Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
next xbox will be an exbox
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Is the next Xbox essentially going to be a Steam Machine?
- Thread starter Fredrik
- Start date
Dr. Wilkinson
Member
….how is this a bad thing?
Palabragrís
Member
In all honesty, I hope you're wrong about the pricing of this Xbox PC. The MS Surface 2024 is around CLP$1.500.000.- here (around US$1635, acording to online converters). That's including taxes (19%) and before delivery. I ignore if it's a similar price in comparison to the US.
Just as a reference, today the PS5 Slim Digital costs around CLP$540.000.- (US$588,60), the Xbox Series S costs around CLP$360.000.- (~US$392,40) and the Series X costs around CLP$580.000.- (~US$632,20), all depending on the store, of course.
Last edited:
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
They did that already. But they came back crawling to Steam...
Fredrik
Member
I don’t think Microsoft is worried about that, Linux gaming is super niche and less of a threat to Windows than Xbox is currently to Playstation or Epic is to Steam.
But I’m not sure what their endgame plan for this is. To me it seems like a nice box under the TV with Steam access would help Valve more than Microsoft.
Fredrik
Member
They’re just back in the pond fishing some more, using Steam to build a userbase.
But it’s possible that the big publisher push toward individual launchers aren’t coming until it’s all subscriptions and running from servers.
Topher
Gold Member
I don't see that happening either. Not on PC. EA, Microsoft and Ubisoft all have subs on PC and they are just sucking wind.
Last edited:
They still will be fighting for the market that Steam basically have to themselves now.
Topher
Gold Member
Eh.....don't really see that as a fight. They offer PC Game Pass but that's the only thing compelling that they are doing.
RoboFu
One of the green rats
This is the truth. It's all about building the audience for the inevitable app on every device.
coffinbirth
Member
1000% LESS LIKELY LMAO, and not at all what I said.
DUAL BOOT...same as your suggestion, but in a way that isn't absurd.
You are literally suggesting they include Linux as if it is somehow more user friendly than Windows...and not an entirely different OS that Valve only uses to avoid paying Microsoft to begin with. You act like people that have Steam Libraries suddenly could not possibly understand Windows over Linux, despite the vast majority of it's users doing exactly that to begin with.
The fuck are people smoking around here?
TropicanaTwista
Member
Do consoles gamers really want that? As a console only gamer myself, I have next to zero interest in PC gaming. Mainly for the reasons you listed but also just the ease of user of console. It's pretty much plug n play out if the box. Don't have to worry about checking drivers or any other nonsense.
But to take it further to your overall OP, what is MS endgame here. Using me as an example, someone who is not in the Xbox or Steam ecosystem, if I were to buy this said box, how is MS making money off of me? I would undoubtedly use steam to buy all games from for a couple of reasons: It seems like a better ecosystem that has been around longer, if I then ever did decide to get a traditional PC I would have my library, it already gets all MS games day and date, and steam seems to have better sales/discounts. I just fail to see how MS is getting people to their ecosystem here and how they actually make money long term off of this.
In the end, this seems like a rather niche product imo. It just seems to target people who own a Xbox console and game on steam. I'm not sure what the market is for that, but seeing how Xbox series is under 30 mil, how many use both. 10, 15 20 mil? (Really have no idea here, just spit balling). Then out of them users who is actually interested in this? Interest is only half the battle too, on top of the people who are interested, how many would drop hundreds (maybe even over $1000 if they go high end) to actually buy said product.
TLDR: I feel like the market for this device is small and new users it attracts would further devalue the Xbox brand.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
I’d expect something like this.
(Microsoft Gaming won’t need an Xbox logo)
Here’s a FAQ all about what it can do.
support.microsoft.com
(Microsoft Gaming won’t need an Xbox logo)
Here’s a FAQ all about what it can do.
Windows Arm-based PCs FAQ - Microsoft Support
Learn about using a Windows Arm-based PC and get answers to common questions about Arm-based PCs.
support.microsoft.com
THE DUCK
voted poster of the decade by bots
The only reason to include steam on an xbox system to begin with is to increase the attractiveness of the xbox console, otherwise you probably shoudln't do it at all.
If you release and xbox with a windows partition, and regular windows, that increase to buyers will exist, but it won't be that much more attractive to TV buyers. PC buyers already have a PC, running windows. And they can run xbox games on the xbox store. Or steam big picture mode.
Maybe there is some crossover then with a few buying an "xbox" that runs windows, but that's basically a PC and already exists X 10000.
So your bla bla bla doesn't really apply to what someone who is launching a gaming console would care about. Of course PC users don't need this.
So the alternative, if you want to offer steam ON A CONSOLE, at least based on what exists today to our knowledge, would be to use steam OS. Have you ever even used steam OS? Of course it is a million times more game freiendly than linux, and the average use would have zero idea it's linux running underneith. So much as you like to pretend you are way smarter than everyone, this is a viable alternative. Could this change, sure, if MS has a secret new TV freindly OS to run right now that runs steam properly.
Regular linux, windows, osx, all unusable in thier current state on a plug and play TV console box. Steam OS = usable as of day one, steam deck has proven this.
DeltaPolarBear
Member
Valve wasn't worried about Microsoft pulling their games... Valve was worried about Microsoft banning Steam entirely from Windows!
That is why Steam OS is a thing. Valve is aware of the danger of Microsoft just killing Steam as a piece of software entirely, so they left themselves an option to operate outside the Windows ecosystem.
Valve doesn't WANT to leave Windows, but by leaving their options open, it allows them to have the piece of mind that the lifeboats exists for them to jump into if the ship ever hits an iceberg. And Steam Deck is another step in that process. Steam will stay on Windows as long as it can, but they would not be blackmailed by Microsoft.
Topher
Gold Member
That's entirely way off. Windows is an open platform. If Microsoft tried to ban competitors from Windows then they would have massive anti-trust lawsuits coming their way. Just no way Microsoft "banning" Steam happens and I guarantee you that is not something Valve worries about in the slightest. Just absurd.
Steam OS is a thing because Valve doesn't have to pay for Windows licenses for Steam Deck and Valve has more control over their fork of Arch Linux than they will ever have over Windows.
Last edited:
DeltaPolarBear
Member
Gabe was a former Microsoft employee. He knows better than anyone that MS is willing to risk a lawsuit because they have the lawyers already paid for. Might as well use them. Microsoft had gotten away with worse things.
Topher
Gold Member
And? Apple's got lawyers too but they are being forced to open up iOS to other stores in the EU. That's nothing compared to what the world governments (primarily US, UK and EU) would do to Microsoft if they tried to make Windows a closed platform. You are simply not thinking this through.
Last edited:
MarkMe2525
Member
I hope so, I have always wanted a gaming PC, but could never justify building one, since I typically have every home console already. By tellng myself "it's just the new Xbox", I can mind fuck myself into dropping a grand on something I really don't need. Needs to support Steam for VR though.
Fredrik
Member
The driver concern is exaggerated and when using Steam big picture mode it’s like using a console, you just use your controller and choose your game and press play.
But if you exit Steam you’re instantly reminded that you’re using a PC… I come from the console side and for me that’s something I wish they could change. A big picture mode in Windows would be nice, a browser and file explorer, and a touch pad, and a good on-screen keyboard. That’s all they need to do.
Yeah this is where I get confused as well. As said earlier it seems like this would be better for Valve/Steam than for Microsoft/Xbox.
Steam would grow from being accessed on an assumed well-designed box for the living room that isn’t as power limited as Steam Deck.
But Xbox? It’s dead. And no online gaming paywall money, can’t have that on a PC device. And even less people than now would buy games on Microsoft Store, no exclusives there and Play Anywhere would be pointless. Steam is already ”anywhere”, on desktop PC, handheld, and then console, and cloud saves works perfectly.
Maybe they’ll put Gamepass front and center? A Gamepass Machine, booting right into Gamepass, with access to the Steam library whenever there is no Gamepass version, with bonus access to Playstation games through Sony’s Steam transition?
HerjansEagleFeeder
Gold Member
In any case, it's going to be very interesting seeing what all of the three are cooking up for next gen. With all the stagnation and creative poverty going on, a real shake up of the industry like the one MS is allegedly preparing can only be a good thing. The traditional console model is definitely on it's last legs, the GAFers claiming it ain't so because of a couple of years increased profits YOY here and there just don't want to see this. The market isn't growing, the platform holders are with their backs to the wall.
It's just a standard PC at that point. A "steam machine" was a linux, Steam OS, machine designed to push the steam store. If you change everything that made a steam machine a "steam machine" then you can't really call it a steam machine. It would be like calling sold PCs "N64 machines" because that's what you installed and use the most.
Megatron
Member
if anyone blocks PS games on it, it won’t be MS.
Fredrik
Member
Yeah I guess you’re right. As said above the idea might be to make a Gamepass Machine. A well-designed box under the TV that is booting right into Gamepass, with access to the Steam library whenever there is no Gamepass version, with bonus access to Playstation games through Sony’s Steam transition.
Physiognomonics
Member
I believe the point is not to make it a Steam machine. More like a Xbox Store machine. I mean there are already good Steam machines out there so I wouldn't see the point of making others but I may be wrong.
Zzzz *gasp!*
If the rumors are true that the next Xbox will run Steam and have third party manufacturers doing their own versions.
Won’t that turn it into a Steam Machine??
On my PC I boot into Steam Big Picture and except for 5 seconds of looking at a Windows desktop it feels like a Steam device, literally.
MS could tweak the OS and have some overlay to get people onto Gamepass etc but the big thing will no doubt be Steam access, right?
Then is it still a Xbox? Or is it more like a Steam Machine?
… just tell me to go back to bed if this is dumb zzzz
Kataploom
Gold Member
I'd like it to be! Since Valve doesn't want to take the Steam Deck success to revive the Steam Machines... But I think the success of Steam Deck comes from it being a closed hardware as well, since pre-compiled shaders is a great deal on PC, not sure if that's gonna cause any problem for Xbox if they're following that path
skit_data
Member
It's funny because when I wrote this 6 months ago this felt like a novel, possible route for Xbox to go down and now it seems more or less confirmed that they are indeed doing it.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Nothing in the world would make me happier than SteamOS becoming a truly viable OS in its own right. I would love to abandon WIndows for gaming.
I'd be very slightly less happy if Microsoft would release (I'd even pay) for a gaming OS that strips off much of the overheard and just allows to run games.
Microsoft has so many easy wins that would a do a lot for the gaming community and generate much needed goodwill, but yet they won't take them....
I'd be very slightly less happy if Microsoft would release (I'd even pay) for a gaming OS that strips off much of the overheard and just allows to run games.
Microsoft has so many easy wins that would a do a lot for the gaming community and generate much needed goodwill, but yet they won't take them....
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Its too early for them to talk about this yet
Though we may very well see some new hardware
Fredrik
Member
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I am clear that they are going to talk about their plans for the next next generation hardware accompanying the announcement of the new "revision" of XSX that seems to be true.
But it's just going to be that, mentioning your plans and BC support as Sarah Bond has been doing or, perhaps, the name of the project (as it was Scorpio/XBO X).
Everything will depend on the time remaining for the launch. We will see, of course the hardware is a part that should be touched and treated in the Sohwcase.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Topher
Gold Member
Fredrik
Member
I can’t
Can you leak something? Do it for GAF, imagine all the news articles that would link to your post, it’s a great idea! 
Geometric-Crusher
"Nintendo games are like indies, and worth at most $19" 🤡
Microsoft needs to sneak a piece of hardware into people's living rooms in order to have subscriptions.
It wouldn't surprise me because that's what a 3DO is, Microsoft wants to be third party on this open Xbox before becoming completely third party. That is, if there is a next Xbox, honestly they should forget hardware and just port their games to Nintendo and Sony platforms like Sega did.
It wouldn't surprise me because that's what a 3DO is, Microsoft wants to be third party on this open Xbox before becoming completely third party. That is, if there is a next Xbox, honestly they should forget hardware and just port their games to Nintendo and Sony platforms like Sega did.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Fredrik
Member
They’re already porting to Playstation and Nintendo. This is something else, going by rumours they want to enter the living room from the PC side of things. It’s an interesting idea and it’s coming at the right time when people are warming up to the idea of having a PC in the living room. Just not sure how they plan to make money from games if people start using Steam instead of Xbox store.
Geometric-Crusher
"Nintendo games are like indies, and worth at most $19" 🤡
It's an interesting idea but the leadership of the Xbox division will ruin everything.
Third party manufacturers will demand to profit from hardware this is the alpha reason for this model to fail but Microsoft knows this, will they be willing to make the biggest subsidy in the history of the video game industry? I don't know, it's business not philanthropy.
the Beta reason why this model fails is that there are more spec variations, you know the xbox series S has raised complaints, you could argue that being a pc the new xbox would receive the same treatment - I say, that's bad - the devs They will never optimize because there will be the thought ''download the graph yourself or buy a more powerful Microsoft Machine''
The reason Gama makes this type of model fail is the possible division of the baby, you know an xbox with steam is not a PC but it is not a console either, it will be bad as a PC and maybe bad as a console. Will Microsoft give up charging to play online? PC nobody pays that, how to equate this?
The only way this model can work is for Microsoft to corrupt Playstation's leadership into giving up on the winning model of having dedicated hardware built in house.
I liked the xbox 360 but honestly the modern xbox isn't worth it, on the PC you can play Hellblade 2 at 60fps, without a black bar, imho xbox is doomed I don't recommend it, even a future version with Steam.
Last edited:
Fredrik
Member
That’s a very negative take.
I’ve jumped off Xbox onto PC now but if their future PC console hybrid thing with Steam was available when I built my last PC I think would’ve bought that instead. I just wanted something in the living room for comfy couch gaming that could handle both Xbox and Playstation games plus multiplats. Ended up with this aquarium…
I boot it in Steam big picture mode, it’s more or less perfect. But when I need a keyboard or mouse, like when installing mods or having to login on some external account bs, then I get cranky and has to pull out a wireless keyboard.
If MS can solve those scenarios on a OS level with a controller focused big picture mode, that you never have to leave, then I think their next box will be a nice bridge between consoles and desktop PCs that could appeal to a wide audience.
But it can’t have the usual console restrictions. There needs to be a file explorer, a web browser, no removed settings menus, needs to run standard exe files and use standard file system, and definitely can’t have an online gaming paywall, that nonsense should’ve been scrapped a long time ago.
The rumours might be false though. Maybe they’re just doing a standard Xbox. Who knows
Fredrik
Member
Woah! Could you detail that a bit? Why wouldn’t there be motherboards for ARM CPUs or graphics cards??
peish
Gold Member
I am just guessing, i dont see ARM making socketable CPU. So if this demand takes off, than PC gaming hardware will just consolidate like other tech before. It is not like Nvidia and AMD makes a lot of money from DIY components.
If Asus MSI handheld PC takes off, at least this mitigate the loss of motherboards sales. And also we are getting into the 400-500W zones with today PC gaming hardware.
Last edited:
sendit
Member
You can do that right now. Which is why the Series S/X are dead platforms.
coffinbirth
Member
Where did the jump in logic from suggesting the possibility of offering alternative storefronts(as an EU preventative measure, at that) to necessitating alternative operating systems? Why in the christ would they do that? All they need is a disclaimer that M&KB support might be required. What you are suggesting would COMPLETELY sidestep the make money part of this whole thing, lmao. Game Pass only runs games natively on Windows...
And as a PC gamer and a Day One Steam Deck owner, BULLSHIT. A thousand trips to desktop mode(ahem, fucking Linux) and back using shitty bluetooth mouse and key to fix games that otherwise would require zero fiddling in Windows SCREAMS BULLSHIT.
Where are the people using Steam OS on their PC's? Right. So what's the GUI difference between Xbox OS and Steam OS? Proper controller support and sidebar submenus? Like some of the stuff they were showing at Build 2024? lol. Pretty sure Microsoft would DARE that route before literally ANYTHING you have suggested...unless they actually ARE trying to acquire Valve, hahahaha.
This is tantamount to saying you think they should offer dual booting to Mac OS to be able to play Apple Arcade games. They wouldn't make any money doing that either.
This is just a ridiculously incorrect and out of touch thing to say.
WTF is a "tv buyer" in this context, lmfao
TV friendly? What year are you living in? Been pc gaming from the couch for the better part of 10 years.
None of your arguments make sense.
DavidGzz
Member
I think you just described a HTPC/mini gaming PC. All shapes, sizes, prices and power levels out there.
But you pay for what you get and then some for the form factor. $499 would net you some lackluster build. With Xbox, it could be a good bit more powerful and cheaper (or at least $599) if MS is willing to eat the cost or break even. Plus having the name Xbox with an easy console like menu system and it could do pretty well.