AcademicSaucer
Member
I dont expect most jrpgs to come out on the home console unit and I dont expect most AAA games from Nintendo or otherwise to come out on the handheld unit.
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NX will launch in March 2017 globally, won't be at E3 (focusing on Zelda instead)
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I dont expect most jrpgs to come out on the home console unit and I dont expect most AAA games from Nintendo or otherwise to come out on the handheld unit.
Doesn't say it here.
Looks like people assumed Iwata meant it was a fad. Remember, gamers have echo chambers just like Nintendo.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/iwata-customers-do-not-want-online-games/1100-6102100/
Not literally though. And also not really non-literally.
Unless the handheld has a ton of exclusive features, I'd expect all handheld games to be playable on the console if Nintendo goes the shared platform route.
Dark Cloud
Member
I don't think a FFVIIR for a NX console would be playable for the NX handheld. If it's possible then that would be amazing. Either I'm buying both since I do use my handheld a lot away from home
What if they had the ability to remote play it to the handheld?
Like 85 percent of the library is shared, all the handheld games are playable on console and all console exclusives can be RP'd to the handheld.
Given how they've have continually marginalised online gaming, I can understand why a person might interpret Nintendo as not respecting it.
Personally I think Iwata was probably right to ignore online gaming on the Gamecube. He didn't feel the mainstream market was ready to embrace online gaming and didn't the want the company throwing massive resources at it. I'm willing to give him a pass here because at the time, it was still early days for online console gaming. Microsoft we're the only company to get their act together early with Xbox LIVE and it didn't help them turn a profit there either.
Moving on though I think it's totally unforgivable that Nintendo continued to ignore online gaming in the 360/PS3/Wii era. At least Sony had the foresight to catch up with Microsoft and make the PSN service more on par with Xbox LIVE. Nintendo basically buried their heads in the sand.
ReyVGM
Member
But some of those games aren't even the same as the portable/console version.
Mario Kart 7 is not the same as MK8. Neither is New Super Mario U / NSMB2, or DK Tropical Freeze / DK 3D.
AcademicSaucer
Member
Nintendo ones? yeah, but Square Enix, Atlus , Level 5 et al? Not really unless is enforced by Nintendo. For example, Game Freak may not release their games on the home console.
ReyVGM
Member
But none of what you said has anything to do with what I said. I wasn't arguing what Nintendo did or thought about online.
I just asked that person to find the 'literal' quote where Iwata said it was a fad. And as Shiggy said, not only is there no such quote, but what Iwata said doesn't even imply it.
Jorok Goldblade
Member
I think Mario Kart and NSMB fit, since they exemplify the problem. Nintendo is spending two development cycles on a franchise (whether it be two teams or two consecutive projects for the same team) when they should be spending one, and using the saved development resources on something new. Not many people are going to keep with both Mario Kart 7 and 8. They're going to pick the one they like and let the other gather dust. And you can't tell me releasing two 2D Mario games three months apart wasn't a giant waste of development time.
ReyVGM
Member
Sorry, I didn't read her article. I just saw the image and the "WiiU and 3DS libraries felt redundant" and assumed the image meant they were the same games.
The shared platform model makes a lot of sense when you consider the position of Japanese developers and the waning relevance of dedicated handhelds.
Many Japanese developers, Nintendo included, have reached a point where handhelds are powerful enough to run all the kinds of games they tend to make. Not only do you see Nintendo making redundant games and ports across 3DS and Wii U, you see a ton of Japanese games coming out simultaneously for PS4 and Vita. They need the audiences of both the handheld and console, but with them sharing a platform they should theoretically be able to just develop a game once and have it ship on both.
Basically, they've already given up on the idea of consoles and dedicated handhelds having libraries unique from each other. They also probably already realize that most people in Japan are fine with just handhelds while westerners are fine with just consoles. Before, a company like Konami or Square Enix couldn't make the exact same game on the PS2 and the GBA, or the original DS. Now, budgets and simple culture have restricted many of those Japanese developers to asset quality and gameplay systems well within the capabilities of something like the PSP, 3DS, Vita, and undoubtedly the handheld NX, with many of their PS4 games simply being high resolution Vita games.
I imagine Nintendo is going to these developers who are currently supporting the 3DS and Vita, and telling them to support the NX platform so they can more easily get their handheld games onto a console. It's probably how we'll end up seeing a lot more JRPGs and the like end up on consoles again. From the perspective of someone who just buys the console (i.e., western customers), it could bolster the console's library. It would be like if the PS4 could play all Vita games. A majority of Japanese users would probably still prefer the Vita over the PS4.
Personally, I'd eventually get both, but likely the handheld first. Being able to play Virtual Console copies of Super Metroid or Earthbound on a TV or on the go without having to pay for them twice would be huge for me.
Many Japanese developers, Nintendo included, have reached a point where handhelds are powerful enough to run all the kinds of games they tend to make. Not only do you see Nintendo making redundant games and ports across 3DS and Wii U, you see a ton of Japanese games coming out simultaneously for PS4 and Vita. They need the audiences of both the handheld and console, but with them sharing a platform they should theoretically be able to just develop a game once and have it ship on both.
Basically, they've already given up on the idea of consoles and dedicated handhelds having libraries unique from each other. They also probably already realize that most people in Japan are fine with just handhelds while westerners are fine with just consoles. Before, a company like Konami or Square Enix couldn't make the exact same game on the PS2 and the GBA, or the original DS. Now, budgets and simple culture have restricted many of those Japanese developers to asset quality and gameplay systems well within the capabilities of something like the PSP, 3DS, Vita, and undoubtedly the handheld NX, with many of their PS4 games simply being high resolution Vita games.
I imagine Nintendo is going to these developers who are currently supporting the 3DS and Vita, and telling them to support the NX platform so they can more easily get their handheld games onto a console. It's probably how we'll end up seeing a lot more JRPGs and the like end up on consoles again. From the perspective of someone who just buys the console (i.e., western customers), it could bolster the console's library. It would be like if the PS4 could play all Vita games. A majority of Japanese users would probably still prefer the Vita over the PS4.
Personally, I'd eventually get both, but likely the handheld first. Being able to play Virtual Console copies of Super Metroid or Earthbound on a TV or on the go without having to pay for them twice would be huge for me.
What makes you think Nintendo wouldn't charge you twice?
civilstrife
Member
My prediction: The NX console and handheld will share much of the same library, but you will need to pay for separate licenses to play a game on one or the other. Bundles will be available at slight discounts.
Basically, think Smash Bros 4 DLC but for everything.
Basically, think Smash Bros 4 DLC but for everything.
Mediking
Member
Uhhhh.... Nintendo needs to be trying their best to get more console JRPG action. They can't let Sony dominate that field anymore. Hopefully Tales of B lands on NX with Nintendo costumes. Actually.... every JRPG in some form on NX should have some Nintendo flavor to it like costumes.
I was counting on it being enforced (as in, all NX Handheld-centric games must be playable on the console, since it wouldn't take away much from the game to do so). But if it's not, I could see the likes of Game Freak locking their games to the handheld.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Im gonna go ahead and assume Nintendo wants the NX reveal, including games to be spectacular as possible and are just saving everything. Yes I know we assumed with Wii U but this is the last time Im going to assume this.
Fool me once shame on you, Fool me twice shame on me, you aint fooling me 3 times.
I am prepared to wait to get the best Zelda experience, if there are more options than Nintendo has told us thus far.
First of all, until this week last week, Zelda was only officially for the Wii U.
Almost everyone had long suspected that Zelda would be coming out on NX, even if it still came out on Wii U (a la Twilight Princess on Wii and GameCube). but nothing was confirmed by Nintendo, until this week.
Now we know Zelda is coming to both Wii U and NX. But, what IS Nintendo's *entire* hardware future? NX is a home console with a brand new concept, that much we can be sure of.
I would love to be able to play Zelda at not just native 1080p, but at 60fps, with huge draw distances..The base NX console may be capable of this, or it may not. That's why the SCD (Supplemental Computing Devices) are so interesting. Since Nintendo went to the trouble to get those patents approved, it must mean SCD's are an integral part of Nintendo's NX hardware-software strategy and long term viability. SCD is both a physical connection based and cloud based way of increasing the quality of game performance. Between more than one console and more than one SCD,
I pray that this is the main hook for NX, because if Nintendo gets it right, the concept and tech could offer a truly useful and exciting way to reset the console marketplace and be a most welcome option for core gamers and developers.
Instead of encouraging Wii U owners to go ahead and "plug in a full-on three terabyte hard drive if you want" as Reggie said, Nintendo should encourage NX owners to, if they want plug in one or more SCDs to experience scalable performance in games like the PC crowd buys better hardware. While making it clear that all NX games will have a base mode (sound familar? NEO hehe).
Nintendo games that can scale according to what the gamer wants sounds great.
First of all, until this week last week, Zelda was only officially for the Wii U.
Almost everyone had long suspected that Zelda would be coming out on NX, even if it still came out on Wii U (a la Twilight Princess on Wii and GameCube). but nothing was confirmed by Nintendo, until this week.
Now we know Zelda is coming to both Wii U and NX. But, what IS Nintendo's *entire* hardware future? NX is a home console with a brand new concept, that much we can be sure of.
I would love to be able to play Zelda at not just native 1080p, but at 60fps, with huge draw distances..The base NX console may be capable of this, or it may not. That's why the SCD (Supplemental Computing Devices) are so interesting. Since Nintendo went to the trouble to get those patents approved, it must mean SCD's are an integral part of Nintendo's NX hardware-software strategy and long term viability. SCD is both a physical connection based and cloud based way of increasing the quality of game performance. Between more than one console and more than one SCD,
I pray that this is the main hook for NX, because if Nintendo gets it right, the concept and tech could offer a truly useful and exciting way to reset the console marketplace and be a most welcome option for core gamers and developers.
Instead of encouraging Wii U owners to go ahead and "plug in a full-on three terabyte hard drive if you want" as Reggie said, Nintendo should encourage NX owners to, if they want plug in one or more SCDs to experience scalable performance in games like the PC crowd buys better hardware. While making it clear that all NX games will have a base mode (sound familar? NEO hehe).
Nintendo games that can scale according to what the gamer wants sounds great.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
Well, that's a pretty convincing position for the idea, I have to admit. As long as the handheld isn't too underpowered (otherwise that'll hold back the scope of console games), it could maybe work. Even so, they still have to figure a way to account for the different game design structures that accommodate handhelds vs. home consoles; certain experiences are better had on one versus the other.
The Monster Rancher example works to demonstrate that to a degree, but I mean in regards to entire game structure. Single player, multiplayer, etc. And in a way where a person needn't have both devices to feel like that's the only way to get their money's worth out of the game.
EDIT: And it's 2 in the morning. Time for bed, lol.
Lord_Byron28
Member
I believe Nintendo is really trying to develop a Android/iOS style ecosystem for their video game platforms. They will all possess a similar OS, similar hardware, unified account system/store and have a certain degree of a shared library. It's also easy to develop for and release across all systems in the NX ecosystem. That way every few years they can release a new console or a different kind of handheld and still have good support for the system. Slowly over time the audience will migrate or upgrade and developers would shift priority.
If the handheld and console have a shared library then I could see good Japanese 3rd party support at the least.
I think there are ways Nintendo can somewhat avoid this by doing a few things. They could create companion titles intended for handhelds and consoles to work together. For example they could release Animal Crossing in a similar style to New Leaf. Then they could release another Animal Crossing that has a different style and gameplay elements such as going to the city and have the console as the target platform. Advertise that you can use your Animal Crossing: New Leaf 2 on your handheld and play Animal Crossing: City Life on the console and they interact with each other. They could do the same for Pokemon. Release a new Pokemon. Then release Pokemon World Cup or something which is an HD 3D that let's you face different characters from the entire series in various tournaments. Advertise that you can use new Pokemon on your handheld with the Pokemon World Cup on the console.
I also think that there will still be some console/handheld exclusives. Some titles like Mario Kart, Smash Bros, 2D Mario, Splatoon, Nintendo spinoffs(Mario rpgs/sports, Hyrule Warriors, Pokken, etc.) can easily be shared across multiple platforms. Meanwhile there are other games that I could see as being console/handheld exclusive. Hypothetically let's say Nintendo releases 12 games a year. Of those I'd guess 8 games would be shared, 2 would be handheld exclusive and 2 would be console exclusive. Again this is speculation but iOS has exclusive software/games for different systems even if the majority of their library is the same.
Nintendo is a company that does R&D on technology, occasionally they find stuff that might be useful and patent it, so that they could earn back the R&D costs, or to build a patent portfolio (to be stronger in litigation or to sell on later). It doesn't mean it has to be part of the NX.
Yeah, I know.
I could see there being some kind of standard "compatibility mode" across all the handheld's games when you play them on the console, sort of like what happens when you run an iPhone app on an iPad that hasn't been re-optimized. From there developers could have the option to have a specific "console mode" when you play the game.
Also, I think charging twice for these games could piss off a lot of people, particularly on the digital side. A unified platform will instantly form comparisons with existing unified platforms: iOS, Android, Windows, etc, particularly for casual consumers who are more connected to those platforms than to PlayStation or Xbox. iOS developers certainly have the option to charge separately for iPhone and iPad versions of apps, but most don't. The standard that's been set is that you pay once, and play on every device that runs that operating system.
The bolded introduces the same problem all over again -- Nintendo having to essentially develop two games when it could develop just one.
And right now I'm not sure there will be handheld-exclusive games at all. And from Nintendo and the other Japanese devs that support NX there could end up being very few console exclusives.
I think we need to accept that from the standpoint of the development situation many Japanese companies are in, it would be easier for everyone if the handheld and console were simply thought of as one platform instead of two separate systems or two separate experiences. The dedicated handheld is losing its relevance as a distinct experience from other platforms. We're reaching a point where it can really only survive as an extension of something else, or as a single component in a larger function or platform (like phones or PC operating systems or consoles).
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Would make sense especially from the mochizuki tweet saying Kimishima said NX will sell at profit day 1
Cheeseman Battitude
Member
This is intriguing. You might thing that Nintendo is playing safe by only launching when everything is properly ready. But we know nothing of NX except that it's a "brand-new concept." So the launch date might be extremely risky depending on what NX is.
I think the main reason Nintendo won't sell you the game twice is because they will have to ask 3rd Parties to use Carts for physical releases on a portable device. As someone pointed out in another thread. Both systems using Carts (the same physical media) saves publishers a lot of money on shipping and logistics, and is probably enough of a saving to make using carts profitable. Asking 3rd parties to physically publish 2 versions on 2 seperate devices would see the handheld overlooked as the cost of carts is expensive, and Nintendo isn't dumb enough to try and enforce a strictly digital ecosystem on its handheld users when modern games can be up to 50GB each
Used-ID
Member
Fredrik
Member
Same thoughts here. I actually never play 3DS on the go, I just use it for comfy gaming at home in the bed or couch, something I could've done just using WiiU if 3DS and WiiU had a shared library.
And SM3DLand and SM3DWorld are completely different, others too in that pic posted earlier, I don't see why it would be a positive thing if one of the games never got released. ;/
Orniletter
Banned
But where is the logic in that ?
We are assuming Nintendo will make it trivially easy to get your NX handheld game to run on the console. Why shave off what is sure to be a significant part of the user base ?
And some nebulous "Games Freak likes portables" doesn't cut it for an explanation.
Joelstinton14
Member
I think it is becoming clearer and clearer that this will be an Iterative IOS/Android style device. I think even Kiminisha (Sp sorry!) eluded to it in the Financial Briefing : We are planning for it to be a platform that will be played for a long time.
The shared library talk is interesting. I do kind of agree that it seems like a lot of money lost if they do migrate the handheld and console divisions, but at the same time, is that where the money is even at? PSN as a service alone made more money last year than Nintendo.
So i can understand why , if, Nintendo are moving their philosophy in how they make hardware and software.
The migration of software division has it obvious advantages; more games, more frequently, less time and money spent on them too.
This also applies to third parties too. The most cited reason why TPD didn't bring titles to the WII U is that it had no market. It hadn't sold enough. By front loading the release schedule i think it should ensure sales and make it a viable platform for TPD to make games for.
And if the machine is Iterative, it also provides a platform for Third Party games to succeed. It gives them time to sell there game and recoup costs across a variety of current and future NX devices. Maybe not straight away, but for sure over time.
The shared library talk is interesting. I do kind of agree that it seems like a lot of money lost if they do migrate the handheld and console divisions, but at the same time, is that where the money is even at? PSN as a service alone made more money last year than Nintendo.
So i can understand why , if, Nintendo are moving their philosophy in how they make hardware and software.
The migration of software division has it obvious advantages; more games, more frequently, less time and money spent on them too.
This also applies to third parties too. The most cited reason why TPD didn't bring titles to the WII U is that it had no market. It hadn't sold enough. By front loading the release schedule i think it should ensure sales and make it a viable platform for TPD to make games for.
And if the machine is Iterative, it also provides a platform for Third Party games to succeed. It gives them time to sell there game and recoup costs across a variety of current and future NX devices. Maybe not straight away, but for sure over time.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Or Nintendo demoed Zelda with NX alpha Dev kits or PC's with similar target specs. We will see when people can play with the Wii U Zelda at E3 and can check out if the Wii U controller is indeed connected to a regular Wii U.
I don't think there is any previous instance when Nintendo had a playable demo running on anything else but their hardware.
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
I think I recall Wii's not being used at their first E3, as Nintendo wouldn't allow pictures of the hardware (and in fact even hid it from view)
Dark Cloud
Member
You guys think if there's a handheld and console component to the NX, then both will launch in March?
Candescence
Member
Nintendo have already merged their console and handheld divisions. It's quite apparent that they want to pool resources and talent together to make more projects for a single platform that encompasses more than one system at this point.
https://twitter.com/GameXplain/status/726252525809102849
Note that the original PR was also stating just 2017, only the website mentioning March.
But I wonder if there is a real possibility for Zelda to miss the NX launch.
Note that the original PR was also stating just 2017, only the website mentioning March.
But I wonder if there is a real possibility for Zelda to miss the NX launch.
The ideal solution IMO is that the cart that comes with the physical box you purchase works on any NX device and you can transfer saves between them.
I am getting more and more confused (perhaps I should stop chasing NX related threads!)
Just a question and only with respect to the "handheld hardware", has Nintendo actually made direct reference to making a NX handheld device?
Cos I am thinking more and more that there will be a home console and then an app for mobile phones......
Don't want to add to confusion or speculation or hype, but just wanting to get back to basic facts that can be traced to statements directly from Nintendo if possible...... if anyone cares to answer that is......
Just a question and only with respect to the "handheld hardware", has Nintendo actually made direct reference to making a NX handheld device?
Cos I am thinking more and more that there will be a home console and then an app for mobile phones......
Don't want to add to confusion or speculation or hype, but just wanting to get back to basic facts that can be traced to statements directly from Nintendo if possible...... if anyone cares to answer that is......
Nintendo have said absolutely nothing about abandoning the market sector that they have the most consistent success in. I've not seen anything to suggest anyone in their senior management have developed an allergy to money.
Nintendo will continue to release dedicated handheld gaming devices.
I think all the signs point to a console only release in March:
*Only Wii U forecast was drastically reduced
*3DS is set for revitalisation.
*Kimishima talked only about Wii U sales bring impacted by NX
*Zelda NX port - it could be possible theoretically on a powerful handheld, but it wouldn't hold an advantage over the Wii U version
*no signs of ramping up productions for cartridges by the end of 2016 (I saw this mentioned yesterday by someone else, but it's difficult to search on mobile).
I love my Wii U, as it's been the most fun I had with a video game console in a long time. (Both the Xbox 360 and Xbox One had almost made me drop playing video games altogether, to be completely honest.)
But there's no denying that the system did more harm than good for Nintendo, and I'm fine with their plans going forward. Reworking their branding, taking their time to get it right, delaying the Wii U/NX Zelda title for next year, etc. Kimishima understands business, and he knows the launch for the Nintendo NX next March will be critical. (That, and it's also the end of their fiscal year period.)
I just hope Kimishima proves to be a shrewd planner.
But there's no denying that the system did more harm than good for Nintendo, and I'm fine with their plans going forward. Reworking their branding, taking their time to get it right, delaying the Wii U/NX Zelda title for next year, etc. Kimishima understands business, and he knows the launch for the Nintendo NX next March will be critical. (That, and it's also the end of their fiscal year period.)
I just hope Kimishima proves to be a shrewd planner.
Eolz
Member
Iwata said in the past there'll be no hybrid (at least not now) and that there'll be "several devices" acting like "brothers".
Think of that what you will but there's absolutely no way they're giving up on handhelds this soon.
Dark Cloud
Member
Sounds like if there's a handheld it would come maybe holiday 2017 or later.
Because if one of those games doesn't get released Nintendo can make Metroid/F-Zero/New IP / any other dormant IP you can think of.
Doesn't it? Twilight Princess was on the GCN and Wii, both ended up with comparable specs. What's to assume the NX wouldn't be much of a leap forward either? As far as the delay goes, might be due to some new control scheme, which we all know is very likely.
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