I suppose, but surely the Square Enix executives listed would be more likely to be the ones making the decisions vs some shadowy Nintendo executives who aren't even given special thanks in the credits?
But hey what do I know.
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More Changes to Bravely Second in the West
- Thread starter Kintaro
- Start date
I suppose, but surely the Square Enix executives listed would be more likely to be the ones making the decisions vs some shadowy Nintendo executives who aren't even given special thanks in the credits?
But hey what do I know.
I thought it was after certain plot events
(similar to the first game's time loop)
-shadow-
Member
I'm not to bothered by the changes in costumes, not really seeing a reason to change most (or any) of them really. But it doesn't negatively affect the game in any way.
Removing any and all consequences from side-quests however is a really odd change. Why would you change any of this when the game is already guaranteed to be rated PEGI 12? The subject matter can be handled with such a rating.
And I see many blaming Nintendo for this, but I highly doubt that. X had changes made to Lin's bikini outfit sure, but other than that everything was still there. Including people murdering each other and very clear suicide (attempts). And that game has the same rating.
I'll still get the game eventually however. I still need to finish the first one.
Removing any and all consequences from side-quests however is a really odd change. Why would you change any of this when the game is already guaranteed to be rated PEGI 12? The subject matter can be handled with such a rating.
And I see many blaming Nintendo for this, but I highly doubt that. X had changes made to Lin's bikini outfit sure, but other than that everything was still there. Including people murdering each other and very clear suicide (attempts). And that game has the same rating.
I'll still get the game eventually however. I still need to finish the first one.
Elaugaufein
Member
You're both kind of right because of the mechanism for the
loop
loop
NG+
NG+
It might have been cut down because apparently there were different
2nd versions
Starwolf_UK
Member
While I've only played the English version and know of the Japanese version I think we have to look at Vivian's sex. The only thing it matters for is Vivian used as a joke with her other two sisters in their group. In the Japanese version the group was the Shadow Sisters with the joke being Vivian is messing it up by not actually being a girl. Now the English version went for something like the Shadow Sirens with Vivian messing it up by not being evil enough. I see that as a convenient comedy change and while it's true who knows the real explanation that is a plausible scenario.
At least it isn't an inconsequential change that bites them in ass ala Capcom with Street Fighter (though that was more not having M. Tyson suing them with the bite being possible confusion about characters unless terms like claw, boxer and dictator are used) and Ace Attorney (it's set in America, in the future with the bites being all these small things like Japanese shrines, film camera as evidence in a case taking place in 2014, left handed drive car).
Fire Emblem Radiant Dawn in the Japanese version playing on hard difficulty had more dialogue. Rather than use this as the base as for the US translation they used the normal difficulty instead resulting in less text.
Weirdly though I think the chapter narration and previews were added for the localisation (as well some other features like game able to run in 16:9 and some gameplay tweaks) so you cut costs on text but add costs with narration.
The whole want to save money part of this rubs me the wrong way. It feels like the only reward for Braverly Default being a success is Braverly Second got a low budget localisation. I'd hope outselling Lightning Returns (at least NPD numbers said that) would be enough to earn it's stars. Then again maybe 2016 3DS market doesn't warrant having large sums of money thrown about it and there is also the Japanese performance of the game to consider so maybe I'm wrong to think to think this.
On the other hand maybe the Japanese reacted poorly to the multiple outcomes for sidequests and the need to play the game umpteen times to 100% the cutscene viewers.
They do what the localization manager tells them to do. The localization manager is Squenix.
Thankfully, we also have credits to back up that Bravely Second to back up that nothing has changed in that regard. It's Squenix, guys.
Movies are not "art" by default. There is art in film, but Transformers 2 isn't art just because it's got a screenplay and actors.
It's not inconsistent with the general idea that it's a game is being marketed to a young audience. It's on the 3DS, it's got cute, chibi-style characters, it's an easy fit. The cutting of quests is specifically cutting out the areas that may cause you to regret a choice you made, probably because they think children don't like any sense of moral ambiguity, as well as the darkness involved. Like one of the scenes is literally "<X> character died because of my decision... I hope I made the right choice in the end".
It can't possibly be a cost cutting measure because it's such a small segment of a very large game to cut, and there's very little voice acting involved in those scenes in the big picture.
There are games on 3DS and there are games that Nintendo publishes that are clearly aimed at older audiences and don't hold back on dark themes, sex and violence. They probably just don't see western adult gamers buying Second, so they've made changes to make it more kid friendly.
sensui-tomo
Member
They want to save money eh, guess they'll be fine with me saving my money on a more complete product that didnt cut out a good chunk of content to save a buck.
"Art" is not the same thing as "Art I like", no matter how much you want it to be. You are not the Art Police.
Artistic expression is art, even if it's Michael Bay's artistic expression.
I am not the art police, but there is a loose consensus among the art world about what constitutes art and what doesn't. The medium isn't what makes it art, is what I'm saying.
Teletraan1
Banned
I don't understand why these super deformed characters had these sexy outfits on them to begin with. These characters look creepy as fuck even with non sexualized outfits. With them they are just nightmare fuel.
Battlechili
Banned
I grow weary of censorship and poor localization of these games. Its getting really hard to get excited for any upcoming game for fears of stuff like this and Fire Emblem Fates happening. I can't support this sort of release. I detested the costume changes alone from all the way back to Bravely Default, wanting the game to be left alone, and now the game is repeating the process but going so far as to cut an ending and potential character deaths? And to censor an art book, a collector's item, of some of its art seems....Strange and really sad.
I'd honestly argue that every medium where works are created is art and should be treated as such. Just that art isn't some fancy word that guarantees a quality work. I mean there is such a thing as bad art.
I was already on the fence about buying this due to how completely personally offensive I found the Native American to Cowboy costume change, but I am 100% not buying it now due to the quest content changes. I flat out refuse to support any release that changes content that drastically. It blows my mind that someone thought that was an okay thing to do. I can get over some things, but completely breaking quest/story content like that is not one of those things.
do you also use the word 'epic' to describe things that mildly interest you
or are you legit shook at these designs
Eolz
Member
Vivian's gender identity wasn't just a punchline though. In the original ending, Goombella says that Vivian's sisters have finally accepted her as a female, and even Goombella herself refers to Vivian with female pronouns.
DXLelouch153
Banned
honestly what sane reason could anyone have for removing bad outcomes for a videogame
characters die so what its not happy funtime rainbows and lolipops
you need your head examined if characters in a videogame dying offends you
characters die so what its not happy funtime rainbows and lolipops
you need your head examined if characters in a videogame dying offends you
Schädelkeks
Neo Member
I find it so funny, that Xenoblade Chronicles X, Bravely (Default/Second) (Fire Emblem Fates probably will too) and Senran Kagura 2 all have USK12 (12year old and above) in Germany. One of the games did not recieve removal of "too sexy" stuff. Guess which one. The decisions to change this stuff definitifly are not enforced by law. I really want to know the thinking process behind them.
Ragnorok64
Member
Man, I may just wait until the make a director's cut version of the game, or (more likely) wait some years until someone puts together the Japanese version with the a modified English script and emulate it.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I like a lot of Japanese games for their gameplay. I enjoy the Japanese cultural flavor, but its also not always essential to me. Fire Emblem is where I get my strategy RPG fix, not necessarily my Japanese culture fix
Obviously you have cases like Okami where you literally cannot separate the cultural influence from, well, any aspect of the game. But you also have cases where localization does not harm the experience
So the truth came out (jump to 52:00) http://operationrainfall.com/2016/03/03/total-control-ep-66-bravely-default-changes/
YianGaruga
Banned
Apparently a SE PR rep told them "Nintendo was responsible for handling the game".
Certainly wouldn't surprise me.
Ragnorok64
Member
I can't find the tweet, but Liam of SuperBestFriends had mentioned that, given his time at Square Enix, he was convinced that these changes came from Nintendo.
"Nintendo was responsible for handling the game."
This isn't shocking at all. Don't know why Nintendo is going so hard with changing games for different countries.
What I question is why only US versions keep changing?? Are they thinking that these changes helps sell more games??
CrichtonKicks
Member
This is referring to the European version. US version isn't out.
It wouldn't surprise me. Usually there's SOME reason that can make a lot of sense, and in regions where the likes of Bioware games and even Bethesda's shallow choices are popular it'd be nuts to actively cut out choice unless something were wrong with the game design there.
I blame both of them, but more-so Nintendo.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
Wow, even censoring non chibi form artwork in the artbook.
I swear, sometimes it's like I never left the Middle East at all.
I swear, sometimes it's like I never left the Middle East at all.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
chaobreaker
Member
I would like to understand the train of thought that led to someone at Nintendo feeling that the bondage art had to go.
Spare us the crow serving. Assuming this was Square-Enix's doing is a reasonable judgement.
Spare us the crow serving. Assuming this was Square-Enix's doing is a reasonable judgement.
Going from the undeniable track record of recently censored games on Nintendo platforms, it could not have been more obvious. I find it hardly reasonable considering the overwhelming evidence to the contrary that surrounds you. So no, please enjoy your crow.
chaobreaker
Member
Bravely Default and Second are both published by S-E in the west. They are not Nintendo games and there was never any indication that Nintendo was involved in the games' localization. So no, there was very little evidence that suggest this was Nintendo's doing.
yanipheonu
Member
Newly announced changes;
Are you sure about that? I'm pretty sure Nintendo published Bravely Default outside of Japan.
chaobreaker
Member
Wikipedia says otherwise.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Couldn't care less about costume changes. The actual content cuts are a little odd, though...
Except that SE has no modern history of doing this while Nintendo is pretty much the only one who does this, so when the only recent example of SE doing this is on a Nintendo platform...
It just made sense.
cosmicblizzard
Banned
Neoriceisgood
Member
I like how this topic's like 5 times more active than the actual game topic.
MrGrGr.
MrGrGr.
Nah, just wish for Square to actually localize something for themselves for a change. Square has been a bunch of idiots about Bravely Second and having everyone waiting for a long time completely forgetting about the west. So who steps in? Nintendo.
EDIT: Oh and Bravely Default too. They were just as dumb. Square didn't even learn from that, like "oh the west still likes these JRPGs?"
Well, it's not out in America yet.
(although people should really hack their 3DSes and import from Europe anyways considering how much NoE has been on the ball vs NoA being NoA)
On the previous page someone put a list of the people who are credited with the localization and most, if not all of them, are Square Enix people. So either the credits are wrong, or Square is the one responsible for the localization.
bbkkristian
Member
I really think Nintendo's doing this on purpose to get the attention to make the game sell more. Easy press for them. Why else would they waste money and resources on this censorship? Because if these changes were left in, the audience this game is catered to wouldn't complain at all: you know, the old school final fantasy fans who are adults now.
Neoriceisgood
Member
I think putting something on the Vita technically counts as a form of self censorship.
Starwolf_UK
Member
The PR person could also be misleading. They apparently said "Nintendo was responsible for handling the game" which can mean a lot of things including distribution and marketing.