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[BasilZero]

Woo! A new KoF!

 

[Urban Scholar]

netcode

netcode

NETCODE.

Someone please plaster this all over the office

 

[GrayFoxPL]

Maximum Impact 2 was great. I dont get the hate for it (First one was ok) and with how things are going now I believe they can make something interesting.

Yeah it's fun and content packed.

 

[Road]

Of particular interest is one of the images in that page: http://www.snkplaymore.co.jp/img/bana_recruit_20130515.png

If that's where they're going I hope it bombs so horribly SNKP will finally die.

 

[SAB CA]

Yashiro always hitting on ladies huh?
Iori too cool for school as always!

Yashiro has the right idea! I bet K' wouldn't show up, even if he was invited...

If that's where they're going I hope it bombs so horribly SNKP will finally die.

Yeah, because SNK has totally shown us that once they go 2D, they completly abandon their 2D passion, and make strictly 3D, right?

• Let's have some perspective here.
• More than 1 game can exist in a series.
• More than 1 graphic style can be applied to a series.
• Multiple games can be developed simultaneously.
• New game releases help make companies money.
• KoF XIII was a "Labor of Love" game. They need to make more than games that need 5 years in development, yet make less profits than your average shooter, to stay afloat.

They're pretty much fighting a fight for 2D pixelart, that no other company is willing to put nearly as much time and effort into. (No, Aksys stiff battle animations and people-void backgrounds are NOT in the same league.) Why would you wish death upon them, because they *gasp* might actually want to make a 3D game once every 5 or 10 years? Or might want to make them even more often, so they can have a presence in day-to-day gaming again?

 

[Slamtastic]

They should make a 2.5D series reboot titled simply "The King of Fighters" that has a good story mode, the kind that switches between various characters, with a decent English localization, with no delay in Japanese/Arcade release to US release, with a marketing campaign behind it.

Million seller.

 

[Loona]

Mai Without Ryu enbu? Hmmm...

In RyuEnBu I always for the impression the flames came from the fan, not the dress's tail.
In FF3 and RB1 she wore a more casual-looking version of her classic outfit and still had the move.

 

[JordanN]

Didn't know people hate 3D KOF.

I actually thought SNK has one of the best artstyles to be used for 3D video games.

 

[Fersis]

If that's where they're going I hope it bombs so horribly SNKP will finally die.

I wish i was a mod ...

>8(

 

[Sothpaw]

I wish figting games didn't destroy my wrists. KOF 13 looks really fun. Anyway I will be interested in watching the new game at least.

 

[SAB CA]

In RyuEnBu I always for the impression the flames came from the fan, not the dress's tail.
In FF3 and RB1 she wore a more casual-looking version of her classic outfit and still had the move.

Yeah, it's always kinda hard to tell if the Tail has anything to do with it. And they could always re-propose it to use the fans, or just give her a different moveset. Always fine with a return of:

(I love how super-big that move was in MI2, btw, haha.)

 

[The Light]

3D KoF? I'm up for it! just glad its not a pachinko game. Besides it's not like SNKP is going to abandon their 2d sprites so I don't get people wanting them to die (Which is dumb imo why would you want the devs of your favorite games gone?) I wonder if this is going to be maximum impact 3. I was sad to see it never happened. I can't wait to see what this 3D KoF looks like. I think sf4 models and art style turned a lot of people off 3d models especially those who enjoy 2d sprites more 3D models. I liked the look of most characters from the maximum impact series (Some designs were out there i'll admit)

Also I wonder if this has anything to do with the chinese KoF game? Terry and Benimaru were announced for it. Maybe this pushed SNKP to go 3D.

 

[Slamtastic]

Honestly people should check out good quality video of Xuan Dou Zhi Wang. It looks great. If KoF or Street Fighter looked this good, I'd be perfectly pleased. I've always thought that the Killer Instinct approach of pre-rendered 3D models, but with modern resolution/framecounts and a celshaded or other stylized look would be the perfect way to have an "old school" look to your fighting game, without spending tons of time and money drawing sprites.

 

[The Light]

Honestly people should check out good quality video of Xuan Dou Zhi Wang. It looks great. If KoF or Street Fighter looked this good, I'd be perfectly pleased. I've always thought that the Killer Instinct approach of pre-rendered 3D models, but with modern resolution/framecounts and a celshaded or other stylized look would be the perfect way to have an "old school" look to your fighting game, without spending tons of time and money drawing sprites.

Wish I could play this. Also this game is actually the reason why I wouldn't care if KoF went 3D. It looks fantastic!

 

[SDBurton]

Put Vanessa and/or Blue Mary in this one plz.

This please. PLEASE.

 

[sibarraz]

Next-gen KOF?! :O

The announce says experience in 360 and PS3 so I doubt it

 

[Loona]

Yeah, it's always kinda hard to tell if the Tail has anything to do with it. And they could always re-propose it to use the fans, or just give her a different moveset. Always fine with a return of:

(I love how super-big that move was in MI2, btw, haha.)

One of the little things i loved to see in MI2 was that they gave her Kouhadan, which both Andy and Hokutomaru used - pretty much the only move both shared depite both practicing Shiranui ninjustsu - it just plain made sense that she'd have it too, so she got it - no idea it it made the game balance worse or something, but it's the kind of SNK history element that made that game fangasmic.

And since technically Mai's supposed to be the primary authority on the style (in KoF XIII Chin mentions now only her and Andy carry the style, Hokutomaru learning from them it seems - since she's from the actual family, she trumps the others), her moves don't have to be set in stone, since she could borrow anything from Andy or Hokutomaru that could be useful without breaking the game.
Again, it's something that 3D makes simpler than 2D, stuff like EX version of characters with tweaked movesets.

 

[Triple Da G.O.D!]

They do play completely different, and Cham Cham had a lot more relevance in her setting and game than Felicia had in hers. SNK was quite willing to celebrate their similarities with her alternate palette and a card in Card Fighters though.

Cham-Cham serves her purpose trying to succeed where Tam-Tam failed and...didn't.

Felicia just wants to sing on Broadway, open up orphanages and live up to Sister Rose. Complete Successful Mission Accomplished!

And Cham- Cham's super just looks plain badass, while Felicia's just emphasizes her relative helplessness.

Beast Rush vs Sexy Kitty Cat Gang Rape Curb Stomp? You be the judge. But in due honesty Cham-Cham's Beast Rush in competitive play is a lot more useful and I'll give it that. Cham-Cham also is awarded points for being the rep for the SS Pachislot games.

Wasn't Cham Cham's craft from an actual leopard or something while Mignon's basically cosplaying. One of those just feels more badass than the other, but hey, personal preference.

It was on both accounts. You're accepting of the badass and I'm more into how nice of a service a Cat Suit does Mignon. But hey, personal preference right?

I have no problem with new faces, but if someone's going to be a new protagonist in an established series, I expect a decent and believable connection to the existing setting and characters - the Meiras feel a bit off because they're outright stated as the ones in charge of a city with a reputation for being violent, by inheriting that role from some guy who somehow managed to succeed Geese when someone with mind control abilities like White from RB Dominated Mind couldn't. They're basically trying to get this supposed inherited authority from an usurper who got their father figure killed.

The protagonists are new, the dead father figure is new, the usurper is new, no narrative is provided to explain the transition to this new cast from the old one, not even from Terry or Rock who should know a thing or two about the whole mess.

It ended up feeling like bad fanfic.

Alba & Soiree didn't ask for Fate to catch one to the skull but they're dealing with it the best they can by being the leaders that South Town needs at the moment.

Can we really count White here? Dominated Mind as much as I wish it was isn't canon. White needed a subordinate and a brainwashed Billy Kane fits the bill. Can't knock White for that. Would've been better to introduce a 3rd character into the mix but the streets still scream "WHERE'S ALFRED AT???!!!?!"

When it comes to the changing of the guard remember that this would take the place of Mark of the Wolves in canon so Terry, Rock and other important characters being on the outside of this shouldn't be surprising. What is weird is how much Seth is tied into the story.

When K' and Ash were introduced, sooner or later we got a rather clear view of their connection to those who came beforee, namely Kyo, without aping his own narrative.

In the classic South Town stories, AoF and FF, the protagonists deal with loss from an already fragile position:
* after Ryo and Yuri's mother died, not long after their fther went missing, so Ryo had to get a job to support the two of them while, and his game begins with the loss of his remaining family member, looking everywhere for her with the son of a friend of his missing fatehr, for lack of anyone else to turn to
* Terry and Andy also lost the family they did have, and are implied to have left the city, and in Andy's case in particular, spent the following years preparing to return - their father figure got killed in the middle of the street in broad daylight and nobody could do a damn thing about it because it was the then police commissioner who did it with his bare hands, so their safety was compromised - it took them 10 years to return and had little help to deal with the situation by the time they returned.

The South Town setting is pretty rich and filled with characters and little details the writers added that nobody asked for that could have provided many "bridges" betweent he known stories and a new one, but we got a pale imitation with little relation to what was already there.

And then they tossed in aliens in the damn thing in MI2... now that was really unnecessary, where there was so much already in that fairly grounded setting they could have drawn from, and even the more fantastic elements introduced by the Jin scrolls story from FF3 and RB3, or even all the stuff from Last Blade which shares its continuity.

And the odd thing is, whomever put together the Another Day mini-series seemed aware of it - the 2nd episode starts with Rock seeing himself in Geese's place like in the ending to Real Bout when Geese chooses death to being saved.

Considering in FF3 the Jin twins were poossessed by their ancestors in what was apparently in the scope of the scrolls' teaching, it could be a hint at Geese's spirit living on through his offspring's body. It's the closest thing we have to a hint at Geese's legacy hinted by Kain in Garou until the day that gets a proper sequel.
When i saw that new portrait today I couldn't help but wonder if they were taking on such an idea...

But they went with flippin' aliens and new Marty Stu protagonist...

They needed to make a drastic turn from the perceived norm and when you get the whole Jivatma & Judeim plot appearing out of nowhere. This is one of the reasons we need to play the rest out. They left the plot on a complete cliff and it was looking as MI3 was going to answer any questions on the subject.

I appreciate them trying to do something different and maybe if they would've pulled from a bit of the "reality" the series is steeped in then maybe more would get it. But if they want to say people are aliens they can seeing as Metal Slug is canon.

That's the thing - SNK knew they were dealing with a new game with a different system (which merged the existing games' nicely), so they made sure to put sufficient focus on the known qualities while keeping an eloquent, but not overwhelming, focus on the new setting - it would have been nice if falcoon and company had learned from that elegant solution from a not so distant past, especially when making such a big jump in format and graphics despite retaining a known name.

MI does this. It's the 2D you love but here's a sidestep and some Style Combos so it could be its own thing. It didn't go reinvent the wheel because it was already functioning fine. It just needed that little bit something extra to make it all work and to me it did that. Very successfully I might add.

 

[DR2K]

KOF13 was a 3D game with 2D sprites drawn over them.

 

[TreIII]

They're pretty much fighting a fight for 2D pixelart, that no other company is willing to put nearly as much time and effort into. (No, Aksys stiff battle animations and people-void backgrounds are NOT in the same league.) Why would you wish death upon them, because they *gasp* might actually want to make a 3D game once every 5 or 10 years? Or might want to make them even more often, so they can have a presence in day-to-day gaming again?

Exactly.

Again, taking upwards of 5 or so years to deliver the kind of game they wanted us to have in KOFXIII, and with little to nothing else to speak of in the meantime? That's nowhere close to a viable business model.

I sincerely hope that SNKP will still be able to make 2D sprite-based games, as well. But I wouldn't at all mind them giving me more fun games (2D, 3D or otherwise) to play in the meanwhile.

They needed to make a drastic turn from the perceived norm and when you get the whole Jivatma & Judeim plot appearing out of nowhere. This is one of the reasons we need to play the rest out. They left the plot on a complete cliff and it was looking as MI3 was going to answer any questions on the subject.

I appreciate them trying to do something different and maybe if they would've pulled from a bit of the "reality" the series is steeped in then maybe more would get it. But if they want to say people are aliens they can seeing as Metal Slug is canon.

I guess side more with Loona on this, however. Even as much as I actually ended up liking the "Super Meira Bros." and Duke, a lot of their overall plotline just came off as being "...and this needed to involve Southtown why, now...?"

I mean, seriously...what I loved about the Southtown saga was that it was actually "more down to Earth" compared to other fighting game narratives (certainly KOF, at least). And when Falcoon seemed poised to immediately cite the Southtown storyline for MI? I was actually interested in seeing what perhaps he could do with it, even if it wasn't going to be a definitive "MOTW2" (yet).

But then we somehow transferred over from gang warfare in the streets of Southtown...right back to the same "fiendish organization" shtick from KOF proper, with a bit of spice added in by aliens.

It just came off as even more a waste of established mythos than KOF2000 randomly blowing up Southtown in that continuity. What else did that accomplish, beyond a bit of "shock value" that they haven't capitalized on since?

 

[thesolidshark]

If it's MI3 they're making, good; I liked the first two.

If it's KOFXIV they're making, great; a dream match with more of that sprite style is always welcome.

More than anything, I just want a good fighter released by SNK again, playable on consoles, and for these incoming employees to continue working on more playable games. Build up the studio so we can see a new Garou, Samsho (2D please), Last Blade, AoF, etc.

 

[Boss Doggie]

I kinda miss Shinkiro doing SNK art. I miss them George Clooney faces.

 

[Loona]

Cham-Cham serves her purpose trying to succeed where Tam-Tam failed and...didn't.

Felicia just wants to sing on Broadway, open up orphanages and live up to Sister Rose. Complete Successful Mission Accomplished!

Felicia has no relevant role in the Demitri & Morrigan & Pyron & Jedah Show, she's just kinda there because catgirls are popular.

Meanwhile Cham-Cham's actually trying to recover an artifact from her homeland that those pesky Ambrosia minions keep stealing to further their plans - despite her success or lack thereof she actually has a decent reason to get involved.

Alba & Soiree didn't ask for Fate to catch one to the skull but they're dealing with it the best they can by being the leaders that South Town needs at the moment.

This declared "leader" status is what doesn't sit well with me fells weird, implausible - in the MI setting I could understand Fate being mentioned as powerful figure, but the moment he gets killed and Duke and his posse move in to take over there's very little reason to consider Fate's would inherit the role when Duke is clearly taking it.

Also, all they do is tell us the Meiras are supposed to be leaders, they never plausibly show it.
Then again, paying much mind to something someone with Alba's hair says kinda defies imagination.

Can we really count White here? Dominated Mind as much as I wish it was isn't canon. White needed a subordinate and a brainwashed Billy Kane fits the bill. Can't knock White for that. Would've been better to introduce a 3rd character into the mix but the streets still scream "WHERE'S ALFRED AT???!!!?!"

Dominated Mind is explicitly mentioned as a FF series entry in the Fatal Fury anniversary, and its story is about an atrempt at taking advantage of the power vacuum in South Town following Geese's death - despite a PS1 Japan-only release, both those factors work toward making it count.

I appreciate them trying to do something different and maybe if they would've pulled from a bit of the "reality" the series is steeped in then maybe more would get it. But if they want to say people are aliens they can seeing as Metal Slug is canon.

I'm on my phone so it's trick to check, but doesn't Metal Slug take place in a time slightly ahead, maybe a decade or two, from the fighting game series, even if the Ikari cast joined later?
While they have their own canon, not all of it is necessary transplanted to other setting just because Fio drops by...

Last I checked the MS series feature 2 alien species, martians and those news guys that appeared in MS6, none of them humanoid.

An an unlockable character, IIRC Fio has no actual ending of her own in MI2, which would have been an opportunity to put Jivatma in perspective with her setting, but AFAIK that remains unaddressed.

MI does this. It's the 2D you love but here's a sidestep and some Style Combos so it could be its own thing. It didn't go reinvent the wheel because it was already functioning fine. It just needed that little bit something extra to make it all work and to me it did that. Very successfully I might add.

I meant in terms of setting and easing us into the new cast - I had no major issues with the gameplay, though I'm not heavily competitive enough to identify some kinds of problems there.
I tended to ignore the dial-a-combos and roll my eyes at the term "Stylish Combos" though.
I wonder if I missed some excluve animations used there, and if so, if they're Youtubed.

 

[TreIII]

I kinda miss Shinkiro doing SNK art. I miss them George Clooney faces.

Even if he did come back to SNKP, I think he's come quite a bit of ways since then. TvC and MvC3 should demonstrate that, certainly.

On that topic, though...I wonder if possibly going in a 3D direction would at all have to do with trying to avoid subduing workers to the kind of nightmarish situations that dictated KOFXII/KOFXIII's developments.

Reading the kinds of things I've seen in the various SNK-related threads over at MMCafe? It definitely seemed like things needed to change for more than one reason. Prospective job seekers might not even want to apply for these jobs, otherwise.

 

[Noisepurge]

Maximum Impact 3. Lets go! (I secretly liked the previous two)

 

[Mileena]

Netcode or no buy. Simple as that SNK, not going in blind like with XIII.

 

[Triple Da G.O.D!]

Felicia has no relevant role in the Demitri & Morrigan & Pyron & Jedah Show, she's just kinda there because catgirls are popular.

Meanwhile Cham-Cham's actually trying to recover an artifact from her homeland that those pesky Ambrosia minions keep stealing to further their plans - despite her success or lack thereof she actually has a decent reason to get involved.

We're talking success and failure at their goals and these 2 being judged upon these factors alone regardless of importance and the facts speak for themselves.

And at the same time Darkstalkers is and will never be Felicia's show. Everybody in that series takes a back seat to Demitri & Morrigan. The same can be said for Cham-Cham who isn't even the same league of story importance like Haohmaru & Genjyuro to put both character's importance to their respective series in perspective.

This declared "leader" status is what doesn't sit well with me fells weird, implausible - in the MI setting I could understand Fate being mentioned as powerful figure, but the moment he gets killed and Duke and his posse move in to take over there's very little reason to consider Fate's would inherit the role when Duke is clearly taking it.

Also, all they do is tell us the Meiras are supposed to be leaders, they never plausibly show it.
Then again, paying much mind to something someone with Alba's hair says kinda defies imagination.

The streets respected that Fate was in charge and in proxy show Alba & Soiree that same respect when he's killed. Duke is just mad salty about his past with Fate and finally does something about it. And the Meira boys did something. They went and kicked Duke's ass to bring peace to the city. If that doesn't scream leadership and taking responsibility then tell me what does.

Dominated Mind is explicitly mentioned as a FF series entry in the Fatal Fury anniversary, and its story is about an atrempt at taking advantage of the power vacuum in South Town following Geese's death - despite a PS1 Japan-only release, both those factors work toward making it count.

Nope. Still a non-canon entry because of Memory of Stray Wolves. It makes no mention of White and confirms nothing happens after Real Bout 1. Some argue that RB2 has some place in canon with the introduction of Rick & Xiang Fei (and technically Alfred) but even I'm unsure if this is true. I usually roll with it as such though because of my belief in the KoF mirror effect. This same little movie is the one that dumps FF1 out of canon and puts Wild Ambition in its place. Geese just gets his ass whipped instead of falling from Geese Tower the first time. Other than that the rest of FF1 events take place as normal.

I'm on my phone so it's trick to check, but doesn't Metal Slug take place in a time slightly ahead, maybe a decade or two, from the fighting game series, even if the Ikari cast joined later?
While they have their own canon, not all of it is necessary transplanted to other setting just because Fio drops by...

Last I checked the MS series feature 2 alien species, martians and those news guys that appeared in MS6, none of them humanoid.

An an unlockable character, IIRC Fio has no actual ending of her own in MI2, which would have been an opportunity to put Jivatma in perspective with her setting, but AFAIK that remains unaddressed.

KoF and Metal Slug share continuity. All that mention was for is that in this universe aliens exist so not too far fetched for one to run a tournament. This is the same universe where a little kid gives his body up to become a God so...

I meant in terms of setting and easing us into the new cast - I had no major issues with the gameplay, though I'm not heavily competitive enough to identify some kinds of problems there.
I tended to ignore the dial-a-combos and roll my eyes at the term "Stylish Combos" though.
I wonder if I missed some excluve animations used there, and if so, if they're Youtubed

The thing is how could that have been done anyway? The best thing they did do is include favorites from KoF so you had a familiar face to ease you in. And they could've skipped that entirely if they wanted to but didn't and did the game a service because of it.

Stylish Combos are hugely important to MI metagame because they're very important for hit confirms and Guard Breaks. This was countered in MI2/Reg A with the addition of the Sabaki to balance it and how combos and walls work together was rebalanced for Reg A.

And you missed some. Most of them you'll find in MI2/Reg A.

 

[Mesharey]

MI2 was really good, will get their next game 2D or 3D.

 

[Loona]

We're talking success and failure at their goals and these 2 being judged upon these factors alone regardless of importance and the facts speak for themselves.

You're talking success and failure, I'm talking setting relevance.
Felicia's goals would be best served by a ryhtm game than The fighting setting that is Darkstalkers - furtinately for her, once again SvC MotM was the superior game and let her take on that genre in one of the mini-games

And at the same time Darkstalkers is and will never be Felicia's show. Everybody in that series takes a back seat to Demitri & Morrigan. The same can be said for Cham-Cham who isn't even the same league of story importance like Haohmaru & Genjyuro to put both character's importance to their respective series in perspective.

Haohmaru has importance in the SS setting, as by the 3D games on the NeoGeo 64 Yuga still wanted hos body to serve Ambrosia - Genjuro is there to be Haohmaru's rival and general asshole, but the broader setting has otherwise little use for him.

The streets respected that Fate was in charge and in proxy show Alba & Soiree that same respect when he's killed. Duke is just mad salty about his past with Fate and finally does something about it. And the Meira boys did something. They went and kicked Duke's ass to bring peace to the city. If that doesn't scream leadership and taking responsibility then tell me what does.

Fate didn't get enough mentions or screentime to make the whole thing believable - I don't know if this was due to development constraints or poor storytelling in the rush to push the Meira boys to the forefront.

Nope. Still a non-canon entry because of Memory of Stray Wolves. It makes no mention of White and confirms nothing happens after Real Bout 1. Some argue that RB2 has some place in canon with the introduction of Rick & Xiang Fei (and technically Alfred) but even I'm unsure if this is true. I usually roll with it as such though because of my belief in the KoF mirror effect. This same little movie is the one that dumps FF1 out of canon and puts Wild Ambition in its place. Geese just gets his ass whipped instead of falling from Geese Tower the first time. Other than that the rest of FF1 events take place as normal.

Memories of Stray Wolves is mostly Terry telling Rock what he knows, and White was mostly Alfred's issue, so it's possible Terry wasn't perticularly involved in that failed coup.

Wild Ambition I have no problems with, but as far as RB2 goes, there are too many common points between Kim, Chonshu, Chonrei and Tung's endings for those to be discarded - esoecially when in RBS you fight Chonshu in Kim's stage and Chonrei in Tung's.

KoF and Metal Slug share continuity. All that mention was for is that in this universe aliens exist so not too far fetched for one to run a tournament. This is the same universe where a little kid gives his body up to become a God so...

One of the nicer things about KoF XIII's story is that its time shennanigans can now be used to explain any older or newer oddities in canon and diverging timelines, from no more K9999 to the presence of SS, LB, Kizuna Encounter or MS characters in stages to the oddbalk strikers in KoF 2000.
I'm curious to see what the future brings...

The thing is how could that have been done anyway? The best thing they did do is include favorites from KoF so you had a familiar face to ease you in. And they could've skipped that entirely if they wanted to but didn't and did the game a service because of it.

SNK(P) make terrible business decisions, but they're not dumb enough to leave out familiar characters entirely when they want to push some new ones - I just felt the balance was off in MI, more than it was with KoFs 94, 99 and 2003 as well as Garou, all of which had new protagonists, but tied them well to the familar cast and setting in different ways.

Considering the new KoF sprites went with as classic a look as possible for everyone to keep them recognizeable - even if Garou Terry and FFWA Ryo are superior in every possible way - I figure they might refrain a bit from that MI strategy if it's getting a sequel.

 

[BOTEC]

Now, I'm a pretty big SNK fan, and am all for them doing shit that isn't motherfucking cellphone games, BUT, the last 3D game they put out was Samurai Spirits/Shodown Sen... Just sayin'

 

[Loona]

Now, I'm a pretty big SNK fan, and am all for them doing shit that isn't motherfucking cellphone games, BUT, the last 3D game they put out was Samurai Spirits/Shodown Sen... Just sayin'

If you compare their first game of any of their 2D series with later work you see a world of a difference.
Heck, compare KoF XII with XIII. Or the original arcade XIII with its console version.

They seem quite capable of learning from past mistakes.

 

[Big0Bear]

Ohhhhh man I dont know how I feel about this I loved 13 and after 12 it was a good fix but man......didnt really care for the MI.............dont mess this up SNKP!

 

[BOTEC]

If you compare their first game of any of their 2D series with later work you see a world of a difference.
Heck, compare KoF XII with XIII. Or the original arcade XIII with its console version.

They seem quite capable of learning from past mistakes.

Maybe, but I'd much rather play Art Of Fighting 1, then Sen.

What I'm saying is that I would LOVE SNK to get their shit together, and make awesome games again, but I just don't think they have any internal vision or talent anymore. Sadly, I think becoming a Mobage dev house is their destiny, which super fucking sucks.

 

[Loona]

Maybe, but I'd much rather play Art Of Fighting 1, then Sen.

What I'm saying is that I would LOVE SNK to get their shit together, and make awesome games again, but I just don't think they have any internal vision or talent anymore. Sadly, I think becoming a Mobage dev house is their destiny, which super fucking sucks.

If they had no internal talent then KoF XIII wouldn't have succeeded in so many ways.

I'm not expecting a perfect fresh start on early 3D experiments, but I'm willing to help make refinement on whatever they try possible, as long as it's not something as embarrassing as some past Japan-only releases.

 

[BOTEC]

If they had no internal talent then KoF XIII wouldn't have succeeded in so many ways.

I'm not expecting a perfect fresh start on early 3D experiments, but I'm willing to help make refinement on whatever they try possible, as long as it's not something as embarrassing as some past Japan-only releases.

Yeah XIII (2D) was great, but Metal Slug 2006 (3D) was a piece of shit. I just have no confidence in SNK's 3D department. The best 3D game SNK ever published was KOF Sky Stage, developed by MOSS, which was still crap. I can't stay optimistic given the weight of this evidence.

 

[fates]

Not sure if want, I need my SNK sprites.

 

[Douche McBaggins The 3rd]

I don't mind 3d too much. Though it does have to play like 2d like SF4 to be good. Hopefully it's on a 2d plane with 3d characters and the same fast and fluid gameplay of previous games. But to continue the true KOF series, they have to have 2d sprites. Hell make new 2d sprites for Fatal Fury and Art of Fighting, and all those other series. Use those same sprites for KOF for later games so they can all share assets. Get as many sprites out there so you can have a big roster.

 

[TreIII]

If they had no internal talent then KoF XIII wouldn't have succeeded in so many ways.

I'm not expecting a perfect fresh start on early 3D experiments, but I'm willing to help make refinement on whatever they try possible, as long as it's not something as embarrassing as some past Japan-only releases.

The more I look at XuanDouZhiWang? The more I could see a possibility why SNKP may be relishing the idea of using 3D polygons in a similar fashion. Perhaps Terry and Benimaru's appearance in this game may be a hint of what is to come?

If it means using 3D models, and just skipping the step where they draw pixels on thousands of frames of animation, so that we can get games faster (and with more characters, as fitting a KOF release)? I'd be all for it, actually. XD actually looks quite good and apparently plays quite good too. Wouldn't mind a future KOF game that looks like that.

 

[Triple Da G.O.D!]

You're talking success and failure, I'm talking setting relevance.
Felicia's goals would be best served by a ryhtm game than The fighting setting that is Darkstalkers - furtinately for her, once again SvC MotM was the superior game and let her take on that genre in one of the mini-games

Confirmed we're having 2 separate conversations. Thing is when we have yours about Cham-Cham she's still low on the totem of importance. Just like Felicia there to fill a character slot and nothing more than that. Also Having next to or even no relevance to the stories in which they're featured in.

And for a fun comparison outside of their setting, Felicia is more important to X Edge than Cham-Cham is to SS RPG and Cham-Cham is a main character in hers. WHATDAFUCKUPWITDAT??!?

Haohmaru has importance in the SS setting, as by the 3D games on the NeoGeo 64 Yuga still wanted hos body to serve Ambrosia - Genjuro is there to be Haohmaru's rival and general asshole, but the broader setting has otherwise little use for him.

And even with Genjyuro being the Iori to Haohmaru's Kyo is still important to the story than Cham-Cham will ever be. Those are the breaks.

Fate didn't get enough mentions or screentime to make the whole thing believable - I don't know if this was due to development constraints or poor storytelling in the rush to push the Meira boys to the forefront.

True. But he got plenty of novel time. Take the time to read those sometimes. They give a lot more rhyme and reason to the things the game fails to explain for whatever reason. And there are a few to read. Most of them are through the eyes of Alba.

Memories of Stray Wolves is mostly Terry telling Rock what he knows, and White was mostly Alfred's issue, so it's possible Terry wasn't perticularly involved in that failed coup.

Wild Ambition I have no problems with, but as far as RB2 goes, there are too many common points between Kim, Chonshu, Chonrei and Tung's endings for those to be discarded - esoecially when in RBS you fight Chonshu in Kim's stage and Chonrei in Tung's.

Actually the whole nothing comes after RB1 stuff is a SNK mandate. That is one of the reasons that Memory of Stray Wolves even exists. And the other thing that MoSW does is to confirm that

Spoiler

Krauser commited suicide after his loss to Terry in FF2.

Which then retcons everything after Geese's death.

Spoiler

Just like his big brother though he's very much alive in the KoF universe though. Thanks KoF '96!

And before MoSW all of that stuff with the Jin twins would've mattered some but as you know now that all of that magic continuity is undone. They couldn't even get a Special D-Assault in NeoGeo Battle Coliseum. WHATDAFUCKUPWITDAT??!?

One of the nicer things about KoF XIII's story is that its time shennanigans can now be used to explain any older or newer oddities in canon and diverging timelines, from no more K9999 to the presence of SS, LB, Kizuna Encounter or MS characters in stages to the oddbalk strikers in KoF 2000.
I'm curious to see what the future brings...

You could but no plausible reason to do. Cameos are just that and should be treated as such. Just a fun treat for fans to have and no reason to complicate that. And K9999 still exists. Them swapping him for Nameless in a Dream Match scenario doesn't change that one bit. He & Angel had their time and that's just how it is.

SNK(P) make terrible business decisions, but they're not dumb enough to leave out familiar characters entirely when they want to push some new ones - I just felt the balance was off in MI, more than it was with KoFs 94, 99 and 2003 as well as Garou, all of which had new protagonists, but tied them well to the familar cast and setting in different ways.

Considering the new KoF sprites went with as classic a look as possible for everyone to keep them recognizeable - even if Garou Terry and FFWA Ryo are superior in every possible way - I figure they might refrain a bit from that MI strategy if it's getting a sequel.

MI for SNK was the same approach they took with Garou by focusing heavily on the new cast and let those characters drive their story. But like I pointed out before MI is the retelling of FF1 to a degree. Putting the spotlight firmly on the Meira boys and their immediate circle made complete sense regardless of who was on the character select screen with them.

Just like AoF is Ryo's story, FF is Terry's, KoF is Kyo's & Garou is Rock's, Maximum Impact is the story of Alba & Soiree Meira and that's just that. Let them have it. If a 3rd game is for real then there isn't too much they can do with the plot other than to finish it and then just like KoF always does when one story reaches the finish is just to pass the torch to the next and let it continue.

 

[.la1n]

Kind of has the Garou Terry coat. 3d Garou sequel? Given the Garou card game we know they are into that series still.

Excellent idea. Mark of the Wolves is my favorite game.

 

[Loona]

And for a fun comparison outside of their setting, Felicia is more important to X Edge than Cham-Cham is to SS RPG and Cham-Cham is a main character in hers. WHATDAFUCKUPWITDAT??!?

I'm not sure about SS RPG, but I've been playing through Cross Edge and Felicia's relevance there kinda boils down to recognizing Morrigan (amnesia everywhere), terrifying Prinny by simply wanting to play with it and having some nice early game combos with other characters - then again I just reached the Jedah battle, and the interaction there is mostly with Morrigan, while the game's general setting fit Jedah like a glive from the look of things.
Felicia does get ti have a planned performance with Wonder Momo in Namco X Capcom and is the one character shering a team with a Namco character in that game, which trumps any relevance in XE so dar, I guess I should finish that game.

And even with Genjyuro being the Iori to Haohmaru's Kyo is still important to the story than Cham-Cham will ever be. Those are the breaks.

Important in what what way? He solos his way through SS RPG, but that's about it in distinguishing factors.
And technically Iori is the Genjuro to Kyo's Haohmaru, SS2 was out before KoF95.

True. But he got plenty of novel time. Take the time to read those sometimes. They give a lot more rhyme and reason to the things the game fails to explain for whatever reason. And there are a few to read. Most of them are through the eyes of Alba.

Where are those novels you speak of?
There's in-game text and I had those translated Hong-Kong comics of questionable relevance, which have their own spin on Alba's role, but that's it.
Something penned by Ureshino?

Actually the whole nothing comes after RB1 stuff is a SNK mandate. That is one of the reasons that Memory of Stray Wolves even exists. And the other thing that MoSW does is to confirm that

Spoiler

Krauser commited suicide after his loss to Terry in FF2.

Which then retcons everything after Geese's death.

Spoiler

Just like his big brother though he's very much alive in the KoF universe though. Thanks KoF '96!

Card Fighters DS also mentions that detail, doesn't change much in the following game outside character slots, which can be taken with a frain of salt as long as Feese is there, especially if they get joke endings unreferenced antwhere else.

And before MoSW all of that stuff with the Jin twins would've mattered some but as you know now that all of that magic continuity is undone. They couldn't even get a Special D-Assault in NeoGeo Battle Coliseum. WHATDAFUCKUPWITDAT??!?

I'm calling development constraint on that obe, the way character pairs were setup on the select screen hints at more themed double assaults which didn't make it, like Chonshu and Chonrei, Lee and Tung, Geese and Big and so on.
But people used more mixed teams in the tournaments that happened for that game, so it was a pragmatic approach not to focus on that too much - I'm still glad that they included what they did.

You could but no plausible reason to do. Cameos are just that and should be treated as such. Just a fun treat for fans to have and no reason to complicate that. And K9999 still exists. Them swapping him for Nameless in a Dream Match scenario doesn't change that one bit. He & Angel had their time and that's just how it is.

He's in a time limbo deeper than Ash's because of lawyers and you know it.

It's kind of amazing they still bothered to flesh out Nameless as much as a replacement in a plotless game like 2K2UM though.

MI for SNK was the same approach they took with Garou by focusing heavily on the new cast and let those characters drive their story. But like I pointed out before MI is the retelling of FF1 to a degree. Putting the spotlight firmly on the Meira boys and their immediate circle made complete sense regardless of who was on the character select screen with them.

FFWA is the retelling of FF1, MI is an atrempt at following its legacy through clumsy imitation through mostly new and unconnected characters, there's a bit of a difference.

 

[Triple Da G.O.D!]

I'm not sure about SS RPG, but I've been playing through Cross Edge and Felicia's relevance there kinda boils down to recognizing Morrigan (amnesia everywhere), terrifying Prinny by simply wanting to play with it and having some nice early game combos with other characters - then again I just reached the Jedah battle, and the interaction there is mostly with Morrigan, while the game's general setting fit Jedah like a glive from the look of things.

Felicia does get ti have a planned performance with Wonder Momo in Namco X Capcom and is the one character shering a team with a Namco character in that game, which trumps any relevance in XE so dar, I guess I should finish that game.

Felicia's relevance in RPG's be so nice even you had to say something about Namco X Capcom.

Important in what what way? He solos his way through SS RPG, but that's about it in distinguishing factors.

And technically Iori is the Genjuro to Kyo's Haohmaru, SS2 was out before KoF95.

I wasn't even talking about RPG. I was talking SS period. The only role Genjyuro plays is the foil to one of the main characters and that's more than Cham-Cham ever does.

Even if techically so, even though we're having this back and forth, how many people would understand it the way you stated it versus the way I did. Kyo & Iori just happen to be a bit more popular than Haohmaru & Genjyuro. Makes the comparison a bit easier to make tinged with the fact that Kyo & Iori's beef goes a whole lot deeper than the latter we speak of as well.

Where are those novels you speak of?
There's in-game text and I had those translated Hong-Kong comics of questionable relevance, which have their own spin on Alba's role, but that's it.
Something penned by Ureshino?

There were a couple of these on the websites for MI & MI2 and they're translated on the SNK Wikia. Maximum Impact 1 Character Stories, Maximum Impact 2 Novellas & Character Prologues. There were some other stuff that was floating around years ago but those things may be lost to time.

Card Fighters DS also mentions that detail, doesn't change much in the following game outside character slots, which can be taken with a frain of salt as long as Feese is there, especially if they get joke endings unreferenced antwhere else.

Not much of a detail as much as it rectons major events in that series. MoSW changed a lot about how SNK's mainline canon worked and accidentally in proxy made KoF's even more out there.

I'm calling development constraint on that obe, the way character pairs were setup on the select screen hints at more themed double assaults which didn't make it, like Chonshu and Chonrei, Lee and Tung, Geese and Big and so on.
But people used more mixed teams in the tournaments that happened for that game, so it was a pragmatic approach not to focus on that too much - I'm still glad that they included what they did.

I see I wasn't the only person to notice that. And people wonder why I want a sequel so bad other than the fact it was already a good sequel to start with.

He's in a time limbo deeper than Ash's because of lawyers and you know it.

It's kind of amazing they still bothered to flesh out Nameless as much as a replacement in a plotless game like 2K2UM though.

SNK didn't want to deal with the Akira stuff. Fine. K9999 & Angel walked away from the wreckage of NESTS' space station for Angel to be forever relegated to cameos for all her days.

And what they did with Nameless was pretty cool I will admit. A lot better than what Capcom did with Donovan & Dee.

FFWA is the retelling of FF1, MI is an atrempt at following its legacy through clumsy imitation through mostly new and unconnected characters, there's a bit of a difference.

Clumsy imitation is a bit harsh. I like the words "inspired heavily by past events." From past interviews and stuff I learned about the production of the game was that there were a lot of ideas floating around at the time and when that happens someone's vision gets left behind. I remember hearing that the game was drastically different very early in development and things changed over time. And don't forget we didn't get the fantastical stuff until Ureshino handled the story for MI2.

 

[Bucca]

Return Blue Mary to us pls.

The Queen needs to make her triumphant reveal to HD.

 

[A.E Suggs]

Could this be to help with doing the 3D models they used to make sprites?

Please?

If not, that's cool. I loved Maximum Impact.

This is the way I feel. Honestly knowing that SNK is still alive and kicking is good enough for me.

Wow @ Mad Man's Cafe still existing.

WoW! Your right! Haven't seen that place in about 9 years.

 

[Tizoc]

Soooooooooooooo here's my idea for a roster for a new SamSho fighting game-
Tachibana Ukyo, Galford, Haohmaru, Naokruru, Charlotte
Killian, Yagyu Jubei, Hattori Hanzo, Senryo Kyoshiro, Kubikiri Basara
Sogetsu, J, Mina, Angelica, Kazuki
Draco, Zankuro, Amakusa, Mizuki, , Asura
Hisame Shizumaru, Iroha, Tokugawa, Andrew, Rimururu
Genjuro, N. , Sieger, Shiki, Wanfu, , Kukuro

 

[SAB CA]

So, everyone's see Guilty Gear Xrd by now.

SNKP already has the models for LOADS of characters (all the ones in XIII) + The ones for various background characters that were used in XIII (Marco, Adel, Rose, Vanessa, Seth, Ramon, Shermie, etc), and the characters used for the cards in the IOS versions + made for the achievement icons (Heidern, many old bosses, Geese, etc).

If they can take those already-made models, and get them working to something that looks like Xrd, what would you think?

We could probably expect SNKP to have:

• Better animation, even still.
• Slightly worse models / 2D illusion, maybe ofset by more original / dynamic shading style.
• Slightly worse special effects, maybe? (But probably much bigger and dramatic)
• Much cooler, more active backgrounds.

I'd be OK with this. I STILL WANT MY SPRITES, but if this change would allow a next-gen KoF that had a crazy character roster + EX characters from all around SNK's history, staight out the gate, I think it'd be worth it.

 

[Master Thespian]

So, everyone's see Guilty Gear Xrd by now.

SNKP already has the models for LOADS of characters (all the ones in XIII) + The ones for various background characters that were used in XIII (Marco, Adel, Rose, Vanessa, Seth, Ramon, Shermie, etc), and the characters used for the cards in the IOS versions + made for the achievement icons (Heidern, many old bosses, Geese, etc).

If they can take those already-made models, and get them working to something that looks like Xrd, what would you think?

We could probably expect SNKP to have:

• Better animation, even still.
• Slightly worse models / 2D illusion, maybe ofset by more original / dynamic shading style.
• Slightly worse special effects, maybe? (But probably much bigger and dramatic)
• Much cooler, more active backgrounds.

I'd be OK with this. I STILL WANT MY SPRITES, but if this change would allow a next-gen KoF that had a crazy character roster + EX characters from all around SNK's history, staight out the gate, I think it'd be worth it.

After my brain stopped melting from looking at that sexy ass trailer, KOF was the next thing that popped into my mind.

Actually, Garou was but you catch my drift.

 

[Loona]

Felicia's relevance in RPG's be so nice even you had to say something about Namco X Capcom.

She not particularly relevant there either, but she's got the appeal to be present - in NxC at least the settings from Valkyrie, Strider, Tower of Druaga, Ghosts'n Goblins, Xenosaga, Tekken, SF, Bravoman, Forgotten Worlds and even Wonder Momo and Captain Commando bring a lot more to the table than Felicia does.

Apparently her animation was one of the things that got Darkstalkers approved as a game, so there's that, while on the other hand Cham Cham is a minority in every possible way in her own series (female, weapon isn't a sword, not japanese, brings a pet), so had to be sneaked in in a sequel.

I wasn't even talking about RPG. I was talking SS period. The only role Genjyuro plays is the foil to one of the main characters and that's more than Cham-Cham ever does.

Which makes him an appendage to Haohmaru, not an asset to the setting and story.

Even if techically so, even though we're having this back and forth, how many people would understand it the way you stated it versus the way I did. Kyo & Iori just happen to be a bit more popular than Haohmaru & Genjyuro. Makes the comparison a bit easier to make tinged with the fact that Kyo & Iori's beef goes a whole lot deeper than the latter we speak of as well.

History and precedents still have their importance IMO - if they're not addressed, no wonder people think SF invented super when it was aof that did it, for example.

There were a couple of these on the websites for MI & MI2 and they're translated on the SNK Wikia. Maximum Impact 1 Character Stories, Maximum Impact 2 Novellas & Character Prologues. There were some other stuff that was floating around years ago but those things may be lost to time.

Clumsy imitation is a bit harsh. I like the words "inspired heavily by past events." From past interviews and stuff I learned about the production of the game was that there were a lot of ideas floating around at the time and when that happens someone's vision gets left behind. I remember hearing that the game was drastically different very early in development and things changed over time. And don't forget we didn't get the fantastical stuff until Ureshino handled the story for MI2.

From the look of that in MI2 Ureshino had to patch a bunch of holes MI1 left open - I respect his work, but the root of the problem is still there.

As far as I'm concerned, fine, let let have a 3rd MI story game to rescue Soiree or whatever, but keep MI in its own alternate continuity.

 

[Hours Left]

3D KoF & SamSho? Please look like Guilty Gear Xrd, kthnx.

 

[TreIII]

So, everyone's see Guilty Gear Xrd by now.

SNKP already has the models for LOADS of characters (all the ones in XIII) + The ones for various background characters that were used in XIII (Marco, Adel, Rose, Vanessa, Seth, Ramon, Shermie, etc), and the characters used for the cards in the IOS versions + made for the achievement icons (Heidern, many old bosses, Geese, etc).

If they can take those already-made models, and get them working to something that looks like Xrd, what would you think?

We could probably expect SNKP to have:

• Better animation, even still.
• Slightly worse models / 2D illusion, maybe ofset by more original / dynamic shading style.
• Slightly worse special effects, maybe? (But probably much bigger and dramatic)
• Much cooler, more active backgrounds.

I'd be OK with this. I STILL WANT MY SPRITES, but if this change would allow a next-gen KoF that had a crazy character roster + EX characters from all around SNK's history, staight out the gate, I think it'd be worth it.

Like I said in the Xrd topic, I'd actually be surprised if most of the "old guard" for 2D makers weren't already moving towards something similar. Examu too, for that matter.

Sprites are, sadly, a dying art. And for a company like SNK, that actually took the time to animate so many frames of animation on top of 3D renders? No wonder it took them so long to realize the game they wanted to give us in KOFXIII.

So I say, it's alright if SNKP goes in this direction as well. KOFXIV is the chance for SNKP to really establish themselves as a decent contender again, and with ideally much less in the way of development turnaround times for them to release games.

It just makes sense in my opinion. If even an indie like XuanDou knows what's up...