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[hydrophilic attack]

Depending on the feminist you ask part of the definition involves you being female. Hell, there is even some transphobic slants some feminists will subscribe to with regards to that. (male spies attitude) the feminist community isn't the most welcoming bunch but that would be a generalisation. It is far from a unified thing.

Most feminists hate TERFs

 

[Nerokis]

I mean. It's not a "label", it's a word with a definition. Your viewpoint fits the definition. You're a feminist. It's not an identity thing.

Of course it's a label. Like most labels, it's also a word with a definition, but it has connotations that are infused with social implication. "Do you identify as a feminist?" is basically the question the OP is asking.

 

[aett]

Yes, wholeheartedly, of course humans should all share equal rights.

 

[LosDaddie]

What?

To answer your question, the Merriam-Webster definition of Feminism is:

So what if someone supports Equal Rights for women, but believe abortion should be illegal?

Is that person a feminist?

 

[Fuchsdh]

People using 'Tumblr' and other 'internet feminists' to discredit the current work and legacy of feminism . . . . talk about showing a lack of understanding. Seriously, please stop using the same scapegoat tactics used by MRA's.


Might as well repost this as we're seeing more and more misguided "im for equality for all", "im a humanist", "im egalitarian" etc. responses.

...Except that post is arguing for more than just equal rights for women? You can be a feminist and argue against that image.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Depending on the feminist you ask part of the definition involves you being female. Hell, there is even some transphobic slants some feminists will subscribe to with regards to that. (male spies attitude) the feminist community isn't the most welcoming bunch but that would be a generalisation. It is far from a unified thing.

TERFs suck.

 

[radios shipping overview]

There are a lot of people in there who seem uncomfortable with feminism because of what people who aren't feminists (or who are against feminism) told them about feminists.

 

[Viewt]

It's interesting - I was listening to NPR today on the way into work, and they were interviewing W. Kamau Bell about his show's upcoming season on CNN. Anyway, they asked him about whether he considers himself a feminist, and he gave this answer (paraphrased from memory):

"I don't think any man can simply call himself a feminist because I think that's something that has to be awarded to you by a woman due to your actions. You can't just decide you're a feminist and call it a day."

There's some compelling reasoning there. Often, privileged classes describe themselves as allies, when at best they're only superficially supportive, or at worst, actually hurtful to the movements they claim to be a part of. Going down that line of thought, I can see why acknowledgement by the oppressed group should be the signifier of a true ally, and not simply a Twitter bio mention or what have you.

On the other hand, I think that many men distance themselves from the "feminism" label because of dumb stereotypes about girls on Tumblr with blue hair, contempt for men, and annoying attitudes. Maybe those people exist, but like 99% of the feminists I've met in life are just regular women who want the same fair shake that I get. So why wouldn't I want to align myself with them? I'm proud to say that I want equality and respect for all genders, so giving a cagey "Oh, I dunno, labels and such" answer to "Are you a feminist" feels... dismissive.

I suppose the most honest answer I can give is that I certainly hope I'm a feminist. I aspire to live my life as one. I think it's a noble pursuit that deserves our attention and respect.

Does that make sense?

 

[Rest]

Anybody that would ask that question in person is somebody I wouldn't answer it for.

 

[Dragonite]

Yeah but I will also tell them I'm not a liberal feminist.

 

[RDreamer]

Not being a feminist is an indefensible stance.

There are people I could see having an aversion to it. Namely trans and women of color. As someone just pointed out there are some strains of feminism, which I think shouldn't color the whole movement, that are transphobic and can be very white centric. I could definitely see wanting to push back against that depending on how much of it you're exposed to.

So what if someone supports Equal Rights for women, but believe abortion should be illegal?

Is that person a feminist?

Then that person doesn't support equal rights for women, as they're advocating women lose bodily autonomy.

 

[collige]

So what if someone supports Equal Rights for women, but believe abortion should be illegal?

Is that person a feminist?

I would say that person is a feminist with an extremely misguided understanding of fetal development and the concept of personhood.

 

[EdibleKnife]

It's honestly disheartening how many people in here are saying "no", or are explaining why sexism is over and it's wrong to be a feminist.

GAF pls.

I'd agree it was disheartening if I didn't already see this trend brewing online. Like you mentioned, too many people have Tumblr memes and 'Male Tears' mugs as their only reference for feminism and back away from it like it's somehow cancerous.

 

[azyless]

Like it or not, men and women have gender roles especially when it comes to raising a child in a family. One of the staple arguments of extreme feminists is that the a man is not required to raise a child in a family which is blatantly wrong. Without a strong male father figure, the child will have developmental problems.

This entire paragraph is... a mess.

...Except that post is arguing for more than just equal rights for women? You can be a feminist and argue against that image.

Sure if you ignore the effects of centuries of oppression.

 

[Nerokis]

It's interesting - I was listening to NPR today on the way into work, and they were interviewing W. Kamau Bell about his show's upcoming season on CNN. Anyway, they asked him about whether he considers himself a feminist, and he gave this answer (paraphrased from memory):

"I don't think any man can simply call himself a feminist because I think that's something that has to be awarded to you by a woman due to your actions. You can't just decide you're a feminist and call it a day."

There's some compelling reasoning there. Often, privileged classes describe themselves as allies, when at best they're only superficially supportive, or at worst, actually hurtful to the movements they claim to be a part of. Going down that line of thought, I can see why acknowledgement by the oppressed group should be the signifier of a true ally, and not simply a Twitter bio mention or what have you.

On the other hand, I think that many men distance themselves from the "feminism" label because of dumb stereotypes about girls on Tumblr with blue hair, contempt for men, and annoying attitudes. Maybe those people exist, but like 99% of the feminists I've met in life are just regular women who want the same fair shake that I get. So why wouldn't I want to align myself with them? I'm proud to say that I want equality and respect for all genders, so giving a cagey "Oh, I dunno, labels and such" answer to "Are you a feminist" feels... dismissive.

I suppose the most honest answer I can give is that I certainly hope I'm a feminist. I aspire to live my life as one. I think it's a noble pursuit that deserves our attention and respect.

Does that make sense?

Nice post. This is more or less where I am, too.

 

[Temp_User]

...Except that post is arguing for more than just equal rights for women? You can be a feminist and argue against that image.

Which image? The middle one that argue for equity for socially disenfranchised groups . . . . . like women? Tell us why would feminists be against it.

 

[LionPride]

This is a very interesting thread. First, it shows that many people only know feminism as equal rights between men and women, but it is so much more complicated than that.

Like it or not, men and women have gender roles especially when it comes to raising a child in a family. One of the staple arguments of extreme feminists is that the a man is not required to raise a child in a family which is blatantly wrong. Without a strong male father figure, the child will have developmental problems. This is just one feminist argument out of many that are actually meant to divide men and women more than equalizing the relationship.

So, that being said, I of course support equal rights for men and women. However, there are things that feminists support (more on the extreme end) that I am opposed to.

Huh, grown up in a single mother household without a father figure and...I'm pretty good

 

[Bronx-Man]

This is a very interesting thread. First, it shows that many people only know feminism as equal rights between men and women, but it is so much more complicated than that.

Like it or not, men and women have gender roles especially when it comes to raising a child in a family. One of the staple arguments of extreme feminists is that the a man is not required to raise a child in a family which is blatantly wrong. Without a strong male father figure, the child will have developmental problems. This is just one feminist argument out of many that are actually meant to divide men and women more than equalizing the relationship.

So, that being said, I of course support equal rights for men and women. However, there are things that feminists support (more on the extreme end) that I am opposed to.

.....you do realize the last president of the United States was raised by a single mom, right?

 

[Imm0rt4l]

Yes. Intersectional tho, TERFs are gross

This

 

[Davidion]

My response is that I don't really name/label myself that way; see this thread for the powder keg that I sidestep here.

I'll make it a point to explain that I'm in support of women's causes such as equal pay, abortion rights, etc etc. (amongst other minority rights/intersectionality in support of a more wholly diverse society, blah blah)

From then on it doesn't matter if they call me a feminist or not.

 

[John Harker]

Don't need to be questioned, I just tell people I am (or at least, trying to be).

Usually I ask why they arent

 

[Psychoward]

.....you do realize the last president of the United States was raised by a single mom, right?

But think of how much better he could have been with a dad too!

/s

 

[Griss]

My typical interaction:

"Are you a feminist?"
"No."
"You don't believe that men and women deserve equal rights?"
"Of course I believe that."
"Then you're a feminist."
"Okay, if you say so, but I've been down this road before."
"Alright, great, you're a feminist."

*Later*

"What do you think about social issue X / Y / Z"
"Well, I think A / B / C"
"How the fuck could you call yourself a feminist and hold that position? You're no feminist at all!"
"I thought you said it was just about believing in equal rights..."

And so on and so on. So the answer for me is clearly no.

 

[Theonik]

TERFs aren't representative of the vast majority of feminists at all.

I never said otherwise. They are as entitled to call themselves feminist as any other feminist though, not every feminist has the same agenda, and that was my point.

 

[marrec]

.....you do realize the last president of the United States was raised by a single mom, right?

Like it or not, without a strong male influence in your life you may succeed wildly and climb to the highest of political positions while being viewed by people around the world as a monumental achievement of a man.

Like it or not.

 

[Mahonay]

My typical interaction:

"Are you a feminist?"
"No."
"You don't believe that men and women deserve equal rights?"
"Of course I believe that."
"Then you're a feminist."
"Okay, if you say so, but I've been down this road before."
"Alright, great, you're a feminist."

*Later*

"What do you think about social issue X / Y / Z"
"Well, I think A / B / C"
"How the fuck could you call yourself a feminist and hold that position? You're no feminist at all!"
"I thought you said it was just about believing in equal rights..."

And so on and so on. So the answer for me is clearly no.

This is very vague. What beliefs do you hold that would lead to someone insisting that you're not a feminist?

 

[perfectchaos007]

My typical interaction:

"Are you a feminist?"
"No."
"You don't believe that men and women deserve equal rights?"
"Of course I believe that."
"Then you're a feminist."
"Okay, if you say so, but I've been down this road before."
"Alright, great, you're a feminist."

*Later*

"What do you think about social issue X / Y / Z"
"Well, I think A / B / C"
"How the fuck could you call yourself a feminist and hold that position? You're no feminist at all!"
"I thought you said it was just about believing in equal rights..."

And so on and so on. So the answer for me is clearly no.

You hang out with some interesting characters if thats a typical reoccurring convo in your social life.

 

[andymcc]

This is very vague. What beliefs do you hold that would lead to someone insisting that you're not a feminist?

Probably something that is contrary to equal rights for women if I took a guess.

 

[Inferno313]

This is very vague. What beliefs do you hold that would lead to someone insisting that you're not a feminist?

That's what I was thinking. Depending on what exactly "social issue X/Y/Z" and "belief A/B/C" is, it's totally possible that that person is, in fact, correct.

 

[Kurdel]

But think of how much better he could have been with a dad too!

/s

We would never be tired of winning

 

[The Lamonster]

The answer is "define feminism"

Obviously people have different definitions of it -

Yes, wholeheartedly, of course humans should all share equal rights.

...but this is where I stand.

 

[WedgeX]

Indeed I do.

 

[EdibleKnife]

Huh, grown up in a single mother household without a father figure and...I'm pretty good

Right? By that poster's assumption if you have a mother and a father most importantly, it's nigh impossible for an offspring to have emotional or developmental damage.

 

[marrec]

That's what I was thinking. Depending on what exactly "social issue X/Y/Z" and "belief A/B/C" is, it's totally possible that that person is, in fact, correct.

I mean, that's what Griss is saying though?

The conversation stems from Griss saying he's not a feminist, then the other people insisting Griss IS a feminist if defined extremely broadly, then later saying Griss is NOT a feminist because of some more micro-level policy disagreement.

I don't think we need to interrogate Griss here, he's clearly saying he doesn't consider himself a feminist.

 

[shawnbuddy]

Assuming that just because someone is a feminist they support TERFs is like assuming that just because someone likes baseball they're a Yankee's fan. It's hurtful and unfair.

 

[pablito]

Absolutely

 

[Mahonay]

I mean, that's what Griss is saying though?

The conversation stems from Griss saying he's not a feminist, then the other people insisting Griss IS a feminist if defined extremely broadly, then later saying Griss is NOT a feminist because of some more micro-level policy disagreement.

I don't think we need to interrogate Griss here, he's clearly saying he doesn't consider himself a feminist.

EDIT:
I'm confusing myself.

 

[OG Shaka Zulu]

There are a lot of people in there who seem uncomfortable with feminism because of what people who aren't feminists (or who are against feminism) told them about feminists.

It's very unfortunate. Some of these posts come off as a "my hometown was burned by marauding women" origin story.

 

[marrec]

Except the part where he suggests he'd like to call himself a feminist but then is told he's not after expressing certain views.

What?

Also, that interaction is not a rare one. There are wildly different practicing forms of feminism that disagree on various issues.

 

[Bronx-Man]

It's very unfortunate. Some of these posts come off as a "my hometown was burned by marauding women" origin story.

They poisoned our water supply, burned our crops and delivered a plague onto our houses!

 

[Mahonay]

It's very unfortunate. Some of these posts come off as a "my hometown was burned by marauding women" origin story.

Lol. Obviously this is the next step in feminism, duh!!

 

[Griss]

This is very vague. What beliefs do you hold that would lead to someone insisting that you're not a feminist?

That both sides of the abortion debate make valid points, and that the anti-abortion side is not fueled purely by hatred of women but rather by a genuine concern over the ethics of terminating a human life.

That the presumption of innocence is the most important part of our criminal law, and shouldn't be changed or adjusted in any way to allow for a higher level of rape convictions in "he-said she-said" cases. That the low level of rape convictions in court is an unfortunate but necessary side-product of the nature of the act combined with the presumption of innocence.

And so on and so forth, but those would be two that constantly recur. I've never met a feminist who'd let me into their club with those opinions.

I'm don't consider myself particularly liberal on social issues.

You hang out with some interesting characters if thats a typical reoccurring convo in your social life.

I have twin older cousins who both majored in women's studies, and went to law school where it was 70% women and discussions of feminist jurisprudence were common.

 

[LosDaddie]

Then that person doesn't support equal rights for women, as they're advocating women lose bodily autonomy.

I would say that person is a feminist with an extremely misguided understanding of fetal development and the concept of personhood.

While I agree, it goes back to what the current definition of feminism is.

Is it the strict definition as posted before, or does it mean more today?

 

[Mahonay]

What?

Also, that interaction is not a rare one. There are wildly different practicing forms of feminism that disagree on various issues.

Never mind. I mixed up different posts in my head. Thread is moving fast.

 

[Doc_Drop]

The aversion to labels is quite amusing to me. The accusations of pretentiousness to the people labelling doubly so

 

[RDreamer]

It's very unfortunate. Some of these posts come off as a "my hometown was burned by marauding women" origin story.

People do this with ideologies they don't actually like. It's like universal healthcare. I swear every backwoods Wisconsinite I've met claims they know someone that has literally died from Canadian healthcare.

 

[benicillin]

Maybe you'll get there one day people. It's a super simple answer.

 

[Mahonay]

That both sides of the abortion debate make valid points, and that the anti-abortion side is not fueled purely by hatred of women but rather by a genuine concern over the ethics of terminating a human life.

That the presumption of innocence is the most important part of our criminal law, and shouldn't be changed or adjusted in any way to allow for a higher level of rape convictions in "he-said she-said" cases. That the low level of rape convictions in court is an unfortunate but necessary side-product of the nature of the act combined with the presumption of innocence.

And so on and so forth, but those would be two that constantly recur. I've never met a feminist who'd let me into their club with those opinions.

I'm don't consider myself particularly liberal on social issues.

Is there some kind of collective large push to make hearsay a stronger form of evidence in rape cases? That's news to me.

I don't agree that both sides of the abortion debate had valid points and I'm going to leave it at that.

 

[Transhuman]

The aversion to labels is quite amusing to me. The accusations of pretentiousness to the people labelling doubly so

If they think what a person labels themselves matters then they are pretentious.

 

[rjinaz]

I've never been questioned. If I were then yeah, I'd say I was because I believe in feminism. I'll admit to not being active enough outside of online activity to really self-identify as a feminist though.