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[univariate]

RIP. Gaming is changing

 

[Jarmel]

What's quantum break, what is sunset overdrive, what is recore,what is scalebound, what great forza games have they released. A great halo game.

People are commenting before thinking.

Almost all of that is not MGS.

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

Zipper were giving chance after chance and failed, and they waited for the game to tank numerous times. Bend was canned when? Liverpool was a small studio.

Liverpool made wipeout. Holy crap it's psygnosis the best f1 games. Etc. People have sweetie thinking. Lionhead made Fable 3 tgat was universally seen as a let down after Fable 2. Then they were working on this. Like I've said it is sad news but the content from a lot of people in this thread is embarassing to read

 

[Obliterator]

What's quantum break, what is sunset overdrive, what is recore,what is scalebound, what great forza games have they released. A great halo game.

People are commenting before thinking.

QB, SO, Recore, Scalebound are all 3rd party titles.

Forza is solid I agree

Halo is tanking by series standards and many feel the franchise isn't what it used to be.

There is very little good that can be said about MS / Xbone this generation

 

[chadskin]

I guess they're not doing this now:

https://twitter.com/LionheadStudios/status/705760152746647552

Or their GDC session on "Creating Lush Dynamic Procedural Foliage for 'Fable Legends'"

http://schedule.gdconf.com/session/creating-lush-dynamic-procedural-foliage-for-fable-legends

 

[prwxv3]

Layoffs are to be expected if they have nothing to work on, I'm sure even if the game would've released most of the layoffs would've still happened except for maybe Stig Asmussen. A bit like for Sucker Punch.

This is true. They will probably have the same out of employees before once GOW gets further along.

 

[Doffen]

RIP. Gaming is changing

Or Microsoft are just being fucking stupid regarding Europe like always.

 

[AncientDiety]

Liverpool made wipeout. Holy crap it's psygnosis the best f1 games. Etc. People have sweetie thinking. Lionhead made Fable 3 tgat was universally seen as a let down after Fable 2. Then they were working on this. Like I've said it is sad news but the content from a lot of people in this thread is embarassing to read

OK but what does one have to do with the other? Bend was also not closed. Why would anyone bring up sony in this thread? Wipeout is a small franchise, as much as I like it, and yes that sucks, but relevance here?

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

Almost all of that is not MGS.

Seriously? Lol you don't think they okayd them being developed?

 

[ChosenPredator]

Another sign that MS is moving away from the traditional console business?

No not at all, if you played the game you know why that happened.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

QB, SO, Recore, Scalebound are all 3rd party titles.

Forza is solid I agree

Halo is tanking by series standards and many feel the franchise isn't what it used to be.

There is very little good that can be said about MS / Xbone this generation

They are all first party titles. The developers are not all owned by MS. The shift seems to be MS moving on from owning huge studios that produce their first party games, to making deals with independent developers to produce their first party games, but they are all first party games.

 

[injurai]

I can't stop laughing. Microsoft Games Studios has been a trainwreck for years.

Fuckin hell.

 

[jelly]

Phil cares, he will wear an original Xbox logo t-shirt at E3, see he cares.

 

[Caayn]

Well this comes unexpected.

I don't know if the NDA still counts for Fable Legends so I won't say much. But what I can say is that the game looked like it was nearly complete. Shame that a 1.0 version will never see the day of the light.

 

[dEvAnGeL]

No not at all, if you played the game you know why that happened.

Enlighten us, please, im serious BTW

 

[etta]

Or Microsoft are just being fucking stupid regarding Europe like always.

Are you thinking that they're closing European studios to potentially open new ones in the US? Otherwise I doubt this has anything to do with the location of said studios.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Quite the opposite in fact. Sony are in it for the money. They release second tier titles all the time because second tier titles pad out the platform library, helping to move consoles early, and by the later stages of a generation second tier titles move enough copies to pay for themselves and then some. It's a worthwhile cycle for keeping studios that haven't nailed a big breakout title open and profitable with the potential of catching such a breakout down the road.

Nintendo is also all about making paper. They've stuck by what they've defined as the "core" franchises and keep iterating on them with a strong focus in quality, even when farmed out to 3rd parties. End result is that Nintendo's "core" titles always sell millions, even on under-performing hardware. In fact, they're frequently the saving grace of under-performing hardware.

Microsoft on the other hand is only willing to get involved in video games as a means to an end - home media convergence being that end. The money that could be made via having a strong stable of second tier studios and IPs serviced by them is not interesting to Microsoft, even though there is a clear window within which you can make good return on investment, something MS has been dubious with on most new initiatives.

Microsoft is not and has never been truly invested in the video game industry. This is where Sweeney is right to question their Windows Store/DX12/executable integration as MS has made it pretty clear they're only engaged as long as there is a clear benefit to the "vision" of the company to be capitalized on. They could dump Windows Store external usage of DX12 and their executable wrapper in a hot minute just like they did with GFWL. As we saw with GFWL MS won't even do basic cleanup on their own products broken by such a move.

They're the least financially motivated of the three platform producers. All they want is to not get left out on the next big thing. Gates and co. built the company on seeing and maneuvering to own the "personal computer" explosion. Since then they've been on the outside looking in at almost every major tech wave that couldn't be simply bought in to and somehow have managed to fail at a good number of the ones where buying into it should have been a viable strategy. They have a toxic corporate culture by most accounts that is entirely incompatible with external studios and branches. I could continue with the negatives but at this point it feels like piling on.

The real question isn't if MS are going to pull completely out of the gaming sector, it's when, how jagged is the cut they make to severe themselves, and how much damage does that cause to game development as a whole and PC gaming in particular when they do.

Your point about them not being truly invested, I'm starting to believe that and this is someone who he's been there since 2003. When you think about it, some fans have gone elsewhere (I always buy PlayStation/Nintendo anyway as I'm fan of that too) and can you blame them? As a Xbox fan I found myself more critical than positive as time has passed over the years and it comes to a point where you ask yourself, why bother ?

 

[Granjinha]

Man, this sucks. The beta was fun, and i loved fable 2, and liked 3, to a lesser extent.

Also, Press Play was an incredible talented team. Max was great and Kalimba had an AMAZING level design. A hunger games-esque from them could do incredibly well in the market. Such short-sight from MS. *sigh*

 

[Garrett 2U]

Damn. This is really sad news.

 

[LordOfChaos]

I felt this was a pretty well liked series until they started doing weird stuff. I mean, call it experimental, but the first three games were well liked, and then they made the Kinect-only Fable The Journey, then a free to play game. Maybe not the best way to manage the franchise.

I mourn even more what they did to Banjo Kazooie. I don't hate Nuts and Bolts, but hyping it as a Banjo game was maybe a miss, if it was just Winkle and Slappy Nuts and Bolts people may have liked it more. When people hear B&K, they want a B&K platformer.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

QB, SO, Recore, Scalebound are all 3rd party titles.

Forza is solid I agree

Halo is tanking by series standards and many feel the franchise isn't what it used to be.

There is very little good that can be said about MS / Xbone this generation

They own the IP for all those games except for SO and they're all made on their dime. they're first party games made by independent studios.

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

OK but what does one have to do with the other? Bend was also not closed. Why would anyone bring up sony in this thread? Wipeout is a small franchise, as much as I like it, and yes that sucks, but relevance here?

As an example that a company shutting a studio doesn't mean they are walking away from console or game development, that is all

Fable legends was zero on nearly every ones hype meter

 

[privitsan02]

Whoa calm down, the "bone" is actually performing better than their most successful console...

While the Xbox One isn't doing bad, your statement doesn't hold much weight from my perspective. The Xbox 360 didn't start to sell gang busters until the Kinect came out 5 years after launch and a new slim model with price cuts. The Xbox 360 in many ways grew exponentially successful overtime.

I highly doubt the Xbox One will have the same life cycle or get a second boost in popularity like the Xbox 360 had.

Best wishes.

 

[Diprosalic]

can't say i'm sad for the studio. they haven't produced anything good in... well ever.

i do hope everyone finds a better job.

 

[AncientDiety]

As an example that a company shutting a studio doesn't mean they are walking away from console or game development, that is all

I never said otherwise, but that's not what people are saying.

 

[GHG]

lol yeah completely changing the entire concept of the game is just "retooling"? That would cost even more money. The money spent is already spent. You can't unspend it, but you have to make smart decisions about how much more money to put into something that you have no faith in.

And it's not really unprecedented. The history of this industry is littered with games that were canned just as they were going to ship for a variety of reasons.

It wouldn't have been changing the whole concept of the game to make it single player only:

You can play the game single player, with a party of three heroic AI companions that follow your lead through stories and adventures. Or you can play cooperatively with up to three friends and discover the game’s quests and content together.

https://www.fablelegends.com/faq

If you get rid of the co-op element you remove the need for servers, maintenance and future patches.

Name me another recent game that has been completely cancelled this close to completion. I certainly can't think of one. Games get cancelled all the time, but this game was pretty much finished.

 

[mcrommert]

No not at all, if you played the game you know why that happened.

Enlighten us, please, im serious BTW

Game never came together and became fun.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Excellent summary by Stump. MS' f2p report card is almost as bad as their MMO report card.

 

[Leflus]

i dont think it could have been retooled.

Idd. Fable Legends would have needed a massive retooling for it to become an okay single player game.

They wanted it to become a pvp/multiplayer game where they could sell hero characters and villain minions to the players. It didn't really have a lot of content in terms of story or quests. The current version of Fable Legends would have made for a terrible single player game (I didn't like it as a multiplayer game either, but that's another issue).

 

[wapplew]

The writing has been on the wall ever since Microsoft announced their big shift in direction for Xbox. Anything that doesn't fit into their new vision was going to get the boot, and nothing is really safe unless it's a sure hit. And in the event that this new vision doesn't pan out, the cuts will get deeper and deeper. Microsoft isn't really interested in Xbox as a hardware platform the way they were in the past, so this might be a sign that they're not planning to stay in that market.

But fable legends fit right in their current vision. A cross play Windows 10/Xbox one, game as service type of thing, pushing direct X 12 too.
It will get the MAU MS wanted.

Something is wrong here, need more inside info.

 

[Doffen]

Are you thinking that they're closing European studios to potentially open new ones in the US? Otherwise I doubt this has anything to do sith the location.

No, I'm thinking that Microsoft has mismanaged their European Xbox division since before the Xbox One launch. And they will continue to do so until the end of Xbox.

#Tier2

 

[DeadlyParasite]

It would seem that they join the developer graveyard that has been growing for years now. Very few studios left from the early 1990-2000's.

 

[Mass_Pincup]

It wouldn't have been changing the whole concept of the game to make it single player only:



https://www.fablelegends.com/faq

If you get rid of the co-op element you remove the need for servers, maintenance and future patches.

Name me another recent game that has been completely cancelled this close to completion. I certainly can't think of one. Games get cancelled all the time, but this game was pretty much finished.

Sony Santa Monica's game.

 

[nib95]

I can't stop laughing. Microsoft Games Studios has been a trainwreck for years.

Fuckin hell.

You do realise hundreds of people are going to be out of a job because of this? Many of whom may have families to feed, rent to pay etc?

 

[ChosenPredator]

Enlighten us, please, im serious BTW

It's really hard to describe but based on my experience playing the game, it just felt like if it released these year it would be thrased beyond belief by fans of fable and non fans, it just wasn't a fun game.

 

[mcrommert]

QB, SO, Recore, Scalebound are all 3rd party titles.

Forza is solid I agree

Halo is tanking by series standards and many feel the franchise isn't what it used to be.

There is very little good that can be said about MS / Xbone this generation

To give 343 their due they made mistakes with their content rollout on halo 5

That said, this is the best playing halo ever. Its unfortunate that so many people can't see this but it is the truth.

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

Yeah that was bound to happen.
After Fable 2 this studio had no hope anymore.

Sad for the developers but totally understandable their output after Fable 2 was just bad and took way to long.

 

[Sydle]

Yea, i know that, and your basically re-iterating what I said. Microsoft wants to own your living room, and I believe who Bill games asked from Sony if they were willing to use Windows operating system for their console, Sony exec told him to fuck off. Best decision they ever made IMHO.

Gates and MS have a bad reputation at putting up a stink when they don't get what they want.

ANd I know this is really harsh, but if they leave, I will not miss them. I enjoyed my time with gears, halo, but in terms of legacy, they just never gave a shit, and I think most of the original; xbox team knew that after 360.

If sega had the means would love them so get back into the fight, but they don't have the capital. But imagine if sega did make a machine with collaboration with MS? Because that's who original XBox kind of was born was through the death of the Dreamcast.

I feel like you missed my point. It wasn't about wanting to own the living room, that wasn't the motivation behind their decision to enter the game console market. The purpose was to make sure they could fight off potential Windows competitors.

I don't care for more proprietary hardware, I'd be much more happy if Sega started making more great games again than locking anything down to some hardware that is nearly identical in nature and performance to other consoles. I quite like the idea of the consoles dying off, so I can focus on my PC.

It wouldn't have been changing the whole concept of the game to make it single player only:



https://www.fablelegends.com/faq

If you get rid of the co-op element you remove the need for servers, maintenance and future patches.

Name me another recent game that has been completely cancelled this close to completion. I certainly can't think of one. Games get cancelled all the time, but this game was pretty much finished.

Did you play it? I'm having a hard time imagining you'd take the same position if you got to experience it.

 

[Ninja Sharingan]

I never said otherwise, but that's not what people are saying.

There are a lot of people in here stating that it's a sign of what ms is doing.

Not aiming at you tho man. All love over here. Just saying some people are really reaching in here

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Honestly, I don't think Fable was ever really on the level of being as safe as Halo, Forza, and Gears.

Even with it selling fairly well, it always seemed pretty obvious that there was a general disappointment in the series from all angles and that MS and Lionhead were always scrambling to find ways to rework it into something that stood out better (and beyond the absurd hype built up for the first game).

What's gonna happen to 343 after Halo 6? Is The Coalition just gonna be pumping out Gears games for as long as that studio is active? Things eventually get tiring. People are already getting fatigued from Halo. The best games on Xbox are usually the third-party titles.

They've been doing this for a long time now, and it amazes me that they haven't realized that the mass market actually sees it as a bad thing. Probably Sony's biggest advantage is the sheer breadth of their catalogue - not the AAA titles. They have something for everyone.

It's been like this since the start of the OG Xbox. Microsoft always experiments in the beginning with different genres but in the end the focus is always back to Halo. This E3 is gonna be a test to see if they want to continue experimenting or fall back on their safe franchises.

 

[SneakersSO]

Wondering how buying Mojang fits into this list of mostly if not all other negative points? I know it's not organic growth internally, but it can only be a boon to MSFT overall buying the maker of arguably the most popular franchise worldwide today in Minecraft right..?

Its not a list of good vs. bad, or just highlighting negative/failed ventures, but rather the post is highlighting their shift in priority, more specifically, how they only see value in software that does business in extremely high volume. Mojang is a perfect fit for this.

 

[LQX]

MS doing shit like this is no longer shocking. Them taking the pedal off Forza or being bold enough to make those talented people behind Halo try something new...now that would be shocking. Not a damn thing about MS is appealing any more.

 

[MikeE21286]

Wow wasn't expecting that

 

[cHaOs667]

Are they kidding me? They have send out the latest Fable beta news mail just a couple of days ago (And i have and had plenty of fun with fable legends...)!

W T F ! ?

 

[Obliterator]

They are all first party titles. The developers are not all owned by MS. The shift seems to be MS moving on from owning huge studios that produce their first party games, to making deals with independent developers to produce their first party games, but they are all first party games.

None of it is developed in house. I mean cool for them I guess, but its still not the same in terms of legacy. They dont even own all of those IPs.

I am getting to the point I'm not sure how people defend MS anymore. They buy studios, run them into the ground, and close them. Over and over and over again. They can throw money at Tomb Raider but cant develop a traditional Fable 4? Even though 2 and 3 sold MILLIONS of copies?

MS has no commitment to gaming, thats clear as day. Sure all companies are in it for the $$$ but Sony and Nintendo at least give the impression they are committed to strengthening the industry itself. MS simply does not care, which isn't surprising as gaming is a tiny tiny fraction of their revenue

 

[AncientDiety]

There are a lot of people in here stating that it's a sign of what ms is doing.

Not aiming at you tho man. All love over here. Just saying some people are really reaching in here

All I see is people looking at the bigger picture, including MS own words/actions to come to that conclusion, not just this news.

 

[mcrommert]

What's gonna happen to 343 after Halo 6? Is The Coalition just gonna be pumping out Gears games? Things eventually get tiring. People are already getting fatigued from Halo. The best games on Xbox are usually the third-party titles.


It's been like this since the start of the OG Xbox. Microsoft always experiments in the beginning with different genres but in the end the focus is always back to Halo. This E3 is gonna be a test to see if they want to continue experimenting or fall back on their safe franchises.

343 will always make halo games (their name is based on halo)

The players at the studio might cycle but they will always make halo

 

[FuturusX]

I gotta agree with this. Freaking crazy that people are not assigning blame to Phil.

I wish everyone that lost their jobs good luck as they try to find something else.

I have a wee bit of sympathy for Phil Spencer, you have to imagine that when the word comes down from above he has to fall in line like everybody else. I suspect that the external pressures of the 'unified windows 10 strategy' is central to every decision that Phil has to make.

 

[Phediuk]

Ouch.

 

[AstroNut325]

RIP. Gaming is changing

Nope. This is just MS being MS. You haven't followed what MS has been doing since the early days of the Xbox 360 with respect to their studios?