Deferred rendering, which like most games from 2010+ make use of, makes MSAA literally exponentially more expensive.
Best example these days is Mankind Divided, which is about a 20FPS per 2x sample drop.
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Why won't PC do checkerboard 4K? (it does)
- Thread starter Renekton
- Start date
Deferred rendering, which like most games from 2010+ make use of, makes MSAA literally exponentially more expensive.
Best example these days is Mankind Divided, which is about a 20FPS per 2x sample drop.
kraspkibble
Permabanned.
the 1070 can do this at 4k:
Rise of the Tomb Raider / very high quality - 39fps
Dirt Rally / Ultra - 53fps
Ashes of the Singularity / extreme - 41fps
Battlefield 4 / Ultra - 60fps
Crysis 3 / Very high + FXAA - 28fps
The Witcher 3 / Ultra - 28-35fps
The Division / Ultra - 32fps
GTA V / Very High - 22-29fps
Hitman / Ultra - 40fps
Source: http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1731
RealityCheque
Banned
Fuck that. It's a PC, bring raw, brute force power and do it natively. None of this fannying around and faking it!!!
fabricated backlash
Member
It's just one of hundreds of upscaling solutions. Sony didn't re-invent the wheel. They just use a good implementation.
Yeah, so in the end I doubt this is even worth bring out. Consoles and PCs are vastly different beasts. While the PS4pro might be in consumers hands anywhere from 2-3 years depending on sony's PS5 timeline, PC upgrade according to their owners will and that alone. 4k monitor adoption rate stands at >2% of Steam users right now. What's the point in working on and releasing such tech in a driver profile for the current cards out there when the people probably running a 4k monitor are likely already using the highest end cards out there already and capable of acceptable framerates anyways? By the time GPU hardware catches up to 4k at midrange pricerange (presumably next year) and people start buying 4k monitors, the tech is pointless other than for legacy cards who are probably just going to stick to 1080p anyways until they upgrade again.
I don't see in my post anything which suggests otherwise.
capitalCORN
Member
But you did instigate that Sony's solution was the best and others would suffer,
dr_rus
Member
Why do OP think that PC won't (or don't) do that? You can easily implement this type of upscaling / reconstruction on PC h/w in your game.
It doesn't make sense for PC to have any kind of h/w support for this though because of a sheer number of different output configurations and the ability to actually spend these transistors on general performance in games which don't use the upscaling (and I'm unsure at the moment what h/w support Pro have tbh as this is very much a shader postprocessing stage).
It doesn't make sense for PC to have any kind of h/w support for this though because of a sheer number of different output configurations and the ability to actually spend these transistors on general performance in games which don't use the upscaling (and I'm unsure at the moment what h/w support Pro have tbh as this is very much a shader postprocessing stage).
No I didn't. I said people trying to emulate it come out with costly and weird results. Nothing is stopping somebody coming upto with an entirely new system (which is better).
capitalCORN
Member
This reminds me of when people were arguing against high IQ and framerates because it made games too "gamey". Not that you're doing it but...
So highlight the part of the text which says I said Sony's is the best.
capitalCORN
Member
Do you need explicit results? Because the context is the same.
Depends on your interpretation and reading comprehension.
I'll tell you again, that's not what I was trying to imply. Sorry you didn't get it.
Do you even know what you were saying?
It's not standard upscaling, it's new upscaling. Yaaay.
i'll buy the highest resolution monitor i can afford the pixel budget for and render natively like a decent human being.
no. sony would never do that.
they want to sell you an underclocked mid ranged GPU instead.
no. sony would never do that.
they want to sell you an underclocked mid ranged GPU instead.
capitalCORN
Member
They stated all other implementations would be inferior. I quoted them to reflex their inference. What was your interpretation?
That nobody would be able to replicate it without it being costly/worse making Sony's method the best. Nonsense obviously, but lol. Fucking Ubisoft is already doing something similar iirc.
Yes.
capitalCORN
Member
So how am I wrong? I didn't imply he said it was the only way. Just making the point he stated that Sony did it 'best'.
So is remedy and given all the buzz on twitter from Sousa, id likely has a solution running for Bethesda titles using id's software.
It's hardly a new idea, either. I mean sony can dress it up for the console warriors all they want but to claim they have some kind of lock on the idea in perpetuity and will have the best solution now and forever is kind of daft.
I'm agreeing with you.
No, it's the new cloud
crazy monkey
Banned
capitalCORN
Member
My bad.
But the cloud is real? There's no shortage of industries and businesses dependent on it now.
Of which you are just lying.
Of course, but it's not substantially enhancing the performance of your XB1.
LukasTaves
Member
That doesn't seem to be about checkboard rendering at a first glance, they talk about using a low res image, a reference image and using both to find a uprendering matrix to do this transform.
There is a massive shortage of the type of partial cloud processing gaming implementations MS was trying to market 3 years ago though.
RealityCheque
Banned
It's the new blast processing.
capitalCORN
Member
Once again,
You state that any other implementation, that are not the implicated patented kind, will 'suffer'.
Not calling MS any less than bullshit on that fact, but the implementation they were marketing is become more and more a reality. I mean in the strict sense of remote processing.
Again your making stuff up which I never even wrote.
People have already mentioned in this thread games which use different systems to this which work fine.
The problems arise when someone tries to circumvent a patent to try and replicate the same results this one. As I said, costly and can produce weird results.
LordRaptor
Member
and a new 4K TV, and a new UHD BluRay Player, and a new HDMI passthrough sound system.
I'm increasingly convinced it's not exactly suits intentionally misleading consumers with technological-jargon that doesn't make sense, it's suits who don't understand what it is they are trying to sell.
The highest quality pixels.
Lister
Banned
Consoles aren't goign to be doing even upscaled 4K on anything like ultra anyway.
I alps don't see wy developers couldn't easily do this on PC. It's up to them though, unless Nvidia/AMD can provide an out of the box/driver level solution.
capitalCORN
Member
What are 'weird results'. And why is it a given?
That patent isn't the checker box method. (Nor it affect any usual tricks to get higher resolution on GPUs. (MSAA-trick, checkerbox, temporal reconstruction etc.)
A one implementation of checker box rendering is already used in a game on PC and gives >30% improvement in performance.
http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/guides/tom-clancys-rainbow-six-siege-graphics-and-performance-guide
Nope.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1022990/Rendering-Rainbow-Six-Siege
Page 44 forward.
Actually if developers want to have artifact free rendering in 4k with near 1080p shading cost the basic 4xMSAA trick might be a good choice.
Gives perfect edge resolution, no temporal artifacts. (Texture resolution/shading is 1080p.)
Without any tweaking in areas where there are no polygon edges, the basic version would give identical result to 1080p 2x nearest neighbor scaling you suggested.
Because this requires complex interaction with the game's own renderer and isn't something that can be simply enabled on the driver. More specifically, there's a bunch of things that must be done ensure things like texture sampling is consistent across discontinuous pixels and it needs velocity data for reprojection. The PS4 pro GPU has new features specific to aid checkerboard rendering.
BRocknRolla
Member
I 100% prefer native (and who wouldn't), but seeing as very few peoplr, even in the enthusiast space, are going to be able to do native 4k/60 with any kind of reliability any time soon, I would love an alternative solution.
LordRaptor
Member
I mean, you should probably be clear that you mean reliable 4k/60 of the latest AAA titles at Ultra / Super high settings, because a lot of people on "good" cards not "stupidly high end" cards can reliably hit a 4k/60fps target on older titles or on "console equivalent" detail settings
Lagspike_exe
Member
Volta Titan won't be hitting anytime soon. Don't get your hopes up.