Or availability. Movies hit streaming services 6+ months after the home release, and just disappear after a while. My physical collection is there, always. I can literally watch Ghostbusters right now, just because I have a Blu-ray of the movie. It's not on Netflix, nor on my cable's on demand service.
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Sony likely saved about $15 by not including a UHD drive in PS4 Pro.
- Thread starter SURGEdude
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Or availability. Movies hit streaming services 6+ months after the home release, and just disappear after a while. My physical collection is there, always. I can literally watch Ghostbusters right now, just because I have a Blu-ray of the movie. It's not on Netflix, nor on my cable's on demand service.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
I see why they couldn't call it PS4K (which was the closest name, the easiest and the smartest). It doesn't neither have the sufficient hardware power nor the UHD Bluray reader to be qualified as a true 4K gaming machine and 4K media player (unless they update the Bluray Players in all PS4s to read UHD Bluray Disk like they are going to do for HDR which I highly doubt).
They could have waited for next year to ship a more complete console with UHD Bluray Reader and more power since components will be more affordable and still be ahead of upcoming competition but they were so stubborn to release it this year. This PS4 Pro will be the worst intiative Sony ever made since the Betamax and Vita.
They could have waited for next year to ship a more complete console with UHD Bluray Reader and more power since components will be more affordable and still be ahead of upcoming competition but they were so stubborn to release it this year. This PS4 Pro will be the worst intiative Sony ever made since the Betamax and Vita.
aygomyownroad
Member
Tight gits!
I wonder how much they saved taking optical out of PS4 slim
I wonder how much they saved taking optical out of PS4 slim
TBiddy
Member
No worries. jeff_rigby is about to prove, that the PS4P can indeed play UHD BRD. It just needs a firmware update!
In all seriousness, though, I can understand Sonys decision not to include it. I think there's a very, very small subset of customers, where the lack of a UHD drive will make or break the decision to buy a PS4P.
People really got to stop using BOM or Bill Of Material for the actual final price of product. Have to factor in shipment of the parts to be put together, labor for putting together, and cost of inspections. Using BOM to say a certain or any company is cheap is not painting the whole picture in manufacturing.
Here's a simple example the BOM for making certain parts from plastic lets say a generic material is from ABS Lustran (which is what a certain company I know of use) is roughly a few cents per pound. 1 part ways less than a pound after machine make the part. so is that part still only should be a few cents because thats what the BOM says. Factor in machine time, labor time, pressure drying material time, qaulity assurance, and many more and that BOM that was a few cents per pound is now 5 to 10 dollars and thats just for one piece. This is not factoring everything else.
Basically using BOM to gauge a price of a part to go into another part is not very good. People dont work for free, machines need power to run, quality personal dont work for free and these are the people that are no factor into the BOM. Usually if its an already made part thats need to be assemble. The cost of the parts goes up 50 to 100 pct before leaving manufacturing. At the end consumer the price goes up another 50 to 100 pct easily so that retailers and everyone in between get there cut.
Here's a simple example the BOM for making certain parts from plastic lets say a generic material is from ABS Lustran (which is what a certain company I know of use) is roughly a few cents per pound. 1 part ways less than a pound after machine make the part. so is that part still only should be a few cents because thats what the BOM says. Factor in machine time, labor time, pressure drying material time, qaulity assurance, and many more and that BOM that was a few cents per pound is now 5 to 10 dollars and thats just for one piece. This is not factoring everything else.
Basically using BOM to gauge a price of a part to go into another part is not very good. People dont work for free, machines need power to run, quality personal dont work for free and these are the people that are no factor into the BOM. Usually if its an already made part thats need to be assemble. The cost of the parts goes up 50 to 100 pct before leaving manufacturing. At the end consumer the price goes up another 50 to 100 pct easily so that retailers and everyone in between get there cut.
To be honest, if you are an enthusiast, you will probably want a dedicated hardware for a particular need/function you want. That means a dedicated UHD player instead of whatever is packed in the gaming console which will definitely be of lower quality than a dedicated unit.
I struggle to stream at 1080p on Netflix in the evenings as it is!
test_account
XP-39C²
Personally, i didnt read his comment like that. I read it like its the engineers jobs to make sure to make a product thats both attractive and also will be profitable. If they dont do a good job at that, their jobs could be at stake. Now, i'm not sure if an additional $15 (if that number is correct) would make or break something like that ($15 extra for each unit will however add up to a fairly big number when millions of units are expected to be sold), but generally speaking, its important to keep cost etc. in mind when doing design like this.
I know, the team that gets the most points wins!
Aceofspades
Banned
$18 is huge cost when you produce millions of units.
BoilersFan23
Member
People seem to forget, last gen Sony was aiming for an all out media machine. This generation Sony is aiming more so to be a game console first and foremost, not a media machine. Its why they never even released an official blu-ray remote control...and not releasing UHD blu-ray either. They are aiming to make it an affordable game console first and foremost, not bleeding (losing money) just to include a drive most will not use.
That $15 means fuckton for certain market like Asia, which Sony seems to more seriously aim this generation around. Unlike Xbox, PS market is not just revolved around the US but also worldwide you know?
You're using too much common sense and knowledge here.
SlipperyFishes
Banned
Personally, i didnt read his comment like that. I read it like its the engineers jobs to make sure to make a product thats both attractive and also will be profitable. If they dont do a good job at that, their jobs could be at stake. Now, i'm not sure if an additional $15 (if that number is correct) would make or break something like that ($15 extra for each unit will however add up to a fairly big number when millions of units are expected to be sold), but generally speaking, its important to keep cost etc. in mind when doing design like this.
I know, the team that gets the most points wins!
They likely would have made a saving costing them far less than $15 per unit based on order volumes. Economics. The more you buy the more you save.
Yes the more volume that is purchase will lower the price, but here's the important thing. The BOM is basically what it is the BOM. The BOM does not take into consideration the cost of shipping, labor, storage, or anything else for that matter. The BOM is just the price per unit before all the work is needed to put together and so on.
Really? The PS3 blu-ray player was one of the best on the market for a long time as far as I can recall.
family_guy
Member
Like it's been mentioned before, they could just add it in to their price. People buying the system this year are not going to balk at $415 or $430 or $450, when they bought $1000+ TVs to take advantage of the system to begin with. Consider it the early adopter tax. Sony just raised the price of PS+ $10. They could eat the cost even if it means losing a few dollars of profit per console during the first year until UHD drives are cheaper to manufacture.
Why not playing it on Scorpio? It will look even better.
I think that it's worth remembering that the Xbox One S and PS4 Pro are just not the same type of console and don't have the same costs involved in production due to that.
The Xbox One S is the default Xbox One for Microsoft they'll likely sell multiple times the amount of consoles that Sony will sell of the Pro version. They've being released for very different markets and the PS4 Pro is simply not going to be selling in the same numbers as the standard PS4 or Xbox One S, I wouldn't be too surprised to see that the the Xbox One S sells around ten times as many consoles over Christmas as the PS4 Pro.
The Xbox One S is the default Xbox One for Microsoft they'll likely sell multiple times the amount of consoles that Sony will sell of the Pro version. They've being released for very different markets and the PS4 Pro is simply not going to be selling in the same numbers as the standard PS4 or Xbox One S, I wouldn't be too surprised to see that the the Xbox One S sells around ten times as many consoles over Christmas as the PS4 Pro.
For the price point iirc. During that time dedicated Blueray player is super expensive and the BD Player in the PS3 was not cheap either.
kinoki
Illness is the doctor to whom we pay most heed; to kindness, to knowledge, we make promise only; pain we obey.
Right now the prices for UHD movies is about 30. That's about 20 too much for my comfort zone when buying movies. If I buy a 4K HDR TV next year I'll probably be very content with the content Netflix provides until the price drops on UHD. And at that time we'll most likely be wanting a PS5. I think it's a bummer but a bummer that won't affect me.
Marty Chinn
Member
No, back then, it really was a top tier player among enthusiasts and the price point being the cheapest was just icing on the cake.
Hockeymac18
Member
How does streamed 4K compare to a UHD BluRay in picture quality, sound, etc.?
andythinkpad
Member
Has the UHD bluray disc even positioned to be the successor of Bluray?
I don't remember seeing any discussing of UHD in Off Topic until now.
I don't remember seeing any discussing of UHD in Off Topic until now.
I don't know with 4k but 1080p streaming I'd nowhere close to Blu-ray.
ViciousAnchovy
Member
As someone who has no plans to buy a PS4 Pro, having to pay an extra $5 a month for the rest of the PS4's lifecycle would displease me.
I'd rather then just charge more for the hardware. $429.99 would have been a fine price.
Pathfinder
Member
Depends on the quality of your Internet connection and quality of the source. Additionally, streamed 4K content will usually be compressed during transmission, so it will not be quite as clear as media delivered from a physical disc.
Not at all. I'm someone who really enjoys buying my favorite movies on Blu-Ray because that's the best way to experience them. I've been buying 1080p Blu-Rays for my PS3 and PS4 over the past 10 years, and I've been perfectly fine with these players. I don't want to pay more money for a dedicated player. Maybe I'm not enough of an enthusiast, but I can't be alone in this. This omission on its own made me go from wanting to buy it to not wanting to.
This console is clearly aimed at the person who just bought a 4K TV and cares to use it for 4K content. This kind of person probably wants to max out their TV's potential, and 4K Blu-Rays are the only way to do that at the moment.
Depends on a lot of things include the service and your TV. Vudu is usually the best youtube is normally the worst for me.
Overall it is worse. The difference between UHD streams and UHD BD is greater than the difference between 1080p streams and regular BD.
It depends on the source for sure, but I remember reading that Netflix's 4K content looks worse than 1080p Blu-Rays.
I was kind of mad at first but then I thought about it and I really don't buy physical movies often anymore. And when I do, it's more as a collector's item. Seems like a smart move if it's keeping the cost down. But then again, I can see the choice losing some sales as this is meant to be the product for enthusiasts.
DwightSchruting
Member
This is akin to Apple's earphones.
Xbox messed up in overreaching with regards to DRM and Internet but even then their DRM system required pings from your internet or data on your phone; it would've worked.
But streaming? In 4K? That's a huge endeavor & not one that'll change the landscape like Xbox Live, it'll fail by way of fact.
Xbox messed up in overreaching with regards to DRM and Internet but even then their DRM system required pings from your internet or data on your phone; it would've worked.
But streaming? In 4K? That's a huge endeavor & not one that'll change the landscape like Xbox Live, it'll fail by way of fact.
Cellbomber
Member
Less risk not dealing with new UHD drives. Games may play horrible in these drives for all we know. Also if UHD doesn't take off that price isn't going to come down any.
Smart financial decision to get it out. The mass market doesn't give a shit about 4k. I never hear any talk about it, people wanting it or companies really pushing it. I think the demand for this stuff isn't there since most are satisfied with there current set ups.
Smart financial decision to get it out. The mass market doesn't give a shit about 4k. I never hear any talk about it, people wanting it or companies really pushing it. I think the demand for this stuff isn't there since most are satisfied with there current set ups.
Livingskeletons
If I pulled that off, would you die?
Should bump the price up to $415 then.
WellPS will most likely have the biggest player base like in destiny 1
They could have made the Pro $424.99 and drank the profit. Who's spending $400 and then getting upset about $25 more?
Sony has courage confirmed.
Sony has courage confirmed.
It does not work like this.
hamauzu kaito
Member
Don't they still make standalone players. They made a long term decision maybe thinking of data caps and internet speed in the US and the continued prominence of disk media in Japan. They don't want to truncate another leg of their business. In the process they saved money on the revision. Sucks for us but I can see why they did it maybe.
If it led every ps4pro owner to purchase even just one UHD, it more than pays for itself.
Wouldn't you agree that the standard PS4 is now "as mass market as mass market gets", while the Pro is for price-counscious enthusiasts?
I was looking forward to buying a 4K TV in the near future, and buying the Pro as the one machine I need for everything on that TV.
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