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Reasons for concern when it comes to the PS4......
- Thread starter BruiserBear
- Start date
Well for me only 3 is an issue, and not so much that things take to long currently, but that a lot of new functionality is built on the lynchpin of a much faster network. like the whole play while you download feature. mean if i have to wait say 30 minutes so its downloaded enough of the game that I can start to play a game or a demo its certainly not that useful.
Longer term I'm probably more worried about seeing much of the new features being US limited, like in the case of game streaming. If this the way Sony moves forward offering pre-PS4 titles, and it stays say limited to US/Canada/UK I'm going to be pretty bummed.
Longer term I'm probably more worried about seeing much of the new features being US limited, like in the case of game streaming. If this the way Sony moves forward offering pre-PS4 titles, and it stays say limited to US/Canada/UK I'm going to be pretty bummed.
I wouldn't be too concerned with the download speeds. The Vita downloaded faster than my PS3 until I learned about setting up a proxy server. Now the PS3 is able to max out my 50Mbit connection when download anything off PSN. The slow speeds on the PS3 are caused by it only downloading over single connection, and not reestablishing a connection if it slows down, I'm sure this is something that can be tuned, but I'm not sure if multiple connections can be added and since it's been so many years that's probably be a reason they never were. I feel that with the PS4 focusing on online it would Sony failing on their faces almost at the level of the RROD.
Brad Grenz
Member
The first thing you should do is see if the light is actually a problem in your home.
No kidding, for all the hyperbole in the OP about his grave concerns about PS4, half the complaints are PS3 specific. The PlayStation Store runs fine on Vita and PC. The PS4 has a completely different networking hardware and software stack. You'll even be able to link your PSN ID to a Facebook account if you'd prefer to use your real name, even if they don't offer the option to change it. The Trophy thing is just stupid. Personally, I'm not too worried if I can't farm Trophies by watching the season premiere of Big Brother or spending a certain amount on downloadable titles, and I'd bet a lot of the flexible game stuff will be like for like on both platforms.
Brad Grenz
Member
Read any thread on NeoGAF between May 21st and about 2 weeks ago.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Seem like very small complaints and im getting the xbone.
Clockwork5
Member
But I am not talking about the Move and I have no use for anecdotal examples. I have also played Move and have seen its reflection in the television. But again we are talking about the lightbar, which has shown, more than once, to project a visible reflection on the television screen. When i play a dark game in a dark room, I do not want to see a blue light floating around on my tv screen.
ParenegadeM
Banned
Why not patch it so it's not on developers? Why not make it so it's off by default? I'm sure there are far more developers who won't use it than will.
It's purely aesthetic really, but it's a bit of a bummer that they finally made a good controller, but decided to have it look all dumb and glowing. Wouldn't really call that an area of concern though.
The download speed stuff hopefully is improved. I have pretty good Internet (75/35) and my PS3 downloads were always noticeably a lot slower than on my 360.
The download speed stuff hopefully is improved. I have pretty good Internet (75/35) and my PS3 downloads were always noticeably a lot slower than on my 360.
BruiserBear
Banned
The store complaint went over a lot of people's heads. I was not suggesting that because the new PSN store is slow as hell on PS3, that it will also be the same on the PS4. In fact, I suspect the PSN store will be plenty fast on PS4.
I brought up the new store because it's an example of Sony doing something dumb, and it was recent. If they're still doing stupid shit now it's cause for concern when it comes to PS4.
The light on the controller is another example. They designed a great new controller, but then they decided to stick a big light bar on the top of it for some reason. Like I said, one step forward, another step back.
I could give many more examples of this, such as Sony finally implementing trophies. Oh hey, it's 2008, and Sony finally got an achievements system on PS3! Oh wait, I have to manually sync them? Why?
So it's this pattern that leaves me concerned about what new dumb ideas might be lurking in the PS4 OS when we finally see all of it.
The slow download speeds are probably the most annoying thing with PSN at the moment, that and the atrocious PS Store which better be fixed for the PS4, especially since they'll be charging for multiplayer now.
In the grand scheme of things, however, these grievances seem trivial.
In the grand scheme of things, however, these grievances seem trivial.
Because they're looking at the screen, not their hands...
I guess I am in the minority that has good peripheral vision. The 360 controller blinking has always bothered me more than a light on the tv screen.
Scapegoat
Member
Death by a thousand cuts.
I can tell you that while I loved my PS3, all the minor problems/deficiencies it had (detailed in the OP) cumulated in it being my secondary/least favored console.
Slow download speeds are terrible, especially on top of the archaic and huge patches for games. Compare this to XBL with both speedy and small updates. There is nothing wrong with coming home with a new game, putting it in your console, and then having to sit through a 30 second update. It's torture when you have to wait 30 minutes+ for it to download a 100MB patch.
The DS3 controller was fine, but the 360 controller was great. It was more comfortable to hold and my thumbs lay naturally no matter what input (stick, d-pad, or buttons) you were currently on. For me the DS1/2/3 still feels like the d-pad and buttons are the natural/comfortable location, with the sticks being less so (given they are just bolt-ons from the original PlayStation controller). And don't get me started on the DS3's triggers... did no one test them before release? I get that people would use them differently but did no one during development find their fingers slipping off due to their convex shape?
The 360's user experience, particularly with online play and communicating with friends was leaps and bounds ahead of the PS3. Getting into voice chat, sending and accepting game requests, comparing achievements are head and shoulders above the PS3 experience.
And to those saying the light is not visible for them on their glass screens: add me as another who 1) plays in the dark 2) has a plasma screen and 3) can definitely see the Move's reflection. And yes, I at times also notice the annoying blinking from the 360's guide light.
not sure if it has been said before, but I've been playing games for...eva and I have just one gripe. it edges me like a knife on melon cutting day...
as a junior member I have the freedom to express my opinion without worry of recourse (within reason...)
I have a serious concern for the future of both video games and for the PS4...
I will be completely broken, as if someone came in and stole my chocolate milk if sony doesn't advertise - well perhaps not robotic, perhaps not 'zombified', perhaps not over emphatically telling me how I am the center of the universe...
I am awaiting the return of kevin butler.
If he says we should.... well - Can you say no?
as a junior member I have the freedom to express my opinion without worry of recourse (within reason...)
I have a serious concern for the future of both video games and for the PS4...
I will be completely broken, as if someone came in and stole my chocolate milk if sony doesn't advertise - well perhaps not robotic, perhaps not 'zombified', perhaps not over emphatically telling me how I am the center of the universe...
I am awaiting the return of kevin butler.
If he says we should.... well - Can you say no?
And just because most people are saying it's not deal breakers means this thread is full of people getting offended because of his opinion when most just disagree with the majority of them or realize it's too early to even talk about the OS?
It works both ways. GAF isn't a single entity so I'm not sure how "GAF" is getting offended when most people are just discussing the points. A FEW people overreact as always but that's no different than some of the people in Xbox threads so what's the difference? Does that mean "GAF" gets offended at specific problems with the new Xbox too? No, they're INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE.
Just because some people don't agree with his points doesn't make everyone here offended or defensive of the PS4 just like anything else on here. It's hard for everyone to agree on points that no one could possibly know anything about on the PS4 right now anyway...Slow download speeds on PS3 have annoyed a lot of people getting the PS4, but we don't know how it is on PS4 anyway. The unknown doesn't automatically become a negative afterall, especially with how much they've talked about the need to improve their interface and infrastructure. It's simply unknown.
For all the people that complain about the console wars and GAF collectively taking sides, they sure do make it a point to bring it up in every opinionated thread. There's always going to be a few downsides to a console anyway and it comes down to each person's preference, but people disagreeing on the list doesn't make them offended by any means and a few people that did take it personally doesn't mean GAF collectively is offended and so defensive of the PS4. It's just like politics. There's a majority but it doesn't mean the entire country agrees with everything going on at any given time. No reason to generalize a forum when it's no different than any other large community.
The light bar on the controller can't be turned off.[/B] Agreed, Always having the light on is gonna annoy, especially since I already don't like the new controller.
2) Still can't change your PSN ID name. This is a non-issue for me, I like BHK3 and have no plans of ever changing it, don't know why people would pick names they hate :/
3) Download speeds are still a problem for many of us. Legitimate concern here too, download speeds and basic slow down is everywhere on ps3, I don't see how it's just gonna all magically go away with the new console unless they really upgraded every single server.
4) The PS3 store got redesigned for a third time, and usability regressed dramatically. Same, Sony has an issue with things being just fine then BOOM they break it.
5) Achievements are going to involve, but we've heard nothing about trophies. Where the hell is that god damn trophy room
TLR
I'm mostly just afraid of sony not delivering, they promised some grandiose things that I simply need to have the console for myself in order to believe it. I doubt hitting share and uploading some 240p nonsense on youtube/ustream is gonna work the way they intend, I just have all these doubts since they haven't been competent for the past few years.
Brad Grenz
Member
Yeah, how foolish that after so many people had complained about the old store they decided to completely modernize the back end, add a bunch of convenience features, create a consistent style across multiple platforms and make it easier to promote new content.
Oh, man. Yeah, they added an innocuous light to solve a couple problems (camera interaction & player identification) and you think it's a failure because of a problem literally no one in the world has actually had yet.
I thought you were talking about PS4? Why do you keep dragging up ancient PS3 problems? You keep talking about this quiver full of arrows you have to fire, but every time you loose one it's the chippiest, often solved bullshit that not even console warriors have cared about for 5 years.
DigitalDevilSummoner
zero cognitive reasoning abilities
REAL reason for concern:
MP paywall + games not called COD or BF:
MP paywall + games not called COD or BF:
Evolution_1ne
Banned
you can't be serious
I refuse to believe your really that dumb, your just fucking with us.......right?
Exactly. All these years and I have ....never......ever...noticed the red light on the controller reflecting from my TV. Ever. Never noticed the light on the 360 controller....ever. The blue light? maybe cuz its bigger and on the front of the controller. Still a small inconvenience and like someone mentioned, I used the Move a few times and never noticed it. Who are these ppl that are noticing lights on the PS3 and 360 controllers reflecting on their TV's?
I am willing to bet Sony might have a way to turn it off in the Settings in the future.
I ts been posted before....for wireless the PS3 has inferior hardware vs the 360. It cant connect to wireless N, the 360 can. You have to change your router to a,b, or g for a better wireless connection. The PS4 can connect to wireless N. Its not just the servers...
I agree with most here...the rest are...well kinda trivial as reasons to not get a PS4 or hold off on getting one. I was expecting some list of technical things. I agree the PSN store was a lil better before...but I like the updates to the store vs. the orig design. I still dont like the changes they made for searching or scrolling thru lists of games. They may have fixed it and I didnt notice.
3rdamention
Member
1) The light bar on the controller can't be turned off. Again, this could be a small thing to some, but to others like myself, who have newer tvs that are very reflective, it's a big concern. I sometimes notice the tiny red light on the dual shock 3 when playing my PS3 now. That big light bar on the dual shock 4? Oh, it's going to be noticeable. Sony had better figure this one out before launch, because it's gonna irritate a lot of people.
2) Still can't change your PSN ID name. Yes, this is a small thing to some, but for others it's a big annoyance, myself included. This was possible on the Xbox 360 the day it launched in 2005. Here we are 8 years later, and it's still not possible on PS3. Maybe it will be possible on PS4, but we have yet to hear about it.
3) Download speeds are still a problem for many of us. To put it simply, for many of us PSN download speeds are far slower than Xbox Live or Steam. Yes, some people seem to have fast speeds, maybe they're just lucky to be located near a server, but many of us experience rather mediocre speeds. I'm lucky that mine are just meh. Not terrible, but not great. Sure this could be improved with new servers, but Sony's had years now, and things really haven't changed. This is clearly something they need to work on, and I don't believe they've promised it will be anytime soon.
4) The PS3 store got redesigned for a third time, and usability regressed dramatically. To me this is a real problem and it happened so recently, and it's a pattern for Sony. Sometimes it feels like they don't learn from the past, and that concerns me for the future. This new store has a ridiculous boot up time, and using it is basically a pain in the ass. Yes, it looks prettier, but the old store was fine, and much faster.
5) Achievements are going to involve, but we've heard nothing about trophies. Like it or not achievements blew up last gen, and from everything we've heard so far, it sounds like Microsoft intends to push them even further with the XB1. Dynamic achievements, and special events where those who participate will receive a special unlock all sound like great ideas to me. Sony has said nothing on this front, and I wonder if they'll be left behind once again, trying to play catchup in this highly popular sub culture in gaming. On a side note, will trophies still have to be synced on PS4? They do on Vita, and it feels very old fashioned to have to manually do this when the 360 has been auto updating achievements in the cloud since 2005.
TL
For everything Sony gets right, they get something else very wrong. They design this brilliant new controller that everyone says is a joy to hold and use, but then they stick a large lightbar on the top of it that will surely irritate a great many users. They redesign their PSN store and make it really pretty to look at, but the usability suffers greatly, to the point where people literally dread using it. They pimp day one digital downloads, but they still have pathetically long download speeds for many users, making buying large games less appealing.
I'm just concerned that as we saw in the previous gen, Microsoft is constantly looking forward, and always ensures that the basics are done right. I don't have that same confidence with Sony, and I hope they prove me wrong next gen, but I believe there are already early warning signs that things may not be as blissful as some are expecting come launch.
Ok, I am going to answer all of your "concerns" as open and thorough as I can. Most of your concerns may not actually have to really be concerns for you. I guess it just depends on how much you really want them to remain concerns for you, or how much you really want a PS4. Please read all my explanations with an open mind to see what I mean.
1. You could use the electrical tape method. One piece about 2 inches long should cover the light bar. You are not slapping tape on a $400 electronic device, you are slapping it on a $60 controller, big difference. OR you could go play a Move game right now, and test your TV to see if you see a reflection. I have played dozens of Move games with my kids, and I have never noticed a reflection or been distracted by one at all.
2. This is still to be determined. They did say you could link your PSN ID with your Facebook account (if you wanted, its optional). However, Sony definitely has NOT said that you cannot change your PSN ID on the PS4. So this is going to have to be something asked directly to Sony or #yosp. Actually, #yosp has been asked this, but I don't see where an answer has been given, see the end of my post for more.
3. Download Speeds are something some people complain about, and others do not. It appears to be a user by user basis. I have never had any issues with downloading titles at all on my PS3 or Vita. They are just as fast as downloading on any of my other devices. You will find many people on GAF who do not have issues as well. Just ask!! However, with Sony implementing their new "Play as you Download" feature on the PS4, even if you are having speed issues, they are not going to be as restrictive for you since you can play PS4 games BEFORE they are done downloading. When you download a game, you can begin playing it after a portion of the game has been downloaded, then the game will continue downloading while you are playing. Finally, you could also even download titles using the Playstation Store or Playstation App, and the games will download while you are away from your PS4 and be ready when you get home, thus taking away less time from your gaming. See Number 4 for more about this.
4. Good thing about the PS Store is that you can now download titles from the PS Store from your PC, or from the new PlayStation App. If you don't like the PS Store Interface on the PS4, you have 2 more alternatives. I exclusively make purchases on the store on my PC anymore. The PlayStation Store changes and updates Sony has made isn't because they are "dumb" as you stated above. The store was updated to HTML5 so it could be accessed by other devices, such as your computer and in the future, the PlayStation App. It was updated to give you more choices, it is unfortunate that it is still slow to load and clunky on the PS3.
5. Trophies are in. They have trophies on the Vita and Sony showed this image of the PS4 user interface at the February reveal. Its pretty safe to assume that Trophies will carry over to the PS4, just like they did to the Vita from the PS3. Also, did you know that with PlayStation Plus your trophies are sync'd at night, automatically? You do NOT have to manually sync them with PlayStation Plus. I know manually syncing them is a big concern for you, but you don't have to as a Plus member. Trophies could even be more fun to achieve with the ability to share your gameplay videos to show off how to snag those super tough trophies, or you could allow your friend to take over your game to help you achieve them if needed. Taking this even further, in a game like Knack, if you are trying to find a specific part or gadget (say to achieve a trophy) you even get the choice to choose the item that is in a chest, or choose an item that any of your friends found at the same chest during their journey. The more friends you have, the more choices you have. Definitely a neat innovation and could really add some fun to the trophy hunt, if a trophy is associated with finding all the parts in the game.
So it looks like the real concern may stand with number 2. The good thing is, this is something that people have been asking for FOR YEARS on the PS3. It has also been gaining ground on GAF in the last month. I would love to change my PSN ID as well, but I am not going to assume I will never be able to on PS4 since it has never been confirmed by Sony that I will not be able to in the near future or at launch. I really hope this helps you out with your personal concerns and helps you decide which system you want to buy at launch.
3rdamention
Member
Ok, I am starting to think I may be wasting my time and I am just trying to help out. You made the first statement in the OP, then you later made the second. Are the Games going to help you make your decision? Or are your concerns going to help you make your decision? In my opinion, it appears you may already have your mind made up "the more you think about your concerns" so is it really going to help if we help you alleviate those concerns?
For what it's worth, I did my best to help in my above post.
Amazing that some people can over look or maybe brush aside one companies extreme attempt to fuck the consumer, had it been adopted, the precedent (not the actual reason for the precedent) could possibly be used to make arguments for no ownership in other industries. Thus potentially fucking consumers out of ownership in other industries where fathomable as well.
There was more at stake than games. How's that for a big picture?
We have a small idea and Sonys stated intentions, how PS4 will improve these first buy "deal breaking grievances". Hope for the better from Sony, just like you are from Microsoft OP. This point in time, if anyone needs hope for the better in the next-gen, it should be clear, that it's Microsoft.
There was more at stake than games. How's that for a big picture?
We have a small idea and Sonys stated intentions, how PS4 will improve these first buy "deal breaking grievances". Hope for the better from Sony, just like you are from Microsoft OP. This point in time, if anyone needs hope for the better in the next-gen, it should be clear, that it's Microsoft.
Youve never had plus have you?. Why the hell do you keep bringing up hardware releated ps3 issues when you are suppose to be talking about ps4. Alot of what is wrong with ps3 is releated to hardware, they backed themselves into a corner over os footprint and how memory was used leaving them little room for things like party chat trophy synching etc etc. Your complaints are silly and have nothing to do with ps4 as we know of it today. Its like complaining about 360s rrod when your talking about xboxone.
IdiotMyshkin
Banned
Stop feeding trolls guys...
Ok....I am OCD about ppl making claims that can be easily checked....
I just tried with both my 360 and PS3 controller.....I see nothing reflecting from my screen from where I sit.....about 8 - 8 & 1/2 feet away from the TV. Its 2:42 a.m where I am. lights out. I have a LCD HDTV, 55". Right up on the screen, yea I see it. I have to tilt the controllers in an awkward position tho.
Checking online I see I have a matte screen so that might help me. But... I can see my windows and other things in my TV screen when the lights are on or in the morning. Someone said they play in the dark alot and notices the glow from their controllers now....
If its matte vs glossy....I will try to get matte screens from now on. That said....if it is that....it wont effect everybody because we all dont have the same types of TV screens. And we all dont have our TV's at the same height, and we all dont sit the same distance from our TV's. If it is matte vs glossy.....they are having other reflecting issues beside lights from controllers.
I just tried with both my 360 and PS3 controller.....I see nothing reflecting from my screen from where I sit.....about 8 - 8 & 1/2 feet away from the TV. Its 2:42 a.m where I am. lights out. I have a LCD HDTV, 55". Right up on the screen, yea I see it. I have to tilt the controllers in an awkward position tho.
Checking online I see I have a matte screen so that might help me. But... I can see my windows and other things in my TV screen when the lights are on or in the morning. Someone said they play in the dark alot and notices the glow from their controllers now....
If its matte vs glossy....I will try to get matte screens from now on. That said....if it is that....it wont effect everybody because we all dont have the same types of TV screens. And we all dont have our TV's at the same height, and we all dont sit the same distance from our TV's. If it is matte vs glossy.....they are having other reflecting issues beside lights from controllers.
This really does come off as reaching.
Then you close saying for every good thing sony does, they do something else really wrong?
So, $399, but they havent talked about evolving trophies.
8gddr5 ram, but devs turn the light bar off.
Yup, damn those sneaky sons of bitches!
(seriously, I dont get this list)
EDIT just read passed page 1, yeah, you should have just said you want to buy an Xbox One. Clearly that is your preference, which is ok. It just comes off as petty when you create a least of minor issues and play it up as big concerns.
Then you close saying for every good thing sony does, they do something else really wrong?
So, $399, but they havent talked about evolving trophies.
8gddr5 ram, but devs turn the light bar off.
Yup, damn those sneaky sons of bitches!
(seriously, I dont get this list)
EDIT just read passed page 1, yeah, you should have just said you want to buy an Xbox One. Clearly that is your preference, which is ok. It just comes off as petty when you create a least of minor issues and play it up as big concerns.
freefornow
Gold Member
My concern at this stage is that Sony have had a great E3 with lots of promises. What if they dont deliver? They do have a track record of overpromising
Sony has had a pretty good year for promises.
Most of the stuff would be pretty hard to back out on, but I share your apprehension.
I dont count on it until its actually out and people are using it. Some stuff sounds too good be true. Also why I didnt lose it over the DRM shit for Xbox, it was too bad to be true.
Those are some graving concerns. I have some more for the list:
6) The visuals might be too real. Blurring the lines between the real world and virtual worlds might gradually lessen your ability to tell the difference. You are free roaming and you hijack a jetfighter only to realise you are not playing GTA.
7) The games might be too awesome. Real life will seem dull in comparison. Anything will be unable to stimulate you. A visit to a real zoo with plain animals, or a visit to a virtual zoo with dinosaurs and land-walking deep-sea creatures that you can blow up?
8) The system might be too easy to develop for. Developers will shitting out AAA titles every quarter. You will have to quit your job and divorce your family just to have the time to keep up.
9) The system might be too perfect. Now you have to make up next-gen issues that are not even issues.
6) The visuals might be too real. Blurring the lines between the real world and virtual worlds might gradually lessen your ability to tell the difference. You are free roaming and you hijack a jetfighter only to realise you are not playing GTA.
7) The games might be too awesome. Real life will seem dull in comparison. Anything will be unable to stimulate you. A visit to a real zoo with plain animals, or a visit to a virtual zoo with dinosaurs and land-walking deep-sea creatures that you can blow up?
8) The system might be too easy to develop for. Developers will shitting out AAA titles every quarter. You will have to quit your job and divorce your family just to have the time to keep up.
9) The system might be too perfect. Now you have to make up next-gen issues that are not even issues.
Not sure if OP is trolling...
Srsly? there's a light on the controller, so ok screw it not buying it anymore.
I can't change my psn name? OH NO NOW I MUST DEFINATELY NOT BUY IT.
Are you also not buying it because the vent is a bit too much to the left for your liking?
Or maybe you don't like the font that sony uses?
Srsly? there's a light on the controller, so ok screw it not buying it anymore.
I can't change my psn name? OH NO NOW I MUST DEFINATELY NOT BUY IT.
Are you also not buying it because the vent is a bit too much to the left for your liking?
Or maybe you don't like the font that sony uses?