Support NeoGAF

[zoukka]

2D platformers are actually pretty hard to make.

Yes but the workload put into level design is not valuable. One man hour of rigging a 3D! Character versus level design is more important and way more demanding! Because all college graduates can design memorable and challenging 2D levels while 3D artists and cinematic game designers are basically as hard to find as the next einstein.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

They're really not. You could argue that a good 2D platformer is hard to design, but in terms of implementation, only puzzle games and 2D shooters are easier.

Design is a pretty fundamental part of, you know, making a game

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

When another developer looks at the failure of Zombie U (the best reviewed/selling(?) 3rd party title), how can they not be pessimistic?

Zombie U wasn't the barometer. Assassin's Creed, Black Ops 2, Madden, FIFA, and NBA2k were. Literally the largest franchises in gaming in the West. Several were near perfect ports. Publishers look at the attach rates for those games and scale down for their projections for everything else. A major console where AC3 and Blops 2 sell < 150k in 8 months? No matter what the reason, those numbers are damning.

 

[M°°nblade]

No, people just let hype and rumors get the better of them

Can you blame them?

When you read that Retro Studios hires Naughty Dog, id Software and Vigil Games staff members for their upcoming game, Donkey kong is the absolutely last game people expect them to be making.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

look, i played zombi u at launch, i beat it the first week it came out, and i enjoyed it very much; however, that game was not destined to be a big hit because it was a new idea with no marketing push. Oh, and the game wouldve been a 9+ scored game if it had any ounce of polish. It is a rough game.

It wasn't a hit primarily because of the install base. It's not a perfect game, but it's clearly the best of the rest.

Zombie U wasn't the barometer. Assassin's Creed, Black Ops 2, Madden, FIFA, and NBA2k were. Literally the largest franchises in gaming in the West. Several were near perfect ports. Publishers look at the attach rates for those games and scale down for their projections for everything else. A major console where AC3 and Blops 2 sell < 150k in 8 months? No matter what the reason, those numbers are damning.

I used Zombie U as the example because it's generally well received within NeoGAF and further afield.

 

[Kurtofan]

When you read that Retro Studios hires Naughty Dog, id Software and Vigil Games staff members for their upcoming game, Donkey kong is the absolutely last game people expect them to be making.

You can't blame them.

Rare made several DK games along with Killer Instinct, Perfect Dark and Goldeneye.

And Naughty Dog made platformers as well, more than Retro did.

 

[StunandStab]

Also I'm sure if they released a new one you'd reject it for just being another racer when Nintendo already has Mario Kart.

The game would have to do a lot to touch what is the greatest racing game of all time: F-ZERO GX.

No, I certainly would not say it's "just another racer", Kart racers and futuristic arcade racers are completely different things. One of which I have absolutely no interest in.

Anyway, with Nintendo's creative minds in the current state that they are I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if a new F-ZERO came out and was totally underwhelming. Perhaps Miyamoto's decision not to make a new F-ZERO is actually one of the smartest decisions he has made recently as he knows he probably can't touch the greatness that is GX.

Either way I would definitely be following it very closely and would hope for the best.

know there is more to their systems than 2D platformers and Pikmin.

I was only talking about Wii U, sorry I didn't make that clear. If you really mean that about Wii U, though, that is simply factually incorrect at this point in time, there is really NOTHING more to Wii U right now than Pikmin and NSMBU.

Nintendo has SMB3D World, MK 8, and Donkey Kong coming in the near future. I am not the least bit interested in either of those titles. It's really unfortunate about Mario because Mario 64 is one of the greatest games of all time, Mario Sunshine was a great followup, and the Galaxies was Mario with a new perspective and great platforming to go along with it, but SMB3D World does nothing for me. It's Mario with a cat suit. It does nothing for me.

Can't believe you even bothered to post that after I pointed out how silly the point was. Though I shouldn't be surprised as you seem to be able to only focus on one thing (in this instance Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze) and become oblivious to everything else.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, what the hell are you talking about? I made one post about how I feel about Wii U and you make all these assumptions about me... geeze.

First of all, Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze is, unfortunately, simply the most recent evidence towards one of Nintendo's largest problems with the Wii U: the lack of software diversity from Nintendo's output. Yes, my previous post highlighted that fact.

No, I am not oblivious to everything else. As far as "everything else" goes, there are a few games coming to Wii U I am actually greatly looking forward to. X, in particular, looks amazing. I love Smash Bros., too, so there's that. Bayonetta 2 is cool, I liked the first game. And last but not least, SMT x FE sounds amazing as I am a huge FE fan and I like SMT. Now, will I buy a Wii U in order to play all those games? Well, maybe, I'm not sure. Of all those games, only X really comes close to being a "must have" for me. We'll see.

Despite all that, however, I still think the Wii U is a shitty console, and I still think Nintendo's current output is equally shitty.

 

[TDLink]

I was only talking about Wii U, sorry I didn't make that clear. If you really mean that about Wii U, though, that is simply factually incorrect at this point in time, there is really NOTHING more to Wii U right now than Pikmin and NSMBU.

Nintendo has SMB3D World, MK 8, and Donkey Kong coming in the near future. I am not the least bit interested in either of those titles. It's really unfortunate about Mario because Mario 64 is one of the greatest games of all time, Mario Sunshine was a great followup, and the Galaxies was Mario with a new perspective and great platforming to go along with it, but SMB3D World does nothing for me. It's Mario with a cat suit. It does nothing for me.

So you say this and yet later you admit:

No, I am not oblivious to everything else. As far as "everything else" goes, there are a few games coming to Wii U I am actually greatly looking forward to. X, in particular, looks amazing. I love Smash Bros., too, so there's that. Bayonetta 2 is cool, I liked the first game. And last but not least, SMT x FE sounds amazing as I am a huge FE fan and I like SMT. Now, will I buy a Wii U in order to play all those games? Well, maybe, I'm not sure. Of all those games, only X really comes close to being a "must have" for me. We'll see.

Despite all that, however, I still think the Wii U is a shitty console, and I still think Nintendo's current output is equally shitty.

Now obviously with that last statement you are biased towards thinking anything Nintendo does is going to be shit. Even beyond that though, with the titles you admitted are also coming (as well as stuff you didn't mention like The Wonderful 101) there is at least as many non-platformers (if not more) coming to the system than platformers.

There is nothing wrong with the Nintendo focus on that genre either. Nintendo makes tons of games in nearly every genre but Platformers have always been their bread and butter. Right now there are very few other companies in the industry (indies aside) even investing in trying to make platformers, especially ones with big budgets.

Maybe you don't like platformers but many many people do, and they typically have wider appeal than most other genres. Just because you don't like the genre doesn't mean it's shit. Nintendo has more than platformers coming anyways.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

Can you blame them?

When you read that Retro Studios hires Naughty Dog, id Software and Vigil Games staff members for their upcoming game, Donkey kong is the absolutely last game people expect them to be making.

If I remember correctly, the Naughty Dog employee (a company that made two mascot platformer franchises before, no idea if he worked there then though) explicitly mentioned on twitter that it felt good to not be working on a realistic title (I don't know the exact words, I'm sure you can find it)

Considering those comments in the context of retro's previous game (and how well it sold) and the rerelease on 3ds (also reduced price on Wii version), its definitely not the last thing I would expect

 

[Bony Manifesto]

Design is a pretty fundamental part of, you know, making a game

Yeah, you're right. I think I get so bogged down in the technical side of things, that dragging out platforms and obstacles to make a fun level seems like a lark in comparison. I forget about the constant iteration and refinement that designers can spend hundreds of hours plugging away at.

 

[evilromero]

Can you blame them?

When you read that Retro Studios hires Naughty Dog, id Software and Vigil Games staff members for their upcoming game, Donkey kong is the absolutely last game people expect them to be making.

I can't believe people are still running in circles with this. I just want to Retro to rectify my disappointment with a core game that ISN'T a 2D platformer.

 

[M°°nblade]

Rare made several DK games along with Killer Instinct, Perfect Dark and Goldeneye.

And Naughty Dog made platformers as well.

Yes, 9 years ago.
On the PS2.

They also made the 'Uncharted' series and recently 'the last of us'.
Adding the fact that Retro didn't announce or show anything untill 6 months after the Wii U launch, it's not really abnormal that people expected them to be working on a 'high profile' game.

If I remember correctly, the Naughty Dog employee (a company that made two mascot platformer franchises before, no idea if he worked there then though) explicitly mentioned on twitter that it felt good to not be working on a realistic title (I don't know the exact words, I'm sure you can find it)

Considering those comments in the context of retro's previous game (and how well it sold) and the rerelease on 3ds (also reduced price on Wii version), its definitely not the last thing I would expect

The only thing I can find is this:

Alas I am going to shelve it for a little while as I am going to work on another project that I am super excited about. I can't talk about it too much but if all goes well it might just be one of my crowning achievements as an artist....

He doesn't say anything about not working on a realistic title here.

http://www.ign.com/blogs/81jono81/2...ame-hires-big-names-from-the-industry-updated
At least Donkey kong was the last thing the writer of this article expected

So what do you think this could be? Retro's take on the Zelda series? Star Fox? F-zero? metroid? A new IP? Whatever it is, It may convince me to get a Wii U earlier than I expected. what do you think? Sound off below!

 

[StunandStab]

So you say this and yet later you admit:



Now obviously with that last statement you are biased towards thinking anything Nintendo does is going to be shit. Even beyond that though, with the titles you admitted are also coming (as well as stuff you didn't mention like The Wonderful 101) there is at least as many non-platformers (if not more) coming to the system than platformers.

There is nothing wrong with the Nintendo focus on that genre either. Nintendo makes tons of games in nearly every genre but Platformers have always been their bread and butter. Right now there are very few other companies in the industry (indies aside) even investing in trying to make platformers, especially ones with big budgets.

Maybe you don't like platformers but many many people do, and they typically have wider appeal than most other genres. Just because you don't like the genre doesn't mean it's shit. Nintendo has more than platformers coming anyways.

I'm really not biased against Nintendo. Like I said about the games currently available on Wii U, they simply don't interest me. I don't doubt that they are GOOD games. In fact I am SURE they are good games. I don't think they are shit games; however, Nintendo's output - for me- is shit, because it lacks diversity in genres and most of the games they're bringing out seem less ambitious and safe to me, as others in this thread have said before I'm sure.

As I said, I'm not saying they aren't good games.

As far as platformers go, I don't dislike them. I can really only handle about 1 or 2 of them a generation. For me, that has always been that one big Mario game. Mario 64, Mario Sunshine, Mario Galaxy. You mentioned big budget platformers... well, the aforementioned Mario games all seemed to me like big budget games, but I'm really not seeing the big budget in NSMB U or SMB3D World. I'm not seeing the innovation, I'm not seeing the ambition, I'm not seeing anything interesting for me there.

Good games? Sure, probably good games, but if Nintendo wants to me to buy their console they can make as many "good" games as they want and I'll still never want it. Until they make a game that is so amazing and unlike anything else, that I literally can't not play it, that's when I'll buy a Wii U. Mario 64 was that game for N64, Super Smash Bros. Melee was that game for GameCube, Twilight Princess was that game for Wii (I bought it at launch, and this is where my relationship with Nintendo started to falter). For Wii U, I'm not going to jump in until I know for damn sure I will never regret the purchase.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Pretty good I'd say, what with the atrocious failure bit. Gamecube was a disappointment, but it was still profitable. So again, using a metric supplied by you it was actually a success. Not that I expect any logical consistency in your posts at this point.

At what point did I say merely having a profit is a success? A dollar in profit does not justify an enormously expensive venture. By Nintendo's own admission, the gamecube was a failure. The Wii U is selling worse than Nintendo's previous worst performing console. Every single decision was a poor one on their part. And that includes the software they chose to greenlight. DKC:TF is one of several missteps by Nintendo.

The Wii U is destined to failure at this point. No console in history has come from such horrid sales to be any kind of success, and it goes without saying that the Wii U is a dramatically more expensive venture than any previous Nintendo console.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

Yes, 9 years ago.
On the PS2.

They also made the 'Uncharted' series and recently 'the last of us'.
Adding the fact that Retro didn't announce or show anything untill 6 months after the Wii U launch, it's not really abnormal that people expected them to be working on a 'high profile' game.



The only thing I can find is this:

He doesn't say anything about not working on a realistic title here.

http://www.ign.com/blogs/81jono81/2...ame-hires-big-names-from-the-industry-updated
At least Donkey kong was the last thing the writer of this article expected

Well, there's the ex naughty dog environmental designer who said he prefers "stylized stuff over realistic projects" and that's why Retro is a good fit or something. He also mentioned playing Nintendo franchises when he was younger, implying to me that the game at the very least was an existing IP

Can't link ATM but a google search with stylized and other appropriate words should find it. No idea if its the same guy you're talking about

 

[m.i.s.]

I think it is a bold prediction. where is the glut of buyers that Wii U desperately needs coming from? I'd be surprised if Wii U does better numbers than GC.

It is a bold prediction.

I would regard N64 numbers [just under 34 million LTD] to be the absolute best case scenario if they turn things around in spectacular fashion. You have to consider that N64 saw its debut with Super Mario 64 and Pilotwings 64 and was supported throughout it's life with a string of hits from Rare at it's creative peak - including the genre defining Goldeneye. Nintendo, at present, has no such resource to call upon.

Just for this reason alone I think it is highly unlikely for Wii U to reach N64 numbers in the market as Nintendo currently exists today.

 

[Future PhaZe]

The software is getting better but the Wii U is basically in Vita land for me in regards to becoming a solid product that is just terribly overpriced given the realities of the market.

 

[Hindle]

Expecting Nintendo to replicate the Wiis success so soon is unrelistic. When's all said and done I expect the Wii U to be profitable for them.

 

[Pie and Beans]

Expecting Nintendo to replicate the Wiis success so soon is unrelistic. When's all said and done I expect the Wii U to be profitable for them.

WiiU isn't even replicating their worst selling home console, the Gamecube, yet. Nobody is expecting Wii numbers at any point. That ship sailed a long long time ago. Now we're looking at the 20-25 million zone lifetime.

 

[Hindle]

Do we know these are huge system sellers? As I recall people were already buying Wiis up like crazy due to Wii Sports and the tremendous buzz around it, and the motion controls.

So yeah, they sold bucketloads on hardware that was already a huge success, but what about hardware that's lifeless?

That's why they're working on the games for the Wii U at the moment. When the console gets regular great games then the sales will pick up. You only need to look at the 3DS as an example.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

That's why they're working on the games for the Wii U at the moment. When the console gets regular great games then the sales will pick up. You only need to look at the 3DS as an example.

The gamecube got regular great games (at least as much as can be expected from just nintendo) and it never really picked up, being Nintendos worst main home console launch in history.

There is little to no reason to expect the Wii U to be able to even match the Gamecube right now, which is an unmitigated disaster for Nintendo.

 

[Vinci]

I would argue that Nintendo never really embraced motion controls throughout the whole Wii lifetime.

I would argue Nintendo never fully understood why the Wii was so popular. Deep down, they felt that they had unlocked some secret sauce that made people want to play video games - which wasn't the case, IMO. They misunderstood the job the Wii was doing for people - that's absolutely clear given how the Wii U aligns itself from a marketing perspective going the exact opposite direction.

 

[Maxrunner]

Some? if he's talking big developers, then i would say most of them...

 

[Hindle]

WiiU isn't even replicating their worst selling home console, the Gamecube, yet. Nobody is expecting Wii numbers at any point. That ship sailed a long long time ago. Now we're looking at the 20-25 million zone lifetime.

And for a console that's basically a 360 components wise, I expect they'll make a decent amount of profit of those 25m sales.

I expect Nintendo will go back to doing thier own thing after the Wii U. They tried replicating MS and Sony and it just doesn't work for them.

 

[Vinci]

I expect Nintendo will go back to doing thier own thing after the Wii U. They tried replicating MS and Sony and it just doesn't work for them.

Personally, I don't think that's what they did. I think the Wii U is a stepping stone towards a hybrid handheld/console system. It's a way to develop the technology and maybe make a bit of money on the side while doing that - only it didn't turn out well and it's eating money instead of earning it.

 

[Vashetti]

And for a console that's basically a 360 components wise, I expect they'll make a decent amount of profit of those 25m sales.

Haven't they admitted they're making a loss on Wii U right now?

The gamepad adds a lot to the cost.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

And for a console that's basically a 360 components wise, I expect they'll make a decent amount of profit of those 25m sales.

I expect Nintendo will go back to doing thier own thing after the Wii U. They tried replicating MS and Sony and it just doesn't work for them.

How is the Wii U replicating the PS3 or 360 in anything but relative hardware power?

 

[Snakeyes]

And for a console that's basically a 360 components wise, I expect they'll make a decent amount of profit of those 25m sales.

I expect Nintendo will go back to doing thier own thing after the Wii U. They tried replicating MS and Sony and it just doesn't work for them.

But releasing a turbo 360 with a tablet is precisely doing their own thing. Replicating MS and Sony means releasing a 1+ Tflop console in line with the PSBone.

 

[The_Lump]

And for a console that's basically a 360 components wise, I expect they'll make a decent amount of profit of those 25m sales.

I expect Nintendo will go back to doing thier own thing after the Wii U. They tried replicating MS and Sony and it just doesn't work for them.

This is them doing their own thing.

I always find it strange when this comes up:
Nintendo weren't trying to make a 'bleeding edge' console and this is just what they came up with; they were trying to make what they made (for better or worse) and succeeded. They have very talented engineers and were working with AMD/IBM, so I've no doubt they hit their design brief.

Whether it was a good idea or not is up for debate of course, but this is certainly the console they intended to make power wise.

Although I doubt anyone really thinks their engineers are actually incapable of doing what MS & Sony have done. Of course they just didn't want to (again for better or worse) and now face the consequences, whatever they are.

 

[Hindle]

How is the Wii U replicating the PS3 or 360 in anything but relative hardware power?

I'm thinking they thought if they'd release a console with graphics comparable to the 360, and an online service, everyone would buy it. They were wrong.

I expect with thier next home console, it will differ completely from the competition.

 

[M°°nblade]

I'm thinking they thought if they'd release a console with graphics comparable to the 360, and an online service, everyone would buy it. They were wrong.

I expect with thier next home console, it will differ completely from the competition.

Nintendo didn't try to replicate Sony or MS. The Wii U already is completely different from the Xbone and PS4. They tried to replicate the Wii and it didn't succeed because there are no killer apps for the controller and/or the price is too high.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Yes but the workload put into level design is not valuable. One man hour of rigging a 3D! Character versus level design is more important and way more demanding! Because all college graduates can design memorable and challenging 2D levels while 3D artists and cinematic game designers are basically as hard to find as the next einstein.

Well 2d games require good 3d artists as well. That donkey kong model still needs to be modelled, textured, rigged and animated. Also it needs to read from far a way. It's not some 16 color sprite based game, and those are hard too these days. Not that many pixel artists around lol

 

[Days like these...]

I think Nintendo needs to go balls out money hatting anything and everything they possibly can at this point and I'm not even talking exclusivity just to get some games on Wii U. Situation is looking really dire!

 

[schuelma]

I think Nintendo needs to go balls out money hatting anything and everything they possibly can at this point and I'm not even talking exclusivity just to get some games on Wii U. Situation is looking really dire!

I think they should do this for Japan.

West is a lost cause I think.

 

[Linkhero1]

I think they should do this for Japan.

West is a lost cause I think.

Likewise. I'm surprised they didn't already money hat anyone else aside from Sega.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

I think they should do this for Japan.

West is a lost cause I think.

West is where they need the most actually.

 

[schuelma]

Likewise. I'm surprised they didn't already money hat anyone else aside from Sega.

With a few exceptions (the HD part of SE, Konami), I don't think Japanese developers and publishers are adverse to developing Nintendo titles, and if given incentives will develop for basically anything (see 360 at the start of last gen and Vita right now).

Something like Samurai Warriors 4 or a completely new IP- I think Nintendo could get stuff like that relatively easily if they open the checkbook.

 

[Hindle]

I think they should do this for Japan.

West is a lost cause I think.

Was the West a lost cause for the PS3 or the 3DS? Both consoles took a while to gain momentum. It's the same for the Wii U.

Starting this Christmas they'll release Mario, followed by Mario Kart, SSB, X and on and on.

 

[schuelma]

Was the West a lost cause for the PS3 or the 3DS? Both consoles took a while to gain momentum. It's the same for the Wii U.

Starting this Christmas they'll release Mario, followed by Mario Kart, SSB, X and on and on.

I meant for Western developers.

DS/3DS have never received much attention and PS3 was fortunately in a position where 3rd parties had already heavily invested in HD development and 360 was doing well enough to carry the PS3 for a few years in terms of generating multi plats.

 

[Linkhero1]

West is where they need the most actually.

I don't remember exactly, but I think Nintendo mentioned that they would not money hat for multiplatform titles. It would be harder for them to convince western developers/publishers to put an exclusive on the Wii U unless Nintendo pays for full development and marketing. I don't think it's a risk they're willing to take unfortunately, but it would be nice.

With a few exceptions (the HD part of SE, Konami), I don't think Japanese developers and publishers are adverse to developing Nintendo titles, and if given incentives will develop for basically anything (see 360 at the start of last gen and Vita right no).

Something like Samurai Warriors 4 or a completely new IP- I think Nintendo could get stuff like that relatively easily if they open the checkbook.

Definitely. I just hope to see some stuff from Capcom and Namco at least. A Tales game would be nice.

 

[Hindle]

I meant for Western developers.

DS/3DS have never received much attention and PS3 was fortunately in a position where 3rd parties had already heavily invested in HD development and 360 was doing well enough to carry the PS3 for a few years in terms of generating multi plats.

Oh yea, I agree for the 3rd party's.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

I don't remember exactly, but I think Nintendo mentioned that they would not money hat for multiplatform titles. It would be harder for them to convince western developers/publishers to put an exclusive on the Wii U unless Nintendo pays for full development and marketing. I don't think it's a risk they're willing to take unfortunately, but it would be nice.

I remember that. Iwata said it, as usual. One more reason for him to leave his office.

 

[Dave Long]

Whatever happens with the Wii U at this point in time is academic to me. I have really enjoyed the system since we got it at Christmastime last year. It gave us some really super multiplayer times with NintendoLand and New Super Mario Bros. U and we've all enjoyed a bunch of single player stuff on it in my house. We still play games on it multiple times in a week. IMO, it's a great system with some really great games already and I expect Nintendo to support it for the next three years at least. There are lots of great looking games coming and we'll play those, too.

If some developers want to be pessimistic about it, that's fine. They can stay with Sony or Microsoft or OUYA or whatever the hell they want to do. My own satisfaction has already been assured.

 

[I am Michael Bolton]

Remember when folks were hoping that GTA5 was coming to the Wii U? Those were the days.

 

[Days like these...]

It would have been nice to get GTA. At least that game would have made the Wii U seem like a viable option to gamers in the west. You know perception is reality etc.

 

[Linkhero1]

I remember that. Iwata said it, as usual. One more reason for him to leave his office.

I hope they're doing something behind the scenes at least. It's not looking so good for them and I can't believe that they're this incompetent. Arrogance can only get you so far.

Remember when folks were hoping that GTA5 was coming to the Wii U? Those were the days.

Ironically, I was thinking about this during my drive to work and couldn't help but laugh.

 

[I am Michael Bolton]

I hope they're doing something behind the scenes at least. It's not looking so good for them and I can't believe that they're this incompetent. Arrogance can only get you so far.



Ironically, I was thinking about this during my drive to work and couldn't help but laugh.

Yep.

 

[Effect]

I think Nintendo needs to go balls out money hatting anything and everything they possibly can at this point and I'm not even talking exclusivity just to get some games on Wii U. Situation is looking really dire!

Pointless. The games still wouldn't sell in high enough numbers. The problem isn't so much the lack of games at this point I think. It's that Nintendo themselves haven't cultivate or trained customer base to buy these games. They haven't since after the Wii released and I question how many of those games in the beginning years were simply holdovers from the GameCube days vs games designed purely for the Wii.

They had chances to do this on the Wii with any number of series but didn't. Several games were handled badly and sent to die. That they didn't follow up Metroid Prime 3 with another game when it was clear FPS were taking off is a huge mistake on their part. It not having online is another big problem. Doesn't mean they needed to come out with their own military shooter but they needed to provide an experience similar to those games and they had a series that did that. Or if they weren't going to do it themselves they should have championed the games and companies that were trying to provide those games.

They didn't care though since Wii Sports, Wii Fit, etc were bringing in so much money. Mario Kart was selling so well. Then they went back to the 2D platformers. Even if they did provide those games though they wouldn't have looked as good as the PS3 and 360 games. So it would have been a struggle but at least it would have laid a foundation or kept those that wanted those games engaged instead of allowing them to drift over to the PS3 and 360 and split their gaming time and money with those systems. Which is what I think has happen. Was the main reason why I decided to get those systems after just having the Wii.

If they did start throwing money around it would be in order to train customers to buy these games. They'd have to champion them as if they were their own. Be prepared to lose money on the investments as well since this would be a long term project lasting years. Perhaps with no real pay off until their next home console. The long term goal would be end up with customers that would be happy to buy a Mario platformer one month or week and then buy a third person shooter with tons of swearing the next month or week. They'd have to be comfortable being the company that offered such extremes. Accepting that if they can not or will not provide games to certain demographics they have to provide a platform for others to do so and have to be willing to be put their stamp on it and not be afraid of how it will make them look or if they will end up out selling their games. If not then nothing will change for them and the Wii U and any other home console they put out will be a failure and their success will only come from the portables.

 

[SmokedMeat]

That's why they're working on the games for the Wii U at the moment. When the console gets regular great games then the sales will pick up. You only need to look at the 3DS as an example.

When it comes to consumer interest, Nintendo's handhelds and consoles are almost always polar opposites.

You can't point to 3DS and assume Nintendo can repeat that success with their console.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Out of curiosity, does anyone know Condemned's sales during the 360 launch and about 6 months afterwards?

I think it's a perfect comparison to ZombiU given its a new, well reviewed, first person horror ip at a system launch.

Condemned was also up against far more new competition at launch, while Zombi U's only new competition was NSMBU.