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[Alx]

I think the problem is that MS more or less lied to everyone with the Kinect reveal. Very little of that initial vision of the Kinect became reality

Oh come on... most of that initial vision made it to the final product.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2qlHoxPioM
Kung-fu demo : first person interaction with user (Kinectimal), gesture tracking in a fighter (Kinect Sports Boxing, Fighters Uncaged)
Racing demo : virtual wheel driving (Forza, Joyride), virtual gear shifting (Steel Battalion). Missing : wheel changing minigame.
Gozilla demo : monster animation (Star Wars Kinect, Kinect Party)
Goalkicking demo : virtual ball kicking and catching (Kinect Sports Soccer)
Skateboard demo : object scanning (Kinect Fun Labs), feet-controlled board (Sonic Riders)
Dressing room demo : virtual dressing (Kinect Party)
Quiz demo : sentence recognition (Mass Effect, Skyrim), missing : virtual buzzer
Media control demo : voice commands (Dashboard).

In all those features, only two didn't make it to the final product.

 

[Amused]

The potential is obvious.

Now, what I really would love to see is some form of AR+VR, where i can be in the same room as you through VR glasses, while at the same time you see me in the same room as you through the AR glasses. I guess it would be easier to capture static enviroment than living human beings for something like that, but if it could be done, that would really change the world.

 

[Marvel]

I want to chainsaw a Locust and see it's blood fly all around me.

 

[Odah]

Age of HoloEmpires:

See the world from your living room carpet and control your armies and workers by drag and dropping them on the map.


I want to believe


edit: what if your dog/cat runs through your Minecraft castle? Will it destroy the illusion or will the headset react to the animal and destroy the castle.

Evil cats

 

[Doukou]

I want to chainsaw a Locust and see it's blood fly all around me.

You can even chainsaw a locust in a lovely park.

 

[Sanpei]

I'd like to see more about Directx 12...It was too short

 

[dofry]

I don't mind the ideas behind the system but I loathe that they call the objects holograms. It's wrong, misleading and only used for marketing purposes.

And in the stage demo video I can feel the awkwardness of the script. Why can't they just use someone who sounds like a normal person with actual enthusiasm and less scripted stuff. Now the stage demo felt like a vacuum cleaner sales pitch. E.g. when LittleBigPlanet was demoed at first and had some tiny part bug on stage, it didn't matter because the guys on stage were enthusiastic and wen't with the failure. It made people excited. Faked emotions create nothing.

 

[Terbinator]

I want to chainsaw a Locust and see it's blood fly all around me.

A Surgeon Simulator could be great with this. Pulling and prodding away at someone's insides all on your coffee table.

 

[Alx]

I don't mind the ideas behind the system but I loathe that they call the objects holograms. It's wrong, misleading and only used for marketing purposes.

I suppose it's technically wrong, but I don't think it's misleading. I guess "hologram" should in theory be exclusively used for 3D representation made with a specific technology (that laser thing), but in popular culture a hologram is princess Leia appearing on R2-D2's head as a virtual 3D object, whatever the technique involved.

 

[Americanmushroom]

Alx, genuine question; do you work for MS or anything related to VR or AR, I see you comment on everything AR/VR related?

 

[Man]

Current mobile phone AR on see-through lenses. I can envision it being fun for some things but the technology is simply not here yet for good reliable AR (minimum 10 years and that's being highly optimistic, I would say 20+). And it doesn't double up as a VR device which is truly impressive technology *today*.

 

[AmyS]

Hands-on: Microsoft’s HoloLens is flat-out magical
2015: the year that sci-fi becomes real.

For the second time in as many months I feel like I've taken a step into the world of science fiction—and for the second time in as many months, it's Microsoft who put me there.

After locking away all my recording instruments and switching to the almost prehistoric pen and paper, I had a tantalizingly brief experience of Microsoft's HoloLens system, a headset that creates a fusion of virtual images and the real world. While production HoloLens systems will be self-contained and cord-free, the developer units we used had a large compute unit worn on a neck strap and an umbilical cord for power. Production hardware will automatically measure the interpupillary distance and calibrate itself accordingly; the dev kits need this to be measured manually and punched in. The dev kits were also heavy, unwieldy, fragile, and didn't really fit on or around my glasses, making them uncomfortable to boot.

But even with this clumsy hardware, the experience was nothing short of magical.

Microsoft calls it holography. I'm not sure if it really is (Wired describes HoloLens's "light engine" has having a "grating," so perhaps it really is using interference patterns to reconstruct light fields rather than providing the same simple stereoscopic 3D found in VR systems), but this is a detail that only pedants will care about. (Though if it is true holography, it should solve the focus issue that many people find with existing 3D systems.)

However it works, HoloLens is an engaging and effective augmented reality system. With HoloLens I saw virtual objects—Minecraft castles, Skype windows, even the surface of Mars—presented over, and spatially integrated with, the real world.

It looked for every bit like the holographic projection we saw depicted in Star Wars and Total Recall. Except that's shortchanging Microsoft's work, because these virtual objects were in fact far more convincing than the washed out, translucent message R2D2 projected, and much better than Sharon Stone's virtual tennis coach. The images were bright, saturated, and reasonably opaque, giving the virtual objects a real feeling of solidity.

Full article here:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/hands-on-with-hololens-making-the-virtual-real/

 

[Sir_Crocodile]

This would be pretty cool for a yugioh game I guess

 

[Alx]

Alx, genuine question; do you work for MS or anything related to VR or AR, I see you comment on everything AR/VR related?

I wish I was. I may even consider applying, since I find most of those new techs fascinating, which is why I'm never far when such things are discussed. But my background is more in computer vision, hence my initial interest with Kinect.

Full article here:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/hands-on-with-hololens-making-the-virtual-real/

Funny that all those journalist never fail to tell how they took all their electronic device and locked them up beforehand. "Noooo, not my phone ! What's that, pen and paper ? Is it the XXth century ?"

 

[lighthouse777]

Full article here:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/hands-on-with-hololens-making-the-virtual-real/

Using Skype

A Skype demo was intriguing. I, with the headset, was talking to a person using regular Skype on a Surface Pro 3. The person was helping me wire up a light switch (and it seems that, yes, it was a real light switch with real mains electricity running through it). My assistant saw the world through my eyes; I saw him on a floating Skype pane that I could pin in place, where his head would remain. Using his Surface Pro 3 pen, the assistant drew diagrams showing me how to wire the switch up, pointing out which tool I should use for each task.



Finally, the one non-interactive demo showed off HoloStudio, Microsoft's 3D modeling application for HoloLens. We saw a koala in a space suit and a monster truck assembled in front of us, again using a mix of voice and gesture control. Microsoft described this as "print preview for 3D printing"; by projecting the objects in 3D space and integrating them with the real world, artists and designers can get a sense of just how their objects will look before sending them to the 3D printer.

 

[Xone9]

I just want my living room to turn into Debobah with an Xwing stuck in the middle of a swamp and yoda asking me for a piece of sausage

 

[ArchedThunder]

I'm completely uninterested in AR tech for gaming purposes, but the practical and "toy" applications will be really interesting. That being said the device is far too big for normal every day practical applications and they need to work on feedback for toy applications, so a lot of work needs to be done.

I also eagerly await the dumb comparisons and fanboy arguments about this and morpheus even though they aren't even remotely the same thing.

 

[Seanspeed]

Hmm very interesting. I am pretty excited to see some actual discussion about AR on gaf for a change. I agree with other posters, it's disappointing how dismissive many in the thread are about the tech and it's practicality and potential, but I suppose that makes a lot of sense for many reasons. Trumpeting this particular piece of hardware as being "from the guy who brought you kinect" is probably not going to do a lot of favors in a place like this either.

I'm a designer who works with AR every day, after many years in games and VFX. When I got started down this part of the path I was mostly of the same mind (not very interested, looked like a gimmick) but before long I started to understand where it was going and what it means. The point is this is ultimately going to pull you away from staring into a flat screen to experience things. No, AR isn't VR, one is not "better" than the other and in fact they are very closely related - ultimately, we'll probably have some kind of hybrid of the tech. As my boss says "one day we won't even have a name for it, because it will just be 'how things are'"

Anyway AR (and VR) both have a long road ahead of them. We are still barely in the Atari 2600 days of things, although I won't say it's going to take us anywhere close to 30 years to get to a huge plateau. Seeing major players such as MS and Facebook and Sony getting involved in such a manner shows that they are at least committed to researching the expansion of this new format as well.

To the naysayers in here, I am going to assume many are younger and jaded and sort of fed up with the notion that "oh it's not here doing cool stuff NOW like I want it to so it is just stupid." That's a very shortsighted POV to have, and that's okay. But if you take a little time and start to tune in to what's being done for real, right now, dig a little deeper, try to experience what's on the bleeding edge yourself - it's not far out there. You will be surprised as things mature. Like I said I was right there with you a couple of years ago in the same mentality, and now I'm fucking excited!

Great post.

 

[glaurung]

All I know is when this is meant to be made available to the general public. Sony demoed Morpheus two years ago and we are no closer to learning a real release date.

When is this thing going to be on sale? 2019?

 

[AmyS]

Hmm very interesting. I am pretty excited to see some actual discussion about AR on gaf for a change. I agree with other posters, it's disappointing how dismissive many in the thread are about the tech and it's practicality and potential, but I suppose that makes a lot of sense for many reasons. Trumpeting this particular piece of hardware as being "from the guy who brought you kinect" is probably not going to do a lot of favors in a place like this either.

I'm a designer who works with AR every day, after many years in games and VFX. When I got started down this part of the path I was mostly of the same mind (not very interested, looked like a gimmick) but before long I started to understand where it was going and what it means. The point is this is ultimately going to pull you away from staring into a flat screen to experience things. No, AR isn't VR, one is not "better" than the other and in fact they are very closely related - ultimately, we'll probably have some kind of hybrid of the tech. As my boss says "one day we won't even have a name for it, because it will just be 'how things are'"

Anyway AR (and VR) both have a long road ahead of them. We are still barely in the Atari 2600 days of things, although I won't say it's going to take us anywhere close to 30 years to get to a huge plateau. Seeing major players such as MS and Facebook and Sony getting involved in such a manner shows that they are at least committed to researching the expansion of this new format as well.

To the naysayers in here, I am going to assume many are younger and jaded and sort of fed up with the notion that "oh it's not here doing cool stuff NOW like I want it to so it is just stupid." That's a very shortsighted POV to have, and that's okay. But if you take a little time and start to tune in to what's being done for real, right now, dig a little deeper, try to experience what's on the bleeding edge yourself - it's not far out there. You will be surprised as things mature. Like I said I was right there with you a couple of years ago in the same mentality, and now I'm fucking excited!

Really good post.

I think the 2020s will be a boom decade for both VR and AR in the consumer space as the tech matures and as developers come to grips with how to make apps, games and entertainment for these new formats.

 

[Ubersnug]

I might have a very narrow view point on this, but from what I've seen leaves me VERY excited.

I'm imagining Hololens spawning a huge 60"+ screen somewhere in my room - I assume it's position would be either user defined or could 'float' with you as you move your head/body. Given that Windows 10 is integrated into HoloLens, I imagine the Xbox app would be available. I would run that and start the streaming service from my Xbox One to the spawned screen I have in front of me.

Then, while having my game up, I could then spawn a Netflix screen to the side, or Spotify. Perhaps when a message comes through Xbox Live, I could access it via a separately spawned window and reply to it, probably with voice recognition (given how accurate the demonstrations of this was during the briefing).

I could load up Spartan (or whatever web browser), and load up a youtube video of a particular area of a game I'm having difficulty with and let that play, side by side with my game. Maybe even a Twitch stream....

The possibilities of this tech are MINDBLOWING - and I haven't even touched on the potential games that could be developed which supports this natively. Can't believe people are so quick to dismiss this.

 

[Seanspeed]

I might have a very narrow view point on this, but from what I've seen leaves me VERY excited.

I'm imagining Hololens spawning a huge 60"+ screen somewhere in my room - I assume it's position would be either user defined or could 'float' with you as you move your head/body. Given that Windows 10 is integrated into HoloLens, I imagine the Xbox app would be available. I would run that and start the streaming service from my Xbox One to the spawned screen I have in front of me.

Then, while having my game up, I could then spawn a Netflix screen to the side, or Spotify. Perhaps when a message comes through Xbox Live, I could access it via a separately spawned window and reply to it, probably with voice recognition (given how accurate the demonstrations of this was during the briefing).

I could load up Spartan (or whatever web browser), and load up a youtube video of a particular area of a game I'm having difficulty with and let that play, side by side with my game. Maybe even a Twitch stream....

The possibilities of this tech are MINDBLOWING - and I haven't even touched on the potential games that could be developed which supports this natively. Can't believe people are so quick to dismiss this.

All of that stuff you mentioned will be entirely possible. In time. Don't expect that sort of complete functionality anytime in the next year or two or anything.

But yea, its really cool stuff. A proper revolution.

 

[dofry]

Hmm very interesting. I am pretty excited to see some actual discussion about AR on gaf for a change. I agree with other posters, it's disappointing how dismissive many in the thread are about the tech and it's practicality and potential, but I suppose that makes a lot of sense for many reasons. Trumpeting this particular piece of hardware as being "from the guy who brought you kinect" is probably not going to do a lot of favors in a place like this either.

I'm a designer who works with AR every day, after many years in games and VFX. When I got started down this part of the path I was mostly of the same mind (not very interested, looked like a gimmick) but before long I started to understand where it was going and what it means. The point is this is ultimately going to pull you away from staring into a flat screen to experience things. No, AR isn't VR, one is not "better" than the other and in fact they are very closely related - ultimately, we'll probably have some kind of hybrid of the tech. As my boss says "one day we won't even have a name for it, because it will just be 'how things are'"

Anyway AR (and VR) both have a long road ahead of them. We are still barely in the Atari 2600 days of things, although I won't say it's going to take us anywhere close to 30 years to get to a huge plateau. Seeing major players such as MS and Facebook and Sony getting involved in such a manner shows that they are at least committed to researching the expansion of this new format as well.

To the naysayers in here, I am going to assume many are younger and jaded and sort of fed up with the notion that "oh it's not here doing cool stuff NOW like I want it to so it is just stupid." That's a very shortsighted POV to have, and that's okay. But if you take a little time and start to tune in to what's being done for real, right now, dig a little deeper, try to experience what's on the bleeding edge yourself - it's not far out there. You will be surprised as things mature. Like I said I was right there with you a couple of years ago in the same mentality, and now I'm fucking excited!

I wish I could put words as eloquently as you did. I have so much trouble expressing myself in writing. You kind of put what I want to say in a very clear format.

Now I do research on Augmented Reality too, and the things that I see from others are fasicinating and way beyond my skill level as I am more of a designer and others do my ideas for me. E.g. I find SLAM, PTAM style point cloud stuff really interesting but I have no idea how to solve that kind of problems. I can just design something (UI, app, interaction) that's usable in combination with those methods. I know the possibilities of AR and what it can offer in the future for us, but it's a long road with a lot of obstacles.

GAF itself consists of individuals from different fields and experiences not usually related to AR, so opinions on AR or VR are skewed towards gaming or general applications they have experienced on commercial level. What HoloLens does, is something that hasn't been shown that much outside of research circles. The applications it brings are not that much aimed at gaming, which is GAF's bread and butter, so opinions are what they are. I understand why people are so close-minded regarding the tech, because it's so unfamiliar and they see it through a different lense. More exposure is good for the tech and will change these opinions over time.

 

[sono]

When does 50c appear I miss him

 

[theusedversion]

So is this the HoloLens or something else because the two different threads are confusing me?

 

[dofry]

So is this the HoloLens or something else because the two different threads are confusing me?

It's the same thing. HoloLens is just an Augmented Reality solution, so that's why the thread title before the actual product name was revealed.

 

[detrimental]

I don't think many people really understand what Augmented reality will ultimately be - it is the future, but it's also a good 20 years away from being what we want it to be. Eventually, Augmented Reality will be like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJI8tNG1rbQ

Augmented Reality should be virtual reality abstracted over reality. Here is a proof of concept being worked on from several years back:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jpWiTVR0GA

Again, we're just not there yet. VR is walking, AR is running. The things we need to solve for great VR will make for great AR; they're not solved yet. This is a very limited, specific use tease of AR, similar to CastAR. I think it's definitely worth pursuing, but it won't be what we want it to be for a very long time.

I'm going to be entirely honest, not a single thing in that first video clip interests me whatsoever. It seems about as futile and gimmicky as Google Glass, possibly even worse. The possibility of road overlays, etc, it's just gimmick. By then most affluent people will be switching to automated vehicles anyway.

The truly captivating concept, to me, can be found in VR. Sitting in your loungeroom with a VR headset, watching an NBA game from the front-row, for example. Dedicated cameras and speakers for different seating positions, etc.

AR has reasonable promise in things like live-networking and trouble shooting but beyond that I see it as gimmick; and a rather boring addition to the sphere of entertainment.

 

[AmyS]

From the HoloLens thread:

OCT, 1993

I remember reading that editorial.

Who knew, right?

 

[Crispy75]

The truly captivating concept, to me, can be found in VR. Sitting in your loungeroom with a VR headset, watching an NBA game from the front-row, for example.

How about having a 1/10th scale basketball court on the floor of your lounge, and you can watch little 8" players running around?

 

[In Service]

Age of HoloEmpires:

See the world from your living room carpet and control your armies and workers by drag and dropping them on the map.


I want to believe


edit: what if your dog/cat runs through your Minecraft castle? Will it destroy the illusion or will the headset react to the animal and destroy the castle.

Evil cats

The headset has a switch that enables it to destroy said cats with a laser.

An insider told me.

 

[oldergamer]

I recall Nintendo years ago looking into a company that could produce holograms inside a vacuum or something along those lines.

Anyway this has me interested as it sees this is more of an extension of the TV instead of replacing it. It kinda reminds me of illumiroom, but more 3dimensional. The fact they plan to do this untethered is one thing that VR has yet to do imo.

 

[dofry]

I'm going to be entirely honest, not a single thing in that first video clip interests me whatsoever. It seems about as futile and gimmicky as Google Glass, possibly even worse. The possibility of road overlays, etc, it's just gimmick. By then most affluent people will be switching to automated vehicles anyway.

The truly captivating concept, to me, can be found in VR. Sitting in your loungeroom with a VR headset, watching an NBA game from the front-row, for example. Dedicated cameras and speakers for different seating positions, etc.

AR has reasonable promise in things like live-networking and trouble shooting but beyond that I see it as gimmick; and a rather boring addition to the sphere of entertainment.

Don't like that Infinity concept video either, but that's just some simple stuff that's possible. And as they are now, I do not think og Google Glass as AR, just as HMD's.

In your NBA example, you could watch the game live on location, and replace all of the players with Playboy models or Tom of Finland characters if you want. And have the play field made of lava.

 

[Doffen]

All I know is when this is meant to be made available to the general public. Sony demoed Morpheus two years ago and we are no closer to learning a real release date.

When is this thing going to be on sale? 2019?

If they didn't plan on releasing it within a few years they would have demoed it on their Microsoft Research YouTube channel.

That's my take on it.

 

[In Service]

AR has reasonable promise in things like live-networking and trouble shooting but beyond that I see it as gimmick; and a rather boring addition to the sphere of entertainment.

I don't see the headset as a primary entertainment device. I see it as a business device that, like all good business devices, eventually makes it into the home. Business will pay the premium if it offers a competitve advantage. Consumers will not (en masse) pay $1,000 to watch NBA games in their living room.

Maybe it does morph into AR/VR at that stage. Who knows. We are years out.

 

[Ramenman]

I just love AR, I'm a sucker for it. Yes it's limited and "gimmicks", but I just can't help it, I really love things like the 3DS AR games or the Chibi Robo gimmicks (only played the demo but still).

So yeah, bring it on.

 

[Fredrik]

If they didn't plan on releasing it within a few years they would have demoed it on their Microsoft Research YouTube channel.

That's my take on it.

I believe the wording was "within Windows 10 time frame" and Windows 10 isn't even out yet so I'd guess they are at least 3 years away, possibly around the launch of next Xbox since they never spoke about Xbox One in particular and just Windows 10 devices.

 

[Can Crusher]

Amazing for non gamimg aplications. Possibilities are immense.

 

[LX_Theo]

Looks badly implemented to me.

Tech needs to prove itself.

 

[Anton Sugar]

I believe the wording was "within Windows 10 time frame" and Windows 10 isn't even out yet so I'd guess they are at least 3 years away, possibly around the launch of next Xbox since they never spoke about Xbox One in particular and just Windows 10 devices.

The HoloLens Mars program will be available to NASA engineers later this year, I believe. I think it's closer than 3 years.

 

[Fredrik]

Amazing for non gamimg aplications. Possibilities are immense.

It should be perfect for cool board games though, multiplayer, Eye of Judgement type of games, Warhammer 40k, chess, etc.

 

[Raide]

The HoloLens Mars program will be available to NASA engineers later this year, I believe. I think it's closer than 3 years.

They will follow the OR route and release a version of it to Insiders/Developers probably/maybe around GDC or beyond and then they will drag refinement out for another year+.