole Nazi on Twitter who happened to say "I like the idea!" is proof of this. It's incredibly transparent what they're doing.
Arguing thst things should never change in comics is futile. The Captain America books were always historical sci-fi, they don't have any moral impetus to be historically accurate. They have the luxury to pick and chose what sticks, that comes with the territory.
They didn't gloss over that fact or hand waive it, they went to lenghts to explain it and how things changed. They don't glorify the Nazis or paint Hydra in a good light either, bother are terrible organizations.
Also Nazis according to George Lucas
http://www.starwars.com/news/from-world-war-to-star-wars-imperial-officers
LordOfLore
Banned
And they want the stores to dress up their shop as well. This is not just a t-shirt or two.
That's not a hydra uniform
This is a hydra uniform
Looks like they started on the first letter of Y.M.C.A.
I already responded to you on this earlier dude.
Were those stores refusing to sell Hydra t-shirts or action figures after Winter Soldier came out?
Edit: And again, you're ignoring the fact that they literally are lying in the headline. The part about stores putting up Hydra logos, which is still not asking employees to dress up in Hydra uniforms, is in the follow-up article. It's not even part of the "dressing up as Hydra" article.
They lied.
DeathoftheEndless
Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
Dressing up the store too?! That changes everything.
And has been addressed already, leaning on a specific aesthetic for branding is nothing new. It's a Hydra heavy arc and they are emphasizing it. You will likely find many such examples in the past.
Including no more events for at least 18 months after the event.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
YOUNG MAN, THERE'S A PLACE YOU CAN GO.
I SAID, YOUNG MAN, WHEN YOU'RE SHORT ON YOUR DOUGH.
YOU CAN HELP BUILD THE NEW WORLD ORDER,
BY BEING A HYDRA SOLDIER!
IT'S FUN TO WORK FOR
HY-DR-AH!
IT'S FUN TO WORK FOR
HY-DR-AH!
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
If you read enough George Lucas interviews you will find that the likes to change his mind every time he talks. He was clearly going for Rome in the original Star Wars. The only similarities they had to Nazis were visual.
Yeah, I think Marvel is poised to turn things around quickly. No more large events for a while should help with that.
It's been a long time since Marvel Comics had a down point like this and a long time since DC Comics were legitimately good and both of those things happened at the same time.
With Perlmutter's support of him? That might be the inspiration.
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