That would be kind of weird, since the game's final scene is STILL Noctis and Luna in the afterlife.
I took the repeat of the opening dialogue as a way to remind the player of the beginning of the journey before showing the absolute end of it.
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Final Fantasy XV SPOILER THREAD
- Thread starter Kagari
- Start date
That would be kind of weird, since the game's final scene is STILL Noctis and Luna in the afterlife.
I took the repeat of the opening dialogue as a way to remind the player of the beginning of the journey before showing the absolute end of it.
Iirc they are actually messengers of the gods (a load screen tells you)
Make pryna's absolute absense and death all the more confusing.
SoraanTribal
Member
Lol what. No... I don't think that's what happened.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
I don't think that's what happened either, lol. But it would have been kind of interesting. Would have been a nice throwback to FF1's ending when the WoL break the time loop.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
Best sex indeed.
SoraanTribal
Member
Would have definitely been cool if it had gone that route. Lol
Lights and Waves
Member
Disagree. It was so dumb and I instantly thought:
Ok, they ran out of time when creating the game and had to rewrite Gentianna from whatever she was meant to be and turn her into secret Shiva.
Lights and Waves
Member
The moment you realize that this is the only FF game where the bad guy wins*
*
Wrong. Kefka wins, Ultimecia wins, Caius wins AND kills the main character AND causes the literal end of the universe.
What if that's not the afterlife, but the outcome of the new timeline where everything went right?
The selected picture being there kind of negates the theory.
They weren't very popular rulers then judging by the crowd they had.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
Kefka: That's like saying Beatrix won because she beat you at the end of Disc 1.
Ultimecia: Huh? She wanted to escape her fate and pretty literally 100% didn't.
Only Caius counts (but even then I'm sure at the end of XIII-2 he didn't expect everything that would happen to him and Yeul in XIII-3, whereas Ardyn's victory is much more complete at the end of FFXV).
It's the vengeful ghosts of Noctis and Luna plotting to destroy the happiness of their alternate timeline counterparts, by forcing Alt-Noctis to kill Stella.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
Exactly how I felt but I can't deny Shiva is sexy. Yup, Gentiana according to leaks/Roberto Ferrari she had a major role with Stella and had a sword or something. It was a friendly but icy stare whenever Stella needed her help.
Mediking
Member
Hahahaha just no way. That dialogue was just a reminder how the suicide mission began. Toss that theory into the trash can. There's no time loop stuff going on.
Prince of Space
Banned
Kefka brings about the World of Ruin, but doesn't manage to snuff out all life as he intended.
Ultimecia manages to
Dunno anything about Caius; haven't played XIII-2.
Ardyn sees the destruction of the Crystal, the complete severing of ties between man and gods, and the end of the Lucian lineage, plus his curse of immortality is lifted and he finally gets to die. Dude gets literally everything he wanted.
LOL
This is totally what I felt!!! I really,really doubt she was meant to be shiva.It was glaringly obvious this was hobbled together to save time on Shiva & Gentiana by making them one character.
Another thing to support that is that she is completely absent in the leviathan fight when She could've kept luna & the entire population of Alitissia safe by freezing Levi dead in its tracks.
This is at odds with her being close to Luna & liking humanity in general.
Going long with this, Ardyn does indeed seem to be the only villain whose plan truly worked as intended. Below are some FF spoilers:
Garland/Chaos: Desired ultimate power and immortality but is destroyed by the WoL, who ends the time loop.
The Emperor: Becomes absolute ruler of the world and then Hell, but is still defeated (twice)
Xande: Wanted to become immortal and froze time to do it, but is defeated by the WoLs.
Zemus: Wanted the Blue Planet for the Lunarians but he is defeated by Fusoya, Cecil, and Golbez.
Exdeath: Wanted to end existence, but is defeated by Bartz and co.
Kefka: Insane and destroyed the world but his true goal was to end all existence. Thankfully, he fails.
Sephiroth: Wanted to take over the Planet and seek out other planets to conquer, but is defeated several times by Cloud
Ultimecia wanted to negate all existence and recreate the world with herself as ruler. Not only does she fail to stop Seed, she actually CREATES Seed (and, as one theory goes, trapping the Sorceress Power in an infinite loop) when she dies.
Kuja: Wanted to get revenge on Garland and Terra but then end existence once Garland revealed the truth about his mortality. Defeated by Zidane and co. before he could destroy the Crystal (he almost does and summons Necron)
Yu Yevin: He just wanted to summon, summon, summon. Yuna, Tidus, and Jecht finally send him to his rest.
Shujin: wanted to destroy Spira with Vegnagun. Defeated by Yuripa and laid to rest by lenna.
Vayne: Wanted to become a Dynast King free of Occurian interference. Defeated by Ashe and co.
Barty and Orphen: They wanted to die so that Cocoon would fall and kill millions of people, opening Etro's Gate for Bhuni's return. They do get their death but Vanille and Fang's sacrifice stops Cocoon from being destroyed and closes the Gate.
Caius got what he wanted in XIII-2, yes, but in LR, we find he is trapped between two opposing forces. His ultimate fate is something I am sure he never expected would be his role!
Bhunizelve: The ultimate troll who wanted a new universe with beings who would only worship him and his awesomeness. He loses his new world to Lightning and is now stuck as a crystal lost among the Unseen Realm.
The Emperor: Becomes absolute ruler of the world and then Hell, but is still defeated (twice)
Xande: Wanted to become immortal and froze time to do it, but is defeated by the WoLs.
Zemus: Wanted the Blue Planet for the Lunarians but he is defeated by Fusoya, Cecil, and Golbez.
Exdeath: Wanted to end existence, but is defeated by Bartz and co.
Kefka: Insane and destroyed the world but his true goal was to end all existence. Thankfully, he fails.
Sephiroth: Wanted to take over the Planet and seek out other planets to conquer, but is defeated several times by Cloud
Ultimecia wanted to negate all existence and recreate the world with herself as ruler. Not only does she fail to stop Seed, she actually CREATES Seed (and, as one theory goes, trapping the Sorceress Power in an infinite loop) when she dies.
Kuja: Wanted to get revenge on Garland and Terra but then end existence once Garland revealed the truth about his mortality. Defeated by Zidane and co. before he could destroy the Crystal (he almost does and summons Necron)
Yu Yevin: He just wanted to summon, summon, summon. Yuna, Tidus, and Jecht finally send him to his rest.
Shujin: wanted to destroy Spira with Vegnagun. Defeated by Yuripa and laid to rest by lenna.
Vayne: Wanted to become a Dynast King free of Occurian interference. Defeated by Ashe and co.
Barty and Orphen: They wanted to die so that Cocoon would fall and kill millions of people, opening Etro's Gate for Bhuni's return. They do get their death but Vanille and Fang's sacrifice stops Cocoon from being destroyed and closes the Gate.
Caius got what he wanted in XIII-2, yes, but in LR, we find he is trapped between two opposing forces. His ultimate fate is something I am sure he never expected would be his role!
Bhunizelve: The ultimate troll who wanted a new universe with beings who would only worship him and his awesomeness. He loses his new world to Lightning and is now stuck as a crystal lost among the Unseen Realm.
Mediking
Member
Luna was doomed to die. Gentiana couldn't save her OR Noctis. All she could do... was help them get to where they needed to be.
Now was Gentiana originally planned as Shiva? I dunno....
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
Yeah, the ramuh pillar part kinda made me think she was mysterious but certainly not one of the 6. I hate this "offscreen" deal to explain things but Gentiana seemed like she had no bond with Luna other than flashbacks. Her voice was perfect... such a mysterious character but I even laughed when Noctis said "Wait, Gentiana? You're the Glacian!" He didn't even ask how? ....such lazy and bad explanations.
Ardyn stabbed her,Levi severely injury her-both preventable instances if help was present.
Shiva/Gentiana supposedly has a strong personal relation to Luna and a strong affinity to Humanity.
She stepped in against ardyn,stepped in against Ifrit,absolutely no reason for not to aid against Leviathan.
+ She is elementally superior to Levi.
Speaking of never questioning anything, Noctis hardly questions anything that happens around him.He just reluctantly accepts and follows through whatever he is told.
He never questions or critically thinks about WTF is going on,nor does he attempt to take action to change his fate or the fate of his world.
This is something that's becoming increasingly distressing the more I think about it.
He's not an inspiring or great character at all.He succumbs to Dogma and fate.
MegaSackman
Member
I think there's a cutscene between Luna and Ravus that implies that she was dying/going to die, like if life were leaving her.
Anyway, there a million things that should have been explained better or explained at all, or developed or completely changed.
Doesn't really matter because he would have no choice but to accept fate. He dies if he takes no action or he dies taking action. No win, win around that.
So Noctis needed Tidus?
Screamapillar
Member
So I am 46 hours into the game. Main story completed. Now going back through and doing sidequests. I completed the bases to unlock the airship. Just finished the Crestholm Channel, that was intense.
My major problem at this point is two-fold:
1) Though I am over-leveled for the quests/ dungeons I am taking on, I am consistently getting my ass kicked by most of the bosses, and find myself either burning through potions like crazy, or just cheesing by calling a Summons to basically get rid of the boss for me
2) I have only ever performed magic twice, and one of those two times was to complete the Deadeye hunt, where magic is forced in order to ignite the barrels to trigger Deadeye to actually take damage.
Am I doing something wrong? Should I be putting more emphasis on magic? Is it normal to use so many elixirs and potions in boss battles when you're a few levels above the quest level?
Overall, absolutely loving the game, just minor confusion and minor annoyances at certain times with the combat.
My major problem at this point is two-fold:
1) Though I am over-leveled for the quests/ dungeons I am taking on, I am consistently getting my ass kicked by most of the bosses, and find myself either burning through potions like crazy, or just cheesing by calling a Summons to basically get rid of the boss for me
2) I have only ever performed magic twice, and one of those two times was to complete the Deadeye hunt, where magic is forced in order to ignite the barrels to trigger Deadeye to actually take damage.
Am I doing something wrong? Should I be putting more emphasis on magic? Is it normal to use so many elixirs and potions in boss battles when you're a few levels above the quest level?
Overall, absolutely loving the game, just minor confusion and minor annoyances at certain times with the combat.
I mean,especially within the universe of FFXV there's good reason to question WTF is going on with the Crystal and the Gods.
They're destructive,capricious and unreliable.
Ardyn himself got fucked over by the crystal & gods inspite of being a truly good person.
Shouldn't Noctis ponder whether following through with what he is told is actually any good ?
He was left in the dark most his life about shit and he had 10 years to ponder. LOL
Prince of Space
Banned
Ardyn knows that getting Noctis to full power (and becoming the True King) will kill him anyway, and that only said True King is capable of completely killing Ardyn by eradicating the daemons he's got in him. It's why he assists the bros early on.
Yeah, I felt the same way about the ending. Even ignoring the argument about whether Noctis is a heroic / inspiring character, it's just...boring.
Like, Noctis gets sucked into the Crystal, Bahamut tells him he's going to die, Noctis makes an "Ah crap" sort of face.
10 years later, Noctis wakes up and goes to die.
The end.
Earlier in the thread, there was some discussion on Noctis' character arc, that this was a story about him growing up and learning responsibility. To be honest, I don't really see it. He's resigned to his fate from the moment he drives off to enter into a politically-motivated arranged marriage, and that doesn't change up until the final moments of the game. He's afraid, but never enough to subvert or challenge the plan that the gods (and Ardyn) have laid out for him. There's no twists in Noctis' tale; it all goes in exactly the way that the in-the-know characters tell you it will.
I completely agree with everything you said.
I never liked Nyx much ,but I felt he was more internally motivated than Noctis ever was & he actually wears the ring,trash talks the kings and gets power he needed & deserved.
But yeah almost every aspect of Noctis' life is out of his control.Even if things didn't go to shit & times were peaceful, he was never gonna take charge of his life.
That imo is just terrible writing.Even if Noctis is likeable & casually nice, he doesn't have an interesting or inspiring internal world.
LordKasual
Banned
This story is an empathetic one. And it's supposed to be based on reality. Noctis doesn't ask about the things that are going on around him because to him, what he needs to do is obvious -- obtain the crystal, reclaim his throne. He was born and molded for this. His friends were raised and molded for this.
The difference between XV's narrative and the usual FF tropes (thing happening, twist happens, a godlike being is somehow involved, kill godlike being, happily ever after) is that not only is it setup in a more realistic fashion, it gives you more realistic results considering what is pulling the strings. The gods are either directly or indirectly responsible for Starscourge, nobody knows right now, but what's clear is that they are directly responsible for Ardyn and how everything surrounding him went down. Ardyn is thousands of years old, immortal, and has the power of both the daemons and the crystal on his side. If he wanted, he could have taken the world over anytime he wanted to.
Both Ardyn and Noctis / Lucis kings were all set on their path by the Six before anyone had a chance to say anything about it. Noctis follows his path without complaining or deviating because it's the only path that's avaliable to him. Noctis actually had the chance to walk away from Ardyn after killing him, but that isn't the ending that he or anyone else would have wanted. Noctis, Luna, and Ardyn all got fucked by their circumstances, of which there was no viable way out that wouldn't have ended in annihilation of everyone on the planet. But the conflict is setup in a way where, in some bittersweet fashion, everyone still ultimately gets what they want. (Which probably is why Luna's tunnelvision for her duty as Oracle was emphasized in her character so much, as well as Noctis' childlike desire to just want to be with Luna over pretty much everything else.)
I'm sure it would have been neat for Noctis to pull some shit out of his ass and try to kill Bahamut and the other 5...but that just isn't how things happen in real life. In real life, you're given a set of cards, and those are the cards you play. Some hands you can work with...some you can't.
cj_iwakura
Member
Loved the ending, especially the segue into the logo. Classy touch. Yes, things could have been more fleshed out, but it was a great journey.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Wow, I guess Vayne really wasn't that bad at all, especially by comparison
Mediking
Member
Ravus TOLD Luna that she was doomed and she KNEW that. Regis knew Noctis was doomed. So did Luna. So did Gentiana. So did thr higher forces in the game. So did Ardyn. Noctis began really getting scared when Luna died. He was freaking out on the train and he wasn't really worried about Ignis' eyes because his girl just died!!! Thats what I don't understand about Gladio's stupid rant at Noctis.
Noctis sadly accepted the ring in chp 13.....
Then Bahamut dropped the bomb... that Noctis waa doomed.
Noctis sadly accepted the ring in chp 13.....
Then Bahamut dropped the bomb... that Noctis waa doomed.
LordBaztion
Member
Has someone tried to explore the dark World?
LordKasual
Banned
You pretty much have to kill Ignis first lol. I beat them in my 70s but it generally comes down to Armiger and killing Ignis so they will stop healing eachother.
Ribbon for Prompto, never let him hit you with that recoil shit, instakill even at lv99
I just saved Gladio for last, he seemed to evade the least but a few of his moves seem to OHKO so i just avoided him
Ignis was the white mage, Prompto was the black mage, Gladio was the point DPS/tank
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