Gordon Shumway
Banned
Good chunk of ladies there as well..
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North Carolina GOP headquarters firebombed | Investigation underway
- Thread starter SwiftDeath
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Good chunk of ladies there as well..
Exactly, Hillary is anything but far left. "Centrists" should be flocking to her.
Red Blaster
Member
how about donating to any other charity on the fucking planet instead of a party that is literally catalyzing white supremacy
god liberal guilt is pathetic at times
wumster3000
Member
I had to give you all some time to respond. Assumptions are running rampant and responses are predictable. The "If you're not with me, you're against me" mentality is strong. It just proves my point. I do not like either candidate. It isn't a contest of who's shittier, it should be about the future of the country. Neither are good for us imo. My views run right up the middle. Both parties have takeaways I agree & disagree with. The far left is just as foolish as the far right. But most of you have proven my point anyway. I rarely dip into these threads anyway. It's normally the same old spew
I'm a registered independent. I flipped the past two elections. It's not an if you aren't with me, then you are against me. It's saying that both candidates are the same, but leaving no evidence as to why you say that. People are tired of this, me being one. It's clear that one candidate is close with Russia, like to grab pussy, doesn't like to rent to brown people, doesn't pay taxes to support our schools and military, says it's okay to call their daughter a "hot piece of ass", calls the election rigged, doesn't show sympathy, a sexual predator, a con man, temperament of a child...you know what, I'm going to stop.
So Hillary let me see, she got her emails hacked, she did speeches for money, called gang member kids "super predictors", I guess the Benghazi situation...
It's calling them both terrible when one is clearly worse. The facts are there, read them. This is not Obama - Romney. I thought both candidates presented themselves really well. This is one that's obvious to a lot of people.
I had to give you all some time to respond. Assumptions are running rampant and responses are predictable. The "If you're not with me, you're against me" mentality is strong. It just proves my point. I do not like either candidate. It isn't a contest of who's shittier, it should be about the future of the country. Neither are good for us imo. My views run right up the middle. Both parties have takeaways I agree & disagree with. The far left is just as foolish as the far right. But most of you have proven my point anyway. I rarely dip into these threads anyway. It's normally the same old spew
So you claim both sides are the same and that Hillary is just as repulsive as Trump, get reasonable arguments otherwise, ignore them and then respond with that same objectively wrong point again. I can't understand this wilful ignorance.
He is starting to lose the ladies. He already lost college educated ones
I can understand that.
Father_Brain
Banned
That people are actively supporting a homophobic, transphobic, racist party for the sake of vapid civility fetishism? That's about as far from awesome as possible.
I sure hope none of these people complain about third-party Johnson or Stein protest voters again, because at least those voters aren't directly working to elect Trump et al.
Jawbreaker
Member
Good on them. That certainly helps spin the narrative away from Trump, coupled with his ugly tweet.
wumster3000
Member
No, according to trump, it's Hillary's animals that did this. Case closed.
Edit: the same animals that are donating to repair the place.
White male American (who would never vote for Trump) reporting in to say stop generalizing, that's how we get in situations like this.
Wuthering_Heights
Banned
Hope they can find the terrorists who did this and bring them to justice.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Look at him. Look at his words. I don't think so.
Slurpy2k20
Member
I had to give you all some time to respond. Assumptions are running rampant and responses are predictable. The "If you're not with me, you're against me" mentality is strong. It just proves my point. I do not like either candidate. It isn't a contest of who's shittier, it should be about the future of the country. Neither are good for us imo. My views run right up the middle. Both parties have takeaways I agree & disagree with. The far left is just as foolish as the far right. But most of you have proven my point anyway. I rarely dip into these threads anyway. It's normally the same old spew
What an utterly useless post filled with nothing but word vomit. Literally got stupider reading this shit.
As others have said, that's not even close to awesome.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Yes, there's that unfortunately, but in such a dark moment I do believe it's good to see people take the high road. I don't believe there's a wrong answer for however people want to see this aid. I say this as someone who is glad no one was hurt and also agrees absolutely with what you're saying, in regards to the GOP too.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
A lot of people on my Twitter feed lashed out tonight from positions of real pain about how that money could have been spent to genuinely help people. There are so many more productive uses that money could have been put towards, and instead it was spent as a gesture of goodwill towards a party so toxic and full of hate. Its maybe the first and last time I'll actually describe something as "virtue signaling", because I'm not sure how else to describe it.
Stevetopsy
Member
What a stupid fucking move. I'm a Dem, voting Hillary, and I hope they find whoever did this and punish them accordingly. All it does is make it seem like we're on the same level as the people at Trump rallies who assault old women carrying oxygen tanks, or who leave posters with swastikas and "media" at the press table. And worse, it gives rich dummy Trump more fodder for his ignorant propaganda. God I can't wait for this fucking election to be over. It's just been more and more depressing the longer this drags on and it's been running on fumes for weeks now. Let your words and your votes express how we all feel and take the high road while Trump does more damage to his campaign than anyone else ever could. He continues to be his own worst enemy by spewing alex jones-esque conspiracy theories, pointing fingers and pouting like a child about how everything is rigged and out to get him, and defending himself from accusations of sexual assault and misogyny by pointing out his accusers aren't hot enough for him to have wanted to grope.
Father_Brain
Banned
I'm sure the NC GOP is absolutely touched by such high-minded sentiments, and will immediately cease defending transphobic bathroom bills and attempting to suppress the minority vote.
Maybe take a breath, step back and try to understand what I wrote one more time.
Ah, okay. This helps me understand a lot better, so thank you! Yes, I know what virtue signaling is. What's done is done I guess.
Someone above pointed to this as pathetic liberal guilt. But the spirit of fairness is the reason we're even fighting against trump instead of being greedy af about our taxes, supporting BLM, and getting riled up against injustices.
It's the same human decency that is why this fundraising occurs. Fuck the haters saying this is terrible. If this is such a terrible thing, why are people even concerned about this in the first place, and pretending that they are glad no one was hurt?
Edit:
Sorry, just kind of angry about this. I guess this money could go to other places, and that the GOP can more than afford this, so t is kind of useless. I guess the sentiment makes sense.
But I don't think the people doing the fundraising are terrible.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I don't even normally believe in virtue signaling. I think its frankly a bullshit concept. But I don't know how else to describe this. Who are the people donating doing so for? For the GOP? Republicans aren't going to look at this and go "shucks I guess the liberals aren't all so bad afterall". I'm left only being able to think that its to look good to other liberals
Donating money to them is an misguided attempt at empathy at best, and a cynical way to undermine the GOP further by "taking the highroad" at worst.
A statement of condolences like Hillary put out earlier would suffice, and is one thing. Giving money to an organization that actively promotes and supports oppressive thoughts, and allows laws of the same ilk to pass is something else.
I fully understand why people would want to help out, but I sincerely doubt that the Republican Party needs help with rebuilding one of their base of operations.
It's a huge fucking jump from not wanting people to waste money on bigots out of a sense of guilt to wanting said bigots hurt/dead.
I agree. I'm fine with this. It's $10,000. It's won't help their campaign but maybe they can use it to help rebuild their office, or other things that happened because of this.
People need to chillax a bit. Mind you I wouldn't donate. I'm sure they can cover it, and at this point we don't really know who did it. But if people want to, alright.
You know, I'm suprised the plot to destroy an appartment complex that was intercepted ins't being more talked about..
http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/14/us/mosque-attack-thwarted-kansas/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/14/us/mosque-attack-thwarted-kansas/index.html
Glad no one was hurt or god-forbid killed in this attack. I'll agree that donating to them is kind of silly. They (should) have insurance for this sort of thing. Extra money is just going to help them enact their shitty oppressive policies. Now, if someone had been hurt in this my tune would change drastically. Donate for human life. Fuck trying to help an organization that hurts people, though.
Father_Brain
Banned
No, I understand perfectly what you said and it has nothing to do with the reality of the current American political system, let alone NC in particular. Try asking a trans person down there what they think of this.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
To be 100% fair, the money does not actually go into campaign funds. Its being raised and run by an independent org with the explicit purpose of rebuilding the location, nothing more
Whether or not they need help is entirely beside the point. A free, democratic election should never be subject to acts like this and an attack on any side is an attack on the fundamental process itself.
I think that's awfully presumptuous of you.
It wasn't talked about as much as it should have been. Hardly saw it myself on CNN and the like. It's a bit weird really.
This right here though is happening now. It won't be talked about by the time the debate happens.
Exactly. I can understand the negative responses but I don't really agree with them. Helping to fund the reopening of the office is a costly signal--a virtue signal in the original sense of the term--that this kind of political violence is unacceptable. One of the most pernicious effects of having Trump in the race is that he's blown through all these old norms that kept political campaigns at least somewhere approaching reasonableness. One of those norms is the avoidance of and condemning of political violence. No other major party candidate in our lifetimes has outwardly and openly encouraged his followers to violence against those who disagree with them. It's horrible, and harmful, and frightening, and has directly resulted in violence.
This is an effort to push back and attempt to restore that norm, to say in the clearest way possible that we don't condone or encourage violence and that resorting to it will not help because we won't accept it.
The people giving money here aren't opening new offices. They aren't kicking off new hate campaigns. They're simply restoring the status quo. To make it as though this firebombing had never happened, and thus to discourage those who might consider taking this type of action in the future.
Maybe they can even mitigate some of the damage Trump has done.
j_k_redtail
Member
FWIW, this is my feeling as well.
Fair point but it's an investment in civic diplomacy .
It really is, I just sort of blew up on the keyboard. Turns out that doing so apparently involves creating straw men.
My apologies for kinda shitting up the discussion with even more anger.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
A lot of people, quite fairly I feel, raised the point that if people had $13,000 to spare directing it at some of, for example, the trans aid charities in North Carolina might actually save lives instead of rebuilding a building almost certainly covered by insurance.
If you think things are so bad that the "good guys" should not be allowed an ounce of empathy for the other side being firebombed and vandalized, and that anyone trying to help in the situation should be condemned as a pariah, then you probably don't think there is any value in the system of democracy or politics anymore. Might as well burn it ALL down, right?
Crash Station
Member
Or maybe it's because people want to bridge the ever-widening gap between left and right as a nice gesture calling out violence and acknowledging that we're all Americans here? Maybe for some it's for their own sense of self-worth, but the message it sends is much more valuable than that.
Saying something like "they'll be fine, they have insurance" doesn't come across as empathetic, it comes across as insensitive and furthering the "us vs them" mentality that this election cycle has perpetuated.
Vicetrailia
Member
Try looking up the demographics.
MWS Natural
Member
That's great news but facts are facts.
Crash Station
Member
I really want to see the percentage of Harambe write-ins when the election over.
Father_Brain
Banned
That's quite a straw man.
Empathy is one thing. Actively raising money to help the NC GOP pursue a homophobic, racist, transphobic, misogynistic agenda is quite another.
If anyone actually believes raising money for this will do anything to steer the GOP away from the course they've been on for a half-century, well, "agree to disagree" is the most civil response I can muster.
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