i love it when any company tries to do the 'hey we're gonna elevate games beyond what games are and make them like movies' thing because the writing always ends up being shit. and usually they take the gameplay/design aspect down with it because they focused on the wrong fucking thing.
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Why DmC's Dante is a Bad Character (Video)
- Thread starter HyperBitHero
- Start date
HyperBitHero
Member
Watched the video and it seemed more like an angry rant than actually elucidating any problems with the character – for example the idea that someone who who is traumatized at a young age is more necessarily more likely to become a violent, hateful bastard than of a violent, cocky bastard.
Can't wait for DmC. I'll probably enjoy this more than any Devil May Cry game since DMC1.
That said I like videos like this, generally speaking. Just disagreed with the conclusion and thought the evidence used was unfair. "FUCK YOU" being repeated back and forth can be funny, but it was pulled out of context. Nearly everything Dante says, in any DMC game can sound terrible, pulled out of context.
Can't wait for DmC. I'll probably enjoy this more than any Devil May Cry game since DMC1.
That said I like videos like this, generally speaking. Just disagreed with the conclusion and thought the evidence used was unfair. "FUCK YOU" being repeated back and forth can be funny, but it was pulled out of context. Nearly everything Dante says, in any DMC game can sound terrible, pulled out of context.
Isamu Dyson
Member
Great video OP.
Really down with your take on the new Dante,
i think this game looks pretty awesome from a gameplay perspective.
and even though i didn't have much love for Dante previous, at least i appreciated his annoyance was acceptable because he was less self serious.
when DmC was first announced i must say i did really enjoy the look of new Dante, he basically looked like a bedraggled dude, smackhead chique haha
like say renton in trainspotting.
but ever since the old dante has been force fed into him he now seems like a mess.
still really looking forward to playing DmC though, so hopefully i can survive new Dante's terrible wisecracks.
Really down with your take on the new Dante,
i think this game looks pretty awesome from a gameplay perspective.
and even though i didn't have much love for Dante previous, at least i appreciated his annoyance was acceptable because he was less self serious.
when DmC was first announced i must say i did really enjoy the look of new Dante, he basically looked like a bedraggled dude, smackhead chique haha
like say renton in trainspotting.
but ever since the old dante has been force fed into him he now seems like a mess.
still really looking forward to playing DmC though, so hopefully i can survive new Dante's terrible wisecracks.
HyperBitHero
Member
I'm not angry about this new Dante. I'm just disappointed. Like, I don't have a problem with him being a new character, or being different from the original, I just think he isn't made very well, and lacks any real vision.
Isamu Dyson
Member
yeah it is a terrible idea, its an absolute bugbear to the industry i feel,
you shouldn't be trying to make games more like movies, you should just try and make better games. they are entirely different mediums, so we shouldn't be emulating the other.
great movies didn't become great movies by trying to copy books.
It's fair enough that it's your opinion. I think you did a good job on the video.
It seems to me like Devil May Cry is getting the same treatment James Bond movies have been getting over the years. They go through eras with different actors. The character, in essence, is the same, but the mood and overall production is completely different.
When he was a fresh character in DMC1, I thought he was great. If Capcom wants DMC to be a long-running relevant series, then it's good to throw on a new coat of paint from time to time.
I personally like this "new actor" a lot. And I loved Heavenly Sword and Enslaved not that I think they're masterpieces, they're just great little action adventures with enjoyable, well-written characters and a serviceable story.
Tizoc
Member
Uh....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxkezvGwI20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4ZT8EXRBk0
Dante's design is based on Cobra from the Space Adventure Cobra manga/animated series of the 80s.
JonathanPower
Member
I think you got it wrong. You say in the video that they made him this way because "it's supposed to be cool". The problem is, Dante is not this way because he is trying to be cool or something, Dante is the way he is because he simply doesn't give a damn fuck about what people or the society think about him.
That's what's supposed to be cool about him.
He's talking about the designers' intent, not the character himself.
Ditto.
HyperBitHero
Member
That would be too on the nose!
Isamu Dyson
Member
i think the point trying to be made is that,
dante not giving a damn fuck is what is supposed to be cool
ComputerMKII
Banned
Devil May Cry: serious business.
No offense to the OP, but i'm just not sure why i should care about your opinion. Was Dante ever a deep or interesting character? Did DMC ever have a good story? I've only ever played DMC for the combat and it just seems like the easiest thing in the world to rip on videogame characters and stories.
moozoom
Member
I pretty much agree with your video, and nothing is bad as somebody trying to act cool when he isn't, yet I think Dante has always been on the very thin line between cocky and unsufferable. I remember being totally put off by his characterization in Devil May cry 3, to the point of not finishing the game because of his one-liners and attitude. Maybe I was already too old to find it cool at the time.
The worst thing in D.M.C looks to be the faux-rebel social comment... which has already been done countless times in film and litterature.Carpenter did it 24 years ago, and the movie is still valid and fun to watch despite its cheesiness.
The worst thing in D.M.C looks to be the faux-rebel social comment... which has already been done countless times in film and litterature.Carpenter did it 24 years ago, and the movie is still valid and fun to watch despite its cheesiness.
BlazingDarkness
Member
'these traits don't work with this character' - For what reason? His design supports the characteristics, because he has modern hair that means he needs to be all emo? Old Dante was cheesy, we don't all want a character that's amusing
' a lot of it seems like pandering' - No, it was alterations based on feedback from gamers, why is this a bad thing?
'they did this with the devil trigger, missed potential' People were bemoaning the lack of white hair, and thus the devil trigger has that
'the quality of writing here is awful at times' see every DMC game. NT games have had great writing in the past, you're judging trailers and whatnot, when there's 4 terribly written DMC games for you to enjoy
*goes on to compare him to old Dante*
*goes on to criticize the story* (which on trailers alone looks more interesting than previous DMC plot)*
At this point I got bored and turned it off
I disagree with pretty much every one of your points
Let the old DMC Dante go, he ain't in this game, so deal with it
*prepares to be attacked*
' a lot of it seems like pandering' - No, it was alterations based on feedback from gamers, why is this a bad thing?
'they did this with the devil trigger, missed potential' People were bemoaning the lack of white hair, and thus the devil trigger has that
'the quality of writing here is awful at times' see every DMC game. NT games have had great writing in the past, you're judging trailers and whatnot, when there's 4 terribly written DMC games for you to enjoy
*goes on to compare him to old Dante*
*goes on to criticize the story* (which on trailers alone looks more interesting than previous DMC plot)*
At this point I got bored and turned it off
I disagree with pretty much every one of your points
Let the old DMC Dante go, he ain't in this game, so deal with it
*prepares to be attacked*
HyperBitHero
Member
Harsh, man.
Fudgepuppy
Banned
You know what, I'd really like to play a dark and twisted game about a guy with PTSD because his mother was raped by demons and because he was tormented by demons in an orphanage.
It could be like Dante's Inferno (the book, not the game) where he's just going deeper and deeper into the madness.
It could be like Dante's Inferno (the book, not the game) where he's just going deeper and deeper into the madness.
JonathanPower
Member
Well, about the club scene when Dante writes "fuck you" and the video poster defines this scene "it's such an ignorant view of what beign cool is" if I got it right.
This is what I meant by saying he got it wrong in my opinion. There, in my interpretation Dante didn't write "fuck you" because he is a bad ass, but because he was saying "fuck you" to a world made of rules in which only few selected and "suddedly cool" people can enter in a club.
HyperBitHero
Member
That line was meant to go along with the "Fuck you" scene. I guess it fits the club scene too.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Amazing Bully soundtrack.
You know, I really liked the video.
Why is new Dante flipping its finger so much! I hate when characters do all the time that and do it only because they think its cool. Like people taking photos flipping their fingers just because.
You know, I really liked the video.
Why is new Dante flipping its finger so much! I hate when characters do all the time that and do it only because they think its cool. Like people taking photos flipping their fingers just because.
dark_inferno
Member
Hearing from people that they hate the new "crying emo boy dante" is like hating themself.
Characters come and go so deal with it. Some people cried at Max Payne how R* messed him up (well i was one of them and learned my lesson). MP was even a more whiny bitch in MP3 then in MP1 and 2. And what came out? Many liked the game because of the gameplay and not cause of the Story or the Character. And i didnt liked Dante. He was a badass yeah but he was just baddly written in every game in my opinion.
Characters come and go so deal with it. Some people cried at Max Payne how R* messed him up (well i was one of them and learned my lesson). MP was even a more whiny bitch in MP3 then in MP1 and 2. And what came out? Many liked the game because of the gameplay and not cause of the Story or the Character. And i didnt liked Dante. He was a badass yeah but he was just baddly written in every game in my opinion.
He has Avrillavigne syndrome, leave him alone.
Ninja Theory is not known for their stellar gameplay design. Just saying.
HyperBitHero
Member
This new Dante isn't emo at all. I guess he was in the original concept video, but he has changed quite considerably.
dark_inferno
Member
R* arent well known for their linear Gameplay. Just saying.
electroplankton
Banned
I can understand you.
I'm disappointed as well.
I almost cried at the last scene!
To me, DmC always seemed as a way to make more attractive the franchise to Western players, clearly changed throughout the years and restless towards Japanese games, or better, how Japanese games are conceived.
I'm disappointed as well.
I almost cried at the last scene!
To me, DmC always seemed as a way to make more attractive the franchise to Western players, clearly changed throughout the years and restless towards Japanese games, or better, how Japanese games are conceived.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Fuck, so it was her the one that made it cool?
Will have to send some donation to cure that syndrome.
HyperBitHero
Member
Nope, after the first trailer shown, he hasn't been seen with a cigarette.
Yet Ninja Theory worked on two games in the same genre in Devil May Cry, and the gameplay was the worst thing about them.
What gives you confidence that they will be able to pull it off this time?
I used to do that as a 14 year old even though I despised Avril Lavigne. I realized how dumb it was when I became older.
I don't like how this game is turning out not one bit but this is huge hyperbole.
HyperBitHero
Member
I love when people say this. It's the most obvious joke to make, but it still amuses me every time.
Snowden's Secret
Banned
I've never played a DMC game but that video was pretty good and I enjoyed the analysis. It reminded me a lot of those Sequelitis videos in that you "get" subtle things.
Bravo, A+
Bravo, A+
HyperBitHero
Member
There are people that actually say this seriously
I know, the comments of the video are filled with serious comments like that. I can see where they're coming from, but this game feels more like a developmental mess than an intentional bastardization.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
That unfortunately seems to be the direction most games are going in dialog-wise from what I am seeing. Seems like it is getting harder to play a game without a plethora of immature, unnecessary profanity trying to make it seems edgy.
Good review and there are some interesting points about the new Dante.
The only thing I've ever felt from Dino since his initial reveal is that NT/Capcom don't get why DMC ended up being as popular as it was. I've never been as put off by a game announcement in my twenty-something years of playing video games than I have been by DmC, and all the follow-up trailers have only done more harm than good to me.
The bit with Dino getting to SSS on a boss fight using the same move and dealing over 1/4 of his health was depressing to watch.
The bit with Dino getting to SSS on a boss fight using the same move and dealing over 1/4 of his health was depressing to watch.
Tony Redgrave
Member
I don't know, I think it's a little bit premature to make such judgements about the character from a few trailers, it might surprise you when you get to see his development in the actual game.
HyperBitHero
Member
So, are we calling him:
New Dante
Neo Dante
NuDante
Donte
Dino
Tameem
We have to decide,
HyperBitHero
Member
Oh man, I just remembered I wanted to add in that scene from KZ2, where one of those ships crashes into the ground, and Natko, I think that's his name, is like "Shit!!!! SHHHIIIIIIIITTT!"
I kinda wanted to throw in that scene from breaking bad, where Walt gives the most intense "Fuck you" ever filmed.
Eh, it would have distracted from the video, so I guess I'm glad I left them out.
I'm sorry.
The video is well-done, but making such an analysis on a character we don't know much about is silly.
And the outrage over the Fuck Yous in the writing are hysterical. People might just not think about context. Dante seem to be an arrogant, bratty kid. And yes, it's corny, but it's not indicative of bad scriptwriting.
And the original Dante was nothing special character-wise anyhow.
The video is well-done, but making such an analysis on a character we don't know much about is silly.
And the outrage over the Fuck Yous in the writing are hysterical. People might just not think about context. Dante seem to be an arrogant, bratty kid. And yes, it's corny, but it's not indicative of bad scriptwriting.
And the original Dante was nothing special character-wise anyhow.
Dante. That is his name. I know that the concept of two different characters having the same name sounds mind-boggling at first, but it can work. Sometimes.